Car (or bike) Chat!

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Originally Posted by struth

I think its a matter of planning a route more carefully. Most folk tho wont be doing 200 miles a day. The cost of buying/leasing is the problem compared to ice or hybrids. The Kia was the closest to its stated range at about 90% of stated in real life driving.

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Try this, which I hope shows how to plan from a trip from Thurso (close to John o' Groats) to Penzance (close to Lands End) - https://abetterrouteplanner.com/?pla...7-4a4545e8f126 - based on a Tesla 3.

Note that there is a suggested speed limitation (62 mph) on this proposed route - which seems a bit pointless, as there are charging points between Thurso and Perth, for example at Dornoch, Inverness and Aviemore.

For "everyday" use, electric cars seem manageable, though I test drove an Ioniq the other day, and the guys at the garage had forgotten to charge it overnight, so it was at the lower end of its capabilities. It would be a bummer to get into a car on a cold day, and discover that it couldn't even get to the nearest charging station. At least with a petrol car one can keep a spare can in a shed for this sort of situation.

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Originally Posted by dave2010

Try this, which I hope shows how to plan from a trip from Thurso (close to John o' Groats) to Penzance (close to Lands End) - https://abetterrouteplanner.com/?pla...7-4a4545e8f126 - based on a Tesla 3.

For "everyday" use, electric cars seem manageable, though I test drove an Ioniq the other day, and the guys at the garage had forgotten to charge it overnight, so it was at the lower end of its capabilities. It would be a bummer to get into a car on a cold day, and discover that it couldn't even get to the nearest charging station. At least with a petrol car one can keep a spare can in a shed for this sort of situation.

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yeah see only 7 stations in scotland, and none in n ireland. only a couple in n england until you get down to about liverpool. not exactly confidence building is it..

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Originally Posted by dave2010

. I did wonder if it would be possible to combine electric car technology with hydrogen car technology - I don't see why not. This might increase the possible range of a car, though could make for even more dangerous vehicles - with batteries which could explode, plus a gas which would be very inflammable if released from its containers.

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I thought the hydrogen was stored in liquid form, not gaseous?

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Originally Posted by Macca

I thought the hydrogen was stored in liquid form, not gaseous?

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can be both but gas is most common at moment i believe

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Originally Posted by struth

can be both but gas is most common at moment i believe

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Is it really gasesous? I need to check.

This article gives hints that it might usually be gaseous, rather than in liquid form - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquid_hydrogen
As it points out, the energy density of hydrogen is high, but the density of liquid hydrogen is very low - compared to water and petrol - so the volumetric energy density of liquid hydrogen isn't enormous.

This table shows the critical teperature and the critical pressure for a range of substances, including hydrogen - https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/g...ure-d_161.html Hydrogen won't exist in a liquid state even with very high pressures unless the temperature is at or below the critical temperature - which is around -240 degrees C, and the pressure to do that is 13 atmospheres. There may be some applications where it is useful to cool hydrogen below the critical temperature and pressurise it, but for operation under normal environmental conditions it seems much more likely that hydrogen will be in gaseous form.

Looks like it can be - but is not always - transported to the filling station in liquid form but you fill the tank with gas not liquid.

There is a potential for 'Hindenburg' style disasters https://abc7news.com/hydrogen-explos...rhood/5326601/

they were working with starch enzymes to create hydrogen from water. dunno if that was viable but it was kinda self producing

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Originally Posted by Macca

Looks like it can be - but is not always - transported to the filling station in liquid form but you fill the tank with gas not liquid.

There is a potential for 'Hindenburg' style disasters https://abc7news.com/hydrogen-explos...rhood/5326601/

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Oil/petrol can also be dangerous - remember Buncefield - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buncefield_fire

Re trips - here is another trip in Scotland - from Thurso to Portee - https://abetterrouteplanner.com/?pla...6-13998dbc36da again I think using a Tesla 3. Odd that the suggested refilling stop is only 10 minutes in Ullapool, but the final battery charge is down to 10% on arrival at Portree. I would have thought that it might be worth having lunch in Ullapool, or going round Tesco, and putting at least 30 minutes worth of electricity in. Also, I haven't actually checked that it's possible to get away from Portree, having arrived there. No point in getting to places, if one can't get back.

Apparently some chargers used to do a flat rate charge - presumably irrespective of how much was "pumped in", but now the pricing for many chargers is proportionate to the time and charge actually delivered. Seems that pricing for charging "on the road" can vary between OK/reasonable - to "I might just as well have stayed with a petrol car", though for people who charge at home the effective fuel costs can be very low.

I don't know how long it takes to charge a car, such as a Tesla, via an ordinary extension cable (13 amp), which would make going to visit friends and family a possibilty - take them a bottle of wine or whisky, and hope that they'll let you use their electricity. It might, however, mean they'd have to put you up for a week or two!

Of course, if there are electricity power failures most people are stuffed - yet again.

PS: I think the trip to Portree might have to take into account a return to Broadford, (26 miles from Portree) where there is a charging point - https://abetterrouteplanner.com/?pla...5-4ae65697f961 - not sure if there is one in Portree. 10% residual charge should just do it, but who wants to live that dangerously?

PPS: There are some charge points in Portree - https://www.zap-map.com/locations/po...arging-points/

should charge overnight ok. The superchargers tesla have can charge at a huge rate so less than an hr certainly. again tho its all liverpool down. as per usual as we and far north of england/n ireland dont have as big a population so are a bit abandoned a bit like petrol in old days.
dont think i will get one on the motability scheme anyway; certainly not one that i can fit my scooter in. but govt dont seem to have considered this. Of course there is a fair chance they will do away with it anyway now they are free to do what they want

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Originally Posted by struth

Of course there is a fair chance they will do away with it anyway now they are free to do what they want

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You're not suggesting that they're going to screw everything and us, up, by any chance, are you? :)