Richard's hi-fi ranting 'Room 101'

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Originally Posted by Richard

Completely dissagree, there was nothing insulting veiled or otherwise in what I wrote, in fact you paraphrased it in the latter part of this post, are you insulting him? There have been more insult in his replies than my post, but whatever. If you look for something you want to find I am sure you will find it. He over reacted - full stop, with anger and agression which *was not* reflected in *my* post. Seems strange for me to be defending a distributor, but you if see the behaviour of some (very few) customers who are just up their **** regarding what they think are their rights and your duties you would see what I mean. Problem is until you actually buy something you have no rights and they have no duties, and sometimes you just get so much demand for attention and continual questioning as though you are dealing with a child it is much simpler to say sorry but I just do not want your business. Like all relationships a little common sense is required which is all I was trying to convey.

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Ok Richard, I'd really like to draw a line under this for good and then I'm going to leave you to your view of the world.

Your reply to my initial post was condescending and patronising in the extreme. From there on you just let it get more personal in my view.

At no point in our exchanges did I resort to name calling, for example, the term *patsy*. I did say I thought you had a pompous tone to your replies and I still stand by that.

As a customer I'm certainly not up my own rear end. I didn't mention my *rights* or their *duty*, I merely detailed my interaction with company(s) who were supposedly in business to sell product but were seemingly disinterested in doing so. Those terms have all been introduced into the exchange by yourself. Of course they are entitled not to sell me anything but the efforts made by them were minimal.

I certainly didn't demand in a child like way and in fact all my communications with both parties were cordial and civil, even at the point where I expressed that I wasn't going to consider the product further.

I know about demanding clients in my line of work but I'm always as positive and helpful as I can be in those kind of situations. Perhaps you might want to try and view things from the other side of the fence now and again.

I want to bring this to a reasonably happy end but every time I do you have to prod one more time. I hope this now explains my reason for the initial post and the ones following.

Cheers

Nick

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Originally Posted by Nick

Ok Richard, I'd really like to draw a line under this for good and then I'm going to leave you to your view of the world.

Your reply to my initial post was condescending and patronising in the extreme. From there on you just let it get more personal in my view.

At no point in our exchanges did I resort to name calling, for example, the term *patsy*. I did say I thought you had a pompous tone to your replies and I still stand by that.

As a customer I'm certainly not up my own rear end. I didn't mention my *rights* or their *duty*, I merely detailed my interaction with company(s) who were supposedly in business to sell product but were seemingly disinterested in doing so. Those terms have all been introduced into the exchange by yourself. Of course they are entitled not to sell me anything but the efforts made by them were minimal.

I certainly didn't demand in a child like way and in fact all my communications with both parties were cordial and civil, even at the point where I expressed that I wasn't going to consider the product further.

I know about demanding clients in my line of work but I'm always as positive and helpful as I can be in those kind of situations. Perhaps you might want to try and view things from the other side of the fence now and again.

I want to bring this to a reasonably happy end but every time I do you have to prod one more time. I hope this now explains my reason for the initial post and the ones following.

Cheers

Nick

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You have a problem sir! everytime I make a generalisation or reply to someone elses post you take it as aimed at you. This is not a personal letter (and nor were the others) sent to *you* it is a reply to a forum post, which means it is addressed to the *whole* forum. So "patsy" referred to anyone willing to pay 10 grand for a speaker *in my opinion* and "up your ****" or child like behaviour wasn't even connected to you in any way or even as a reply to your remarks, it was a reply to another poster.

You are reacting and getting angry out of context. The whole world is not on your back there are others out there you know. Why do you have take it all so personally?

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Originally Posted by Steve Toy

Richard,

I agree with the above 100%. All I ask is that you do your bit to relieve us all of the confrontation element existing on both sides of any given heated debate.

As for the future of dealers the golden age of hi-fi is definitely over and many dealers will find it tough trading as a result. As fuel, taxes and food go up and earnings don't, people will have less to spend. This is precipitating the decline that began in the nineties as hi-fi became stigmatised in a brave new world of glossy lifestyle magazines, style over substance as well as more other new things like computers, AV and games consoles to tempt us to part with any disposable income we may yet still have left.

The situation is no different in France where I spoke to the son of the owner of Amplitude in Tours. I was surprised to find even one hi-fi shop but aparently back in the late 80s there were 17 of them in a city roughly the size of Derby. Perhaps the decline in the number of dealers is both inevitable and serves as a form of natural justice.

However, there are one or two dealers out there that genuinely do add value to your purchases in making the whole of your system greater than the sum of the parts. As these few dealers continue to prosper - and they are, others may follow and build on their good practice within a few years. These things tend to go in cycles.

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Sorry mate but I have to dissagree again :eyebrows:

The two system - direct or through retail are mutually incompatible unless the retail point just becomes an extension of direct sale like PC direct. The reatiler know perfectly well that unless they stop any direct sale from being successfull then they have lost the game. In the past they could do it and the cartel could kill any company stepping out of line and killing the slurp. Now, thank goodness in my opinion, they cannot stop it and it will progressively happen over the next 5 years and the recession we are going into, which in my opinion will be a big one will change buying habits for ever. Most is made in China now and the uk retailers and distributors are making over 70% of the profit in those sales, if you really saw the price you can buy in bulk from China you would be shocked. That manufacturing base (with India coming on line as well) will dominate mainstream products from cars downwards. Manufacture for us will be bespoke and *direct*, the future is the likes of Beresford and sorry to be rude but I cannot remember his name and I cannot look while writting this, the guy who makes Marcos amp, the new moderator, and myself. Bespoke supplies hobby and quality, different market to AVI and their like, they still think they can have the best of all worlds, sorry no way, if you are really good and create a market you will be copied and China and India will copy with no conscience. Bespoke and direct is the only future for this industry as it declines (in my opinion grows) into its core, its enthusiast, its real purpose, it should never have been a mainstream market.

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Originally Posted by Richard

You have a problem sir! everytime I make a generalisation or reply to someone elses post you take it as aimed at you. This is not a personal letter (and nor were the others) sent to *you* it is a reply to a forum post, which means it is addressed to the *whole* forum. So "patsy" referred to anyone willing to pay 10 grand for a speaker *in my opinion* and "up your ****" or child like behaviour wasn't even connected to you in any way or even as a reply to your remarks, it was a reply to another poster.

You are reacting and getting angry out of context. The whole world is not on your back there are others out there you know. Why do you have take it all so personally?

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Hells teeth why can you not resist the temptation to always have the last word ?

Your clarification of the use of the term *patsy* does nothing to defend your assertion that it wasn't aimed at least partly at me. Until I mentioned my budget £10K hadn't come up in this thread. So as a person willing to spend £10K on a speaker I'm lumped in with your definition and I object to being called it either directly or in your veiled manner.

Once again I must correct you, I'm not angry nor do I think the whole world is on my back. I do think however you have issues with actually taking the time to consider a point of view contrary to your own.

It was clear to me in the context of the post I made that your remarks were at least partly aimed at me. I draw this conclusion from your judgement of me in previous posts and the fact that the reply you mention was in response to Steve's rebuke regarding your treatment of me. Your referral to me as "him", I have a name clearly displayed, indicates the level of disadain you apparently have for me.

To say your replies were not addressed personally to me is also bogus as they were all based around my anecdotal post.

It's pretty easy to see through the posts you make and I don't think you are doing yourself any favours with your line of "discussion".

Cheers

Nick

Nick,

I must congratulate you on the quality of your writing in recent posts, and also some of the excellent points you've made :)

When it comes to Richard, you must remember that when he's in 'rant mode' he's making general observations that aren't directed at any one person in particular, even though it may seem that way. He's just 'going off on one' about what annoys him.

It's best to read Richard's posts with that in mind and not take them too seriously.

Richard,

Would you like me to resurrect your old ranting thread and re-establish it as a sticky? I could then merge this thread into it so you've got one area in which to do your 'ranting'?

Or are you happy with things as they are? Just let me know what you'd prefer :smoking:

Marco.

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Originally Posted by Marco

Nick,

I must congratulate you on the quality of your writing in recent posts, and also some of the excellent points you've made :)

When it comes to Richard, you must remember that when he's in 'rant mode' he's making general observations that aren't directed at any one person in particular, even though it may seem that way. He's just 'going off on one' about what annoys him.

It's best to read Richard's posts with that in mind and not take them too seriously.

Marco.

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Hi Marco

Thank you for the compliment and the advice.

I will make sure to have large quantities of salt nearby when reading Richard's rants :)

Cheers

Nick

Trust me, it's definitely recommended! :)

Marco.

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Originally Posted by Marco

Nick,

I must congratulate you on the quality of your writing in recent posts, and also some of the excellent points you've made :)

When it comes to Richard, you must remember that when he's in 'rant mode' he's making general observations that aren't directed at any one person in particular, even though it may seem that way. He's just 'going off on one' about what annoys him.

It's best to read Richard's posts with that in mind and not take them too seriously.

Richard,

Would you like me to resurrect your old ranting thread and re-establish it as a sticky? I could then merge this thread into it so you've got one area in which to do your 'ranting'?

Or are you happy with things as they are? Just let me know what you'd prefer :smoking:

Marco.

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Yeah! ok sonny, why not! do your bit for papa :smoking:

Done :)

Don't say I'm not good to you!

Marco.

I find the total disconnect between Richard in "Forum Rant Mode" and how he comes over when dealing with him as a seller of his excellent hifi goodies hugely amusing ! ;)

IME as a hifi seller he is the epitome of polite, understated, non-pushy helpfulness. As a Forum Ranter, :doh: errr .... well, you know the rest! :lol: