View Full Version : mc or mm?
Ive had my technics a year now and and dont regret going the vinyl route one minute.
I need to get a power supply one day but im very happy with the sound and my ortofon 2m blue seems to gel really well with the deck.
A few weeks ago i nearly won a second hand 2m black on e bay but missed out.
Its made me think for the expense of the black, would it be worthwhile getting a moving coil. It would mean me spending £200 on a transformer mod but most analogue fans use mc carts and i cant help im missing out.
In terms of economies of scale what direction would you choose.
A black shibata stylus costs £350 these days. Am i just paying for less surface noise? Without owning a quality mc am i missing out on a totally different listening experience?
Hypnotoad
20-09-2010, 02:53
In a nut shell.
MM carts have a much more in your face sound, I call it the wall of sound.
MC carts seem to have more detail and have a gentler sound to them.
I have both and prefer the extra detail and clarity of the MC.
Let "your" ears be the judge.
Use the HiFi Hierarchy - DECK FIRST!!!!!!
The Ortofon you have will reproduce any deck upgrades quite easily I think and I'd always look at the Techie first.
MC's can perform brilliantly, but models like the Denon 103 are fussy in compatibility and higher output ones like the excellent Sumiko BPS tend to be a bit "raw" in presentation.
And then there are the London Decca's....... ;)
Hi Colin
May I suggest you re-read the 2nd line of your post and take things from there? Forget reading other peoples opinions (you know what they're like) and go with what you know.
Cheers.
Hi Colin
May I suggest you re-read the 2nd line of your post and take things from there? Forget reading other peoples opinions (you know what they're like) and go with what you know.
Cheers.
Wot eee sedd! :lol:
Thanks everyone. Very clear to me which direction to go now.
selfaddict
20-09-2010, 21:03
I assume your Icon Audio phono stage is MM only?
Instead of buying a SUT you could try high output MC cartridges first and see what you like of them. I think you cannot go wrong sticking with Icon Audio phono stages, I have read only positive feedback of them, especially the PS3. They are built in China, but designed and tweaked in UK for my understanding.
I love the little amp. Best upgrade i have made in my analogue set up.
Ive often read about the Denon 160 with the Technics but dont know if it would suit the Jelco arm i have.
Hypnotoad
21-09-2010, 02:17
I love the little amp. Best upgrade i have made in my analogue set up.
Ive often read about the Denon 160 with the Technics but dont know if it would suit the Jelco arm i have.
Better snap up the DL-160 quick as Denon has discontinued them.
What about a Dynavector 10x5?
The DL110 may be even better and is cheaper too. The 160 has a couple of gimiks like a tapered cantilever which in this design does nothing to improve matters. I liked the blue body though.....
TBH, at the time, the DL110 didn't really offer anything over a 1012GX and was very much a "me too" kind of product. It became very popular a few years ago when the £ was stronger because it was still available for £70 or less when its competition had almost doubled in price. The weaker £ and other not-so-subtle price rises by Denon or their agents has seen the price almost double in a year or so and it's no longer the bargain it was before.
Sadly for your wallet, if you want to hear what mc's can really do, it's either a DL103 with suitable shell and step-up etc, or a higher output Dynavector 10XV or the excellent but skeletal Sumiko BPS or more refined Blackbird..
Just read TNT review for the Dyna . Smooth midband and low surface noise caught my attention,as did the used one on e bay finishing tonight ( £50 at the moment, bought from your old workplace i believe , KJ west one)
I've worked at KJ twice for my sins. Once from '74 to '82 and returned for a few months to the current site just after the takeover in 1998. They were doing OK a couple of years ago I believe, but then, the sort of gear they sell (and clients they attract) tend to be in a bracket above most mere mortals - until the upgrade bug hits and the clients take a massive hit on trade-ins...
Ive often peered through the window but never been brave enough to walk in!
Hypnotoad
21-09-2010, 15:12
Sadly for your wallet, if you want to hear what mc's can really do, it's either a DL103 with suitable shell and step-up etc, or a higher output Dynavector 10XV or the excellent but skeletal Sumiko BPS or more refined Blackbird..
DSJR gives good advice.
The Denon DL-110 or DL-160 is not a major step up. I owned the DL-110 and my Benz Micro Ace is in another league altogether.
I really considered three carts when moving up from the DL-110, the Dynavector 10X5, Benz Micro Ace and Sumiko Blackbird.
The Ace won out because I picked up one really cheaply that was just run in, it is Swiss made and has most of the attributes of the highly acclaimed Glider.
The 10X5 came highly recommended from other owners though.
The Sumiko Blackbird was at the top of my list but cost more than the others (I am a cheap #$%@%). It has glowing reviews all round.
It's one cart I would love to own.
If you want to be able pin point every instrument these will do it for you.
Another thing about MC carts is that they are more forgiving of loading that MM carts.
selfaddict
21-09-2010, 18:40
Interesting findings about the Benz Micro Ace.
I recently had a chance to try it in my system and I found it very warm and musical but it was not for me. Most probably my 12" Jelco was just just too heavy for it and synergy/compliance was not there. On the other hand I had Lyra Argo at the same time and that gave me a really bad headache :(, just way too analytical and no warmth what so ever. These two cartridges were just the opposite of each other. But as always it all depends on your system and your own ears.
Thats the headache with carts. I wouldnt dream of buying a CD player or amp without trying first yet with carts you can gamble half a grand on something that just doesnt work.
selfaddict
21-09-2010, 19:15
Why don't try Sumiko Blue Point Special as recommended by Dave. There are two of those on e-bay at the moment, second hand. It should work well with lighter tonearms. And if you don't like it you can always sell it again on e-bay :).
That first sumiko one looks tempting. The Dyna is hitting the 100 mark. Ill keep my eye on it.
I'd be using a BPS or Blackbird now, but being skeletal, one must take care with them. I believe hifi dave used to buy in two for each one sale, the second one to replace the first with swiped cantilever.......
I have no doubt at all about their sonic abilities. I have no experience of the Benz models I'm afraid, so cannot comment on these.
Hypnotoad
21-09-2010, 20:00
The Benz Glider is the same, a lot of people have had bent cantilevers with those too, not sure I would want to spend a grand and worry about ruining it in a moment of carelessness.
hifi_dave
22-09-2010, 16:41
I'd be using a BPS or Blackbird now, but being skeletal, one must take care with them. I believe hifi dave used to buy in two for each one sale, the second one to replace the first with swiped cantilever.......
Correct.
That long, naked cantilever is a magnet for dusters and fat fingers but if you can be careful, it is a very, very good high o/p MC with more balls and body than the 10X in it's various guises.
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