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To add;;;;; The Art of Sound is not about willy waving with purchases of consumer goods, (hi-fi goods), it is about how you implement them and maximise their potential i.e. getting the most from your given expenditure along the way.
Thus it's not a case of your dick being (measured) big but how you use it...
THAT, folks, is The Art of Sound.
Amen.
Well, I don't think you can separate the "faith" (I prefer alchemy) or the "science" from the equation. Since it requires both, and there is an hazy overlapping of the two, there is never going to be a consensus. Certain things can be passed off as empirical, and certain things can't. There are only things that sound "different" from each other.Quote:
HiFi snobbery is rife and particularly difficult to get past given the faith versus science nature of the debates, especially when it comes to purchase power.
The worst kind of hi-fi snobbery, is the phoney one. I would call this the Bose Factor. During a 4 year old's birthday party on the weekend, I was having a chat with an acquaintance, and the topic of audio somehow came up. He declared his allegiance to Bose, and how it is basically the final chapter in audio. Since it was a 4 year old's birthday party, I decided to bite my tongue (but I think I rolled my eyes). I just said I was a "tube" guy and that Bose wasn't really my thing. He felt obligated to encourage me to just do the right thing, and switch to Bose. He informed that 7 of his recording industry friends had ALL switched to Bose (in other words...come to their senses).
There's no point in fighting Bose marketing...you can't win. That is, until you sit them down in front of a decent set up. That's what I like about good hi-fi...you don't need "golden ears" to immediately here the difference. Some of the "faithful" just can't handle the fact that they have been wrong all this time, and you never know what strange reaction they may have. Sometimes it's better to not confront "faith".
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However, you can’t reproduce what isn’t there
Well, you can add or subtract to what was there. And that's not always bad. Depending on well a live recording was miked, mixed and mastered, the recording can sound better than the live performance because of less than perfect equipment, venue acoustics, set up, etc. I've also heard live recordings of 3 piece & quartet jazz groups in small clubs where it really did feel like I was there sitting at a table 12 feet from the stage. I think I probably like a bit of added harmonic distortion my single ended tubes add. What it boils down to is the completely unknown factor our brains contribute to the experience. It can't be part of the "science", because we don't know how to measure it.
Vanity cannot be completely illuminated...we are all a little guilty. And it probably plays a healthy role in our self esteem. But it's those "things" that we truly have an intimate relationship with that has nothing to do with other people that give us pleasure...not pleasure in vanity. Most of the things I "collect" and take great pleasure in doing so, are completely off the radar of any of my friends...nobody is impressed.Quote:
I do have a few friends who do tend to purchase luxury goods just for the sake of ownership and the prestige they believe it gives them
I think it is possible to purely concern yourself with function or utility, and I think you can purely concern yourself with aesthetics (art). But there is also the case where the two are inexplicably linked..."fashion" being the obvious one.Quote:
“because of something that thing can do” is the key point for me. Art can elicit emotion.
Audio is a strange category, as it will include people all over the map. The function & utility is not always the same for everybody(sometimes it's cost efficiency, convenience or sonics). It is possible to manufacture audio products where most the emphasis on utility...or aesthetics...or both. It's also a bit like golf...always looking for perfection, and never finding it. It's a rabbit hole you can fall very far down if you want.
I've never felt like telling anybody they were "wrong", except when it involved a hard fact (or if someone tries to make me a Bose convert). But I'll "debate" the subject till someone feels like hanging themselves.
Nice comments, Kevin. I feel like you do about Bose, and also about Apple. I rarely get into a debate about it for the reasons you state, that people get entrenched in their views and it becomes a belief system. The odd time I do demo my system to a new person I usually get a good reaction but I don't need that fix any more. I love my car for its engineering principles and the superb way it goes about transportation, but I do get accused of being a 'BMW cock' by those who think I bought it according to my class values.
I also like the engineering principles behind the hi-fi equipment I use and do certainly admit to pride of ownership over and above the great sound they make. There is a technical empathy that I get a great kick from and which I see as one of my little pleasures.
It's the little vanities and 'off the beaten track' collections that make us individual. I hardly have anyone to talk to about classical music, none of my friends having a clue, let alone my collection of Lesley Charteris 'Saint' books or my predilection for HP reverse notation calculators (I so used to love loaning it in a business meeting only to have it returned 30 seconds later without comment as they were unable to use it).
Ultimately, I discuss music with few people and hi-fi with even fewer as it is unproductive overcoming the resistance in individuals to accept that I can spend such money and get so much pleasure from them. I simply don't care any more, happy with what I have and generally enjoying it all alone.
AoS is pretty much the only outlet I need to talk about common issues and learn about new music.
Great post Martin, (edited for brevity, but had to leave in the last bit - hear hear! :))Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinT
Superb post, Martin! :)
It's contributions like that which remind me of why you're so valued here.
I'm also enjoying the debate between John and Kevin.
Marco.
If certain companies invested as much time and money into producing their products as they do in marketing, they might make something half decent...:rolleyes:
There is a website devoted to exposing Bose and their products. Anyone here know the www address ?
This one?
http://www.intellexual.net/bose.html
That's the one. Thank you.
You made me analyse my behaviour in the car. When I'm mooching along on auto pilot I play a variety of music at reasonable volume and leave the gearstick in 'D'. This constitutes most of my commuting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Toy
When I'm in tune with my car, engineering aesthetic to the fore, I play 'driving' music ('scuse the pun) which compliments my enjoyment of the country roads. The volume is set louder, my gearstick is snuck over to 'M' and I'm on the flappy paddles.
When I'm very tired I turn the music off entirely as I need all my faculties to get me home safely.
Jean Jeanie, Radar Love, You ain't seen nothing yet. You can't beat a bit of 'driving' music:)Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinT
Steve (BMW 'Cock')