Confronting your own realities...

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Originally Posted by Primalsea

Marco,
If music is the important thing and Hifi is the means to the end then why did you start what is primary a Hifi forum?

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Hi Paul,

Good point. The problem is that hi-fi forums which are started up under the premise that they are predominantly music forums with a bit of hi-fi thrown in for good measure, and then who try to set their stall out that way (when in actual fact they're quite the opposite) we feel are generally unsuccessful.

That's why we've always stated that AOS is predominantly a hi-fi forum, with music and other discussions added - but for people who see hi-fi as a means to and end, and that end is to enjoy greater fidelity from their chosen music.

We started AOS to provide what we thought was something a bit different and to use it as a vehicle to help people discuss and achieve the above. It's the 1st year anniversary of the forum tomorrow and we think we've achieved quite a lot in that time :)

What do you think?

Marco.

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I don't particularly care whether my beliefs are prejudiced or "correct" - how can there be "correct" beliefs anyway, actually beliefs are bound to be prejudiced to some extent at least. What matters most is that people have fun in what they are doing, both with kit (whether diy or not) and music. We could next comment on people's musical interests.

Some people are very competitive they have to have "the best" or have the "the best" philosophy. I'm old enough not to care what others think, I just want to enjoy the both the kit and music that I have, it's totally selfish. Others will constantly need to have "bake-offs" and "shoot-outs" but that's not for me.

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Clive,

I completely agree. I'm just trying to get people to think a little bit more about what they're doing with hi-fi, and whether or not they feel that their current system building methodology, or whatever, perhaps needs some reassessing. If you're having fun, that's great - so am I, but I suspect there are others who are just kidding themselves on because they're not willing to tackle inconsistencies in their belief system and deal with it accordingly.

Sometimes when this sort of thing is highlighted it makes people reassess their current position with hi-fi to their overall benefit, and in turn allowing them to have even more fun...

Sorry if I'm thinking about things rather too deeply, but that's just me! :)

Marco.

Marco,
I am 100% confident about my chosen musical path.
It is not a dad's radiogram special that so many are 'absorbed in' that effects the UK so much.
Real musical reproduction is not for the faint hearted, it is far and away beyond the 'safe' UK approved style of sound that is generally given as read.
Neither is it the naim or linn paths to true box enlightenment, it lies on road to some distant shore that populated by 'true source' reproduction, no fuzzy lumpkins or thin emaciated, texture bereft evangelical thrown at you spatially unaware bland breed of eastern European hifi.
Nor is the US heavy hitting iron of soperific one note entrenchment and those audio Jackhammer behmoths that litter highways and byways of pure music.
I have gleened ear to six figure SET's that would make this board cry, yet as good as they proclaim, the magic does not exsist across whole spectrum of audio reproduction.
Close yet, the tropical fruit is still elusive!
It just imbibes pure unadulterated music, no more no less.
True contentment is not a cigar called Hamlet, but a musical reproduction system that imparts music not in the room (so 90's man) firmly and utterly insconced inside your mind (without the use of artifical stimulents or substances.
Take the flight that carries you to music central station, only stopping on route to take in the spectacular musical journeys that await your cerebral delights throughout the eons of musical exploration.
Music lovers have a state of mind, a place they go to un-harness by the shackles of everyday life, a place where time and space become one and the same, they transcend the tedium of humanity and rise into the great gig in the sky.
They also do it with dignity, insightfulness and without recourse to the public domain.
A Mr. C in mellow philosophical mood.

Marco,

That's ok, I understand what you're doing. I suppose where I'm coming from is that I've asked myself those sorts of questions and now I have an equilibrium I'm content with.

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Originally Posted by Mr. C

Marco,
I am 100% confident about my chosen musical path.
It is not a dad's radiogram special that so many are 'absorbed in' that effects the UK so much.
Real musical reproduction is not for the faint hearted, it is far and away beyond the 'safe' UK approved style of sound that is generally given as read.
Neither is it the naim or linn paths to true box enlightenment, it lies on road to some distant shore that populated by 'true source' reproduction, no fuzzy lumpkins or thin emaciated, texture bereft evangelical thrown at you spatially unaware bland breed of eastern European hifi.
Nor is the US heavy hitting iron of soperific one note entrenchment and those audio Jackhammer behmoths that litter highways and byways of pure music.
I have gleened ear to six figure SET's that would make this board cry, yet as good as they proclaim, the magic does not exsist across whole spectrum of audio reproduction.
Close yet, the tropical fruit is still elusive!
It just imbibes pure unadulterated music, no more no less.
True contentment is not a cigar called Hamlet, but a musical reproduction system that imparts music not in the room (so 90's man) firmly and utterly insconced inside your mind (without the use of artifical stimulents or substances.
Take the flight that carries you to music central station, only stopping on route to take in the spectacular musical journeys that await your cerebral delights throughout the eons of musical exploration.
Music lovers have a state of mind, a place they go to un-harness by the shackles of everyday life, a place where time and space become one and the same, they transcend the tedium of humanity and rise into the great gig in the sky.
They also do it with dignity, insightfulness and without recourse to the public domain.
A Mr. C in mellow philosophical mood.

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yes, what he said!:eyebrows:
nice one mr C.;) :)
anthony...

LOL, Tony! And I thought that I was being a tad too deep... Great post. I love little 'personal insights' like that :)

I laughed at loud reading this though:

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It is not a dad's radiogram special that so many are 'absorbed in' that effects the UK so much.

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"Dad's radiogram" F*cking love it! :lol:

Trouble is, if only some "dad's radiograms" didn't sound so much better than half of the 'plastic-fantastic' pretenders made today ;)

I do get your point though and think you're right, and I knew that Anthony (another valve aficionado like me) would agree...

It's because we're so confident that our choices are right that we've got no worries or insecurities ;)

Marco.

Worried and insecure? Never!

OK... Well my interest in hi-fi has come about through the convergence of a bunch of different things that led me to the same place. Firstly I've been seriously into music fom when I was around 14, listening to John Peel, alternative Radio 1 concert broadcasts, late night music telly, and recording what I liked almost religiously.

When I was 16 I started collecting and swapping live recordings and put together a basic system that allowed me to more seriously copy and playback stuff with the least degradation of signal... My current speakers are the same home-made ones I was using when I was 16. My amp back then was also home-made. My dad was big into Hi-Fi and making his own stuff and for a 16 year old with a weekend job there was far more SPPV in making than trying to buy something that sounded as good as we could make :) I was 17 when I bought my first CD player, for £40 off a friend, and that's player I'm still using. That would have been back in 1989 or so. The amp has been retired, but only replaced once, with the one I currently use, which I purchased about 10 years ago.

I upgraded to DAT ten or so years later when I could afford a machine, to avoid the scourge of gen-loss, and later still started collecting the machines so I could play back original old reel and other analogue formats.

I was given my first reel to reel player (my TC-377) by a friends' dad. I used it to archive some of his old home recording to CD. That machine gave me a taste of what reel to reel was capable of so I did my research and fell in love with the RT-707. Then I ran out of room and focussed on more portable machines :lol:

There is something very tactile about old tape equipment, and especially reel to reel. I have a fascination for obsolete formats. I think there is a big bit of me that wants to archive stuff. That's a big part of it. I love how the machines are built and engineered. I love the fact that they're quite unusual now. I think that I feel about my reel to reels how a lot of vinyl fans feel about their turntables. There is some kind of 'added value' from the fact that it's not some 'black box' making sound, but a whirring machine that harks back to the same age that a lot of the music itself was recorded.

Some of the stuff I play on my machines isn't well recorded, and might even be degraded by the passage of time (old reels, like old records) but I know that my players are getting about the best that any player is going to get off them. I have heard quite a few reel to reel machines, Revox B77, Phillips, Teac, Grundigs, Akai's and funnily enough in the real world my RT-707 sounds better than all of the others I've heard... I guess I've been lucky, but the most important thing is I'm happy :)

So I love music, and I love old vintage equipment. And sometimes I buy equipment just to play old music :lol:

On the matter of DIY I like the challenge of doing something that gives a good sound for not very much money. I enjoy making stuff eventhough I have very little electronics knowledge. I think when I come to replace my amp, which I will at some point, I'll replace it with one I build myself, most likely a kit-type thing. I am convinced that if you feel confident with a soldering iron and can follow instructions that DIY is the single best way to maximise the investment you make in your system. And the satisfaction of having done it yourself is immense.

I don't feel like I have any pre-conceived notions, other than being a subjectivist. I don't care for the numbers, only how it sounds. I don't have golden ears and so don't feel the need to tweak. I have never heard cables making any difference. I wonder sometimes if I have a poor 'audio memory' - it surprises me when people on the forum say they discern differences over long periods - my abilities are more limited to quick-time A/B comparisons ;) Having a young family I find that I can never listen to my equipment at levels that would allow me to discern very much in terms of subtleties anyway so I don't worry too much. Because I don't have many friends with a serious interest in hi-fi I don't have the experience of other systems against which to measure my own. I know that front end of my system isn't particularly special.

Perhaps I'm a happy fool!

I look forward to hearing some of your systems at forum gatherings to shake me out of my complacency :)

So anyway, I think I'm a hi-fi enthusiast rather than an audiophile :)

To use the cliché, me system is a means to an end. I love music and love having a system to play it back on that does it justice. I like being able to play with old kit and have the music to play back on whatever format I like. So I collect my favourite albums on vinyl, reel - if they were released - and CD... I know I've spent thousands more on music than any of the equipment I have play 'em on...

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Originally Posted by Mr. C

Take the flight that carries you to music central station, only stopping on route to take in the spectacular musical journeys that await your cerebral delights throughout the eons of musical exploration.
Music lovers have a state of mind, a place they go to un-harness by the shackles of everyday life, a place where time and space become one and the same, they transcend the tedium of humanity and rise into the great gig in the sky.
They also do it with dignity, insightfulness and without recourse to the public domain.

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I love that. Almost worthy of Betjeman. One to keep I think :)

Yes...Re-examination. I have been doing that this week, and so far, very interesting it has been too. I am working on a review(over view)for AOS. I hope to post the review at the end of the week. Its to do with digital... and should be of interest to all. However I do hope to keep the angry villagers at bay, so no burning torches and pitchforks...we shall see.

I will have a wee think about this thread and post any thoughts when I have some worth sharing... very interesting so far.

Regards D S D L---Neil :)

Marco

i will freely admit to making many mistakes with hifi, although i made an even bigger mistake when i sold off some of my vinyl.

Around 20 years ago i had a very narrow minded approach to music and Hifi ,thinking my linn was the best deck in the world and listening to quite a bit of crap music.

But i started to become more adventurous with my system and different types of music
and confidence grew' i was easily led before.

I built up a fairly high end system' but as you know i sold almost all of it except the snells.

So i now have a simpler system almost back to where i started' but do you know what i am quite happy with it , i think i will keep it this way for quite a while.

The one thing i have really learned over the years and is important to me now is the music and to have as much of it as possible and any format if not on vinyl then mp3, cd,
flac wav.,

I have never been a DIYer with hifi, but i am no longer a badge snob , but i must stress
i never looked down on the techy' i had sneaking desire to try it even in my Linn days.