KEF R100 any good

[ramsden]

Hi everyone, recently bought these speakers in nice condition and curious about opinion of others who had an opportunity to listen to them.

Specifically interested in:
-are they easy or hard to drive
-amp matching experiences
-comparison with other speakers
-trebles extension “airiness”
-possible tweeter deterioration (is it ferrofluid based?)
-possible crossover upgrade, where to get the schematics if yes

My experiences:
Pro
-Lovely “organic” voicing (specifically lower midrange)
-size

Matching:
-not easy regarding treble extension

Against:
-airiness limited comparing to KEF Q350 or MA silver 50/100

Amps used:
-CA 851A
-Sony TA-F444ESII
-Nakamichi SR-3
-Sherwood AX-7030R

[Macca]

Not high sensitivity so will need a lot of watts if you want high levels that are clean.

Not a tough load but tough enough to show up amps with poor power supply regulation. Some AV receivers and boutique amps won't get the best out of them.

Bass drops off a cliff below 80Hz so if you want deep bass you need subs



smooth frequency response, so should have natural tonality (depending on room acoustic ofc)

I wouldn't worry about 'tweeter deterioration' they be good for thirty years or so unless you rag them incessantly.

It's quite hard to find a KEF speaker with poor performance although their sound signature is not for everyone.

https://www.soundstagenetwork.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1390:nrc-measurements-kef-r100-loudspeakers&catid=77:loudspeaker-measurements&Itemid=153

[ramsden]

Thank you for the answer.
The difference between the R100 and Q350 trebles extension is not clear to me from that though. Both CA851A and Sony have very probably some reserves touching power supply when compared to usual nowadays amps at about half of that power.

[Lawrence001]

The R series are supposed to be a step up from the Q series although the Q350 may be later. I would be surprised if the Q had a more extended treble than the R. However the R may be tuned to suit a more "mature" listener and hence be less bright and a little smoother. You might be mistaking this for less extension.

From my experience you have to give a change in speaker up to a month to get used to. If you do this and go back you might find the Q to be bright and aggressive. If you still prefer the Q then keep them.

[Macca]

The Q350 have rising response from 5KHz to past 10Khz and the R100 a descending response over the same bandwidth

Since this is the frequency range that contains 'air and space' that coincides quite neatly with what you heard.

I don't know about the MA50 or 100 but I never heard anyone say an MA speaker sounded dull ;)

[Lawrence001]

The Q350 have rising response from 5KHz to past 10Khz and the R100 a descending response over the same bandwidth

Since this is the frequency range that contains 'air and space' that coincides quite neatly with what you heard.

I don't know about the MA50 or 100 but I never heard anyone say an MA speaker sounded dull ;)Do you have a graph for that I know Kef can be laid back but I'd be surprised if it fell by a dB or more after 5khz
Yes MA make "exciting" speakers [emoji6]

[ramsden]

The R series are supposed to be a step up from the Q series although the Q350 may be later. I would be surprised if the Q had a more extended treble than the R. However the R may be tuned to suit a more "mature" listener and hence be less bright and a little smoother. You might be mistaking this for less extension.

From my experience you have to give a change in speaker up to a month to get used to. If you do this and go back you might find the Q to be bright and aggressive. If you still prefer the Q then keep them.

Perhaps you are right, the R100s are calmer and fuller sounding despite smaller boxes and smaller drivers. I will try to run them for a while..

[ramsden]

The Q350 have rising response from 5KHz to past 10Khz and the R100 a descending response over the same bandwidth

Since this is the frequency range that contains 'air and space' that coincides quite neatly with what you heard.

I don't know about the MA50 or 100 but I never heard anyone say an MA speaker sounded dull ;)

Quite interesting info, thank you.
The both MA silver 50 and silver 100 have brighter signature, yes, the 100s sounding bigger cause of 8” driver, but at the same time somehow similar (but even bigger) to Q350. I don’t have them anymore, so can not directly compare. The Silver 50s midrange sounds better then 100s to me, the box is much smaller then 100s and even smaller then R100s. Also midbass driver is smaller, about 4.6”, and for that size, they sound very good, but different.
Still more energy is flowing from tweeters from both MAs, and I don’t need as much. The woofer of MA50s seems to have very low distortion to these ears though.
Of all of these speakers the R100s have that charming midrange range which gives some instruments like electric bass guitar, piano, strings the right timbre, which is unfortunately incomplete without proper treble extension (I can forgive bass extension with years).. that’s why this exploration..

[Macca]

Do you have a graph for that I know Kef can be laid back but I'd be surprised if it fell by a dB or more after 5khz
Yes MA make "exciting" speakers [emoji6]

link was in my first post but here it is again https://www.soundstagenetwork.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1390:nrc-measurements-kef-r100-loudspeakers&catid=77:loudspeaker-measurements&Itemid=153

It doesn't take more than a dB or two to make a pretty obvious difference if it's across enough bandwidth.

Q150 is here

https://www.stereophile.com/content/kef-q350-loudspeaker-measurements

and here https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/kef-q350-speaker-review.13484/

(Klippel shows it as flatter but still no roll-off like the R100)

[Macca]

Quite interesting info, thank you.
The both MA silver 50 and silver 100 have brighter signature, yes, the 100s sounding bigger cause of 8” driver, but at the same time somehow similar (but even bigger) to Q350. I don’t have them anymore, so can not directly compare. The Silver 50s midrange sounds better then 100s to me, the box is much smaller then 100s and even smaller then R100s. Also midbass driver is smaller, about 4.6”, and for that size, they sound very good, but different.
Still more energy is flowing from tweeters from both MAs, and I don’t need as much. The woofer of MA50s seems to have very low distortion to these ears though.
Of all of these speakers the R100s have that charming midrange range which gives some instruments like electric bass guitar, piano, strings the right timbre, which is unfortunately incomplete without proper treble extension (I can forgive bass extension with years).. that’s why this exploration..

so the R100 is too shut-in sounding for you?

Like you I would rather sacrifice a bit of bass for a top end that sounds right to me. If I had to.

[struth]

indeed my homemade speakers had a bit less bass to allow the mids etc to shine. which they did. ive never been into deep bass anyway. im not sure its natural, and when you get past 50 you cant hear it so well anyway