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Yeah, looking forward to the journey, as l posted in another thread, l am shocked you can get this kind of performance for so little and all the features is just the icing on abig fat VFM cake, l think l may have hit on some synergy with the Stanton 681 EEE/SL1200/ Cambridge 640P, this makes my music sound addictive and is much greater than the relatively modest costing sum of the parts:).
Love that expression - should be in the Ethos!Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarzan
Isn't it wonderful when you "cobble together" a collection of not too expensive audio gear and it delivers so much pleasure?
I was sent an email describing a chap's visit to a top end dealer - the sound wasn't good (Jazz at the Pawnshop didn't have the Pawnshop venue...;)) and when he told the sales guy the latter agreed, saying the amp only had 50 hours on it and the setup needed the £2000 Transparent Audio mains lead to make everything work... My entire vintage system is worth half that I reckon and I DEFINITELY have Jazz played at the Pawnshop :lol:
Hahaha, what an arse! As for Transparent mains leads, I might be getting rid of mine and swapping them for some Mark Grants. Watch this space! ;)Quote:
I was sent an email describing a chap's visit to a top end dealer - the sound wasn't good (Jazz at the Pawnshop didn't have the Pawnshop venue...) and when he told the sales guy the latter agreed, saying the amp only had 50 hours on it and the setup needed the £2000 Transparent Audio mains lead to make everything work...
Marco.
Ho Ho.....:lol:
Jeez, if a system *needs* a special mains lead to make it work, something is very wrong. All cables are just the final topping, not a fix.
£2,000 for a mains lead :scratch: think about that for a minute ' how much is an SME V ? £2,400 or for 2k you can buy a properly sorted NAS or 1200 with a good arm and cart .
There's a sucker born every minute . . .Quote:
Originally Posted by chris@panteg
If I had the cash to burn on a £2K mains lead, I'd give the money to charity . . .
Yes, it's definitely a bad day when your power cord costs more than your turntable,
Marco won't have that problem anymore when he swaps over to the Mark Grant cable.
To be fair, I know the dealer and the mains there is absolutely of the worst quality I think I've ever experienced. When I was there we used Russ Andrews Kimber mains blocks and the difference wasn't subtle. then Russ took all his sales in-house and made twice the profit for the same selling price...
Of course, the equipment shouldn't be sensitive to cr@p mains in the first place, should it???? :lol:
You'd be *far* better off spending £1800 on a PS Audio Powerplant Premier and £200 on a mains cable, trust me on this. Its effect isn't at all subtle as it isolates equipment completely from the quality of the mains.
Or what about audio mains cables from these guys, only £8 for 0.5m for the cheapest one they make although they make some other better ones for about £30. I've made my own cables in the past, both rca and mains. This one is not much more than cost of making your own mains lead.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWAX:IT
A nicely made lead for £30
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWAX:IT
I've made my own RCA leads from gold wire in the past bought off Scientific wire co for the tiny sum of £10 at the time !! Add some cotton or teflon tubing and nice locking RCA plugs and you can have a super lead with low L and C for around £30.
Only thing maybe a bit cheap about these budget leads is the screen being galvanised steel rather than thinned copper which is more flexible.
Gold is not a good conductor; silver is far better. I don't know about the e-Bay cables, personally I'll only recommend what I've heard and for me Kimber is the best. Not cheap, but not £2000 either.
I use a Silver & Gold from Audio Friendly on my Creek amp, and all sounds fine to me, though I think I got lambasted for it here because the woven cable is crap? Can't remember exactly...
Oh for goodness sake Alex, get some Mark Grants. I'm sure you can afford them and you know it makes sense ;)
Yes I know gold is worse than copper, it was an experiment at the time. I made my next leads out of gold plated silver, pure silver and the last out of copper, all solid core with a single core return wire and no screen. Thats the great thing about a bit of diy, you can try different things at low cost. They all sound different and the lower resistivity of gold is less of an effect when compared to L and C in a cable, as a result of the construction, usually the screen. Low C seems to make the biggest improvement which is why Nordorst make cables like the Red Dawn. However a screen become important on longer runs and from the pre to power amp.
David
Are the main 3 conductors woven / braided ? They do not mention that in the ad. They look OK to me. A friend of mine used to manage the test dept at RADex in skem Lancs before they shut down and transferred production to Europe. I got a bit of inside knowledge on the audio cables they supplied to certain audio manufacturers. Most were not custom orders and designs (that costs too much I guess) but standard off the shelf products that can be quickly made without re-design, re-tooling and complex testing. They just added the appropriate name on the sheath in the batch run then batch test.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex_UK
So I don't doubt some of these leads like the Belden mains cable is used in many other makes.
It's on the cards Dave! I'm a sucker for a nice cable, but £2,000? We've been here before, Kris sums up my opinion on the matter!Quote:
Originally Posted by DSJR
The dealer margins on cables are incredibly high and the £2000 mains cable I referred to is imported by Ab Sounds - say no more....
Back to the bearing PLEASE?????
Marco,
What we are seeing now'a'days,is a rediscovery of lessons which were learned in Japan 20 years ago,but which withered on the vine due to the combination of a marketing force in the West which was biased against direct drive,and the CD revolution.
I present the Yamaha GT 2000x as proof:
Yamaha had already had phenomenal success with the GT 2000.It sold very well in Japan(and the Far East).A few years later they devised to update the turntable(in conjunction with the manufacturers and co-designers Micro Seiki).The only substantial changes to the turntable itself(forget the arm for the moment)with the introduction of the 2000x was the bearing which was uprated(all I can say is that the size and diameter were larger)and the plinth was made slightly more substantial.
What speaks volumes about the GT 2000x as compared to the 2000 is that the 2000x sells in Japan today for 3 times what the GT 2000 does on the second hand market.Whatever the bearing-mod brought to the party,people are(and have been for years now)voting with their wallets to have a piece of it.
It's kind of a shame that the Direct Drive Drive sputtered and fizzled-out around that time.I'd imagine that a lot of good developments were probably blueprinted and prototyped,only to be scrapped or shelved when the maintenance of an unprofitable figurehead product was seen to be untenable.
The bright light is the small vanguard of experienced listeners with decades of exposure to a vast array of different systems and components who are prepared to say:
"Yes.These turntables sound good with no concessions needing to be made to other turntable types.They can be competitive in and above their price range."
Along with the greater acceptance of quality Direct Drive as cutting edge comes the market impetus that rewards innovators with sales because the critical mass of sales numbers can allow these enterprises to be sustained and further development can unfold.That's good for all of us.It'll be interesting to see just how good Direct Drive can get,in the next few years.
May I add that buying in direct drive motors complete with dedicated electronics on an oem basis isn't as fulfilling as buying a motor, making a case and suitable power supply, all of which can be over-charged to the consumer for, then using string or whatever to drive the platter. rather than "just" being a Matsushita sourced clone, the more profitable way of doing it puts even more individuality on things. having said that, Neil's enlightening show review seems to be full of "me too" turntable clones, so I suppose there isn't much left that could be truly inovative, except people like Arthur K and his Funky new arm-tube/wand.
Hmmm.............................................. ........................
Oh alright mark, you win :lol:
By the way, how's the Rubykon doing? I'm regressing back to childhood autochangers right now so haven't been keeping up with developments ;)
I remember a 'scientist'(remember Marco we spoke about this cult)who came out a few decades back and announced that Science(notice the Big S) had pretty much discovered 99% of all that there would ever be possible to discover. :doh:Quote:
Originally Posted by DSJR
I'm sure that he thought that there wouldn't be much innovation either. ;)
Quite a lot to tell - but I'm not sure how much I should say on a public forum (probably not much is the best policy). First deliveries are in a few weeks and most seem to have found homes (which is nice).
Whaetever happens with DD and the possible or potential of decks like the 1200 ' or even belt drive decks, LP12 ' Roksan ' WTA , its small fry and in the great scheme of things only of interest to a dwindling minority of die hards like us on here (alas) .
Hope that doesn't seem to harsh ' well it is i suppose ' but it seems to me the future is all Digital , but i for one will keep playing Vinyl to the bitter end:).
I hope Mike is doing well with his bearing and platter , Dave can't be far off with his either.
People were saying the future is digital 20 years ago, but today analogue is as strong as ever.
Hi Mark
Yes analog is still strong ' but where i live here in Banbury i don't know anyone else that buy's new vinyl ' John ' a good friend still buy's 2nd hand vinyl .
But Mark you must agree we are in a minority !
Yes, I accept that I/we are in the minority, but it has been thus for many years. On the other hand, I do know friends who still buy vinyl. I recently bought The XX's album on vinyl and also the new Antony and the Johnson's album; Andrew bought a new Porcupine Tree album and another friend bought the new Belle & Sebastian album (which I will probably also buy) - it's not hard to buy new releases on vinyl these days (much easier than it was a few years ago).
Hi Dave
as buying a motor, making a case and suitable power supply
But where would you buy the motor?? That is the big question!
Regards
Dave
You can't - not a suitable one anyway (which is why both the companies to produce new direct drive decks in the last few years had to build their own).
I'm sure you knew that though.
Not really mark, not outside our clique anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by YNWaN
Since the Technics is still in production, is it not possible to buy the motor from Panasonic on an OEM basis?
Since the Technics is still in production, is it not possible to buy the motor from Panasonic on an OEM basis?
Tried that, no joy!
Dave
Dave, please don't try to bring reality into my world :) (I do think analogue is stronger now than it was 10 years ago though - at least, I don't seem to have any difficulty buying the new releases I want.Quote:
Originally Posted by DSJR
Im always surprised how many yoof are digging in the crates beside me when im in a record shop, including young ladies:eyebrows:
I catch them looking at me wondering what Grandads buying.
Which record shops do you go to? I never find I'm rummaging through crates next to a lady. I must be going to the wrong places.
]+1 :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Beechwoods
Yesh, but you need to go the 'special' record shops, where the lighting is dim, there's a faint whiff of patchouli oil in the air, and the bearded clientele are sporting cheeky wee grins along with their sling-backs and Kaneesha tops...... :eyebrows:
Marco.
U took me to all the wrong places when I visited ;)
Yep! Thats the ones. The only benefit i can think of these days of living in London.Quote:
Originally Posted by Marco
:scratch: MN bearings (I have one :) ) have been appearing on eBay at knock down prices with a donation to charity (?), guessing you have seen this?
Well on another forum one of my earlier posts was why a bearing, worthy of a £12,00.00 turntable has been withdrawn. I got an answer of sorts. Later on another post of mine (mysteriously airbrushed out) stated that I was undecided but would be sticking with the MN bearing as there are satisfied customers world wide that like it. I suggested that as the bearing was sealed (faulty???) it could be taken apart for inspection for any faults, if any, and the results made known to at least inform us of the probs? Furthermore a section cut out of the bearing housing could be shown? The old delete button must have been pushed on my questioning without reason given to me. I was very, very careful not to infringe forum rules and I do think that points raised were well within the bounds of reason? Needless to say, as someone who bought an MN bearing, I was right piddled orf so I'm persuing my questioning over here, if thats okay? I am well aware, now, that the two gentlemen involved with the bearing would not pull the other out of shark infested waters to safety but, please, don't have the shark bight the customer.
I also questioned the use of PTFE as a thrust pad for a bearing based on John Ruggles, Audio Innovations, observation whilst involved in precision engineering... guess what, nada?
My intention is not to be provocative but to be reliably informed and educated on the matter. Another requirement is best bang for the buck?
Finally, I hope I've stuck this winge in the right forum place?
Lets be hearing from you, satisfyed and dissatisfyed with the bearing in question?
Jazz
This has been discussed in some length on this thread
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8099
Hi Jazz
I presume you're talking about the Timestep forum? You're not alone, I had my perfectly legitimate postings removed and a threatening pm sent to me asking me to 'play nice'. Presumably playing nice involves not asking any controversial questions at all. On that basis, I'm already out of there as I don't believe in censorship of that kind.
I can only speak for my MN bearing and not those posted on eBay, but based on mine alone there is nothing wrong with them. It is very well constructed and has given me excellent service to date, with a large step-up in performance over the Technics original. I'm also using the MN platter and base plate so I'm high on the curve of Techie upgrades and I've had a very good experience so far. Having spoken with Mike on several occasions he is a gentleman and clearly a very skilled engineer which shows in his products.
On the balancing side I feel honour-bound to say that Dave C has sold me various upgrades in the past including a special arm board for my Dynavector and each time I received good service from him. A shame, then, that he has treated anyone participating in this forum as suspect. His loss.
There is a vast repository of knowledge here at AoS so ask away and we'll try to answer your questions.
I'm sure a PTFE thrust pad is fine with the standard-weight platter, offering low friction and low noise, but the heavy platter obviously needs something more substantial..
Jazzbones (Ron), do I know you??????? ;)
Hi Ron
Unfortunately,some dealers and manufacturers have set up forums with the sole intention of fleecing you for as much money as possible,instead of giving impartial advice.
I'm sure if there was a problem with your bearing,Mike New would resolve this problem as quickly and efficiently as possible.
Have a read through Martins post and also the thread highlighted by John.
Hi again Martin, yup it was Timestep. Noticed the daily posts have gone down? By the way I put my post in the wrong place on AoS, the one you replied to here, it was afterwards that I read the main threads on the MN bearing. I'm still finding my way around here.Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinT
Due to time commitments I have not installed my MN bearing yet but will do so confident that its a keeper... why go down the ladder of improvements?
Thanks for the re-assurance
Jazz:)
Course you do...Saturdays at Studio **, Harpenden, general dogs body and large speaker lumper, plus sharer of excruitating high pitched vocals from the manager's party tapes, hot chilli pizzas and the aroma of garlic and morning josh sticks, etc!:stalks:Quote:
Originally Posted by DSJR
Regards DaveO,
Jazz(Ron)
Attention
To those folks who have purchased my Bearing on Ebay, You should email me for a copy of the "Installation Instructions". This is important as there are certain precautions to be taken when fitting it to your SL1200. I would include a copy here, but it is probably not appropriate.
Ello mate, "I rember you-oooooooo" (still in touch with his son...)Quote:
Originally Posted by JazzBones
So, the LP12's finally bitten the dust eh? I do remember your setup was the first I ever heard SBL's sound civilised, confirmed on later experiences in Northampton.. Gawd, that was over twenty years ago now - like yesterday although so much has happened in the meantime. Love to Bren...
Back to subject - reminiscing over for now ;)