View Full Version : Do cables make a difference?
stuartm1962
10-02-2023, 10:10
Good morning all.
Constantly hearing about cables and the difference that they make. I can appreciate the difference between a cheap cable and an expensive one, but would you really spend hundreds of pounds on a cable, rather than upgrading one of the items in the chain?
Firebottle
10-02-2023, 10:22
Of course they do.
However the benefit will depend on how far up the quality chain you are, the compatibility of the equipment you are joining, plus your own ears.
a done to death topic im afraid stuart. the results are sometimes fairly noticeable, and yet often subjective .... you pays your money and takes your chances. i like a well made cable made from good quality materials, but not( 'silly priced' afaic). others will have their own take, so best to suck it and see
stuartm1962
10-02-2023, 11:57
I think I will stick with what I have, they are solid and well made and were recommended by the installer for a pair of Audiostatics. Obviously you could get an improvement, same with everything, but I guess you need to draw the line somewhere with the upgrade path and actually enjoy the music.
a few cable guys here so you may get more responses in fullness of time
walpurgis
10-02-2023, 12:38
The reason cables of all types have varying effects on the sound, is that none are perfect (including 'digital' interconnects).
Just go with what you like the sound of in your system if you get the chance to compare.
AJSki2fly
10-02-2023, 12:50
Good morning all.
Constantly hearing about cables and the difference that they make. I can appreciate the difference between a cheap cable and an expensive one, but would you really spend hundreds of pounds on a cable, rather than upgrading one of the items in the chain?
Cables are IMO one of the most contentious and difficult areas of a HiFi system. There is and can be a lot of smoke and mirrors around them, especially the higher end, ultra super-duper, made with exacting technical specifications and then treated with snake oil to get that last bit of detail from your system. I believe a lot of Hifi cable brands actually source their basic components of their products from proper cable and plug manufacturers, make their cables up and then brand them. Often they will market them with a brief of - we went to exacting testing and trials to get the best, this may or may not be true.
So does it all mean its balls**t? Well no it isn't, different types of cables, copper, tinned copper, silver, and so on have properties of their own, and the construction, such as number of strands, solid, or multiple core etc. IMO a key for a good cable is to have low resistance, so finding one that is and is suitable between your components is the trick.
I have tried out quite a few interconnects and speaker cables, from relatively cheap to around mid priced, some worked well and others just did not do it for me, and it was not always the higher priced ones that were best.
My advice is if you want see if yours system sound can be improved with new cables then try and trial some in your system, some manufactures offer that, Chord used and I think Eccose do, I expect others do and some dealers.
Here’s something to bake your noodle
https://www.futureshop.co.uk/quantum-science-audio-silver-extreme-level-uk-mains-fuse
i'm saying nothing...nothing:eyebrows:
Here’s something to bake your noodle
https://www.futureshop.co.uk/quantum-science-audio-silver-extreme-level-uk-mains-fuse
£4,200! I paid over £5,000 for mine! :lol:
Same old nonsense talked about "bottlenecking". Clearly they don't understand how current flows in a conductor, Whilst it's not quite as straightforward as it seems, it's certainly not about the electrons trying all to squeeze into a conductor of small diameter.
£4,200! I paid over £5,000 for mine! :lol:
Same old nonsense talked about "bottlenecking". Clearly they don't understand how current flows in a conductor, Whilst it's not quite as straightforward as it seems, it's certainly not about the electrons trying all to squeeze into a conductor of small diameter.
yup, more than twice the cost of a good espresso machine, and it comes with a free fuse:ner:
ps maybe you sould outline that last bit for folk barry;)
£4,200! I paid over £5,000 for mine! :lol:
it's certainly not about the electrons trying all to squeeze into a conductor of small diameter.
The Three Stooges. In electron form.
I hope you have the fuse the right way round: they are directional you know! :lol: Oh, and they need to be burnt in (at least 200 cups, before you can make a decent cup of coffee). :D
As to the last part, it would be dull as dishwater physics. And since this is ostensibly a subjectivist form, wouldn't really help.
I hope you have the fuse the right way round: they are directional you know! :lol: Oh, and they need to be burnt in (at least 200 cups, before you can make a decent cup of coffee). :D
As to the last part, it would be dull as dishwater physics. And since this is ostensibly a subjectivist form, wouldn't really help.
took it out and went for a copper bar:ner:
Pigmy Pony
12-02-2023, 18:49
yup, more than twice the cost of a good espresso machine, and it comes with a free fuse:ner:
ps maybe you sould outline that last bit for folk barry;)
Which in turn is more than 1000 times the cost of a good shop bought espresso :ner: and they come with a sit down in the warm.
Which in turn is more than 1000 times the cost of a good shop bought espresso :ner: and they come with a sit down in the warm.
is there such a thing for 2 quid... ive not tasted one
Just think what you could do with a set of these:
https://www.futureshop.co.uk/nordost-odin-2-speaker-cable-factory-terminated-pair
https://media.futureshop.co.uk/media/catalog/product/cache/8558a96842b78078724a2aa91dcc9028/n/o/nordost_odin2speaker_square01.jpg
£37,350!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek: :eek: :eek:
Pigmy Pony
13-02-2023, 08:35
is there such a thing for 2 quid... ive not tasted one
As of 30 January McDonald's double espresso is £1.06, at Costa the same is £1.80. Independents may be dearer, I wouldn't know, I don't drink espressos :D
Pigmy Pony
13-02-2023, 08:40
Just think what you could do with a set of these:
https://www.futureshop.co.uk/nordost-odin-2-speaker-cable-factory-terminated-pair
https://media.futureshop.co.uk/media/catalog/product/cache/8558a96842b78078724a2aa91dcc9028/n/o/nordost_odin2speaker_square01.jpg
£37,350!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek: :eek: :eek:
Cool. If I won the lottery, my trainers would have them for laces :) And change my name to Mos Def Blingshu Innit.
As of 30 January McDonald's double espresso is £1.06, at Costa the same is £1.80. Independents may be dearer, I wouldn't know, I don't drink espressos :D
i drink flat whites..lol they are a bit dearer due to skills and milk i guess. mcdonalds coffee is better than costa, if indeed it is coffee...:ner: yeah, a lot of fancy coffee shops charge an awful lot more.
Firebottle
13-02-2023, 11:03
Just think what you could do with a set of these:
https://www.futureshop.co.uk/nordost-odin-2-speaker-cable-factory-terminated-pair
https://media.futureshop.co.uk/media/catalog/product/cache/8558a96842b78078724a2aa91dcc9028/n/o/nordost_odin2speaker_square01.jpg
£37,350!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek: :eek: :eek:
Well chop my toenails off with a flymo, they even have the audacity to offer Deoxit contact enhancer for an EXTRA £3. On that price!
Plus the price is for 1m lengths :doh:
walpurgis
13-02-2023, 11:55
But it might be quite good :).
A friend of mine leant me some pairs of expensive cables to try. The thing that surprised me most was that one pair made my system sound worse. I wasn't expecting that. My take was that cables make a difference, but not always a good one, and that expensive cables can be a miss-match in your system just as cheaper cables can. Try before you buy!
Pigmy Pony
13-02-2023, 16:17
[QUOTE=ReggieB;1340122 The thing that surprised me most was that one pair made my system sound worse. I wasn't expecting that.![/QUOTE]
Of course if you were a potential buyer the salesman would have an explanation for that :rolleyes: Which would lead to even more expense.
This thread is suffering from AoS's notorious thread drift. It is largely my doing, but I fear some of the posts may have put Stuart off experimenting with cables.
The best advice to Stuart was given by Adrian (AJSki2fly), with which I concur.
Us-&-Them
13-02-2023, 21:44
IF YOU ASK ME, A SIMPLE ANSWER TO THE QUESTION IS........................... IT'S ALL A PILE OF SHITE!!!!!!!! :D :lol:
Firebottle
14-02-2023, 07:03
:D:lol: Don't agree but you've certainly made your point.
Pigmy Pony
14-02-2023, 08:30
Those kind of prices look crazy to most of us, but then the "modest" amounts we spend often don't make sense to Joe Average - my brother doesn't get it, he has Amazon Echoes scattered around his home which sound "more than good enough". But he'll happily spend big money on bicycles (he only has two legs) and various carbon fibre bits to make them an ounce or two lighter (A Slimming World membership would be much cheaper). They're all hobbies, which rarely make sense to outsiders.
Personally I could have a dedicated listening room built onto the house for that kind of money, but the bloke who buys that cable probably already has one.
walpurgis
14-02-2023, 08:46
Hobbies tend to bring out the obsessive tendencies in many. Glad I never took up golf or fishing!
Pigmy Pony
14-02-2023, 09:20
My few hobbies (motorbikes, archery, hifi) come and go - I stick with one for a few short years, realise my limitations, get bored, move onto another hobby, then return a few years later. I sense the archery thing making a return soon. The hifi thing has run for more than ten years this time round, which is way longer than normal. Probably down to the nutjobs on here keeping me interested :)
Two of my old hobbies (weight training and judo) have long gone now. And they're not coming back. Though I may join a gym if they offer an old fogey discount.
My few hobbies (motorbikes, archery, hifi) come and go - I stick with one for a few short years, realise my limitations, get bored, move onto another hobby, then return a few years later. I sense the archery thing making a return soon. The hifi thing has run for more than ten years this time round, which is way longer than normal. Probably down to the nutjobs on here keeping me interested :)
Two of my old hobbies (weight training and judo) have long gone now. And they're not coming back. Though I may join a gym if they offer an old fogey discount.
collecting and occasionally drinking good whisky...does that count lol
Pigmy Pony
14-02-2023, 09:23
My few hobbies (motorbikes, archery, hifi) come and go - I stick with one for a few short years, realise my limitations, get bored, move onto another hobby, then return a few years later. I sense the archery thing making a return soon. The hifi thing has run for more than ten years this time round, which is way longer than normal. Probably down to the nutjobs on here keeping me interested :) Even though I rarely have anything to say about hifi.
Two of my old hobbies (weight training and judo) have long gone now. And they're not coming back. Though I may join a gym if they offer an old fogey discount.
Pigmy Pony
14-02-2023, 09:26
Repeating myself in posts is quite a recent hobby - inexpensive, and takes no real effort :)
Pigmy Pony
14-02-2023, 09:27
collecting and occasionally drinking good whisky...does that count lol
Hoarding the empty bottles might count :D
Hoarding the empty bottles might count :D
i do usually fling em out(quietly to avoid shame)lol
Pigmy Pony
14-02-2023, 09:34
What would you say is the difference between a hobby and an interest? Money?
What would you say is the difference between a hobby and an interest? Money?
money or lack of it is behind most things, although having it can cause problems too i guess; dunno ive never had lots of it
I have various interests that don't cost me much money: visiting art galleries (to admire the paintings of the French Impressionists and other modern (20th century) paintings) and museums; studying comparative religion, though I practice none; walking in the country (about the only sport I do), and watching foreign films. I would describe them as interests rather than hobbies.
Of my hobbies: I used to be very keen on photography, mostly travel photography, and travel to foreign parts of the world. Curiously with the advent of digital photography and consequently the limited supply of film stock, I lost my 'eye' and those photographs I now take with a digital camera are merely recordings with no real artistic composition. And travel is now limited largely due to increased costs post-Covid.
Another hobby of mine used to be building amplifiers for then my newfound interest in music and the means to reproduce it. It was the only way, as an impecunious student, I could pursue the hobby. I built a couple of valve amps and preamps as well as record and replay electronics for a tape deck. Later I built a couple of solid-state amplifiers and head amplifiers for cartridges.
Now my interests include fine dining and wine (highly enjoyable); not a hobby as such as my culinary skills are pretty average, and an increasing interest in politics, philosophy, and ethics.
Being of an increasingly advanced age, a new hobby of mine is shouting at the TV whenever some idiot from the government is being interviewed! :doh:
Oh - I should have added, as it is pertinent to the thread, another hobby of mine is assembling cables (!). Not for reasons of sound, but more for the fact that a lot of commercial cables are badly made, and for the fact that in my system there are components that use different connectors (RCA phono (ugh!), 1/4" jack sockets, XLR connections, DIN, Tuchel, and CAMAC). For the sake of neatness I also like to make the cables to be no longer than is necessary. I will sometimes make up mains cables.
i used to run sort of cross country although on tarred rds.. it was right up to the hills and down other side of town and back in that way. it was almost exactly 6 miles. my best time was about 49 mins at my peak, but averaged about 60 mins a go. but with age about 27 it became hard work so gave it up. i like b&w photography and had my own developer and enlarger etc. it was an ancient mostly wooden thing my grandfather used in his chemist shop. but it did a good job. always liked cooking too...but its become a bit difficult now
What would you say is the difference between a hobby and an interest? Money?
A hobby may be inspired by an interest, but it typically requires more commitment and involves taking action, like learning a new skill, or collecting, building, or creating something. Hobbies are essentially the active pursuit of a personal interest.
When you're participating in a hobby, you're actively participating in an activity or sport. Interests are often feelings or desires to learn more about subjects with the potential to become activities.
A hobby may be inspired by an interest, but it typically requires more commitment and involves taking action, like learning a new skill, or collecting, building, or creating something. Hobbies are essentially the active pursuit of a personal interest.
When you're participating in a hobby, you're actively participating in an activity or sport. Interests are often feelings or desires to learn more about subjects with the potential to become activities.
yes ive an interest in origins of words and phrases. all very interesting etc.. trouble is my recall these days is poor thank go for the interweb
yes ive an interest in origins of words and phrases. all very interesting etc.. trouble is my recall these days is poor thank go for the interweb
Yes - etymology, is another harmless interest of mine.
Yes - etymology, is another harmless interest of mine.
thats the word... you see, i forgot it.lol
AJSki2fly
14-02-2023, 13:45
Here’s something to bake your noodle
https://www.futureshop.co.uk/quantum-science-audio-silver-extreme-level-uk-mains-fuse
F*** me, so that's were the Millennium Falcon main fuses went, I've been searching for those:guns:, laser cannons at the ready.:guns:
designing or building equipment I'd say is a hobby but buying boxes and cables and plugging them in, I don't think that constitutes a 'hobby' and that's all I do really. I'd describe it as an interest rather than a hobby.
I think the only real hobby I have is my job. Unless watching the telly or sleeping counts.
Lawrence001
14-02-2023, 22:59
I think constantly buying and selling kit and tinkering with a collection of DACs, cables etc to optimise the system around what you've bought so that your system in any given week or month won't be the same as the last, together with all the research, browsing classifieds etc., takes it up to hobby status.
I would argue that rather than a hobby, that level of activity takes it to an obsession
I think constantly buying and selling kit and tinkering with a collection of DACs, cables etc to optimise the system around what you've bought so that your system in any given week or month won't be the same as the last, together with all the research, browsing classifieds etc., takes it up to hobby status.
Personally I reckon most if not all of the DAC and Cable thing is just chasing placebo effects. Not sure I would categorise that as a hobby, it's more like a pass-time.
Pigmy Pony
15-02-2023, 16:11
I keep tinkering and box-swapping to an absolute minimum. I just put stuff on and listen to it, so I guess that makes it a pass time.
Lawrence001
15-02-2023, 21:29
Personally I reckon most if not all of the DAC and Cable thing is just chasing placebo effects. Not sure I would categorise that as a hobby, it's more like a pass-time.It makes quite a difference in my system. It can make an unlistenable system listenable at times.
Enossification
26-02-2023, 09:18
Cables certainly made a difference in my system, a difference that was audible to myself and Sue my other half but my last cable purchase was quite a number of years ago and there won't be another change anytime soon.
Love these posts "Do cables make a difference"
They do if you can hear it.:)
I have percieed differences between interconnect cables but they have always been subtle and I'm not willing to dismiss the possibilty that they were palcebo effects.
The only time I heard a big difference was swapping some NVA cables to some Bigbottle 'Spotfire' cables which appeared to totally change the sound. I was using a passive stepped attenuator pre-amp at the times and can only conclude this was some sort of edge-case scenario where change of impedance was so large there was a real change in frequency response. Even then I can't entirely dismiss a placebo effect as they can be quite dramatic. It's a test I would be mildly interested to repeat but I no longer have that pre-amp.
Changing interconnect cables recently trying to eliminate a ground loop (Belkin, Spotifire, Audioquest cables all tried) I could not hear any difference at all. Ground loop remained as well, regrettably.
It makes quite a difference in my system. It can make an unlistenable system listenable at times.
I've had some bad sounding set-ups in my time but I've never been able to cure the problem with interconnects despite trying numerous different brands and copper, silver, silver plated copper etc. I just don't go there anymore and instead try to ascertain the real cause of the problem (usually but not always an amp/speaker mis-match).
On only one occasion have I ever heard a clear, definite and repeatable difference when changing cables. The cable in question was a Chord Signature Tuned ARAY cable terminated iwith RCA 'phono' plugs.
It was hugely expensive (over £600 if I remember) and was on loan. The change in sound was subtle, and difficult to describe: the best I can do is to say it changed the 'projection' of the sound from the speakers (Spendor SP-1s, I think). The effect was subtle, but repeatable. It was not necessarily better; just different.
Being curious as to the construction of the cables (they were on loan, so we couldent open up the plugs), we had them x-rayed. The cables appeared to have a 'shotgun' configuration, whereby two screened cables are used, with the screening connected to one of the inner cores at one end only (hence directional), with the second inner core providing the path between the inner pins of the RCAs. Also the overal screening was brought out as a flying lead, which could be connected to the metalwork of whatever the cable was plugged into.
In the past I have made up several experimental cables for my own curiosity, and passed them around to various Members here for their opinion. I think there were 5 participants who tried 6 different cables in their own systems and offered feedback. The test was in no way scientific (the cables were not of identical length, nor did they use identical style of phono plugs). Interestingly though, all 5 participants reported different 'likes' and 'dislikes'; there was little in common to say that one cable was in general better than another; suggesting that 'cable sound' is system dependant.
No wonder the whole topic of 'cable sound' is such a contentious subject.
All I will say is, if you try a new cable and like what you hear, then keep it. But I would also suggest that after, say a couple of weeks, you revert back to the status quo - you may find the 'old' cable sounds just as good.
The long and winding road with cables has many twists and turns. So many materials to choose from and lots of different construction methods and especially when you factor in different plugs which may also be made from a huge variety of material. Therefore it is not really possible that there is no difference to be found between different cables as all of the variables associated can influence the electrical conductivity and flow of electrons. But it all depends on what you are attaching to what as they may all behave differently with different bits of kit.
One persons system wired up with a particular cable may not be influenced audibly by the cable where as another persons might be very sensitive. All depends on capacitance and inductance and the electrical properties of everything working together. So where as one person may hear something another may not. Also you have to factor in hearing sensitivity which is hugely variable amongst us audio fool folk.:) And as Martin has mentioned before time of day, mood , placebo effect etc may all also have an influence.
So when you start to add up all the variables .....:doh::eek:
I always take. with a punch of salt any recommendations or reviews of cables because of all the reasons I have given above and also because I have tried mega bucks cables and they have done absolutely nothing positive in my system but also had cheap as chips cables which have delivered great audible results.
All the BullS*iT about materials, purity and construction makes me smile as it is all marketing and foo.
I know someone who wired up some of his system with black and decker lawn mower cable and his system won best in show!
Wakefield Turntables
26-02-2023, 16:43
Black and decker was good enough for Peter Walker
Pigmy Pony
26-02-2023, 17:08
The long and winding road with cables has many twists and turns. So many materials to choose from and lots of different construction methods and especially when you factor in different plugs which may also be made from a huge variety of material. Therefore it is not really possible that there is no difference to be found between different cables as all of the variables associated can influence the electrical conductivity and flow of electrons. But it all depends on what you are attaching to what as they may all behave differently with different bits of kit.
One persons system wired up with a particular cable may not be influenced audibly by the cable where as another persons might be very sensitive. All depends on capacitance and inductance and the electrical properties of everything working together. So where as one person may hear something another may not. Also you have to factor in hearing sensitivity which is hugely variable amongst us audio fool folk.:) And as Martin has mentioned before time of day, mood , placebo effect etc may all also have an influence.
So when you start to add up all the variables .....:doh::eek:
I always take. with a punch of salt any recommendations or reviews of cables because of all the reasons I have given above and also because I have tried mega bucks cables and they have done absolutely nothing positive in my system but also had cheap as chips cables which have delivered great audible results.
All the BullS*iT about materials, purity and construction makes me smile as it is all marketing and foo.
I know someone who wired up some of his system with black and decker lawn mower cable and his system won best in show!
Hope the Flymo fanboys don't read this, it'll be all-out war :doh:
Hope the Flymo fanboys don't read this, it'll be all-out war :doh:
:lol:
Hope the Flymo fanboys don't read this, it'll be all-out war :doh:
I found my electric lawn mower cuts the grass better, now I have replaced the mains cable with audiophile cable costing £500 a metre. ;)
Black and decker was good enough for Peter Walker
When Peter Walker was asked what makes a good speaker cable, he replied "Firstly: the cable should be long enough to reach between the amplifier and the speaker. Secondly: the colour of the insulation should match the colour of the carpet over which it runs." (Or words to that effect.)
Hope the Flymo fanboys don't read this, it'll be all-out war :doh:
They already know that if you replace the stock cable on your lawnmower with an expensive lawnophile one it gives a better cut.
That's how Peter Walker was able to pick up the orange cable cheap. One of their cast-offs.
Must admit despite my scepticism I do use fairly expensive interconnects and speaker cable. But I would not recommend spending much money on cables to anyone. Worth it if you can to spend a bit more than the minimum to get something with durable constriction that prevents fall-apart. (I've got lots of broken cables). Otherwise budget should go on speakers and room where there is no doubt as to the benefits.
When Peter Walker was asked what makes a good speaker cable, he replied "Firstly: the cable should be long enough to reach between the amplifier and the speaker. Secondly: the colour of the insulation should match the colour of the carpet over which it runs." (Or words to that effect.)
Brilliant!
They already know that if you replace the stock cable on your lawnmower with an expensive lawnophile one it gives a better cut.
That's how Peter Walker was able to pick up the orange cable cheap. One of their cast-offs.
Must admit despite my scepticism I do use fairly expensive interconnects and speaker cable. But I would not recommend spending much money on cables to anyone. Worth it if you can to spend a bit more than the minimum to get something with durable constriction that prevents fall-apart. (I've got lots of broken cables). Otherwise budget should go on speakers and room where there is no doubt as to the benefits.
Wise words.
walpurgis
27-02-2023, 07:29
I found my electric lawn mower cuts the grass better, now I have replaced the mains cable with audiophile cable costing £500 a metre. ;)
I hope you de-gaussed the fuse first and got it the correct way round.
I hope you de-gaussed the fuse first and got it the correct way round.
no need now as they are infused with vitamin d...;)
They already know that if you replace the stock cable on your lawnmower with an expensive lawnophile one it gives a better cut.
That's how Peter Walker was able to pick up the orange cable cheap. One of their cast-offs.
Must admit despite my scepticism I do use fairly expensive interconnects and speaker cable. But I would not recommend spending much money on cables to anyone. Worth it if you can to spend a bit more than the minimum to get something with durable constriction that prevents fall-apart. (I've got lots of broken cables). Otherwise budget should go on speakers and room where there is no doubt as to the benefits.
I don’t want my cables constricted. :lol:
You don’t “need” boutique cables. Good quality will do.
Pigmy Pony
27-02-2023, 17:07
I don’t want my cables constricted. :lol:
You don’t “need” boutique cables. Good quality will do.
True. Common sense should tell us when something is taking-the-piss expensive. More money spent on boutique cables leaves less cash for records/CDs, and just encourages listening to the system instead of the music.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2026 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.