View Full Version : This Garrard 301 seems a tad pricey.
walpurgis
01-07-2023, 10:20
301:
https://www.hificorner.co.uk/garrard-model-301-turntable.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI-_Lo4qPt_wIVVeN3Ch0-Ew9JEAQYAiABEgIWJfD_BwE#fo_c=1460&fo_k=28f1a32e17045c36bed17233c4453528&fo_s=gplauk
rmcin626
01-07-2023, 10:28
301:
https://www.hificorner.co.uk/garrard-model-301-turntable.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI-_Lo4qPt_wIVVeN3Ch0-Ew9JEAQYAiABEgIWJfD_BwE#fo_c=1460&fo_k=28f1a32e17045c36bed17233c4453528&fo_s=gplauk
Just a bit
The arm cost £3.5K on its own. Would not pay that for an arm let alone nearly ten times that for an antique record player.
Looks good though.
walpurgis
01-07-2023, 11:58
I paid £25 for the first one I owned and that included a mint SME, Leak Stereofetic, Point One and Stereo 20 plus cabinet. Mind you, that was fifty years ago! :)
Mine was about £300 with tonearm and Decca cartridge thrown in about 30 years ago.
Should have kept it!
I paid £25 for the first one I owned and that included a mint SME, Leak Stereofetic, Point One and Stereo 20 plus cabinet. Mind you, that was fifty years ago! :)
That was one hell of a bargain! :eek: I paid £25 for my SME arm, and that was about 50 years ago.
But going back to the 301, this one is much cheaper (although still overpriced IMO): https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/285350529112?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110 006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE
The arm however is an early 3009 and appears to be missing the bias weight.
narabdela
01-07-2023, 13:08
Read this and weep.
https://ripcaster.co.uk/sites/default/files/LP12-1974/lp12-1974-sales-invoice.jpg
Read this and weep.
https://ripcaster.co.uk/sites/default/files/LP12-1974/lp12-1974-sales-invoice.jpg
Still more than what I paid for my Thorens 124/II turntable and SME 3009/II arm.
£134.90 in 1974 is £1260 today.
Still cheap for a Linn Sondek with SME!
High end Hi-fi inflation does not follow the rules of normal inflation. I suppose that is true of all Veblen goods.
£135 is what my first ever system (TT, amp, speakers) cost in 1988. That's £350 today, I wonder what I could get (brand new) for that?
And the answer is
https://www.richersounds.com/denon-dp-29f-silver-cambridge-audio-axa25-lunar-grey-with-wharfedale-diamond-9-0-black.html
Denon DP-19F turntable, Cambridge AXA25 amp and Wharfedale Diamond 9. Not bad and probably better than what I got in Richer's for the same money back in '88
Actually I take that back as the TT looks like complete crap, plus you're stuck with the cartridge it came with.
My old Tensai wasn't that bad at all and would take almost any budget cartridge.
£134.90 in 1974 is £1260 today.
Still cheap for a Linn Sondek with SME!
High end Hi-fi inflation does not follow the rules of normal inflation. I suppose that is true of all Veblen goods.
True - you would have to pay around £2,000 today for a Thorens 124/II turntable with an SME 3009/11 arm.
BARGAIN! :eek:
The Garrard 301 or the Thorens 124/II ?
Wakefield Turntables
01-07-2023, 19:01
NO 301 is worth £32.5k :nono:
NO 301 is worth £32.5k :nono:
Not even one made by the Crown Jewellers since 1735? :lol:
Wakefield Turntables
01-07-2023, 20:02
Well I supposed we could make an exception....
Mikeandvan
01-07-2023, 21:47
Had a 401 once, could not get on with the clunky switches. Literally the best thing about the 1210 is that big Stop/Start pad, love it.
Literally the best thing about the 1210 is that big Stop/Start pad, love it.
Yeah I never got tired of pressing that. And the pop up cueing light in it's little stainless steel housing is excellent as well. Works of art those decks.
walpurgis
02-07-2023, 07:04
Had a 401 once, could not get on with the clunky switches.
That's what I disliked about my 401. I preferred the Goldring G88 and G99 to any of the Garrards.
I think it was Noel Keywood who revitalised the whole Garrard thing when he got his 401 going again. Hi-fi World back in the early 90s
There was always Martin Bastin making his plinths that sorted out the rumble issue but it was Keywood who popularised them again.
Don't get me wrong they can sound really good, Paul Coupe at RFC had (maybe still has) an excellent example of a restored 401, sounded very good to me.
At least the switches are metal not plastic. Plastic should have no place on proper equipment.
Wakefield Turntables
02-07-2023, 07:39
Had a 401 once, could not get on with the clunky switches. Literally the best thing about the 1210 is that big Stop/Start pad, love it.
I own both. Both are bombproof in different ways. I do agree the 401 is clunky and I would have to say the 1210 is probably the best starting deck I've ever owned.
Wakefield Turntables
02-07-2023, 07:42
I think it was Noel Keywood who revitalised the whole Garrard thing when he got his 401 going again. Hi-fi World back in the early 90s
There was always Martin Bastin making his plinths that sorted out the rumble issue but it was Keywood who popularised them again.
Don't get me wrong they can sound really good, Paul Coupe at RFC had (maybe still has) an excellent example of a restored 401, sounded very good to me.
At least the switches are metal not plastic. Plastic should have no place on proper equipment.
Yep! I remember reading Hi-Fi world and especially Noel Keywood. I started with a LP12 and then migrated over to the Idlers. I've met Martin Bastin and went to his house to pick up my 401 plinth, which I'll never sell. I wonder what Noel Keywood is doing now? Martin Bastin is still going.
I had a 401 after my 301 and felt the 301 was better built but back then (1986) I did not take things apart or fiddle with them so much. Nowadays I would have it in bits and service every nut and bolt. I think I did spray some WD40 on the 301 motor and suspension but that was about it.
The Internet forums have been a goldmine for information and nowadays I would just follow any number of folks strip down and servicing guides - ANDY?;)
willbewill
02-07-2023, 07:58
Yep! I remember reading Hi-Fi world and especially Noel Keywood. I started with a LP12 and then migrated over to the Idlers. I've met Martin Bastin and went to his house to pick up my 401 plinth, which I'll never sell. I wonder what Noel Keywood is doing now? Martin Bastin is still going.
Haven't heard anything about him since HiFi World went bust last September
Wakefield Turntables
02-07-2023, 08:00
The Internet forums have been a goldmine for information and nowadays I would just follow any number of folks strip down and servicing guides - ANDY?;)
I really really loved my 301 and 401 and will never, ever sell them. I'm very emotionally attached to both decks. I look at the 401 that was rescued from a barn, yes, it was honestly and truthfully found in a barn!!! The 301 was rescued from a garage in Barnsley and came as a bag of spares. I use both decks every week and they produce amazing music. Amazing decks which will see me out.
Wakefield Turntables
02-07-2023, 08:02
Haven't heard anything about him since HiFi World went bust last September
Maybe had enough of the HiFi things and is just chilling out with his 401 and a glass of wine? :drinking:
walpurgis
02-07-2023, 08:38
I've been full circle with turntables. Had most makes and many models, but I don't play records often now and just want a simple life these days, so a few years ago I settled on a lowly Thorens TD 150 Mk.II with its own TP13a arm. It's very well built, undemanding, works well with a broad range of cartridges and sounds very good!
The TD 150 is still an unsung hero in my opinion, grab one while you can. See: https://theturntableshop.com/opinion/thorens-td150-turntable-review/
I started with an idler wheel turntable - a Garrard SP25 Mk.II. I then wanted a 401, but had difficulty in finding one (Comet were useless), so I tried to get a Goldring G99. Again this proved difficult, but in the meantime I was given a Collaro 2010 turntable, which was a "poor man's 401". I removed the indifferent-looking arm and cut out a slot for an SME bedplate, sprayed the cream-coloured chassis black, and upgraded the motor suspension. Popped it into a plinth of my own design, keeping the rubber gasket around the rim of the chassis, and happily used it with a Shure M55E cartridge.
However, what I really wanted was a Thorens TD124 Mk.II. Unfortunately at the time Thorens had stopped manufacture of the 124, and had replaced it with the 125 (a belt drive design). But luckily the proprietors of an audio and record shop I frequented regularly had just taken one in part exchange. It was in mint condition and I bought it for less than £50. Put it in plinth, again of my own design, transferred the SME arm, and have used it for the last 33 years.
During that time I had a chance to compare it with a Linn Sondek over a period of a few months in my system. I have to say I heard no reason to change my Thorens turntable.
Eventually I acquired the ultimate idler drive turntable: the EMT 930.
Patrick Dixon
03-07-2023, 09:49
Eventually I acquired the ultimate idler drive turntable: the EMT 930.
Surely the 'ultimate' would be an EMT927. The 930 is just a toy by comparison.
I prefer the 'bakelite' chassis of the 930 over the cast aluminium chassis of the 927, with regard to vibration damping. Though I do like the idea of using a 12" arm, which can only be fitted on the 927.
Wakefield Turntables
03-07-2023, 12:41
I’ll do an EMT one day!!
i’ll do an emt one day!!
both nice looking and performing decks if you like that style. I do, but many don't
There was an EMT at the NW Show this year, wasn't in use though. It had the proper stand too.
Wakefield Turntables
03-07-2023, 18:14
Love EMT. One of the few brands I've not owned. Done Thorens, Technics, Sansui, Garrard, Lenco, and a few others. Would have to be a knackered example!
Were EMT just broadcast turntables or were they available for the consumer?
Wakefield Turntables
03-07-2023, 18:49
Not sure :scratch:
Were EMT just broadcast turntables or were they available for the consumer?
Somewhat academic now that EMT have been taken over by the Belgian company Barco and the turntables are no longer made, but in the '70s and '80s, the UK distributor was F.W.O Bauch and the EMT turntables 950, 948, 928 and 930 were available, along with the cartridges and the EMT measurement equipment.
The cartridges are still available along with new EMT badged preamplifiers.
That is the SME supplied 301 and arm.
Still grossly overpriced regardless of providence.
Wakefield Turntables
04-07-2023, 18:52
That is the SME supplied 301 and arm.
Silly money.
Lawrence001
05-07-2023, 12:44
I haven't realised this was a reissue version. Hopefully made in the UK, so compared to reissues of classic speakers when compared to their original price it's not quite so crazy. Although in those cases they have improved the speakers whereas this might be broadly the same as the original (as it was so good already).
Wakefield Turntables
05-07-2023, 13:19
I haven't realised this was a reissue version. Hopefully made in the UK, so compared to reissues of classic speakers when compared to their original price it's not quite so crazy. Although in those cases they have improved the speakers whereas this might be broadly the same as the original (as it was so good already).
i believe they are NOS that SME purchased and not new machines.
I would be surprised if they were new 301 decks.
I too doubt they are new. Would SME or its parent company have the means to cast new chassises? Even allowing for the cost of the SME arm (£3 100), £29k is an absurd price for the turntable and plinth.
could have been sitting in an sme warehouse for years of course but they may need attention before using.
Lawrence001
05-07-2023, 19:42
No they're reissue versions but not built fully from new parts. They are built from mainly NOS parts that are brought back to new condition eg sand and repaint the chassis.
I had assumed as it was a Garrard that it was an overpriced original but it's actually a "new" reissue version that I'd expect to cost a lot more (current UK manufacturing costs, dealer markup etc), that was my point.
I'm not saying it represents value for money, just that it's different from buying a second hand one and restoring it to sell on at a profit.
Wakefield Turntables
05-07-2023, 21:43
No they're reissue versions but not built fully from new parts. They are built from mainly NOS parts that are brought back to new condition eg sand and repaint the chassis.
I had assumed as it was a Garrard that it was an overpriced original but it's actually a "new" reissue version that I'd expect to cost a lot more (current UK manufacturing costs, dealer markup etc), that was my point.
I'm not saying it represents value for money, just that it's different from buying a second hand one and restoring it to sell on at a profit.
Just buy Audiograil for x10 less. Job done.
SME are desperately trying to achieve 'Veblen' status for their wares.
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