Ah ok. It's normal, then. There too many thinks that need permanent connection to the mains (networked), that I only unplug them once a year...Quote:
Originally Posted by Marktdac
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Ah ok. It's normal, then. There too many thinks that need permanent connection to the mains (networked), that I only unplug them once a year...Quote:
Originally Posted by Marktdac
Stan, I notice that the Caimans are out of stock. Do you know when they will be available again?
Also do you have a release date for the USB cable you mention on the web-site?
The Caiman should be back in stock tomorrow. Mind you, there are people ordering it somehow even though I removed the ordering page:scratch:.
The USB cable is a few months away.
..and how long till the next batch of new PSU's become available Stan ?
I do have a friend visiting in a couple of weeks if you have one spare, and my mate could be my courier....
The Caiman DAC and power supply are to be offered as a combined unit, or with the TC-7520. That is separate from the 50 pieces of Caiman power supplies I put aside for AoS members to acquire at cost plus shipping.
I won't know the final price till I see the Customs documents.
PM sent, but could I send you a payment to cover the cost of a Caiman, power supply and an interconnect with some extra so that you could dispatch one to me and then refund the difference when you know the final cost of the PSU ?
Can you tell I am keen to be owning one ???
No can do I am afraid. Each Caiman owner has had to hedge their bet and snap up one as soon as it appeared in stock on my site. It would be unfair on past and future buyers if I sanctioned queue jumping:).Quote:
Originally Posted by steveinspain
Yeah i'm trying to do that by connecting it to my Sattelite box but i'm only connecting a headphone to the built in amp instead of connecting the rca outs as well since its quite a distance from the TV area to the stereo amp. Just gotta make sure it doesnt tune to an AC3 channel otherwise you get that blaring noise :)Quote:
Originally Posted by technobear
Oh well i shall wait and see if things will improve with burn-in (fingers crossed )
Is it the Nad, the drive that is feeding the Caiman ?Quote:
Originally Posted by sum1
If so, how are the connected together ? Optical, coaxial ?
Yep, the NAD is feeding the Caiman. I used the Beresford XQ Toslink as the digital interconnect. I know Coax is supposed to be superior than Toslink but currently i dont have any coax spdif cable unless i'll probably try some of my analoque interconnect cable for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Themis
No problem Stan - I wouldn't want to queue-jump either. I just read it as you having the new PSU's available for sale with new Caimen..Quote:
Originally Posted by StanleyB
I return to the bottom of the queue and wait impatiently.!
If your amplifier allows it, try some A/B tests between the two.Quote:
Originally Posted by sum1
Also, could you please detail what you mean "slow" and "veiled" ? This doesn't sound like the Caiman at all.
Normally, the NAD is a good player, though its dac is no better than the Caiman. If I remember properly (I had listened to the 542 some time ago) they should be roughly equivalent, with a slight advantage of the Caiman.
No, no point in trying a coax instead of the XQ Toslink. Unless the latter is faulty, what you describe has nothing to do with it.
And no point in trying a no-75ohm-cable (an average cable) as a digital coax: the result will be anything-but-accurate.
Well the amplifier has multiple input so it is possible to do a/b comparison but in order to do that i would need to have 2 sets of the same interconnect and currently while i have multiple sets of interconnect they are from different brand and have their own particular sound so in the end i can only do the comparison one after another for a fair comparison.Quote:
Originally Posted by Themis
As for the slow and veiled, to me currently the NAD sounded sharper and gives more punchy toe tapping sound while the caiman is smooth but dull in comparison to the NAD . To me the NAD is already leaning on the warm side of the road and currently the non burned-in caiman seems a tad warmer/darker than the NAD which surprises me as i was expecting a neutral sound. But its still too early for the caiman so i hope the caiman will become more neutral and more punchy once its burned-in.
You can try all the same :Quote:
Originally Posted by sum1
Take 2 interconnects, carefully level the output level of the NAD and the Caiman, then check the differences.
Permute the interconnects, then check again.
Levelling the output is essential to compare the two. Take your time. :)
(if you have difficulties to level the output of the two, and the Caiman is too loud, use the variable output of the Caiman, instead of the fixed).
You have become accustomed to your NAD. Send the Caiman back and stick to your NAD:). Email me for the return address.Quote:
Originally Posted by sum1
In my system the Caiman is fast and transparent just like my Transporter and just like a good £2k - £3k CD player.
If asked to describe budget NAD gear, 'slow' and 'veiled' are certainly words that would spring to mind from my personal experience of the brand. To my ears NAD has always sounded safe, smoothed over, rounded off, designed to sound inoffensive but missing much in the process. But that's just my experience. YMMV.
IMHO: sum1 needs some time to objectively decide which dac/setup fits him the best.
Habit is certainly a serious factor, but: very few people have the habit of trying/changing dacs often enough. This makes it very hard to decide which one is which in such a short period (of a few hours).
I tried to understand what he means about slow and veiled. I have an idea about it, but I'll wait for his A/B comparison feedback before getting further in explaining my point of view.
Moreover, I don't think at all that the C542 is a slow and/or veiled CD player. A tad simplifying, probably, but no less (and certainly no more to many) than other players in its price tag.
Hmm... the differences between the cables is not volume difference, its more like tonality differences so its impossible to balance it out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Themis
Yes you are right. I basically need more time to evaluate the caiman further once its burned-in.Quote:
Originally Posted by Themis
Wow thanks for the generous offer Stan but yeah i'm not giving up on it yet since its not fully burned-in.Quote:
Originally Posted by StanleyB
C542 output is at 2.2V, typically 0.2V louder than most sources (2V). I'm not saying that the cable differences are volume differences, I simply state that it is is very hard (almost impossible) to compare two different sources which have a volume difference: if the sources' sound is near enough (no "enormous" differences) , then louder will always sound "better".Quote:
Originally Posted by sum1
Hello, my name is Ron
Caiman came in today, well packed. it's burning in now
Out of the box sound: wide stage, more detail, firm bass,
so all the things reviewed in this thread are there, this first impressions make you believe, you bought something special. i'm very curious about it's development.
Thanks for the info. That makes things even more complicated for a proper comparison since my amp volume control is a stepped digital control so i would have to balance the sound out with Caiman's variable out and without a proper spl meter to measure volume balance this turns out to be more complicated than i expectedQuote:
Originally Posted by Themis
I'm afraid, yes. If your preamp doesn't allow for an input attenuation on an individual source basis, it'll be really hard. :( (although you don't really need an spl meter, your ears should be able to notice volume differences on quick a/b switching)Quote:
Originally Posted by sum1
Oh, well, nevermind. Do your best and let your heart decide ! ;)
I take your point, but I really doubt you could audibly tell the difference between 2.2v and 2.0vQuote:
Originally Posted by Themis
That equates to a 0.8 dB difference in sound level
Thanks Chippy_Boy,
I always wondered what the conversion was, but never quite enough to look it up. :scratch:
Cheers:cool:
Oh!Quote:
Originally Posted by Chippy_boy
So, it's the same 0.8dB difference between 2.0V and 1.8V, I suppose ?
And the same one between 1.8V and... 1.6V ?
How do you get to that, I wonder... I know little about that, could you explain, please ?
Anyway, the real problem, is, that I listened the other day of a NAD 525BEE player and I found it playing louder than another source. Louder enough so that the A/B test couldn't be accurately made. So, I looked at the specifications of the two sources and... I deduced it came from the output level.
You seem to say that you "really doubt" it comes from there. Ok, I don't know enough, you must be right.
But then, where did the level difference between my two sources come from ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themis
Themis! O Themis!!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decibel
I round terms 3dB represents a doubling in volume and -3dB a halving.
1dB is about the smallest increment the human ear can discern.
The logarithmic nature of the decibel more or less reflects the performance of the ear's perception.
Some surprising conclusions follow.
Think of valve days - if you are old enough. A single ended valve power amp would give 3w. The smallest push-pull amps managed 10w which was twice as loud (potentially). To double the loudness again you would need to go to 100w, and very few valve amps did, the jump was from 10w to 20, 25 or 30w - given the logarithmic nature of loudness this was only a marginal advantage.
And more. I said "The logarithmic nature of the decibel more or less reflects the performance of the ear's perception." More or less, because the ear is not a linear tranducer
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fletche...3Munson_curves
---
0.8 dB ? I haven't checked the maths!
Ah, ok. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Labarum
(levelling my cleric on Aion at the same time, I have an excuse...)
Still, I can't explain why I heard a difference the other day... I didn't imagine it, though: I knew nothing about all that. :o
A 10% higher voltage will give 21% higher power - that's a fifth more and easily audible!
(Power = volts x amps, for a fixed impedance if volts goes up 10% then current goes up 10% and therefore power goes up 21% since 1.1 x 1.1 = 1.21)
Any first impressions of the Caiman power supply?
They haven't arrived yet :(Quote:
Originally Posted by StanleyB
As I said, I didn't look at the maths. From memory (40 year old memory)Quote:
Originally Posted by technobear
For watts 10 log (P1/P2) [The 10 is there because we want the answer in deci Bels, not Bels]
For volts 20 log (V1/V2) [The 2 is there because of Technobear's point.]
gives the dB between the two signals
20 log (2.0/1.8)
according to Google calculator this is
20 log(2.0 / 1.8) = 0.915149811 dB
ie about the limit of human discernment.
This site seems to confirm my memory
http://www.astralsound.com/the_decibel.htm
Anyone more knowledgeable want to chip in?
The "limit of human discernment" is frequency-independent ?
Ooops! Spoke too soon! One just turned up :)Quote:
Originally Posted by StanleyBAny first impressions of the Caiman power supply?Quote:
Originally Posted by technobear
The system is warming up :eyebrows:
It is frequency dependent and different for each individual.Quote:
Originally Posted by Themis
Those fitted with digital hearing aids (like me) go through a testing procedure conducted by an audiologist.
How these factors affect the current discussion, I don't know.
In my primitive understanding there are three factors:
The threshold of hearing.
The threshold of pain.
The ability to discern differences in sound intensity between the two above limits.
All, I believe, vary with frequency and between individuals.
The digital hearing aid is adjusted in a number of frequency bands to optimise the energy injected into the ear without crossing the threshold of pain at any frequency. This I did not appreciate till the fitting. For years in the Army my ears were tested - the threshold of hearing at all frequencies. When the aid was fitted a second test was done to establish the maximum volume I could tolerate at any frequency. Fascinating subject, and I with I understood more.
For those with impaired hearing the difference between the threshold of pain and the threshold of hearing is reduced; which is why, perversely, the deaf cannot tolerate loud noise, and especially high frequency noise. Those with good hearing cannot understand this.
So, it seems, I didn't imagine the volume difference between the NAD 525 and the Denon dac, after all. ;)
My PSU came yesterday but I've not managed to gain exclusive access to the living room for a good listen :(
Hi guys I haven't posted on here for a while but I am still trying to make up my mind about the Caiman. I find myself something sceptical about it, not that I am not impressed with the Beresford 7510, I am. However it is because of this that I wonder just how much better it can really sound?
Let me help you as a 7510 with mods owner.....the Caiman is better....by a fair old margin.Quote:
Originally Posted by daveyboy
Agreed. The Caiman is in a different league to the 7510 - I have both.Quote:
Originally Posted by NRG
Yep, I repaired a modified 7510 here, good dac but the 7520 with Caiman mods is better by quite a bit imo
Well guys my caiman is now about 60-70 hours burned-in i know its not up to 200 hours yet but i thought i give it another go with the NAD542. This time i make sure that the caiman gets a spot at the power conditioner as well to make it a level playing field.
Gone are the slow and veiled of my first impression with the caiman. The sound now are much brighter and transparent than before although the vocals seems to take a step back than before to let the soundstage open up. Right now i would say the sound is a tad brighter on the neutral side, it kinda reminded me of the benchmark dac bright sound which can be a good and bad thing.
One weird thing about the caiman is that when i use it in conjunction with my computer i seem to notice a sound (lasted about a half a second) coming out of the box everytime i start/switch music tracks. I wonder what that sound is, maybe its also related to the small click and pop sound i get out of the headphone amp everytime i start/switch tracks as well. But what could be inside the caiman box that can produce a sound :scratch: i am thinking maybe its the clock syncing everytime you start/switch tracks maybe
Nice news ! This sounds more like my own impressions of the Caiman.Quote:
Originally Posted by sum1
I'm quite confident that the "tad bright on the neutral side" will be a souvenir when the burn-in process will complete. At least mine doesn't have it anymore. :cool:
Sorry, I don't know why the signal-lock produces a click with your computer, as it doesn't do it with my SB3... yep, it sounds like a signal-lock, for sure.
A muting relay. Normally, DACs and CD players costing less than U$2000 use muting transistors since they are far cheaper than relays. But muting transistors produce distortion, so I use muting relays. Cost ten times or more than muting transistors, but quality comes at a price if you want the best.Quote:
Originally Posted by sum1
Does that mean an electro-mechanical relay, Stan? A solenoid moving metal contacts? Or is it a reed switch in a coil? I am guessing enclosed contacts make for more reliability.Quote:
Originally Posted by StanleyB
If anyone wants to know, they are going to have to buy one of my DACs and take it apart to find out:). My products are full of trade secrets Brian. I am not going to make it any easier for my Chinese competitors to figure out how to copy my ideas.
My impressions of the new power supply are positive. It adds a bit of weight to vocals and upper bass which is what I thought was missing with the stock Caiman. There's also a slight improvement in instrument and vocal separation with slightly more stage depth. Because of this it is more engaging and enjoyable to listen to. Well done Stan. :)
Glad that you noticed it right away Neal:).
I am well known for coming up with products that are distinctive with their clear night and day approach, instead of imaginable subtle differences. I didn't want to invest time and money into the Caiman DAC and the matching power supply unless it was well worth the extra effort. Even the embossed 'Beresford Caiman' print on the PSU has no equal in terms of style and finish on any PSU from anyone else for less than a ton:smoking:.
To sub-quote one of my competitors: I don't just go and buy a third party power supply to hook up to my DAC. Why cut corners on something so important at that sort of price:mental:? My customers deserve a lot more respect than that, even if they have to wait for the end results for a few months to show up.
And my unique trademark money back guarantee applies to even the Caiman power supply:). If one can't hear an enjoyable noticeable difference, one can have a refund.
Its really nice to see relays, far better than those crappy muting transistors you see in most gearQuote:
Originally Posted by StanleyB
Thanks fellas could I also ask what in your opinion do you think is the biggest improvement i.e. is it the highs, the soundstage? the definition of notes? etc
It's the feeling of being there, when listeningQuote:
Originally Posted by daveyboy
Ron