Hi Josie, you did not experience any of the vocal problems mentioned in the roon review? Thanks
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Hi Josie, you did not experience any of the vocal problems mentioned in the roon review? Thanks
OK, thanks, I'll wait for the BOSS!Quote:
Originally Posted by The Black Adder
PCM5122Quote:
Originally Posted by struth
To be honest, no. I've only just read that review actually.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kit1cat
All I can say is that I'm sure the DAC will need a good running in. It sounds a bit odd to me.
Audiophonics 32bit/384kHz then.... should work with Moode then easily enough. Never did get the kali to work alas.... Sounds like a winner for you then.:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiohdwr
What did you pay for the Boss Josie?
Retail is 59$ USD
Thanks for the review, Josie, I was getting very eager to hear it and have just signed up to comment (long time lurker).
Prior to hearing of the forthcoming “The Boss” release (great name!), I was all set to buy either a Mamboberry LS or one of the Piano DACs from Allo, plus a Kali. As soon as I heard about this DAC I held off until some reviews came out, hoping to make my choice easier. But if anything it has made it harder, because now I am wondering if any of these alternatives offer anything ‘better’ than my current IQaudio DAC+?!
Sure, they likely have subtly different sound signatures, but there seems to be little agreement among reviewers, which makes me think that it just comes down to subjective preferences for these ever so slightly different flavours.
A few people who own the IQaudio and Piano + Kali on the Rune Audio forum had suggested to me that the Allo combination was an improvement over the IQaudio. This made sense to me as I had naturally assumed that the reclocking done by the Kali (and now “The Boss”) would automatically elevate these options above the IQaudio that relies on the jittery clock of the Pi. But in your review you seem to imply that you prefer The Boss over the Piano/Kali, but that for some music you still prefer the presentation of the IQaudio?
So I am left wondering whether we can think of the differences in terms of better/best, or whether in fact the quality of these DACs has reached a kind of plateau where the best examples are all basically equally good, with only very subtle differences in audible output?
(I also suspect that psychoacoustics comes into play whenever we add a new component into the system, especially if we expect it to perform better, making it very difficult to accurately judge the subtle differences!)
I was wondering, do you agree at all with that conclusion? Could you possibly elaborate on the differences between The Boss and the IQaudio? I know this is probably very difficult without a means to do quick A-B switching. Would you be prepared to show the courage of your conviction and say that The Boss is definitively better than the IQAudio, or is it just far too comfortable on that fence? ;)
The TL,DR version
If you could only have one Pi DAC HAT, which would it be?
:)
I have used both the IQAudio and the Piano/Kali combo and I have to say in my system the Piano/Kali was a good upgrade, wider and deeper front to back soundstage, better, tighter bass with more kick and overall I thought it sounded much better. So much so that it made me question my vinyl setup.
Mike.
Good to hear that, Mike, thanks. I admit that I was surprised to hear that The Boss might sound as good, or even better than the Piano + Kali. But would be amazing if so, given the price point.
hello, just wondering what TL,DR stands for.Quote:
Originally Posted by LC1979
thank you
It was a reference to my long and slightly rambling post above: Too Long, Didn't Read.Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiohdwr
Apologies, obscure internet acronyms are strictly forbidden by the Plain English Campaign, and rightly so :)
Given that it's always trade that responds to this question, should this thread be in trade impressions (or at least 'Strokes')?Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiohdwr
The thread is a review by a private individual, so for me it's in the right place, the replies by the maker are relevant to this thread and the questions asked irrespective of his status surely?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rothchild
If you wanted this moved you'd need every other individuals review moved too?
If you are still keen to have it moved then just ask a mod to check the thread out.
It was a review by Jo re the boss i think. Unless he comes and says i work for Audiohdwr then its best to be here, as its an extention of his first one on the kali ... or thats my take on it at moment. I havent nor will i be reading it all...my lifes gonna be too short as it is :eyebrows:
Thanks 😊
Yeah it's a small thing in the bigger scheme but it's never been made clear that Josie actually bought all this gear (Piano, Kalli, Amp thing and now a boss too (rendering piano and kalli 'redundant')) for personal use or if it was supplied by Audiohdwr for her to review, I know it's an old fashioned concept but it would be nice to have any interests declared or disclaimed.Quote:
Originally Posted by struth
Ah, now I understand 😉Quote:
Originally Posted by Rothchild
Ive no idea at moment either. People do lent (even lend stuff:eyebrows: )stuff for a review to be done etc. Sure truth will out and if there is any change on the current position as i know it, then it will be relooked at of course. Personally im currently happy for it to be where it is, as members will be interested in this new board i think. Hell, i am too. Lol...Quote:
Originally Posted by Rothchild
Andre very kindly sent it to me to use and review.
Hope that's okay.
Tis ok with me. Ps it was a good review. Have you tried it with moode?
Thanks... Not exactly sure why it should matter anyway. :) I'm not trade, this is an independent review.
Regarding Moode, I tried it but no dice. I'll ask and find out if that's a possibility.
And it's appreciated :)Quote:
Originally Posted by The Black Adder
Hi Josie. I posted a quick question for you on page 26... Any updates/additional comments after using The Boss in your system for a while, especially in contrast to your IQaudio DAC+, would be very welcome!
Cheers,
Luke
Just a few words on the review by Josie.
Yes we are sending units for review by independent members of audio community . Jose in particular , did a great review on our Kali/Piano combo , she is truly an artist . For this reason we decided that any hardware that we release will be sent to her for an honest and to the point review. We don't see the review beforehand and we don't have any saying in her text.
We also understand that there must be a separation between the commercial aspect and reviews of our products and we will keep this section free of any commercial comments . (we will keep separate thread for that).
We appreciate this forum and community.
To Josie , I would like to say that you might be a fan of our hardware but we always wait for your reviews with trepidation . We can see our audio hardware coming to life.
Thx you for that.
I am tempted to give "The Boss" ago, but don't really want to move away from Moode at the moment.
Hi Luke... gosh, yes. I didn't see your post.Quote:
Originally Posted by LC1979
I'll try and go in to more detail later on if that's okay?
Thanks
Jo
Your very welcome, Andre. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiohdwr
I'll look forward to it, thank you :)
Hi to all and Josie,
We have found a problem in the BOSS unit we sent you for review. From 7k to 20k the signal degrades (slightly) . We rechecked the whole board...and we found that RC filter in the analog stage changed from old datasheet to new one. Unfortunately we used a value (c) from old datasheet and (r) from new...so the low pass filter characteristics changed allowing more noise to pass. Basically the LPF RC cutoff frequency is 15Khz ...we are changing that to 96Khz (old TI datasheet was 73Khz and new is 140Khz) We think that 100Khz is better.
Mass production will have the right LPF, we are thinking to send new unit to review. If you liked the Boss as it was...wait till you try the production one.
Please stay tuned.
regards
Andre
Hey Andre.
Not a problem. Can't wait to hear the updated version. :)
The ALLO kit is different... I'm not sure if 'better' is simply too subjective for my liking as they are half the same beast in regards to both use the RPI. I personally like the ALLO stuff for my music tastes.Quote:
Originally Posted by LC1979
It depends on what you are wanting from your music. For example, lots have said that the bass on the ALLO kit is much deeper, this is true but it's only one aspect in case. So, if you are after more weight then that one thing might be all you need to give one a go but the same goes to that old saying... if it ain't broke... etc.
Well, if you want a wholesome, big fat bottom end (ooer!) with focus then the ALLO stuff is most certainly a different flavour to the IQDAC+Quote:
Originally Posted by LC1979
In some music I think. I do still like the IQAudio. Whilst there is nothing wrong with the IQDAC+ it's just not as beefy or as open as the KALI/PIANO or BOSS for my liking. But you can bet your pants that on some systems the choice could be very much the pole opposite.Quote:
Originally Posted by LC1979
I listen to a lot of electronica, rock, dance and lots of 60's psychedelic stuff and with that extra weight it fits me and my system to which 15" drivers in cabinets the size of wardrobes seem to love.
I've no idea about the DAC's unfortunately, anything technical goes over my head (although always willing to learn). There are plenty on here who could answer that :)Quote:
Originally Posted by LC1979
There is always an element of psychoacoustics, we are only human but I always allow kit to get warmed up or (burned-in) before I make a judgement. I think initial impressions can be misleading for sure so I like to live with stuff for a good while first. Sometimes it's not too long before I can either flick the 'YES' or 'NO' buttons but then I always like to understand the reasons behind why (if it's the latter mostly) before I throw it to the dogs. WOOF! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by LC1979
Thanks for clarifying Josie.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Black Adder
Thanks for that, Josie. A very thorough reply, I appreciate that it's very tricky to make definitive statements on audio gear where there is so much that is subjective.
I do like the sound of a big fat bottom end, though I am slightly concerned that it might be too much for me. My equipment is much smaller than 15 inches.
Anyway, best to wait and see what people think about this DAC once the wrinkles are all ironed out!
:)
Hi everyone. I'm new here so please bear with me.
I have both the iqa dac+ and now the allo kali piano 2.1 combo. Both are on rpi3.
To be honest I liked both from an SQ point of view. Psycho-acoustically, I think the Kali relocker makes me think it sounds better. Unless I do an AB comparison to the iqa within a short time frame for switching between units, (auditory memory is extremely short lived) it would be almost impossible for me to tell the difference.
However in terms of aesthetics, fit and finish from a product standpoint, the iqa takes the cake. It comes across as a polished product when purchased in a bundle with the beautifully articulated smoked case. This is where allo could improve as the available casings are just too utilitarian.
That being said, my mind (not necessarily my ears) thinks the Kali piano combo sounds better so it's here to stay. Jazz sounds absolutely amazing.
I do have one concern about the Kali reclocker. It adds a 0.7s buffer delay to the music. This is all fine until I use kodi to watch streaming videos. Fixing audio lag by offsetting by 0.7s doesn't seem to help as the audio offset actually varies through the course of a streaming video content. Based on experience the buffer seems to vary between 0.025s and 0.07s range.
Has anyone else experienced this or would have suggestions on how to mitigate this while still retaining the Kali reclocker?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I would agree with you on the difficulty between telling the TI based DACs sound quality apart unless in an AB comparison.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fai
I have not noticed the delay with the Kali but strongly agree that it makes a (positive) big difference to the Piano combo. Ironically their new DAC should sound worse than the Kali combo as the whole idea of re-clocking is to improve the sound. A dedicated re-clocker board should really improve on an on board integrated clock chip as on the new DAC.
My main concern with the Allo range is similar to your comment on design. They seem to have paid little attention to erganomics and functionality with cables coming out all sides. It would be far better if cable in/out sockets were kept in line with the Pi. Their boards are generally a smaller footprint to the Pi board so there is space for a better design. Better/stronger RCA sockets would also greatly help as the current ones do seem to twist a bit.
My other concern over Allo generally is their support site is quite poor compared to other popular suppliers. Responses seem to indicate little knowledge of good customer support via provision of quick useful responses. It all seems totally dependent on Andre - who does an excellent job of promotion.
I am not being negative to Allo - I like their products but so far comments in this post have been almost totally on SQ and build, support and usability are also high on my list of measures on product quality.
Mel
Hi to all and welcome to the forum Fai,
Kali has a buffer to store the DATA of about 0.7s . There is no way around it. As you both observed (Fai and Cycleallday) . Allo hardware is very utilitarian , our main focus is sound quality . Regarding our new DAC, yes the integrated clocks are better (or equal) to Kali. In fact on the BOSS page you can see measurement of jitter is about 0.5ps vs 3-4ps of Kali. So it is possible that Boss is better than Kali + Piano combo.
But yes we do understand the need for a nice casing . This is why we have been working on for the past month and we will announce it very soon...
regard
Andre
Andre, in designing your case it would be nice to give some attention to how cables enter and exit it and how the RCA sockets can be supported.Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiohdwr
If the case is fully closed then internal fly cables could be used to solve both the above by routing them internally to a single side and providing additional RCA sockets which are fixed to the case side.
If the case is an open dog bone type then additional strength can be given to the on board RCA sockets by making sure the top rests on the sockets or some top packing is provided to reduce flexing in at least one plane.
The sound quality of the Pianos with the Kali is really good and I use the Vana player as my main streamer in my office at present.
For all I've said about leads being on different sides I love the 'quirky' look of the Vana with its separate cap multiplier - it looks really good on my computer desk but not sure it would last long if I moved it to my lounge as my wife prefers nice closed in boxes with as few leads as possible.
Your new board sounds like it should be really nice and I look forward to Black Adders review.
Mel
Must admit I've gone back to my IQAudio DAC+. I think I wil put my Kali + Piano 2.1 up for sale.
I never got the DSP crossover functionality working. Bit disappointing really, but hey ho.
hello
Latest Volumio image works bug free with Piano 2.1 or similar
I've been experiencing intermittent skipping during playback on the Kali piano 2.1 combo on rpi3. LAN cable connection.
Skips happens when using both dietpi roon bridge and jriver to dlna renderer.
Does anyone else experience it? It's beginning to get quite annoying when enjoying the flow of music.
Regards
Fai
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The settings for the crossover filters for the 2.1 don't yet work as they should though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiohdwr
Thx you Jonners for finding the bug. There is a dip in the frequency using the LR filters that come in the TI software. We already reported to TI.
Have you tested the new filter?
I haven't been able to test yet, basically because installing the new folder was going to take more familiarity with Linux and ssh than I possess (which is very little!). So Jaikumar is going to send me a complete revised Volumio image that I'll be able to install without a lot of hand-holding. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiohdwr
OK !
Hot off the press.
After Andre sent me the latest BOSS the other day I've been listening to it today. So far I'm very impressed, the sound stage seems wider and basically sounding more natural and easy somehow. Nice wide soundstage, oodles of detail voluptuous bass.
Had a few things on so far, dance, 60's psychedelia, 90's indie, some Goa and now Semprini.
I've opened a box of chocolates (naughty I know) and enjoying every moment.
Tested with Kali?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Black Adder
The Boss will not work with Kali.Quote:
Originally Posted by SantanaCorreia
yes correct, KALI will work only with slave DACs... BOSS is a master as it feeds its own clock.
thanks
Andre
Has anyone else here bought one?
I was about to take a punt on one but then found out it wouldn't work on my Pi B+, so I would have to upgrade that too, plus a new case. So am keen to hear some more opinions on it first! I suspect it might sound better than my current IQaudio DAC +, but probably not an earth-shattering difference given that they both use the PCM5122. May have to wait and see what the new Kali brings to the table...