My bits and pieces

[hoopsontoast]

Thought i would see whats happening over here :)

http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/730/image0045u.jpg

http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/5490/image0044g.jpg

http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/6448/image0046y.jpg

Teac VRDS 10SE | Teac A-BX7R | ATC SCM7 ~ Target R4 / Fostex FF225 Jericho Horns

:)

[Marco]

Hi Rob,

Welcome to AoS :)

First of all, mate, you'll need to host your system pics through Photobucket or Imageshack, rather than hotlinking direct to Wigwam, as they're currently invisible to non-Wigwam members (such as me).

Secondly, all new members are asked to pop into the Welcome area first to introduce themselves before posting pics of their system, and you've done it the other way round.... ;)

Anyway, once you've done the above, enjoy and get stuck in! :cool:

Marco.

[Beechwoods]

Welcome Rob! Hope you can get your pics sorted. I wanna see your horns!

[Rare Bird]

Hi Rob
First of all welcome & secondly did you used to own an ATC Pre amp at some point ?

[MartinT]

Hi Rob - cool picture above the system! Ok, I cheated and went to HiFi Wigwam to see your piccies :)

How do you choose which speakers to listen to?

[hoopsontoast]

Opps oh well, i dived in at the deep end!

Pics changed, i was being lazy!

I have never owned any ATC electronics.

And only just got the horns in the last week so not had a chance to decide really, the horns are still the new toy :)

[SimontY]

I expect the horns will be quite the polar opposite of the little ATCs! Very interesting, and I love your picture...

[hoopsontoast]

Yeah they are, having played with a new pair of monoblocks, i think i prefer the little ATC's with a good 250w up them!

[SimontY]

ATCs take some beating IMO! Other than being a little bland dynamically (especially in the bass) they're all superb from what I've heard.

[hoopsontoast]

I think they do dynamics really well (for their size and with a suitably BIG amp). They really do respond to some good clean watts up them! (250w Mono-blocks did the trick!)

[SimontY]

I realise that but even on a big amp they have their faults. Those faults just happen to be less than almost any rival speakers for similar money (IMHO). They are still just a basic boxed speaker than sprays sound in all directions causing havoc with in-room sound... done using better drivers than most!!!!

[hoopsontoast]

Oh yes, they are not perfect, but for under £600 i have not heard any better from a similar sized speaker that will work in a smaller room. :)
I think they do derserve a slighty better tweeter though, as good as the Vifa unit is (and its great for a £20 unit, it could be bettered, especially when you pay £1.8k for a SCM-19)

[SimontY]

Oh yes, the sound you get from ATC speakers is good enough to make me think twice about DIY speaker-building! Ah well, it's too late now ;)

[hoopsontoast]

I suppose I should update it.

After the Jericho horns i had this-

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5305/5626691587_6c98f3acac_b.jpg

Sony 770ES replaced the Teac A-BX7R, Sony 930QS replaced the VRDS10SE and Kord Tornado's replaced the ATC's and Jericho horns.
This was the system that was exhibited at the last Scalford Hall show (although then I still had the VRDS10SE)

I then was about to move house, and move into a much smaller room, so the Kords were sold :( These were cracking speakers!

I bought a pair of Keesonic Kolts and Rega R1's to fit into the new room-

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3078/5729799840_242795cbc3_b.jpg

The Keesonics on the floor.

The Sony 770ES was sold, and had a Rega Brio3 for a little while, but needed cash, so it was moved on. A little T-Amp was inserted courtesy of Jerry, on Loan.

The R1's were good, but decided to change direction, and sold them both for a new DIY project-

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5152/5901851258_1408a448dc_b.jpg

Little Omnes Audio BB3.AL full range drivers. There were good fun, but was regretting selling the Keesonics, truly lovely little mini-monitors. Sort of like down scaled SCM7's.

Again, was a bit cash strapped so it was all moved on apart from the T-Amp which went in the cupboard and was without hifi for a month or two :(

After a few months, situations changed a little so i pushed the boat out and bought a Philips CD850 and a pair of SCM10's -

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6157/6178367834_baa119bb29_b.jpg

This is how the system currently stands, earlier this week i inserted a Sony TA-F448E amp, to see if it did better than the T-Amp, i prefer the latter.

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6171/6181832700_03e81b8312_z.jpg

The SCM10's mahoosive magnet-

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6152/6182083854_e5ce1016ff_z.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6161/6182097618_e3a4d4f630_z.jpg

And thats it so far :)

[DSJR]

I can barely keep up!!!!! :)

The Celestions as stands won't be ideal in all honesty, as the bass drivers, especially the ABR, may affect the bass from the SCM10's.

The SCM10 is a bit of heaven and hell I found. Stunningly better than the likes of LS3/5A's and basically sweet natured, they have to be treated with respect on rock-n-roll if they're not to bottom out. Couple that with a severe need for good old fashined WATTS to get them going, I'd respectfully suggest some care in use. They can thrill if used within their capabilities - you'd LOVE the 20's in comparison I think :) (I've owned passive and the "Pro" active SL versions)...


P.S. The CD850 makes a FABULOUS transport for when you get your Caiman - hint hint... I used one with a Deltec PDM1mk2 back in the day :)

[Mika K]

I'm using also similar Philips as a transport and it works like a charm ;)

[hoopsontoast]

Yes, bought some bargain Target R1 stands (same that i had for the SCM7's) and picking them up on Monday :)

I dont get loud enough to worry about bottoming out the bass drivers, never had that problem with the SCM7s and they use the same sized mid-bass driver.

A quick comparison between the 10's and 7's -

Now to compare the SCM10's to the modern SCM7's, i think the older 10's with the different tweeter, are a little easier on the ears, the main failing of the 7's was the slightly strident treble at times, the 10's seem a bit smoother, a better compromise IMO. They feel slightly better built (less cabinet vibrations) but do seem a little closed in, but the room, CDP and Amp are completely different. They look nicer in the Rosewood versus the Cherry on the 7's as well.
They certainly sound more focused (soundstage definition) when the grilles are on, the opposite of the 7's from memory.

[DSJR]

I'm answering one thread while you're posting on the other :)

The 10's were far more expensive to make and that's one reason why they were retired gracefully from the catalogue. The introduction of a much cheaper driver from Focal which was at least as good must have helped things along a bit too, and that's one reason why the later "budget" range of ATC's came along. the original 7's were horrid, sounding scrappy and rather coloured in the company of their peers, although they were re-worked quite quickly I remember. I always felt a tad more top would have helped the 10 and 20, but then, the slightly rough quality in the Vifa tweeter would have been exposed, as it was so cruelly in the 20SL Pro's I had, which despite being active, had a one-note "sparkle" all the time - could have been my particular pair I suppose?

Just get the 10's properly powered, use a heavy gauge speaker cable, say, 2.5mm minimum, a well behaved yet meaty amp and you'll be ok for now. Removing the Celestions as stands will give a massive upgrade in the bass I think and, in the meantime, you could do some resorative work on the 15's? using the ATC's as a guide for tonal balance.

P.S. if you haven't done so already, ask ATC if they have any promo material and "white papers" left regarding the 10's and their speaker design s in particular. They make wonderful reading and the language isn't difficult to understand.

[hoopsontoast]

Cheers, i was trying to keep the threads separate.

Which driver was from Focal? The 10's do sound a lot smoother and well behaved than the newer 'Entry range' SCM7s. The 7's had a tendancy to sound a bit hard in the treble occasionally and slightly strident. The 10's sound very well behaved.

[DSJR]

I can't remember, but in the mid 90's, Focal introduced a 5" driver which looked to have a decent chassis and fairly chunky magnet, playing the over-specified ATC driver at it's own game and for far less money per unit. Having a short coil in a long gap can work wonders, but improved magnet circuitry can apparently make for more efficient longer coil drivers which work at least as well - apparently. This is not to damn ATC, who've made their own drivers for decades now, just showing how markets move on I reckon. I think the speaker rule-book was written decades ago, it's only now with modern materials and computer-aided design that such good results have come down in price. Sadly, it seems that Tannoy are one of the very few manufacturers left who can take a forty or more year old speaker and fully restore it and its crossover to better-than-new performance. At least owners of ATC's from the 20 upwards can have the SL drivers and improved amp packs fitted to update them, but the cost these days is profit/survival driven, whereas in "my" day, it was more of a service, if you see what I mean.

[hoopsontoast]

Cool cheers, its a shame that focal spoil their speakers with the horrible inverted metal dome tweeter, at least it has in all the Focal/Neat speakers that i have heard it in.

[DSJR]

That's JM-Lab, which I believe is a different enterprise. the driver i was thinking of had a doped black cone and looked more conventional, albeit with large magnet on the back - I'm sure it was a Focal.................

[MartinT]

Do you mean the Tioxid tweeter, as used in the original JM Lab Utopia range? I loved it on my Mezzo Utopias.

That little T-Amp is very capable - I have one on my computer setup. Doesn't go very loud without breaking into distortion, though. Mine runs a venerable pair of Videotone Minimax IIs.

[Reid Malenfant]

<snip> its a shame that focal spoil their speakers with the horrible inverted metal dome tweeter, at least it has in all the Focal/Neat speakers that i have heard it in.
Funny you should mention this but having heard possibly the same one you are on about i tend to agree. At the same time i was using the Focal inverted Kevlar tweeter & it sounded much cleaner with no breakup. I'm refering to the plain inverted titanium dome.

Do you mean the Tioxid tweeter, as used in the original JM Lab Utopia range? I loved it on my Mezzo Utopias.
Not heard the tioxid Martin so can't comment, i don't like the pre tioxid though ;)

[hoopsontoast]

We have a bit of a fight at the moment :)

I have bought back some of my old speakers, some Keesonic Kolts.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2012/5763824175_b3f455375e_z.jpg

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5068/5763824329_3acc47d9d1_z.jpg

So we have the SCM10 Vs Kolts

And the Sony TA-F448E Vs Ta2020 T-Amp Vs Bantam Gold

Pictures to follow but initially Round One to the Keesonics.

A quick comparison for the Kolts Vs SCM10's and what i remember of the SCM7's (Written elsewhere)

"Well, when i had the Kolts before, they were quite similar in the mid range presentation, being slightly recessed but very stable vocals in the soundstage. The SCM10's are more refined than the SCM7's and the Kolts, but the Kolts like the 7's have slightly more detail, as i guess they both have slightly elevated treble levels over the 10's.

There is a lack of bass depth (to be expected) in the kolts Vs SCM7's and then same again with the SCM7's Vs SCM10's. I have found that the bass is nice and tight on all Three speakers, but the Kolts seem the easiest to drive and seem a little faster than both the ATC's, but this is with lower powered amps.

The Kolts seem more open than when i previously had them, iirc the previous owner before James had replaced the Capacitors in the crossover. This seems to have helped the main problem I had with them that they were not as lively at low volumes, this mod seems to have bought them alive a bit. Although when i previously had them, I was using them with the Sony 770ES and Rega Brio3 for a while, both which seem a little warm in the midrange compared to both the T-Amps, and similar to the Sony 448E on test atm.
I attempted to solve the liveliness at low volumes with some Rega R1's but while they were better, I had a few niggling bass issues and looking back they were not as satisfying overall as the Kolts, or my memory of the SCM7's, hence the move back to eventually both.

The Proac Tablettes (older ones) I would guess have a similar presentation to the Kolts, but with deeper bass (being Ported Vs Sealed) and iirc, they are slightly warmer in the mid range, I would guess the treble is slightly more refined in the Pro-Acs as well.

It has crossed my mind, that I have potentially up to £500 stored up in the ATC's with their stands, compared to £75 with the Kolts And even if the Kolts only do 75% of what the 10's do in some areas (and I think they might be better in others) I dont think i can justify keeping them. My own DIY design, might even be a direct copy of the Kolts, having looked at the spec sheet between the Seas 11F-GX (H149) Vs the modern day CA12RCY, they are so similar, I might get away with keeping the existing crossover design, and tweaking it.
I need to take the crossover out and do a schematic to see what the X-Over point is, I guess its around 3kHz-4kHz."


:popcorn:

[hoopsontoast]

In one corner, we have the amps, the heavyweight (relativley) in the Sony TA-F448E, the featherweight TA2020 T-Amp and the Middleweight in the Temple Audio Bantam Gold. In the other corner we have the Big (relatively again) Bruser in the ATC SCM10 Vs the twinkle toes Keesonic Kolts.

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6237/6323233898_b277776ce0_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6091/6322713459_d9a3609e89_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6034/6322724057_08c73e5edf_b.jpg

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6238/6322718419_092856a3aa_b.jpg

Initial findings, using the Kolts, the Bantam is a bit more refined, the T-Amp a little more forward, especially with vocals. The Sony actually somewhere in between. With the Kolts they do seem to be less dependent on the amplifier.

[hoopsontoast]

Bit of a change, the ATC SCM10's are out, Kolts staying, Sony is sold, Firestone Audio Tube Head pre amp IN :)

[Roy S]

...and the rack's from Ikea

[hoopsontoast]

Yup, good old Corras, just got another one of their storage solutions for some LP's :)

[Roy S]

What turntable are you using Rob?

[hoopsontoast]

None atm, been without one for a year or so.
About to start a Lenco GL75 based project as soon as I find a decent and cheap donor deck.

[hoopsontoast]

Well all change, We have arriving-

Firestone Audio Tube Head Pre Amplifier
Luxman PD272 Turntable
Sure M97xE Cartridge

Just need to get the power amp sorted now....

[hoopsontoast]

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7170/6493696047_da237ddf2e_b.jpg

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7174/6493707335_3d753d12c6_b.jpg

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7024/6493719299_b461f68fff_b.jpg

[Reid Malenfant]

Very nice looking deck Rob :) Love the clean lines ;)

[Barry]

Lux always did produce some handsome-looking decks. I particularly liked their PL 131.

Nice one Rob.

Regards

[hoopsontoast]

I am really pleased with it, very stable imaging and its really quiet, no hum or rumble that I had with the Focus One previously.

[jazzpiano]

Welcome Rob. How on Earth can you listen with that spectacular distraction straight ahead?

Best,
Barry

[Rare Bird]

no hum or rumble that I had with the Focus One previously.

:scratch: Must have been something wrong with it!

[Roy S]

Got a Luxman (might even be the PD272) turntable in the loft (it stopped working but was just too good to bin). Still got the VMS20E that came out of it in one of my SL1200s.

[hoopsontoast]

:scratch: Must have been something wrong with it!

Yeah, when it was delivered to me the motor was broken, managed to fix it, but never got the springs that 'suspended' it to fit properly. The Arm while lovely to look at was a little loose as well.
It did look lovely thought!

I am really liking it, for ~£180 including the near mint cartridge, I am dead chuffed! Played the Johny Cash - Man Comes Around LP, Actually forgot I had bought this, and it was still new, sealed. Vocals and Imaging were spot on!
'Hurt' and 'The man comes around' were just chilling!

[Theo]

I enjoyed the PD272 when I had it, both for looks and sound. I added some Isonoes because I had footfall issues. It certainly helped with that, but it ruined the clean lines somewhat :)

[hoopsontoast]

I have put 3 old metal equipment cone feet instead of the standard feet, maybe sounds a little bit better, possibly, but looks a lot nicer!
Finding that the Luxman works best with the T-Amp instead of the Bantam Gold, Got the Cambridge Audio P500 to try at some point, just waiting for the pre-amp to be delivered although I think it may be lost in the postal system somewhere.

[jandl100]

Wow - that looks fabulous, Rob. :thumbsup:

I wish I'd bought it now!

[hoopsontoast]

It is lovely, There are generally one or two on eBay every week or so if you are tempted ;)

You might be able to help Jerry, I am really liking the TA2020 with the Luxman/Rotel/Sure setup, and prefer it to the Bantam Gold, Any ideas of other TA2020 based amps or similar that might fit the bill?
Really like the open and slightly forward nature of the TA2020 and bass does seem tighter, deeper and punchier than the Bantam.

[hoopsontoast]

Well all change on the Amps!
The Firestone Audio Tube Head Pre-Amp went MIA in the post just before Xmas so I got a refund on that, and the P500/RQ970BX are up for sale as I managed to get a Sony TA-F670ES in my £500 System budget.
I previously had the bigger brother, the 770ES which I really liked, but had to sell due to financial constraints. I did not really try the 770ES with the Keesonics at the time as I was using the Rega R1's mainly. It was a perfect amp for the Kord Tornados, a combo that I thought really gelled!

[hoopsontoast]

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7168/6642390237_c348b2dd81_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6642390237/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6642390237/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7031/6642397549_7ca517f919_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6642397549/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6642397549/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7151/6642383273_98bf6a28b6_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6642383273/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6642383273/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[jandl100]

Nice pics, Rob. So that Sony's the TA2020 t-amp beater? Well done, you've found one at last!

[hoopsontoast]

I think so, overall. It does not have the mid range openness of the TA2020, or the speed in the bass, but the Sony gives a bit more weight to the vocals. I need to do some more listening.
The T-Amp did go really well with the vinyl front end, where the Sony does better with the CDP. I think this is because I dont think I have got the Cart/Arm setup perfectly atm, and it sounds slightly dull and closed in, albeit great with vocal imaging.

[hoopsontoast]

Well currently playing with an Arcam AVR200 that is destined for the HT setup when I move, and decided to plug it in when I got back after Scalford, and you know, sounds not half bad.
Seems to take a leaf out of the T-Amp book with quite fast paced bass and a little more detail than the Sony at the expense of absolute bass depth and dynamics.
The soundstage/Imaging seems a little more focused at the moment with the Arcam but I think because of the incresed treble/detail. Not sure which I prefer atm, Could be the Sony overall I think as it adds a little more weight to both the bass and vocals, or the Arcam lacks a bit.
Should be an interesting couple of weeks.....

Just as I was proclaiming at Scalford that I was pretty happy and did not want to change anything!

[hoopsontoast]

Little and Large-

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7205/6982660391_235e6c3144_z.jpg

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7183/6836536340_ff1554848f_z.jpg

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7181/6982661401_de26ef159f_z.jpg

Very interesting going between the two These are the IAS prototypes that were for sale a while back that I picked up at Scalford from the wam. They use a Richard Allan CB8 (8Ohm) wide range driver.
Reminds me of the Fostex FF225K/Jericho Horns with its presentation, but not quite the dynamics and open mid range. I think they could work well with some stuffing in them, they are some sort of tuned transmission line (1/4 wave iirc).
The drivers have quite a high QTS so they could work well in an OB as well. They have the same moving mass as the little Seas 11F-GX in the Kolts!
They are quite a bit more efficient than the Kolts, roughly 92dB acording to the specs of the driver (1% efficiency)
I just need some large stands now....

[hoopsontoast]

Some more free speakers that will need to be repaired ;)

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7198/6844922770_5dcec9321e_z.jpg

Should be interesting when they are up and running!

[Reid Malenfant]

Some more free speakers that will need to be repaired ;)

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7198/6844922770_5dcec9321e_z.jpg

Should be interesting when they are up and running!
No sh*t Sherlock! Free :rfl:

Someone needs their head testing :mental:

[hoopsontoast]

Well, should not be too expensive to re-foam then.

[Reid Malenfant]

£40 tops & you'll end up with some seriously expensive speakers :D I know the original smaller AE1 (was it?) with the single bass/mid still goes for good money, but these....

You lucky bugger :partytime:

[hoopsontoast]

Yeah, seen places selling a complete kit for £27/pair of surrounds.
Anyone know what the best way to get the old foam of the driver cones, maybe something solvent based?

[MartinT]

Nice find, Rob. They should sound superb when re-foamed.

I used acetone to remove old foam & glue. You can get it in cans from boat chandleries.

[hoopsontoast]

Is that the same stuff as Nail Polish remover?

[Reid Malenfant]

Is that the same stuff as Nail Polish remover?
I'm pretty sure it is actually :) Nail polish remover may well be at a lower concentration though... It should still do the trick :D

[hoopsontoast]

Cool, will give it a try, dont judge me though ;)

[MartinT]

Nail polish remover leaves a residue - it isn't pure. Get proper acetone to ensure you remove it all before applying the new foam.

[Reid Malenfant]

Rob, you are not going to be able to remove the dust cap on the drivers so I suggest you do the following to get the best voice coil alignment.

Remove all the perished surrounds & then see how the cones sit. Then measure how far you can tip each cone north to south & east to west if you get my meaning :eyebrows:

You need to position the cones so you have maximum voice coil clearance when you fix the new surrounds on, so a little measuring & careful positioning could go a long way. Maybe a bit of masking tape to lock the cones in the desired position before applying the new surrounds at strategic points between the tape would help?

PS, use thin or should that be narrow tape? :scratch: 1/4" wide or less as used for doing curves on paintwork would be best imo...

I hope it works out for you. Take your time & you'll have a ball at the end of it!

[hoopsontoast]

Ok cheers, will see if i can get hold of some acetone.

It had occured to me about the alignment, masking tape seems the best idea.

[istari_knight]

Nice catch!

I've refoamed many a speaker & yes acetone is ideal for removing the old gunk after soaking it you can just gently peel it away with a stanley blade.

I find it best to glue the internal ring first evenly as possible then immediately after gluing the outer ring you can center the cone without shims by using a AAA battery, connect + on the battery to the + solder tab & likewise for the negative. You need to connect & immediately disconnect until its centered (normally 5-10 times) - This way it centers itself... Providing the pva hasn't set!

The best advice I can think of when refoaming is just take your time & dont panic if you make a mistake, pva is very forgiving and will let you peel away and try again a couple of times.

You may do it an entirely different way but I've had success using the above method numerous times in the past.

[MartinT]

That battery method sounds excellent, James. I can see how it would encourage the cone to self-centre.

[hoopsontoast]

Thanks chaps! And James, cheers, no worries about the Kubs, they were only going into a bedroom system anyway!

[hoopsontoast]

Thanks for the advice chaps, I wimped out and going to send them to Audio Loudspeakers, they can do them for just over £100 which seems a really good price.

[hoopsontoast]

Update with the AVR200 running as pre, and the Sony as power amp-

http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6060/6868794606_e8d75cec43_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6868794606/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6868794606/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[istari_knight]

I'm quite surprised you prefer the Arcam preamp over the Sony's.

I too recently had a play with a AVR200, Gave the thing a full service & it still sounded like a tv amp trying to play music. Just shows how room/speaker/listener dependent everything is !

...... Unless your just using it because of the remote controlled volume :D

[hoopsontoast]

Yes, having a volume control, and a remote that can be used for the CDP is a bonus!

[hoopsontoast]

New Flat, Single and system in the living room for the first time properly-

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7226/6938577368_498742ec09_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6938577368/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6938577368/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[Reid Malenfant]

Looking great Rob :) Something tells me the speaker stands aren't under a whole lot of stress :rfl:

[hoopsontoast]

Yeah the Kolts are only 3.5kg/ea :eyebrows:

[hoopsontoast]

New amp has arrived, Pics later.

2wpc SET :D

[hoopsontoast]

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8142/7113067065_fb6af2dcb6.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7113067065/)
Decware Zen System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7113067065/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7125/6966989580_7e641ce8bb.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6966989580/)
Decware Zen SE84CW (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/6966989580/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7111/7113346445_261b97679c_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7113346445/)
Zen4 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7113346445/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[Jonboy]

Very nice, how are you finding your new amp i have a soft spot for EL84's

[hoopsontoast]

I really like it, I wrote a bit of a gushing post over on wigwam last night. I am pretty chuffed!

[Rare Bird]

I quite like those Zen 2 watters.. The Wooden bases transforms the looks imho, but i'm not sure how much they are to buy.
How much you pay for the amp itself if you don't mind me asking?

[hoopsontoast]

Yeah the wooden bases are very attractive, that's a long term plan to knock one up at some point.
I was a bit under £300 including delivery, and a proper UK model, not a kit.

[Jonboy]

Yeah the wooden bases are very attractive, that's a long term plan to knock one up at some point.
I was a bit under £300 including delivery, and a proper UK model, not a kit.


Looks to be good value or sound per pound for that then :)

[hoopsontoast]

I am! Been having a play, and using it direct from the CD-850 (rather than the AVR200 as pre) and its even better, bass is even punchier and slightly deeper, seems more dynamic.

[hoopsontoast]

Denon DL-103 added to the luxman-

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5452/7187753844_8a8904b70a_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7187753844/)
Luxman PD272/ DL 103 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7187753844/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[Barry]

Denon DL-103 added to the luxman-

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5452/7187753844_8a8904b70a_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7187753844/)
Luxman PD272/ DL 103 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7187753844/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Nice - very nice!

[hoopsontoast]

Thanks, its all starting to come together now :)

[hoopsontoast]

Kord Vulcans in the house!

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8027/7263615060_70f5691840_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7263615060/)
Beauty and the Beast (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7263615060/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[hoopsontoast]

Vulcan re-Veneer-

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7231/7274740216_9513578e19.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7274740216/)
Kord Vulcan (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7274740216/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Stripped-
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8007/7272938750_1dc756b38e.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7272938750/)
Kord Vulcan (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7272938750/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Sides and top done-
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8026/7272935894_d0e0cc4c58.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7272935894/)
Kord Vulcan (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7272935894/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Just some sanding to do and thats done for the moment, will have a cork baffle.

New Amp to replace the Sony TA-F670ES/Decware Zen -

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7082/7280780080_70f5eb2d51.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7280780080/)
Denon PMA-2000AE (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7280780080/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7097/7280775590_ddb786e14e.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7280775590/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7280775590/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

:gig:

[Reid Malenfant]

Nice, Volt bass/mid & what looks like a Vifa tweeter :) I have seen those tweeters all over the place, smaller than a 25mm dome but still does the trick :D


Nice finish btw :cool:

[hoopsontoast]

Its the Volt BM220DS and Scanspeak D2008 19mm tweeter :) Similar model (Still D2008 but slightly different designation) to the ones used by Naim, Proac and Rega (R7 and R9 iirc)

[Wakefield Turntables]

i've followed your system over the past few months and its developed from something humble to something very nice. Well done mate! :)

[hoopsontoast]

Thanks, its changed a fair bit since I started on here, and had a few different rooms. Seems to be a re-occuring theme based around smaller monitor speakers (Keesonic Kolt, ATC SCM7 and SCM10, Kord Tornado and Vulcan) that I seem to come back to with a nice big Jap Integrated.

Considering the amount of kit I have had over the years, a selection on here if anyone is interested-
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/sets/72157628426948849/

:mental:

[hoopsontoast]

Progress-

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7103/7328179138_ac655015de_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7328179138/)
Kord Vulcan Cabinet (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7328179138/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8153/7328177992_a0cf86f41f_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7328177992/)
Kord Vulcan Cabinet (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7328177992/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[howlindawg]

They cleaned up very nicely Rob, good job!

[hoopsontoast]

AE2's in the house-

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7227/7348667210_7665abd8fe_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7348667210/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7348667210/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7094/7163457169_a6e6cc7b47_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7163457169/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7163457169/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[Wakefield Turntables]

i cant keep up!

[Reid Malenfant]

Mmmmm, AE2s, they look to be as good as new as well :) Nice one!

[hoopsontoast]

I have had them for around 3 months or so, but the drivers have only just come back from having new surrounds fitted. I got them for free as they needed the new surrounds and a re-spray.
The photo's are very flattering, they do need a re-spray ideally but does not bother me too much!

[Roy S]

That's a lump of an amp, got some of my kit in the same bit of furniture & thought my Sony AV amp was on the large side

http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/ss68/Lodger56/P1020538.jpg

[hoopsontoast]

Yeah, the Ikea Corras is on its last legs now, 4 house moves have taken its toll!

The Denon actually sticks out about an inch or so out the back as well as the front!

[Roy S]

Nice looking Luxman, got one myself (currently waiting to go to it's new owner)

http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/ss68/Lodger56/P1020219.jpg

[hoopsontoast]

Nice, I do have a thing for the Luxman decks, would love a PD-300 or PD-171 (iirc).

[Roy S]

Been messing about with a couple of techies but thinking about bringing this back into the mix

http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/ss68/Lodger56/P1010993.jpg

[synsei]

That's a nice system you have there Rob. I own a Corras unit too and I've found it to be a versatile piece of furniture. I've decked mine out with somewhat chunkier shelves. The pic below is from sometime ago ;)

http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af316/Sgtgrash/Hifi%20Stuff/160mkII-SMESeriesIII-Goldring900IGC2.jpg

[hoopsontoast]

Nice deck!

Not sure what to replace the corras with, I am thinking either the Apollo Aria (if I can find a S/H one) as it has the industrial look of the target stands, or the Atacama Equinox as they come up for sale often.

[synsei]

I use a four shelf Sound Organisation rack these days and the Thorens has morphed into a Techy which sits on a Target shelf. The gear has grown up a bit since then too... :)

http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af316/Sgtgrash/Hifi%20Stuff/System307-03-12.jpg

p.s. I've stopped making excuses for the state of the wallpaper... :lol:

[Pilgrim]

I've only just discovered the corras after seeing Robs (amongst others) system at scalford .
I've now got 3 of them and I'm sorted . ;)
There is a black one on eBay at the moment , how many colours did they originally come in ?

[hoopsontoast]

One Vulcan finished (the other just awaiting cork baffle and Danish Oil)

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7098/7396432534_68cd2a4810_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7396432534/)
Kord Vulcan (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7396432534/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7104/7396430526_156e92e0eb_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7396430526/)
Kord Vulcan (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7396430526/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[hoopsontoast]

:popcorn: Another couple of bits added:

Denon AU-320 SUT

Sony DVP-S9000ES (another freebie)
http://audioidiots.com/Sony/diversen/mijn/groot/2010-05-01-11-52-07.jpg
http://www.audiocostruzioni.com/r_s/sorgenti/sony-dvp-s9000es/sony-s9000-es.htm

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8017/7442589360_26a4b4f089_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7442589360/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7442589360/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[hoopsontoast]

Kord Vulcan Monitors finished and up for sale

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8439/7764139302_0d7cbd0fdd_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7764139302/)
Kord Vulcan (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7764139302/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Part One of Two on the great Amplifier Quest-
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8421/7758921870_4ddbd6a92c_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7758921870/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7758921870/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

A pair of ASL Wave 8w PP Monoblocks.

[Reid Malenfant]

I dont mind lending these out to any paid up wammer if anyone wants to try before you buy.
:donk:


:rfl:

Decent price in all honesty, definately with the stands included as well :)


You might want to edit the wammer bit, in the for sale thread to :eyebrows:


E2A:- Hmmm, looks like you have done some chopping :D

[hoopsontoast]

Oops, my bad. Being lazy, and just copied and pasted from the original listing.

[Reid Malenfant]

No worries, I just thought it was funny :rfl:

[Ali Tait]

Hi Mark, nice to see you around again. Hope you are well.

[Reid Malenfant]

Sorry to thread crap Rob ;)


Hi Mark, nice to see you around again. Hope you are well.
Cheers Ali, improving matey & thanks very much!

I don't think I'll ever be well :lol: :mental:

Take care bud :cool:

[hoopsontoast]

Part Two-

Icon Audio LA3

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8293/7774636360_3ef1441127_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7774636360/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7774636360/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8304/7774631746_51b68ab12d_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7774631746/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7774631746/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[Roy S]

What happened to the big Denon Amp in #92 Rob?

[hoopsontoast]

Sold it, I was great on Bass depth/dynamics but missed something in the mid-range. A little too laid back with vocals. Great all-rounder though, battleship.

[Floyddroid]

That looks like a very interesting system. I too would love to hear the horns. I owned a pair of SCM7's until recently and a little too much for my Audiolab 8000S to cope with. I sold them on as they were extremely power hungry. Good monitor speaker though. I think the horns will be a little easier on your amplifier. My guess is that you will get a huge aural picture with them. :)

[hoopsontoast]

I have not had the horns/SCM7 for almost 2 years now ;)

[Floyddroid]

What a gorgeous system. Love the way you have it set up too. Looks the dogs mate.

[hoopsontoast]

Cheers I think I may actually be on the home straight, without spending thousands on it.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk 2

[hoopsontoast]

Hopefully the last change for a while....

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8304/7807089064_3064edcb2c_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7807089064/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7807089064/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Audion Sterling Plus (KT88/EL34/KT120)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8299/7807586912_c90b920932_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7807586912/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7807586912/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[istari_knight]

Looking very nice :smoking: just need a tube output stage on the 9000es now :D

http://lampizator.eu/LAMPIZATOR/photogallery/STEPS/Lampizator.doc

[hoopsontoast]

To be honest, I am pretty happy with the S9000ES, cant fault it. :)

[istari_knight]

To be honest, I am pretty happy with the S9000ES, cant fault it. :)

Indeed, they are quite good arent they ? Also owned the older version (S7700) with the facy motorised fascia & that was superb with CD's but rather poor with DVD's but ditched them both for an Arcam DV27a in the end.

[chelsea]

To be honest, I am pretty happy with the S9000ES, cant fault it. :)

So what amp for september.;)

[hoopsontoast]

At this rate, a t-amp, its boiling! Honestly, I think I may be sorted, certainly don't want to spend any more anyway.

[jandl100]

Whoa - I just caught up with this thread - boxswap mania - I know a Master of the Art when I see one! :eyebrows:

So what did you think of those AE2 speakers, Rob? -- yeah, I know it's a while back! - I think they are very hard to drive to get the best out of them,.

[hoopsontoast]

Jerry, its been a busy few months ;)

Yeah they were nice, not as open in the midrange as the Kolts, and I did not need the extra output/spl that they could provide.

[jandl100]

Hmm - yeah, fair enough.

I had a feeling with the AE2's that there was always something more to be had, but I couldn't quite find a way to get at it! Quite a frustrating speaker, I thought it should sound better than it did. :scratch: It sounded somehow like a big speaker trapped in a small cabinet! :)

[hoopsontoast]

Yeah, I think I may be just about there though, The Icon/Audion combo is really nice, the Audion is not as impressive as the ASL's seem initially, but it makes everything sound just right, rather than one or two things WOW and the rest frustrating.
The Audion is a beast though, runs very hot!
Leaning towards the KT88 with it, but the KT120 only seem to come into their own with bass heavy transients (Massive Attack, Prodigy, Orbital etc).

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8423/7813778516_3e25d79aeb_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7813778516/)
Audion Sterling Plus (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/7813778516/) by hoopsontoast (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[hoopsontoast]

I will stick my head out and say, I am now sorted for amps, the Icon / Audion is a great pairing. Bar any major life disasters I can't see me changing from that combo. Not 100% sure on the vinyl front though.
The CDP, Pre/Power and Speakers are keepers. You can quote me on that!

:mex:

[jandl100]

I will stick my head out and say, I am now sorted for amps, the Icon / Audion is a great pairing. Bar any major life disasters I can't see me changing from that combo. Not 100% sure on the vinyl front though.
The CDP, Pre/Power and Speakers are keepers. You can quote me on that!


Saved for posterity -- and subsequent "but you said ...." posts. :lol:

[hoopsontoast]

Thats the idea, I really cant see me changing. Although I have a AR D70, WAD KEL80 and AN Oto coming to my bake off! :lol:
You are more than welcome over anytime Jerry, if you are ever Faringdon/Swindon way

[hoopsontoast]

A couple of changes, new rack, phono stage and sub :)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8177/8050889076_bfa26793e8_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8050889076/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8050889076/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8453/8050887266_695a5c6493_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8050887266/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8050887266/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8315/8033151705_c0804b1213_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8033151705/)
BK Gemini II Subwoofer (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8033151705/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[Dingdong]

So how does the phono stage sound?


p.s. you should try that sub on its side on a tea towel on some granite. Might improve the sound.

[Butuz]

Yay! Phonostage! \0/

Shame I missed that!!

Butuz

[Dingdong]

Yay! Phonostage! \0/

Shame I missed that!!

Butuz

A bake off with vinyl might give you urges to give the black stuff a go.

[hoopsontoast]

So how does the phono stage sound?


p.s. you should try that sub on its side on a tea towel on some granite. Might improve the sound.

:D

And its OK, cant really compare as the last one I had was the AU-320 SUT into the Sony TA-F670es so I have not played any vinyl since I have had the LA3/Audion combo.
Sounds a bit shut in, could be the cartridge setup I think.

[hoopsontoast]

And I may actually eat my words above as there may be a BIG change in direction regarding the speakers :doh: In a few months.

:mental:

[Dingdong]

Wonder what's up next at Hoops Towers.

Always fancied a return to electrostatics meself. But my room is only 3 by 4m, so maybe a small pair.

[hoopsontoast]

Who knows what direction the wind is blowing......

Will probably change my mind again in a few weeks anyway! ;)

[hoopsontoast]

:mental:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8177/8059592292_eb78baaf8d_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8059592292/)
Magnepan MMG (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8059592292/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8452/8059593958_e31382c4d1_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8059593958/)
Magnepan MMG (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8059593958/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[dantheman91]

Very Nice. What you gonna do with the kolts now then.

[hoopsontoast]

Kolts are staying, going into a bedroom or study system, never selling these, again! ;)

[dantheman91]

Damn It!! Very fair point though. the Magnepan's look very interesting how do they sound.

:cool:

[hoopsontoast]

Sounding OK, these are the the first (supprisingly) brand new speakers I have ever owned They were boxed and sealed when I bought them.

They aparently need around 200 hours to run in so likely a long way from how they will sound in a few months.

Not sounding bad even on the Audion at low levels.

[Effem]

How's the bass on the Maggies sounding Rob?

Maggies interact with the room they are in to develop their bass output and when I had a pair a few years ago my room was just that bit too small for them to really sing, yet in my mate's house they were perfect because his listening room was just a foot longer than mine :( I suppose I could have knocked a hole in the wall and stuck me head out by a foot maybe . . . . . . . . :rolleyes:

[hoopsontoast]

Bass is good, certainly wont be needing the little Gemini Sub.

I think they will (as expected) need an amp with plenty of power!

[Effem]

It's not outright muscle power they need Rob, it's an amp that has plenty of voltage swing. I'm out of touch these days with amps that can do that, but ask the question of the wise ones on AoS to see what they think would suit

[hoopsontoast]

Will do :D

[MartinT]

It's not outright muscle power they need Rob, it's an amp that has plenty of voltage swing.

That would suit a valve amp better, then.

[Effem]

As I recall I drove the Maggies first with an Alchemist Forsetti power amp then a Hafler, which sounded better to my ears

[hoopsontoast]

The Quad doing its thing....

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8471/8087583168_6cfe70fe0b_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8087583168/)
Quad Elite Stereo (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8087583168/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[hoopsontoast]

Restek Challenger has arrived at Hoops Manor :)

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7112/8167206345_e337506e82_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8167206345/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8167206345/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8064/8167240506_65afdb32bf_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8167240506/)
Restek Challenger (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8167240506/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7107/8167238062_47d864df71_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8167238062/)
Restek Challenger (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8167238062/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[hoopsontoast]

First impressions are that it seems to have a bit more power/punch over the Icon/Quad combo maybe at the expense of some mid-range.
Still have the LA3 on loan so might try that as pre going into the Main-In on the Restek for fun at some point.
Certainly getting there, and the MMG's are still only around 20 hours old or so.

[hoopsontoast]

Better pics (less yellow ;) )

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8482/8171849508_2869054b48_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8171849508/)
Restek Challenger and Sony DVP-S9000ES (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8171849508/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8065/8176020839_2a1300a6f7_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8176020839/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8176020839/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[jandl100]

Ooo - Wow :drool:

A Restek integrated. :eek: 130wpc - hmm, yep, that should do!

I'm really enjoying my new Restek pre, so I certainly fancy trying a power amp.

You don't seem totally convinced by it, though. Need a bit more midrange bloom?

Where did you get it?

[hoopsontoast]

Its just early days Jerry, not going to make any rash judgements ;)
Also the speakers are still only about 30 hours old now so not at all run it yet either.
Was sounding great last night though.

It was offered to me from a wanted ad over on the wam.

[jandl100]

Damn, I just tried to send you a PM, Rob, but you seem to have disallowed them!
-- if you do decide to move the Restek on sometime -- ;)

[hoopsontoast]

Damn, I just tried to send you a PM, Rob, but you seem to have disallowed them!
-- if you do decide to move the Restek on sometime -- ;)

Jerry, you are first on the list ;)
Hmmmm not sure about the PM's, was receiving them fine a few weeks back :scratch:

[hoopsontoast]

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8200/8193181458_b780313213_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8193181458/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8193181458/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Well a month and a half in with the Maggies and a week and a bit with the Restek things are coming together.
I decided to move a few bits around, makes it look a lot neater with just the Amp and CDP, and I swear it sounds a little better defined in the soundstage since I put the Restek on the Marble chopping board, with sorbathane feet under that on top of the Sony . I was listening into the late hours last night and even at low volumes it seems to hold together a lot better than before.
I was a bit under the weather in the week and spent a day at home, looking forward to some good music to cheer me up but it just sounded crap, no dyamics, lifeless and was starting to think I had gone down the wrong road.
But alas feeling much better on Friday and it all seemed to come together.

Some standout tracks from last night were Dire Straits-Six Blade Knife and Private Investigations basically the whole XX - Coexist album.
They are still not so good IMO on rock, just sounds a bit flat and overall dynamics are not the best (compared to the Silver Iris OB's or FF225K Jerichos) but macro dynamics are brilliant, little delicate drums/percussion you can hear real variation in them for example which is something I really go for.

I think I would rate the Restek up there with the Sony 770ES/Denon PMA-2000Ae but a little more lively.

I was saying to Paul (sodders) when he poped in last week that I really dont know why, if you were in the US that you would buy anything else for £370 ($599) especially if you have a normal or medium room.
Their biggest problem is that they are not very sociable speakers, as if you stand up, the midrange and treble just dissapears, same if you go more than a few feet off centre but this is not a worry for me.

I decided to give the LA3 a go running as pre into the power section of the Restek and to be honest, I did not notice as big a difference as I was expecting. A lot of people had commented on the Challenger being a bit weak in the pre but decent in the power section. Apart from maybe a little more mid-range expression at the expense of bass definition I dont think it made any worthwile improvement. Which is a supprise as I found it made a massive improvement with the Audion Sterling with regards to soundstage and bass depth/definition amongst other areas.

I think I am getting there to be honest, although listening to music so much is distracting me from some other bits and bobs I should be doing.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8057/8192095557_a633dffbca_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8192095557/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8192095557/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[jandl100]

Hmmm ... sorbothane footers ... have you tried without them? I generally find that they tend to dampen the liveliness of the music, slowing things down and reducing dynamic contrast.

[stupinder]

Looking good hoops!!!

[hoopsontoast]

I am getting worse than Jerry, all change on the hoops train ;)

Going back the way of Flea SET and Efficient speakers, although not decided on the speakers yet.

[chelsea]

What was wrong with the maggies?

[hoopsontoast]

Nothing per-se, absolutely brilliant with dance, electro and 'dream-pop' (The XX etc) but just missed some life with rock and less well recorded stuff.
Love the soundstage (height and width rather than precision) and the seamless integration between the mid and treble panels.

[hoopsontoast]

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8496/8317128585_bb5d6fda24_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8317128585/)
Puresound A10 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8317128585/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8364/8318185260_997a10cbe2_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8318185260/)
Puresound A10 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8318185260/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

New amp, a lightly used Puresound A10. Little 10wpc from EL84 in PP, which is a lot compared to the Decware Zen I was originally after again.

[htm_1968]

Nice amp! Is this #5 since I bought the Antique Valvelab monos from you?

[Idlewithnodrive]

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8496/8317128585_bb5d6fda24_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8317128585/)
Puresound A10 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8317128585/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8364/8318185260_997a10cbe2_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8318185260/)
Puresound A10 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8318185260/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

New amp, a lightly used Puresound A10. Little 10wpc from EL84 in PP, which is a lot compared to the Decware Zen I was originally after again.

What happened to the flea powered SET idea Rob ? I can't keep up with you !

[hoopsontoast]

I was planning on another decware zen, but they really dont come up very often and the new model is just a bit too expensive to import atm.

[Gromit]

Aaah...I just love the look of that little A10; first time I clapped eyes on one at Deco Audio a couple of years ago it's been in the back of my mind ever since.

How does it do driving the Kolts Rob? They seemed to like a bit of current to wake them up so would be interested as to how they fare with the A10.

[hoopsontoast]

See, I dont like the way it looks, looks a bit cheap to me but then I loved the look of the Decware and thats just a box with some tubes and naked transformer so what do I know! :P
Yeah it does quite well, I think maybe not quite as well as the Zen in terms of resolution, speed and soundstage although a bit better bass but not as good as the Audion Sterling/LA3 combo in bass depth but then it is about half the price.

I seem to prefer the Kolts with tubes, having had the TA-F770ES, 670ES, Restek Challenger and PMA-2000AE with them, they tend to miss something in the midrange, seem less open and worse at low listening levels.

[Gromit]

Yup, I'd agree it doesn't exactly shout high quality in terms of fit & finish, and those wooden bits are truly awful (much rather have them gloss black) but there's something undeniably sweet about a small valve amp. It's like the KEL84, the Icon 20PP - they're the equivalent of Bonsai trees to me. Lovely. :)

Interesting your comments about the Kolts being volume-sensitive; I didn't play them loud at all (they weren't mine after all!) but the ProAcs although sounding much larger, only really come alive at higher volume with plenty of power going through. They can shout a bit though, and definitely have a voume sweet spot at which point they're wonderful.

[hoopsontoast]

Thats my point, they sound much better with tube amps at lower volumes, maybe the slight lack of control (over the SS amps) helps with the lean nature of the Kolts and fills them out a little.
The Kolts also sound a fair bit smoother in the treble with tubes, the Restek sounded thin and squeeky with them in the week that I tried them together.

Yeah the small amps are nice, the Decware was great for that, makes the Puresound look man sized!

[Gromit]

Would be interested to hear how the A10 copes when listened to at higher volumes through the Kolts. :)

[Dingdong]

Had a listen to the A10 yesterday through my speakers. Sounded pretty bloody good. Excellent vfm.

[Gromit]

Had a listen to the A10 yesterday through my speakers. Sounded pretty bloody good. Excellent vfm.

What speakers are you using, Mark?

[Dingdong]

B&W DM2a's. Had no problems driving them to decent levels. Sounded rather lovely. Didn't lose out in the bass to my Kel80's.

[Gromit]

B&W DM2a's. Had no problems driving them to decent levels. Sounded rather lovely. Didn't lose out in the bass to my Kel80's.

That's impressive, certainly bearing in mind the 2a's are around mid-80's db/w :)

[hoopsontoast]

Well been giving the Kolts some stick today (they are around ~80dB ;) ) and its not bad, not quite the composure as the Audion at higher volumes, the bass softens a little but certainly not bad. The Audion was an 18wpc SE KT88/KT120 amp so I would have expected a bit more 'reserve' over the ~10wpc EL84 PP Puresound.

Hopefully collecting some new speakers to try, they have been on the 'to-do-list' fo a good while now, some KEF Reference 104/2's which should go well, a resistive 4Ohm load and 92dB/2.83v. Will be interesting to compare.

[hoopsontoast]

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8502/8346640505_13beb5dc92_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8346640505/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8346640505/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8366/8347693958_c48d7dbc78_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8347693958/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8347693958/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[Roy S]

How do the KEFs sound Rob? Have you given up on Analogue?

[hoopsontoast]

Only got the 104/2's back this evening so still very early impressions. Not bad! As a challenge, keeping the system cost down to £500 or under, spot on budget atm.

I am in the process of finalising a design for a DIY turntable, based on a 60's Sony Broadcast deck.

[Rare Bird]

I was never a fan however i love the old '104AB' speekerz

[hoopsontoast]

Well it will be nice to tick them off my list, and if they stay long term then thats a bonus! :eyebrows:

[Jonboy]

Hi Rob, I had a pair of 105.3's which are fantastic speakers but required of bit of grunt behind them to make them sing, never really got the best out of them from valves even using a 100 watt Bill Beard P100 kt88 amp,

[DSJR]

I was never a fan however i love the old '104AB' speekerz

I thought the 104/2 horrible at the time, but I believe they were tweaked early in their life and the thick and clogged quality in the bass disappeared. later experiences of the 104/2's have all been highly positive.

Andr'e, for years the 104ab was a well kept secret with modern sources and amps, but the secret's out now and they're fetching loads of dosh I believe now, as are Concerto's and other much loved classics from this time...

[hoopsontoast]

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8326/8348285641_a91687aac2_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8348285641/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8348285641/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[jandl100]

Blimey Rob - I doff my cap :respect: - you don't half get thru some kit these days! :eek:

How do you work it? - a long list of Wants? - or just have a go with whatever comes along that takes your fancy?

(I use the latter approach to boxswapping ;))

[hoopsontoast]

Its a mix of both, the MMG's and 104/2's have been on my to do list since I got into hifi really, but never had the room to accommodate them.
I really like the mid-treble of the 104/2, but could improve on the bass control, this could be a mix of the amp and the foam rings on the bass drivers need doing. They should be with me within the week so I can get that done.

[jandl100]

Yep, my experience of KEF 105/3 is that they need an amp with serious current delivery to get the bass performance they are capable of. Without that the bass was loose and very ill-defined.

[hoopsontoast]

As if by fate, the 770ES arrives at hoops manor....

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8054/8413585911_535ec21c9c_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8413585911/)
Sony TA-F770ES (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8413585911/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

The 104/2's are in bits at the moment as one of the bass drivers is off being re-built so the little Kolts are thrust back into service.

[diceman]

Blimey the Sony 770Es delivering stork has been busy today!

[hoopsontoast]

Yeah, its like xmas has come early for those who have been good....

[hoopsontoast]

Its not the champagne supernova I was after but the Sony ES love in continues.....

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8329/8415436619_c958aba3ee_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8415436619/)
Sony ES System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8415436619/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8222/8416536908_802bb5081f_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8416536908/)
Sony ES System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8416536908/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8213/8415437363_a1825c2d04_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8415437363/)
Sony ES System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8415437363/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[Gromit]

:thumbsup:

One of these or half a Nait 2? Bwahahaaaahhahaha!!!!! :lol: :lol:

[hoopsontoast]

Yeah, it must be good value if the amps bigger than both the speakers put together (kolts and probably the Proacs I would guess ;) )

[hoopsontoast]

Bass driver should be back from Wilmslow today after being re-built, cant wait!

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8384/8456027430_f34d15aab9_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8456027430/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8456027430/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[AlfaGTV]

Wow! Beautiful pictures sir! Now, can we please see the Sony ladies undressed? ;)
Would like to see the build! :)

Regards /Mike

[hoopsontoast]

DVP-S9000ES:
http://www.hifishock.org/picture.php?/27155

Sony TA-F770ES:
http://www.hifishock.org/picture.php?/18244/categories
http://www.hifi-pictures.net/amplifiers-home/Sony%20TA-F770ES/Sony%20TA-F770ES.htm
(Thats two 18,000uf Caps and two 8,000uf caps!)

[hoopsontoast]

Well, a quick* review of the 104/2 + 770ES combo and roundup of 2012.

2012 was the year of meeting your idols.
Last year, I had the chance to visit 3 speakers that had been on my long term to-do-list now that I had finally settled into a flat that I had just bought rather than moving every year in rented houses. There was also a flurry of buying/selling as I had a little disposable income at the time and went a bit mad.

I moved from a small 8ft square room with the Kolts/670ES/CD-850 system that I took to Scalford '12 along with the Luxman PD-272 lurking in the backgroud. I then moved into a much larger room, and it was clear that the Kolts while great, would not fill the room which is to be expected considering they are not designed for bass, much like the LS3/5A, but as a broadcast monitor.

When I got them into the new room they did not do too badly (much like the room at Scalford) and I decided to stick with them and explore on the amplifier side. First up was the Decware Zen, something that had been on my radar a long time, and in short it was great, minus the ultimate SPL which was not needed with the Kolts, the soudstage was sublime, mid-treble was extended and super smooth with very tight punchy bass, great dynamics (up to a point). I thought it was better as an single input integrated rather than when I tried it with both the 670ES and AVR200 running as pre, as I needed a phono input and a few other line inputs.
Just after this I had my first bake off, which is when I managed to hear some nice kit, including a classic, the Radford STA-12 which someone bought with them, it was just lovely! And a few other bits, was great fun.

Moving on, I was offered some Kord Vulcans the smaller brother to the Tornados I had before, and at Scalford '11, they were visually challenged so were a long term project to get up and running.
About the same time I went all out and bought another item that had been on my radar, the Denon PMA-2000AE, similar beast to the Sony 770ES in terms of power, build and actually overall sound. The Decware did not really go with the Vulcans, and went with the Denon as it gave me all my inputs I needed and a decent phono stage.

Well, anyway, getting back to the 3 idols that I managed to try. I wont go into too much detail, as I have written bits in the previous pages.
First up was the Acoustic Energy AE2, I had always wanted to hear these and managed to luck out on a free pair from my old work boss, that needed new mid-bass driver surrounds.
These went well with the big Denon, nice tight bass but not as deep as I was expecting, and also a lot smoother up to than I was expecting going by 3rd party reviews of AE speakers. Much as expected elsewhere, great SPL ability and dynamics but seemed to lack any real presence in the mid-range, especially compared to the Kolts.
It was good to tick them off though, and at such a decent price (cost of the drivers) as they were not in the best condition.

The Denon and AE2's were then sold as I just bought another Dolomite and found some little ASL Monoblocks about the same time that I finally finished the Vulcans which were sold to fund them. These little 8wpc amps were quite lightweight, but not in sound, I found them to have quite boomy bass, even with the Kolts, it was improved with the arrival of an Icon Audio LA3 on long term loan. This was a revelation, soundstage was wide and the speakers just disapeared but I still had the bass niggle so went over budget and went deep into a Audion Sterling Plus with KT88, EL34 and KT120 valves.

Just before this the Sony DVP-S9000ES was added, another freebie from my old work boss. Result. Although it did spark an unhealthy obsession with Champagne kit!

This was a brilliant combo, the LA3, Audion and Kolts really hit it off, did just about everything right minus the low bass. Just lovely, really was and I even quoted "bar any major life changes, I cant seem me changing anything" which did look as if I had finally settled down!
I then added a sub into the mix, which was spot on. A BK Gemini II, cracking little sub that managed to keep up with the Kolts and really completed the package. It was also just before I decided to have a bake off (bad timing!!)
One of two stand out items at the bake off for me was the AN Oto, which I had heard a couple of times before but never in my room. Its just brilliant amongst some other really tasty kit! The other standout item was the Quad 57's that turned up, that I was looking after as part of the wam courier service, in the week or so they were here I sneaked a quick listen and was amazed, never thought they would sound as good as they did, a real revalation.

I went back to the LA3/Audion/Kolt/Gemini combo for a while and all was good until I spied number 2 of the idols list, some Magnepan MMG's. I first heard of these not long after I joined the wam and had been after some ever since but never had the money or never at the right time. Pushed by my brief fling with the 57's I jumped in and bought some MMG's that were going for a great price. It also meant that the Audion had to go to fund it.

Wow, I got a Quad Elite Stereo to power them, with the LA3 as pre and Wow was said a fair few times. The dynamics, attack, bass punch and sheer size of the soundstage was just amazing. They did seem to miss a little in the mid-range and did not sound great with modern rock/indie but I was smitten, REAL high end IMO.
After a while I had a downsize and put the LA3 to one side, the Luxman PD-272 was sold, along with the Quad power amp and I was without music for a fair few weeks waiting for the new arrival, a Restek Challenger which really went well with the MMG's.
Oodles of power, control with real attack/dynamics, something the big Sony amps just seem to lack a little. It was also slightly grating in the treble but overall was a great match with the Maggies.

I had another downsize, this time in terms of cost, where the MMG's were shipped off, back entered the Kolts, like the little super subs they are. I used the Restek with them for a while and it really did not go, sounded really thin so another move was added, a Puresound A10.
Much like the Audion and Decware, I found these tube amps to go really well with the Kolts, maybe the slight plumpness of the bass compared to the big Denon, Restek and Sony really helped fill them out a little.

This was all going well until I was tempted by number 3 on the idols list, some KEF Reference 104/2s. I plummed for the cheap pair that Leigh was selling over in Cardiff. This brings me to the end of 2012 and start of 2013 where I was using the little A10 with the S9000ES and the 104/2's.
They were great plenty of bass, and not too bad with the A10 using the 4 Ohm tap, great mid-treble integration and the bass was a bit loose. Soundstage was OK.
After a while decided to get the inner foam rings done, which was not too hard to do myself, then discovered that one of the bass drivers needed re-building.

This brings us up to now, I decided to go back to an old fav, the Sony TA-F770ES as I thought it would match the 104/2s quite well.

Now, here is the review I set out to write!

Well after the bass driver was back I had a chance to really give them some stick, and over the past few days I have!
The Kefs are the first speaker I have owned that have sounded best with no toe-in and also a lot better with the grilles on. Not sure why but it just brings everything together.
The soundstage is not quite the size of the MMG's but very good height/width considering the slightly dumpy size of them, although you dont quite get the front/back soundstage that the MMG's had. One advantage over the MMG's is that the soundstage and actual sound does not disapear when you stand up, or move around. They sound great in the kitchen and bathroom!

They just seem to sound great, on everything. I am not getting a Wow with acoustic music like I did with the Kolts/Decware, or the hairs on the back of the neck as with the MMG's on electronic music and vocals but they just seem to play music.

The bass is not as fast/tight as the MMG's, it never will be but it has a fair bit more depth although not as much as you would imagine given the size of the Kefs. They do have quite punchy bass though, really helps move the music along with some bounce. They are also slightly flattering to poorly recorded music, which is something the MMG's and Kolts are not.
Pretty good integration considering the difference in radiation with the two B110's and Bandpass/Coupled Cavity B200's.
Both the Mid and treble do really not draw attention to themselves, great integration much like the MMG's.
The 104/2s are a great speaker, maybe not as sparkly as modern stuff, or as tight bass as mini-monitors or Dipole speakers but they are a lot of fun, just seem to play music like one of my all time fav's, the big Tannoys.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8088/8454931177_0c06f03a2e_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8454931177/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8454931177/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Well am I there? Finally?
Who knows, I am very happy, with the outlay of the overall system less than the price of the MMG's I dont think I could do better for the money. I think some DIY room treatments at some point, and maybe some mains filter other tweaks etc may be in order before any other major change.

There is a niggling feeling that the Kefs would go well with some big valves, but thats well out of my price range these days, and I have the TT project to spend money on!



*Longer than I was expecting when i started!

[Alex_UK]

Very interesting (and nicely written) journey Rob - thanks for sharing. :)

[hoopsontoast]

I think in simple terms, the 104/2 do the least wrong :)

[dantheman91]

Hi

Rob could you do a right review of the IAS the you got at Scalford 2o12 would love to know what you thought of them

[hoopsontoast]

As you know, I did not have them that long but got them as they were going silly cheap. They were a lot bigger than I was expecting ;)
To be honest they were too big for my room but did not do too badly.
Nice punchy bass and good mid-treble integration from the wide range Richard Allen driver. Slightly soft on top and not the best at soundstage but that was comparing to the Kolts.

[Gromit]

I think in simple terms, the 104/2 do the least wrong :)

Nice one. :)

I'll pop in to have a listen to them on 3/3. :)

[jandl100]

Yep, I'll be joining the queue to get into the Hoops Room at Scalford!

I bet those KEFs need some serious current to really get to grips. Yonks ago, I demmed some KEF 105/3 (kind of big bruvs to yours) and they were seriously lacking without an amp with a big PSU to get them in line. Power was very much less important, Current is King for these KEFs, I reckon.
You'll have to get a very hefty valve amp to do them justice, I suspect.

[hoopsontoast]

I would agree Jerry, the little A10 gave me more than enough SPL, hell even the Decware would probably be a good match.
Would be interesting to try some at some later point.

Jerry/Richard please feel free to pop in, bring some music!

I think thats the point with the Kefs, they done excell in any particular area but seem to just be 'good' across the board.

[dantheman91]

As you know, I did not have them that long but got them as they were going silly cheap. They were a lot bigger than I was expecting ;)
To be honest they were too big for my room but did not do too badly.
Nice punchy bass and good mid-treble integration from the wide range Richard Allen driver. Slightly soft on top and not the best at soundstage but that was comparing to the Kolts.


Nice thank you i do like they are lovely i do miss the big old beaulieus which we should never of sold :doh:

[hoopsontoast]

Would be nice to hear some of the other IAS models someday!

Alltogether now....

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8243/8477980789_a96453dbfb_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8477980789/)
Hifi System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8477980789/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[MartinT]

Nice write-up, Rob. Like Jerry, I've always found that big KEFs can sound excellent provided they've got a sodding great butch amp firing up their jacksie. My brother-in-law was left a pair of the big dalek ones (105s?) and they sounded anaemic with Quad a 405 amp. I know they can sound better than that as there was a pair at last year's Scalford show sounding wonderful with a Krell amp driving them.

[hoopsontoast]

Yeah, it seems to be the general consensus about power.

I do love this combo, i am over the moon!

I wrote this on another forum.....

Well, a week since my first impressions of the Kef/Sony combo and I still stand by it. Been listening to a LOT of music and its still a great match. There are one or two bass notes that seem to boom a little, not something I had noticed with the Kolts, but had with the Vulcans and AE2's in this room for example, although the PMC DB1S+ that Andy bought over did not.
This I believe is a function of the room, so I think some room friendly tweaks are in order in the future.

One example from the week, I was listening to Dire Straits - Brothers in Arms (yes, I do love this album) and its just brilliant, the into to money for nothing is great anyway, but has some real kick in the drums! Its a reference CD mainly as I grew up with it and have listened to it through just about all my hifi systems.
Some Orbital - Wonky and U.N.K.L.E -War Stories was just pretty epic I have to say

The biggest surprise for me is that I never expected to really like these 104/2's, even though they had been on my 'to-do-list' for a good while they sort of go against all of my previous favorite speakers that tend to be 'simple' in design ethos, like the Rega speakers (R1, R3, R7, Jura), full-range-drivers like Veravox 5S or Jordan JX92 or simple 2-way bookshelves (Kord Tornado, Keesonic Kolt, ATC SCM7).
The 104/2's go against all of that, one of the most complex crossovers, 5-speaker 3-way design and from a brand that most of their speakers I had heard (current Reference, R-Series, Blade and Q-Series) had all sounded good but far too hifi and really seemed to miss the musical element.
The 104/2's have a very easy listening nature, they are slightly rolled of in the treble but certainly dont sound dull, cymbals still shimmer for example but its not in a hard, fatiguing way that I sometimes got off the SCM7's which is why I prefered the SCM10 for example.

One thing I also found is that voices have very good dynamic range, its portrayed really well (macro/micro dynamics??) so variation in certain parts of the song really help to feel like you are maybe an inch or so closer to the real

The only major downsize is that with Rock, they can sound a little slow/flat at lower volumes but that really changes when you turn it up a bit, this could be the speakers or just the general recordings of the music, Audioslave, The Pixies, Wolfmother etc for example.

The bass could be tighter, but not sure if its just me going from the MMG's/Kolts and certainly cant complain with the depth or punch though.
Only other thing is that I liked the idea originally of them as they should work quite well near rear walls and wanted some speakers that were not as room imposing as the MMG's, but after experimentation they have ended up nearly as far out into the room as them! Oh well.

So overall, I am pretty darn smitten .....

[hoopsontoast]

Big Update

Once again, the roundabout spins and going down the DIY route, in a big way!
The 770ES has gone and the 104/2's are off next weekend!

Some new speakers:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8108/8548544775_3f3e3dfed9_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8548544775/)
Eclipse TD-508 Mk1 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8548544775/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

These were offered up on the Spirit of the wam thread by Pete (Cobbler) as they had the centre domes of the full-range-drivers pushed in and too expensive to get a new pair of drivers.

I plugged them in and they sounded a little rolled off in the treble/recessed, but not too bad considering.

I had a play and managed to get them apart and have a look at the drivers. Very well built inside and great attention to detail.

I tried the old method of using a vacuum cleaner to 'suck' out the centre caps to no avail, then had a go with a craft knife to see if I could prise them out, same result.

I did find a way to pull them out in the end, using a wood screw, made a small hole in the centre and maybe one or two rotations to hold it in, then gently pulled it out. It worked sort of, there are a few creases in the cone now, and of course a small hole.

Supprisingly decent bass depth considering the size and that they are designed as Desktop speakers IIRC.
From looking inside, they also have no filtering at all, the driver is connected directly to the terminals. This also means there is no BSC, so I guess there may be some built in to the drivers response similar to the Mark Audio drivers.

They now sound a lot more balanced, maybe a little on the bright side but then I dont know what they sounded like before, overall I cant complain.

So thanks to Pete some more little toys to play with!



First of the DIY Bits.....

Turntable

Its gone through a couple of design ideas and finally made some progress....
Previous thread: http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=21257

Gone the simple route:
1x Sony TTS-3000 (Free)
1x AT-1005 MkII (£85)
1x Ortofon MC20 MkII (Free)
1x Argos Chopping Board (£15)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8226/8583785798_c5d9ee94c5_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8583785798/)
DIY Turntable (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8583785798/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8375/8582682903_0dd45fb106_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8582682903/)
DIY Turntable (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8582682903/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Todays progress:

PSU/Servo control Board:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8244/8592551824_b8887b47e4_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8592551824/)
DIY TT (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8592551824/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

The Knob is the speed variation (I belive) and the other is the 45rmp/off/33rpm switch. The Black box will have the connector to the TT with the 4x motor cables and earth on the tag board and the two feeds to the strobe on the connection block.

Rough Layout:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8375/8591448721_018c948145_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8591448721/)
DIY TT (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8591448721/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8091/8591450097_4343f2a0ba_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8591450097/)
DIY TT (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8591450097/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

So thats where the TT is as of today.

SPEAKERS

A few years back I had some Veravox 5S drivers in various cabinets including the ones I used for my 'Hoops Audio' project. I managed to track some down, and after two visits to wammer systems, it swayed my mind back to full-range-driver based speakers.

The first system was Graham's (gthang) which just sounded great, did everything right IMO even with dance/electronica tracks and a 4.5" driver and 18wpc!

Then more recently there was a visit to Andy's (ADPully) with his Audio Nirvana based wide range drivers and HA Auggie bass drivers. Just reminded me of all the best bits of the Maggies but without the need for a massive amp. They just disapeared, and would not have noticed had Andy mentioned that the RAAL ribbons were not plugged in! Excelent Soundstage.

I loved the fact that some of the speakers I have enjoyed the most have been open baffle (Quad 57, Magnepan MMG and the previous OB speakers, inc the Veravox drivers I used before). They just dissapear with the soundstage 'hanging' in the room.
I also noticed that both systems were using SET amplification for the Wide-range drivers, which was also a driver for the amp project mentioned briefly above.

My Previous pair of Veravox 5S:

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3199/3029858569_aefb883739_z.jpg?zz=1 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/3029858569/)
Veravox 5s Fullrange Driver 3/4 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/3029858569/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3052/3029858017_c0979e180a_z.jpg?zz=1 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/3029858017/)
Veravox 5s Fullrange Driver Side (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/3029858017/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Its a ~5" driver, about 93dB sensitive with a very light cone and an integrated inverted metal dome dust cap. The new pair should be with me at the end of next week.
The inital plan is to get them back in the old cabinets that I kept from the Hoops Audio to get me up and running for the moment.
The greater plan is to go OB, with a large bass driver at the bottom.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8531/8585599306_d1fd05477b_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8585599306/)
Veravox 5S (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8585599306/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

I used my previous 2-pairs in Open Baffles at the front and the second pair firing into the BiB cabinets as a rough subwoofer/bass horn. Actually worked quite well!

http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2537/3823482291_eeff7c154a_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/3823482291/)
Image0005 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/3823482291/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

The 'interim' cabinets (minus curved stand) all wired up. An old pillow and some extra stuffing to reduce the volume a fair bit, as it was originally designed for a pair of the drivers in Bi-Pole configuration:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8390/8584436179_e509d339cb_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8584436179/)
SDIM0952 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8584436179/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

From the Hoops Audio Project:
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3550/3638049871_424c866651_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/3638049871/)
PICT0208 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/3638049871/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Not sure where to go with the OB, either Active Crossover as a lot of other people use like the Behringer DCX-2496 with a Power amp or just run the Veravox's wide open and use a pair of subwoofer plate amps. I used them in OB before, and did not reach excursion as I dont tend to listen too loudly.
Moddeling on xbaffle, I should get down to 200hz, maybe a bit lower on a ~400mm wide baffle. It will be roughly 600mm wide at the bottom to accomodate the bass driver, likely to be an Eminence 15" or the like.


Amplifier

After my lust for another Decware Zen, and the chances of finding another UK model I decided to go down the DIY route. After some light pursuasion with Greame (Valvebloke) we will be doing a joint project, one each Which helps, as all the experience I have is speaker crossovers!

This is the rough plan is the ZEN Kit #1, although using a tag board rather than the printed circuit board.
http://www.decware.com/newsite/SE84CDIY.htm

There will be some added extras, two inputs, larger/upgraded output transformers with triode/ultralinear tappings, choke on the power supply, valve rectifier and one or two others IIRC that Greame might have to describe!

We will be using a larger case to accomodate the larger output transformers, and I might look at getting a nice front plate made up from work.

The Decware, in the grand scheme will be used to power the Veravox drivers in the final OB.

My initial idea, although the layout is likely to be different depending on how it goes together inside, my idea was having the circuit in a 'U' shape with the power on the left, input on the right front and output section back right.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8512/8590093632_31c1b700df_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8590093632/)
DIY Zen Render (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8590093632/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8367/8588993441_ab1bbd75c5_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8588993441/)
DIY Zen Render (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8588993441/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8508/8588993113_5b021c48f7_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8588993113/)
DIY Zen Render (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8588993113/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr



So the overall plan:

Main System:
Sony TTS-3000 DIY/Audio Technica AT1005 MKII/Ortofon MC20 MkII
Sony DVP-S9000ES
~Pre-Amplifier
~Active Crossover
Decware Zen Build
~PA Power Amp
OB speakers (Veravox 5S/~15" Eminence)

Second/Anti-Hifi room:
~Maybe an uber cheap TT at some point
~Cheap small CDP
Eagle SA-100 (temporary main amp while Decware is built)
Keesonic Kolt

Bedroom:
~Denon DM3# Mini-System
Eclipse TD-508



And Breathe :eek:

[dantheman91]

The eagle will go too a good home then

[hoopsontoast]

Hope so, should be a bit of fun. I will be using it for a month or so while the Decware is being constructed, then its going into the spare room system, which I will call 'Anti-Hifi'. The plan for this is to be cheap as chips and for late night listening, or when I want to just escape for half an hour or so. A man cave with no computers or distractions apart from a book.
Will be getting a cheap small CDP to go with the Eagle/Kolt combo, and maybe a cheap TT as well as the Eagle has a phono stage.

[jandl100]

Bloody hell, Rob, you're amazing! :eek: :lol:


Big Update
The 770ES has gone and the 104/2's are off next weekend!


Ah, well, hmmm --- I'm now free to fess up to my thoughts, I guess --- after hearing your KEF/Sony setup at Scalford I have to say that imo you were a long way from hearing what those KEFs can actually do. The Sony simply wasn't up to it. Richard/ Gromit had the same model amp in his room driving his far easier Q-Acoustic speakers and it sounded amazing, so yup it's a nice amp - but into the KEFs it didn't have the grip, it didn't have the drive. They really need a LOT of current and power and I don't think the Sony came close to delivering that!

The KEFs are the kind of speaker you can pick up quite cheaply - but then, sadly, you have to spend Big Moolah on an amp to get them to fully strut their stuff.

Mind you, you could say something similar about my current setup, as well. It sounds superb with medium/small scale music, but needs more power to flex the walls and rattle your skull. It's all horses for courses. :cool:

[MartinT]

Big KEFs driven by a Krell can sound stupendous. As you say, Jerry, they need a serious kick up the jacksie.

[hoopsontoast]

Yes it does seem to be of opinion that they need a lot of amplifier. Saying that, the levels I was playing at at Scalford are way higher than I play in my flat, so I dont think I would notice much difference at the low levels I play at home.

[hoopsontoast]

First new bit is here, the Eagle SA-100:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8405/8614133414_e5df899db4_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8614133414/)
Eagle SA-100 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8614133414/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8387/8613027155_b941c32c54_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8613027155/)
Interim System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8613027155/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Providing me with a CAC system while the various bits are being constructed. £75 all in, and thats for the Amp :) Not bad for a little SE EL84!

[jandl100]

Oooo, I do like el84 amps - usually very open and musical and quite explicit. Leak Stereo 20 comes to mind -- :thumbsup:

How's yours sound, Rob?

[hoopsontoast]

Oooo, I do like el84 amps - usually very open and musical and quite explicit. Leak Stereo 20 comes to mind -- :thumbsup:

How's yours sound, Rob?

Not as open as the A10, let alone the Decware but I would not expect it to really. Other than that, cant really fault it too much really. Sounds good though, especially for the price. Will be more than good enough for my second/anti-hifi system.

[jandl100]

mmm -- are there decent valves in it? Might be worth a bit of tube rolling? :hmm:
What valves does it take?

[hoopsontoast]

2x Edicron EL84
2x Edicron ECC83
1x NEC 6CA4

Edicron, as it happens are based in Farindon ;)

[hoopsontoast]

Veravox drivers have arrived:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8540/8618765445_2c489f7326_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8618765445/)
Veravox 5s (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8618765445/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

And plummed into their old cabinets:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8117/8619868048_5399742155_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8619868048/)
Veravox 5s (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8619868048/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8264/8618762861_37c35e0bcb_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8618762861/)
Veravox 5s (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8618762861/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8403/8618760661_ff5a672d90_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8618760661/)
Veravox 5s (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8618760661/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[Rare Bird]

Hows the Eagle '100' sound?

[hoopsontoast]

Really nice, mid-treble is great, not the deepest bass but good punchy mid-bass.
Good dynamics/attack with the ~93dB Veravox drivers so far.

[dantheman91]

i should of bought the eagle when i had the chance DOHH..

[hoopsontoast]

i should of bought the eagle when i had the chance DOHH..

Its a great little amp, especially for acoustic music and easy to drive speakers. Its limitations would probably start to show with more 'normal' speakers and heavy metal or electronic music for example.

[MartinT]

I don't know anything about Veravox drivers. Presumably they're full range? What kind of loading does the cabinet offer? High efficiency? How do they sound?

[hoopsontoast]

Veravox were and Italian company and were made by a company call ATD, who also made some very high end speaker drivers. They are now owned or at least some of their drivers are made by Expolinear in Germany:
http://www.expolinear.de/produkte/chassis/atd-serie

The Veravox drivers were also linked with Cantare, another Italian company who made/distributed drivers, its gets a bit confusing who exactly made what.:scratch:

Veravox made full range drivers, in
3" with the '3' which was also made under Omnes Audio as the BB3.AL (I have also had a pair)
5" with the '5FR', '5S' and '5X' (Double magnet Version IIRC)
7" with the '7x' designed for OB use

The 5X are around 93dB and stay withing +/-3dB throughout the range up to 12-13kHz where they drop like a stone.

The cabinet is an old one of mine from when I had two pairs of the 5S drivers and used them in a Bi-Pole configuration. It was a simple 21 Litre Ported box tuned to around 70Hz IIRC. As I am only using one pair I have filled over half the cabinet with a thick pillow and some more material to bring the size down a little, its basically an aperiodic type enclosure now.
Its not ideal but will do for the moment.
Sound much like I remember them, Still need some running in as they are basically new.

The Cabinet is not ideal and I can hear some resonance somewhere thats in the lower vocal range/upper mid bass but they play music really well. They were never the best made in the first place, 25mm MDF but not a massive amount of bracing.

Treble is nice and clean if ever so slightly elevated, compared to the Eclipse/Kolts and 104/2s anyway.

Voices really are their speciality, although on some more 'pop' recordings they can sound a bit bright/thin.

They go more than loud enough with the Eagle amp (~5wpc at a push) so the Decware should be a great match!

Certainly notice a difference between the Eclipse/Kolts at around 78dB/80dB and the Veravox's at ~93dB, much the same as the 104/2s but I never tried them with this amp. I am running these without any filtering, so not even any BSC which is why they are right up against the wall to bring a bit of bass lift.



Some measurements from another DIY'ers project using the 5X...

A comparison between the 5X and 5S here:
http://www.nbl.fi/~nbl104/tavaraa/laajakaistat/vanhat-elementit.jpg


http://www.diy-hifi-forum.eu/forum/showthread.php?t=1333&page=2

(Red trace is with a 'hole' in the baffle for a ribbon tweeter, Green trace with a flat baffle)
http://www.diy-hifi-forum.eu/forum/picture.php?albumid=163&pictureid=2091


Off-Axis response (again dip at 900Hz due to baffle as above)
http://www.diy-hifi-forum.eu/forum/picture.php?albumid=163&pictureid=2132

Waterfall plot:
http://www.diy-hifi-forum.eu/forum/picture.php?albumid=163&pictureid=2177

[MartinT]

Thanks, Rob. Very interesting and I asked because I recently used a pair of Fostex 5" full range drivers in a small speaker project for my PC. I think the lack of crossover makes such speakers have a very immediate quality to the midrange, wonderful for voice especially.

[hoopsontoast]

Yeah I would agree, although I to tend to like a wide range of speakers, including the previous 104/2s which are about as opposite as you can get to a single full-range-driver.

The overall plan is to try and get a mix of the dipole/soundstage advantages of the Maggies with the high sensitivity of the full-range-drivers, and bass depth of the 104/2s. While not getting the disadvantages like low sensitivity of the MMG's, lack of bass punch/output from the FR drivers and better bass control than the 104/2s.

[hoopsontoast]

my first foray into room treatments:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8405/8668157815_e9761805b8_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8668157815/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8668157815/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8406/8669261488_97936b97d4_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8669261488/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8669261488/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8388/8668161595_e3e4b7a467_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8668161595/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8668161595/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Certainly had a very good effect, bass is a lot more even, still not perfect though. Bit more playing around I think. :)

[MartinT]

You should find that the room sounds less 'shouty' and that finger-snapping gives less flutter echo. The big benefit will be in detail extraction in the midrange.

[hoopsontoast]

Planning a diffusor of some sort behind the sofa (listening position) and some foam panels on the front wall between the TV and speakers.

No idea why I never thought to do it before considering how cheap it can be!

[MartinT]

I have a PicturePanel behind my head and that makes a big difference to transparency and insight. Panels above and behind each speaker make a significant difference to intelligibility, the one on my TV has less of an effect, surprisingly.

[jandl100]

I have a GIK acoustic panel behind my listening chair, and that performs as Martin describes - but panels behind my MBLs were not a good idea! :nono: They worked very well with my previous Infinity ribbon hybrids, mind.

[MartinT]

GIK are good and reasonably priced. No import costs, either. I know you're making your own, Rob, but just for interest.

[hoopsontoast]

Cheers chaps, well aware of the GIK panels, there have been some for sale S/H going for £50/ea or so, so I may look into getting some S/H.

Been recommended a diffuser to go behind the listening position (sofa).

[hoopsontoast]

New stands, some Heybrook ones that fit perfectly

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7438/8716833585_ae5a5c4352_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8716833585/)
Veravox 5S Speakers (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8716833585/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

And a T-Amp has arrived courtesy of Clive, doesnt sound at all bad.
Certainly a leaner/brighter presentation compared to the Eagle, but I think thats down to the Eagles more rounded presentation at both frequency extremes.
The T-Amp will be used for backup once the Decware is built.

The Decware build it sheduled to start in the next week or two hopefully, and there may well be a new Pre-Amp in the coming weeks too!

[hoopsontoast]

New addition on the preamp front, a Chinese Doge 8:

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5469/8854670191_58b3c950e4_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8854670191/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8854670191/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Sounding really good, the remote control is nice too! Plenty of room for tube rolling with 4x 12AX7s on the Inputs and 4x 12AT7 on the Phono stage! Loads of older ECC81 and ECC83 to try!

Could be a keeper, soundstage is noticeably more focused and a little extra detail without being bright. Much the same change I got when moving to the Icon LA3.

http://www.stereomojo.com/Doge%208%20Preamplifier%20Review.htm/Doge8PreamplifierReview.htm

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8130/8854664025_6d79434b4f_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8854664025/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8854664025/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2812/8855289500_4a42a4bc6d_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8855289500/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8855289500/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

Cant wait for the Decware now! :eek:

[jandl100]

Wow - that looks mighty pretty! :drool:

-- if you feel like moving it on sometime, Rob, just drop me a line! ;)

[hoopsontoast]

Jerry, its unlikely. I wont better it for the money, or a lot more I suspect!
The Phonostage is supposed to be good too, perfect for when I get round to another TT!

I am actually not a massive fan of the looks, but it does go well with the S9000ES. Cant fault the build though, it weighs getting on for 20kg!

[jandl100]

Fair enough -- enjoy! :thumbsup:

20Kg for a pre? :eek:

-- how about a pic of its rear end and internals? :bum:

[hoopsontoast]

Jerry, some pics of one here:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/495427/review-doge-model-8-tube-remote-controlled-stereo-preamplifier-phono-stage

Not bad for a couple of hundred S/H to me! ;)

[jandl100]

Fook - bargain of the century! Well done, that man.

[hoopsontoast]

Slowly getting towards a final goal, after the excitement of all the kit that passed though my room last year, and meeting some 'heroes', the greatest hits system is starting to take form.
Of course the Doge is new/unknown but seems to be doing the trick of my previous heros, the Icon LA3 or the Audionote M2 that Mark bought over for my bakeoff!

In the past year:

KEF Reference 104/2
Magnepan MMG
Acoustic Energy AE2
Kord Vulcan
BK Gemini II
ATC SCM10 (Previous house)

Sony TA-F770ES
Sony TA-F670ES
Restek Challenger
Denon PMA-2000AE
Decware Zen
Puresound A10
Quad Elite Stereo
Icon LA3
Audion Sterling Plus
ASL Monoblocks

Luxman PD-272
Sure M97XE
Denon DL-103
Heed Questar MC
Denon AU-320
Phillips CD-850

Looking to add some stability in the system ;) Only speaker I really wanted to try but could not track down was the Rega R7 again, would have loved to have another play with them!

[User211]

The Doge 6 CD player chelseadave had was stunning - way up there and prefered by some to a Nagra at a bake off. I bet that preamp is in the same league. £200? WTF?:yesbruv:

[hoopsontoast]

Yeah I am pretty pleased with the Pre, just cant wait now to get the Zen finished.
There was some progress last week (on mine anyway):

http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2860/8893788080_8d92ed5179_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8893788080/)
Decware Zen Build (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/8893788080/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[hoopsontoast]

Finally complete:

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3791/9045538154_b9cfd6f175_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9045538154/)
Decware Zen Build (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9045538154/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7319/9043316025_253603d9f4_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9043316025/)
Decware Zen Build (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9043316025/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3830/9101109009_0fa20b82bb_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9101109009/)
Decware Zen (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9101109009/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3691/9103336080_fe7605fae1_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9103336080/)
Decware Zen (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9103336080/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3682/9101089965_61bfe53988_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9101089965/)
Decware Zen SE84 DIY Build (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9101089965/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5328/9101095315_8852fb9d7c_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9101095315/)
System (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9101095315/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3767/9093394427_86d432292f_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9093394427/)
IMGP0212 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hoopsontoast/9093394427/) by RSdesignUK (http://www.flickr.com/people/hoopsontoast/), on Flickr

[istari_knight]

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/331880/359582.jpg

Looking good ! How does it sound ?