View Full Version : Stream player or Turntable
I'm thinking what my next upgrade will be. Thinking of either a Rega rp1 or a sonus. I like the ideal of a turntable but vinyl is expensive. Will a little one due in December, a Sonus would be more practical and easy to use but doesn't hold the romance of a physical format.
I don't know what to do ! :scratch:
You need to set a price bracket and then listen to what you can get for your money.
My personal opinion at the price range your post suggests, a streaming solution may give better quality replay assuming you have dac etc in place.
Stratmangler
16-08-2010, 12:03
Don't let romance cloud your judgement.
If you want to take up vinyl because you like the way it sounds, then fine.
Be aware of vinyl being high maintenance compared to CD.
As you're new to the vinyl game I give it a miss to be honest, but that's just my opinion.
The only DAC i have is built into my Audiolab 8000cd. Would a DAC be needed ? Excuse me being naive here.
How do you mean Vinyl as high maintenance ?
Stratmangler
16-08-2010, 12:14
You have to clean it, handle it carefully, store it carefully, set up alignment, VTA, VTF etc, etc ............
Stylii wear out, cartridge suspensions can rigidify with age......
That's for starters - do you want any more ?
Graham, given that you have no vinyl at present, I'm wondering if you would be better off either a) giving it a miss or b) trying a very cheap set up first - something you can buy off ebay for not very much and then easily sell for a similar amount if you chose to either upgrade or abandon it. Getting something like this will allow you to road-test the format without making a substantial investment - in either player or records if you go second hand. It's a shame you don't live closer or I could lend you something - anyone else in the Hampshire area with something in the loft?
What do you want to achieve if you go the streaming route? If you are just going to rip your CDs then unlikely to improve the sound, but you do get convenience, and access to internet radio. How close is your laptop/PC to your hifi? How about looking at the new 8200 CD/DAC/Pre - sell off your 8000S & CD player... One of the best investments I've made is a £10 monthly subscription to Spotify - millions of tracks at your fingertips in 320kbps quality, from PC into a decent DAC, a whole world of musical opportunity. (Doesn't stop me buying too many CDs & LPs though!)
Vinyl (and CD now too) is a religion for us oldies who love the tactile pleasure of the process of playing LP's. You'll need some toppy speakers too for LP's to "sound better."
Whether "we" like it or not, a streaming solution is where it's going and depending upon what you go for, you may or may not need a DAC to interface with your amp system. That's one area where the new Audiolab units may come into their own I think - a CD player with a good DAC built in and extra digital inputs (the Cambridge 840C is similar I believe) will be perfect for what you want to do. [Edit - Alex beat me to it..]
As you don't have an existing LP collection and there's a little one on it's way (a HUGE life change coming I can assure you), maybe you should leave records alone for now, or just get the Rega/Fono Micro option discussed elsewhere and wall mount it away from little fingers.........................
OK, so if i wanted something I could upload my CD's too and add high quality lossless files, would a sonos do that ? The convenience would be useful. Is there anything better out there ? I'll be honest, my budget would be £300 - £400. I'll be using some birthday money in September.
purite audio
16-08-2010, 13:25
Sonos is really convenient and easy to use, but the sq isn't anything special, does your cd player have a 'digital in', if it does you can use your PC/Mac as transport.
Keith.
dave2010
19-08-2010, 11:25
Graham
I think Alex has given basically good advice. If you've no vinyl already, then why do you think you need to get into it now? On another forum someone inherited around 2-300 LPs and asked for advice. After several members had given her advice she went to a hi-fi shop, asked for demos, and eventually bought a low end Pro-Ject turntable, which I believe does the job. She was probably more concerned about hearing the music on the discs than having a high quality audio experience.
Your situation is slightly different as you have no vinyl to start with, so what do you want to collect? There's quite a lot around in charity shops, but there's no guarantee that the discs will be in good condition, or can even be rescued.
When I used vinyl regularly I did upgrade decks, cartridges etc. every few years, and at the time it did sound better than radio or cassette. Perhaps it still would. When CD came along I went for it, and generally it was better. It was only a few years later when the "vinyl is better" brigade had made lots of waves that I actually heard some turntables/arms which did sound as good as, or better than, CD - but they were in the £1000+ price range. Some early CD remasters of LPs were not good, but most seemed OK, and in a few cases I was able to compare them directly - though interested to note that in some cases the sound was more or less the same - not better on CD as I'd hoped. A few CDs definitely did sound worse to me including a classic Barbirolli Vaughan Williams string music disc - though perhaps the sound on vinyl was enhanced by acoustic feedback enhancing the bass. I don't think that actually was the reason though.
For most people vinyl is not better than a good CD player. If you want to enter the world of wow, flutter, disc cleaning etc., plus a world in which albums don't all fit onto one side of an LP, then go for it. Also you may become more acquainted with various forms of distortion.
Re the Sonos, haven't heard one, except perhaps in a shop. You might try the Squeezebox Touch, which I believe is excellent. I have the earlier SB3, and that's good, and apparently the Touch is much better.
Lastly, regarding "little ones" - (i) congratulations, and (ii) if you buy a turntable/arm, you might enjoy seeing your stylus moved at right angles to the cartridge, either by your own, or one of the friends which will eventually come into your home. Even a 1-2 year old is quite capable of wrecking a cartridge, or at least the stylus, and try telling that you've just lost £00s to the child or its parents - fun! In my case I just bent the stylus back, and pretended it hadn't happened, and I hope that not too much damage occurred to the discs afterwards.
Hi Dave,
Good post... Regarding this, though:
For most people vinyl is not better than a good CD player.
It depends on who you mean by "most people". If it's the general public or those not really into hi-fi, then most definitely yes.
However, if it's knowledgeable enthusiasts who populate this forum and others like it, I think you'd find the answer not quite so clear cut ;)
Why not post a poll and find out? I'm sure the results would be interesting :)
Marco.
For most people vinyl is not better than a good CD player.
That is of course a very good point - my Pro-Ject RPM4 cost roughly the same as the CD player I bought at around the same time (£400 ish I think, 8 or 9 years ago) and the vinyl sound quality was far inferior. Only now (with a well respected vintage Garrard 401/SME 3009) is the gap closing (albeit I have a better CD player too) but it is still too close to call which is "better" - taking all the pros and cons into account.
Hi Dave,
Good post... Regarding this, though:
It depends on who you mean by "most people". If it's the general public, then most definitely yes.
However, if it's enthusiasts who populate this forum and others like it, I think you'd find the answer not quite so clear cut ;)
Why not post a poll and find out? I'm sure the results would be interesting :)
Marco.
The point is though Marco (per my simultaneous post) - pound for pound CD is usually better - (at the lower end of the market) though others may disagree ;)
Well, that may be your experience, Alex, but it isn't mine... :)
I'd still take a second hand unmodified Techie or a Rega or Pro-Ject, set-up and partnered properly over any, say, sub £1000 CD player.
The key is the bit in bold... Most people don't have sufficient knowledge or experience to get a T/T to 'sing', but when you do, many even fairly budget T/Ts will usually outperform most affordable CDPs.
Next time AOS does a show at Scalford Hall, or somewhere, we'll do a demo which will illustrate this :cool:
Marco.
I think we need that poll setting up! ;)
Well, after you, sir.... :exactly:
Marco.
Okey dokey - just having a sarnie then I'll set it up...
Done! http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?p=145174#post145174
Well, that may be your experience, Alex, but it isn't mine... :)
I'd still take a second hand unmodified Techie or a Rega or Pro-Ject, set-up and partnered properly over any, say, sub £1000 CD player.
The key is the bit in bold... Most people don't have sufficient knowledge or experience to get a T/T to 'sing', but when you do, many even fairly budget T/Ts will usually outperform most affordable CDPs.
Next time AOS does a show at Scalford Hall, or somewhere, we'll do a demo which will illustrate this :cool:
Marco.
And of course you'll have the original master recording to use as a reference, won't you. Anything less is purely opinion not fact :)
Indeed, but that's immaterial since hearing the original master recording would not be an option. Therefore, if the majority of people attending the demo preferred the turntable/vinyl, and overall considered it better, then that's all that would matter :)
We'll do this at a show sometime, as I'm convinced I could put together a budget vinyl-based system that would sonically outperform a similar one fronted by a CDP.
Marco.
Ground rules, then - how do you define a "second hand unmodified Techie or a Rega or Pro-Ject, set-up and partnered properly" - unmodified must mean stock, including Arm, isolation, wiring, mat etc, but do you also include the supplied cartridge in the equation? We can allow a rack, if both use the same, and use the same interconnects (Mark Grant, obviously!) but I'd be happy to bet £50 to a charity of your choice that the CD player will win... but that depends - if it is a Rega P7 or a Pro-Ject RPM10 I'm taking my bat and ball home in a huff! ;)
...and the CD/record we compare has to be one of those that has the fake crackles and pops in the mix, otherwise the CD player automatically has an unfair advantage! (and all this coming from someone who tells everyone who will listen that vinyl is still ultimately better than CD!)
I think this could be rather interesting.
The pro digital lobby, I think may have backed the wrong horse.
Now if you had gone for file sourced audio as opposed to CDP then I think you might have been in with a shout.
Marco, knowing a lot about his preferred medium and not being as green as he is cabbage looking may have just lured you into the vinyl junkies lair ;)
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