:rotfl:
I have the opposite - too much lower down and nothing on top :(
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:rotfl:
I have the opposite - too much lower down and nothing on top :(
The development of the 1210 continues a pace. my new tonearm cable has just arrived from Greece, this is an all solid silver affair with Furutech DIN and eichmann silver bullets and a few other bits and pieces. I now have a completely silver setup. Everything is silver, tonearm wire, interconnects, powerleads!! So, along with the SR7XL I have a lot of listening to do to discern the differences. As always will keep you updated.
PS Richard Blackmoore's guitar on highway star has never sounded better on the Made in Japan album. :eek:
Hung like a donkey, eh?Quote:
Originally Posted by DSJR
Marco.
More Bungalow Bill methinks :lol:
Right brand new tonearm cable fitted, its up against Nordost TYR. First impressions are very very good indeed!
Seems promising, Andy... Look forward to your more detailed thoughts.
Is it the 428 Phono cable you've got or the 432.5?
Marco.
Tbh im not really sure I went for some weird quad geometry cable with solid silver rather than silver litz or silver plated copper. I'll have to dig out the emails from Yannis. I'm listening to Iron Maiden at the moment and treble is out of this world. Very clear, great instrument seperation and bass seems to be more defined with less bloom and more impact. Each instrument can be followed with greater ease. The real tester will be Dream Theater!!! Those guys should have been employed just for devising torture tracks for 1210's.
Black clouds & silver linings track one will hit 102db in my room with ease :-)Quote:
Originally Posted by REXTON
though to be honest that I only let happen fr a few seconds - it is fun though. Very clean recording.
If you can find a copy of Trente Moller - The Last Resort (there are a few still out there apparently) that will give the tracking abilty of the new setup a very nice test :-)
Interesting, Andrew, I have gone the opposite way, from silver to copper cables throughout.Quote:
Originally Posted by REXTON
Have you also changed the tonearm cable on your Dynavector arm - that was silver, no? :)
For me, what's most important, is not necessarily the material the conductor is made from, but how well the overall construction of the cable has been executed, in terms of addressing known sonic challenges in cable design - and doing it successfully!
Getting bogged down on whether cables are silver or copper is missing the point somewhat, IMO. It's not primarily what attracted me to the design that Yannis has come up with.
Marco.
Oops, forgot the tonearm cable when I wrote that. Getting ahead of myself, but the DV cable seems to be doing the job nicely. It'll be very interesting trying out yours.Quote:
Originally Posted by Marco
Yup - hopefully the new and improved one (with posh plugs) will be here by then :)
Marco.
Agreed but I also think the number interconnects and various other cables needed to get the sonics from your MC to your speakers also has a massive impact. I have two layers less than you guys in that I dont have speaker cables as such but balanced interconnects and I dont have a SUT which adds another layer of interconnects. What do you think?Quote:
Originally Posted by Marco
I think the connections are far less important than the cable used. Most important of all is impedance and energy matching; the reason adding a SUT into the circuit can sound so good is that it better matches the energy output of the cartridge, greatly surpassing the added complexity.Quote:
Originally Posted by REXTON
HMMM, perhaps, but I agree with you with regards impedance. The tonearm cable and SR7 are extremely low impedence. BUT, my balanced interconnects and power leads arn't so this could be the next area of examination, I'll have to get my multimeter out and make some measurements. Just out of interest have you any idea what impedance values you've got floating around your system?? Show me yours and I'll show you mine (oooo missus) :flasher:Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinT
You do have speaker cables, but they are kind of short :) You also have 3 sets of them in each speaker, one set from each power amplifier to it's respective drive unit.Quote:
Originally Posted by REXTON
The balanced interconnects between your pre amp & the speakers may as well be regarded as a standard (but balanced) interconnect between a pre amp & power amp.
You have no passive speaker crossover, it's active electronics that splits it before it hits the power amps. One advantage if done right, which I guess it should be being ATC :eyebrows:
I go along with Martin, the low voltage but relatively high current output of an MC doesn't lend itself to being at it's best when fed straight into a transistor, fet or indeed valve phono pre amp. The conversion of that highish current & low voltage to a higher voltage & lower current by a SUT can bring huge benefits in matching & consequent increase in signal to noise ratio (lower noise floor).
Mark,
As ever I bow to your superior knowledge, didn't think too much about the amps and speaker drivers in my ATC's :doh: (Sorry martin!) Looks like I may be getting a SUT at some point but need to get the internal regs sorted and see what's sonically different with the latest slew of upgrades.
PS I've not forgot about the measurements for the 15XR's can you send me a PM detailing EXACTLY what you want me to measure.
Will do & cheers :)Quote:
Originally Posted by REXTON
The latest internal regs have arrived from Paul. I've taken a few piccies of them. I made a start installing the huge ingot of copper which came through the post. As you can see I have cut some silver to size, just need some bloody teflon :steam:. You may also notice I've made a couple of PCB mods in that the pitch control has gone altogether and is now simply replaced with a jumper and the wiring to the on/off pcb has been optimised down to the bare minimum. I'll be doing the PCB mods over the next few days whilst I wait for the teflon to arrive. Hope you like the piccies.
Hi Andrew,
I also have the new modules. Paul sent my set together with the set for James whose SL I have just upgraded for his cutting lathe.
I do have a couple of suggestions however based on my experience fitting James’s SL, which you may wish to consider.
Firstly I found it easier to solder the wires to the 21V supply (the lump of copper) directly to the PCB tracks. Drill 1mm holes into the PCB at the appropriate locations and directly soldered the wires onto the track. (Scrape the green masking coating away at the location of the holes)
I personally feel that this gives a much better connection than relying on the three sets of screw terminals, especially with silver wire which is very stiff and not easy to manipulate. This is especially valid with the centre terminal block, which has to receive three wires twisted together and placed into the terminal from the top. This approach allows the wires to be lower down avoiding any interference with platters. Drilling of these holes is pretty easy as the tracks are wide at the points required. The holes for the 27V input are the only ones where some care is required.
The soldering of the wires can easily be done before securing the module onto the two conical posts in the hollow of the SL.
If you are removing all the now redundant components at the bottom left of the PCB as suggested by Paul, you can now use the two ‘AC’ posts as connectors for the 21V supply to the motor drive chip. The lower post being the 0V Earth. (Bridge across to the securing screw location.)
Run a connector wire underneath the PCB to the point on the track where C110 and R107 are connected ( +21V ). This avoids having to drill a hole in a vulnerable spot on the PCB.
Also consider drilling two holes at the top of the PCB where it says “Technics”
Be sure to drill the holes between the two copper tracks. This will allow you to thread the two wires from the 9V module through these holes and solder directly to the required points. This again avoids drilling holes in the PCB close to components.
The 5V supply is no problem as the wires can use the existing holes for D301. as shown in image TAP31.
There are a few ways of achieving it. I went under the main PCB and soldered direct to the track for the second +21V feed near C110 as I didn't want to drill any holes. I also mounted the two tertiary regulators component-side up, unlike Paul, as I found it easier to guide the silver wiring that way. I also star earthed everything except the +5V supply across D301 which Paul identified as critical for a short path.
http://www.mtc.me.uk/images/P1000507.jpg
Well i've cut the tracks and removed all the components from the PCB, tonight i'm in Salford, going to some lectures about biomechanics :eek: so no techie development. I'll be planning where and how to drill the holes later this week and also getting my head around star earthing and a few other bits and pieces ;) I cant really got much further as I need some teflon for the silver i'm using :( thanks for the encouragement and recommendations guys
Andy
Teflon arrived today :eyebrows: I have a horrid feeling its not the correct diameter :steam: should commence soldering tonight..... :eyebrows::eyebrows:
Right everthing has been soldered together and plumbed in! MAN what a journey :) Just got to hook up the power supply and change to 27V. Then we can start spinning some vinyl again. All I can say is I'm glad I dont have to do this every day for a job. :beer:
There is a point when you wonder if it'll ever turn a record again :)
I've just added a quick piccie of the inner workings! I have a really sneaky suspicion that it wont turn anything tomorrow, I just keep thinking I've missed something or the soldering isnt up to scratch :(
Where's the red incoming going to (from the braided DC cable)? Shouldn't it be feeding the TDR-12?
Also, you really want to remove that plastic motor cover for best sound quality.
Red lead is the only bit that I haven't fitted yet, I goes to terminal 5 or 6 on the tr21 module, it's in the instructions, I just had enough last night and I decided to call it a day, the old eyes wear closing which isn't a good sign :eek:
It's a good idea to put the coil cover on when you are doing this sort of work.Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinT
It can avoid inadvertant damage to the coils when you are waving a soldring iron or screw driver about!!
Yes, agreed Mike. I was only concerned in case it was still fixed in place.
Normally the cover is off but as mike says its been on lately to stop coil damage don't worry it will be removed when I've finished. I will be updating later tonight, wish me luck :eyebrows:
We're all waiting on you, Andrew, with fingers crossed!
Hi Andy,
Good luck with the upgrade. It looks OK so far. Make sure you check everything when you are fresh.
For those who are interested in the internal regulator upgrade, but lack the experience or the time to do it, I have set up a new upgrade service on the mainland in a trading association with ACS Ltd. The SL1200 regulator upgrade is the first upgrade offered and there will be more equipment upgrades for popular items of equipment in the near future.
Here is alink to the details of the new upgrade service at ACS Ltd :-
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showt...290#post340290
Regards
Paul
Your not gonna believe this I've left my tools at work so I cant tune the external psu upto 27V :steam:. Man its been a long day!! Give you all an update tomorrow (promise!!)
Right. I have a problem :steam: I have set the psu to 27v checked it with a multimeter. Checked the soldering, checked I removed all the correct components. Battened everything down, replaced the platter and turned the psu on, thats when things went wrong :steam: I heard a small click, smelled some smoke and then noticed the platter was going round at a fast rate without stopping. The power button on the 1210 seems to have stopped working alongside the 33/45 rpm switches. Any ideas:scratch: or do I need a new pcb
:steam:
Oh dear. I believe that Hamish experienced a similar problem with his 1210 and I'm not sure how it was resolved but I believe he was looking for a new motor drive IC.
I would disconnect all the power feeds to the main board and test the +21V, +9.4V and +5V reg outputs first. I hate to be premature but you might have blown the main board.
A small click is very synonymous with an IC popping off. Usually caused by the application of an inverse voltage. I have seen it happen.
Are you sure you got the red +27V into the correct hole?
I'm at work right now so will investigate tonight
Feel for you Andrew and sincerely hope it isn't anything too serious, obviuosly stuf like this needed like the proverbial hole in the head !
Ooops.
Follow Martin’s suggestion to check you have not damaged any regulators first. If they are all OK then you may have got the polarity wrong on a board connection which, as Mike says, is likely to blow a chip. See if you can see any sign of thermal damage to parts on the main board. If so let me know which ones, as this will help diagnosis.
If there is nothing obvious I will check the deck out for you if you send it to me complete with all the wiring you have added but minus the arm, as this will not be required for the check.
Regards
Paul
Thanks for the generous offer. I've a ordered a spare pcb off eBay just in case;) will have a good look around the pcbs tonight before curry ;) oh well I suppose I'll have to have another with the cd player :rolleyes:
just switched the TT on and it still works and nothing else has blown up :lol: These new mods are ace, my platter spins the wrong way around now :lol: (i'm not taking the pi$$ Paul, just out of myself ;)) Right off for curry and the 1210 can sulk in the corner for another few days. :cool:
At last you'll be able to hear what John Lennon really said...Quote:
Originally Posted by REXTON
Sorry to hear about the problem, unfortunately things don't always run smooth with the old diy . If in doubt with anything try to take as many pics as possible and post on here for us all to go over . A few pairs of eyes can be useful checking over things :)
Leo,
thanks for the support mate, I just put this experience down to one of those things. I have a new pcb coming so i'm gonna have another go :D I think to be honest it was shit soldering technique which blow the board. Never mind. If I blow the second one I'm giving up and buying a new CD player and switching to digital. :rfl:
Wow... I admire the way you can laugh these things off. If that'd been me, I'd have been near suicidal! That's why I only let experts anywhere near my T/T!! :exactly:
Marco.
Whilst the 1210 is my pride and joy its still only an inanimate object. I was really pissed when the board blew because I managed to get another decent haul of vinyl. I have about 30 albums propped up against my wall waiting for a spin :doh: I really must get my 301 fully sorted so that I have a 2nd TT when problems like this occur on my 1210. :eyebrows:
Like your 'It aint life or death' attitude Andrew (Have had to exercise that one a few times trust me, when my daughter spilled nail varnish all over my brown leather recliner comes to mind). With regard to the soldering - I learned that one myself recently whilst fitting my new psu. The Techie struggles to start, red on light flickers away etc. Found out it is due to my blobby soldering joins which in effect cause voltage drop etc so I'm gonna have to undo that and solder in a neater and tidier fashion :rolleyes: Soldering is one of those things that is easy to do but harder to do right :eyebrows:
Your a brave man tackling the 'regs mod' cause that one looks like a bridge too far for me and would be handed out to someone who knows the job.
Well! Whilst I'm for the PCB for the 121090 I think I may have secured a Thorens TD150 for peanuts so this could be a little side project. :eyebrows:
Meanwhile Andrew, what news of the regs and checking their voltages? You can be doing that while waiting for the replacement board. In fact, you MUST before you risk blowing another one.
You should be able to test for the +21V, +9.4V and +5V outputs easily enough. I used the '+' sign deliberately so that you double-check polarity too.