Carpet or wood floor?

[guy]

Wife and I are thinking of refurbishing our home, having decided to spend our retirement here (and spend money saved by not moving on extravagant holidays :) once /if that becomes possible again).

I would like to have wood (possibly bamboo) laid on the solid concrete living room floor (30'x12 1/2') and have a couple of large rugs over that. Other possibility would be to have fitted carpet (preferably wool/wool blend).

I would expect that there would be quite a dramatic difference in the way that sound waves would behave with a wood floor :eek:

Anyone have personal experience of change from wood floor to fitted carpet or vice versa in terms of sound quality? (just "flying a kite" at the moment).

[CageyH]

I have a wooden floor in my listening room. I needed to put a rug down to tame the reflections a bit.

[spendorman]

About 30 years ago I spent days preparing the nice hardwood floor boards in the through lounge of my 1930's house, finished them in Bourne Seal which was a paste, not the liquid that is available now. It looked fantastic. But I ended up with large loose carpets that covered most of the floor!

[Jimbo]

Wood floor is not the way to go for best acoustics in a room unfortunately. Carpet is way better. But I think wood floors do look better so it is a tough call. Something that looks great vs something that sounds great!

[guy]

Wood floor is not the way to go for best acoustics in a room unfortunately. Carpet is way better. But I think wood floors do look better so it is a tough call. Something that looks great vs something that sounds great!

Sort of how I am thinking at the moment. Although music venues have hard surface floors - is it the mass of people attending concerts that tames the reflections?

[Barry]

You could still have a wood floor, but use a large rug on the floor at the first reflection point from the speakers.

[guy]

Cheers Barry, I had to look it up but it looks promising :thumbsup:

[sailor]

Hi Guy, how would the bamboo be laid if you went that route? Laying it solidly on the concrete floor with adhesive is fine. Gluing it on top of plywood which will lie on the floor will resonate unpredictably and should be bedded down on a mastic.

I would prefer the bamboo solidly installed, a) for its beautiful appearance b) for sound quality.

Carpets being relatively thin will absorb sound only over a very limited range of frequencies, so forming a narrow-band absorber. If the carpet is wall-2-wall the effect will be to largely absorb all the information that corresponds to the wavelength of your carpet thickness. To be clear, this info will be mostly MIA :scratch:

A thick attractive wool rug or rugs on felt underlay are fine.

However, isn't there always an however? if you would like to add broad-band absorption (this is the good kind that actually does something and not just reduce a little flutter echo) a better way would be to build a cloud but you may need permission.

If you have the height, hang a frame about 4' x 6' x 4" below the ceiling. This will accept standard panels of rockwool or equivalent. Choose a pretty fabric that compliments your room to cover the frame. The winner here is the fact that by varying the distance from the ceiling you can adjust the low frequency performance. Try for 4" air space, but even 1" will make a rather large improvement.

Depending on personal taste, an LED strip light mounted on top of the frame perimeter looks really cool.

[hifinutt]

Wood floor is not the way to go for best acoustics in a room unfortunately. Carpet is way better. But I think wood floors do look better so it is a tough call. Something that looks great vs something that sounds great!

agreed . i would go for the warmth of carpet and better acoustically

[dave2010]

We have wood over underfloor heating embedded within concrete. We haven't got any carpets. The dirt is quite visible, and the floors do require cleaning quite frequently. Carpets will need vacuuming often, but much of the dirt will apparently disappear. Acoustically I think carpet is better, but perhaps deadens the sound too much.
You have a solid floor under your wood. For a suspended floor the effect is likely to be different from a solid concrete base, with both vibrations in the wood, and also due to the cavities under the floor, but that shouldn't affect you.

You are used to living with your floor. Personally I find it harder to walk on the fairly shiny wood surface than on a carpet or rug. Rugs or free carpets would have the advantage that you could try them out, and would be quite easy to take up again or move if you decided you didn't like them. You might find that you need a more powerful amplifier to drive speakers to give you a similar effect to what you would perceive with a wood floor.

[struth]

i have concrete downstairs. so i got the best quality underlay available; in fact it cost as much as the expensive carpet but ive ended up with a nioce sound. it wasnt bought for audio but for wheelcair use but its wort paying for really good underlay

[guy]

Hi Guy, how would the bamboo be laid if you went that route? Laying it solidly on the concrete floor with adhesive is fine. Gluing it on top of plywood which will lie on the floor will resonate unpredictably and should be bedded down on a mastic.

I would prefer the bamboo solidly installed, a) for its beautiful appearance b) for sound quality.

Carpets being relatively thin will absorb sound only over a very limited range of frequencies, so forming a narrow-band absorber. If the carpet is wall-2-wall the effect will be to largely absorb all the information that corresponds to the wavelength of your carpet thickness. To be clear, this info will be mostly MIA :scratch:

A thick attractive wool rug or rugs on felt underlay are fine.

However, isn't there always an however? if you would like to add broad-band absorption (this is the good kind that actually does something and not just reduce a little flutter echo) a better way would be to build a cloud but you may need permission.

If you have the height, hang a frame about 4' x 6' x 4" below the ceiling. This will accept standard panels of rockwool or equivalent. Choose a pretty fabric that compliments your room to cover the frame. The winner here is the fact that by varying the distance from the ceiling you can adjust the low frequency performance. Try for 4" air space, but even 1" will make a rather large improvement.

Depending on personal taste, an LED strip light mounted on top of the frame perimeter looks really cool.

Brilliant response, thanks for taking the time.

Early days, but I was thinking of something like this:

https://www.bambooflooringcompany.com/all-flooring/solid-carbonised-strand-woven-90mm-parquet-block-bona-coated-bamboo-flooring.html

glued direct to floor, I understand that the resin bonded stuff is very tough which would be important for me (dog for one thing :)).

Pretty limited on height, "house" is a late '50's bungalow which we extended and built an upstairs, so ceiling is only just over 8'

[guy]

i have concrete downstairs. so i got the best quality underlay available; in fact it cost as much as the expensive carpet but ive ended up with a nioce sound. it wasnt bought for audio but for wheelcair use but its wort paying for really good underlay

Thanks for that Grant, any recommendations on type of underlay?

I am glad that you mention wheelchair use. We don't need them at the moment, but as we are planning on staying here for the duration it is something that should be considered (over the last six years both my wife and I cared for elderly parents who were using wheelchairs and ease of movement/accessibility became major concerns in their homes).
My daughter, who recently qualified as an occupational therapist, has been quite forthright in her view that we should stay here as we get older, as the house is quite open plan and makes movement around the place easier :)

[struth]

yes open plan is good. i had to get doors widened etc here for wife... i went to a good carpet shop and asked them what they recommened for wheelchair use.
it wasnt cheap but its 16 yrs ago and although wife is no longer with us, the carpet has no marks from wheels.. ie it never collapsed underneath. it proved point that the underlay was at least as important.. it also is quite good audio wise.

[tapid]

Went from carpet to wood in largish room and there a very noticeable reduction in sound quality. However then moved to smaller room ( also wood ) and was happy again.
So, wether size of rooms was a factor or just got used to a new sound I don't know ?. Would probably go for carpet though for optimum sound

[tapid]

Hope everything goes well Guy

[guy]

yes open plan is good. i had to get doors widened etc here for wife... i went to a good carpet shop and asked them what they recommened for wheelchair use.
it wasnt cheap but its 16 yrs ago and although wife is no longer with us, the carpet has no marks from wheels.. ie it never collapsed underneath. it proved point that the underlay was at least as important.. it also is quite good audio wise.

Crikey! sixteen years is bloody good going for underlay in my experience, just goes to show that you get what you pay for.

[guy]

Hope everything goes well Guy


Cheers - I would like a wood floor, looks mainly, although I do get pissed off with carpet getting grubby/needing shampoo every now and then. One of my sister in laws is Chinese and I can see why they take off shoes on entering the house, although having a dog would negate that!
My only concerns would be effect on sound, and comfort/insulation.

[sailor]

@guy, I am confused! Because one of your sisters in law is Chinese, why would your dog not have to take off his shoes? :)

It is desirable to address the 3 axes: floor to ceiling, front to back and side to side, if this is possible. With the floor to ceiling reflections it would be better to have the absorption on the ceiling, height permitting, for the simple reason that we have evolved to allow for floor bounce. The ear/brain relationship knows well how to deal with this. Unless you have had too much to drink :cool: your ears are always the same distance from the floor. So ceiling absorption is preferred.

I once helped a friend hang a cloud in his dedicated room. He is tall and only has about an inch between him and the cloud frame. He was concerned about someone taller bumping their head. I suggested he keep a crash helmet handy for those occasions. On a later visit I noticed 3 brightly coloured helmets on the front wall above the audio rack. This was always of great interest at get togethers. He explained them away as diffusers or protection devices should someone want to jump up and down with excitement.

[dave2010]

I once helped a friend hang a cloud in his dedicated room. He is tall and only has about an inch between him and the cloud frame. He was concerned about someone taller bumping their head. I suggested he keep a crash helmet handy for those occasions. On a later visit I noticed 3 brightly coloured helmets on the front wall above the audio rack. This was always of great interest at get togethers. He explained them away as diffusers or protection devices should someone want to jump up and down with excitement.Slight diversion - hanging baskets. We used to have hanging baskets outside our previous house near the front door. Miss d got out of her car, and banged her head on it, letting out a great cry of "F***" - the first and perhaps only time I ever heard her swear. We also noted that the lady who delivered our post wore a crash helmet - and we wondered if that had been as a result of one too many encounters with our hanging flowers.

Now back to floors, ceilings, wood and carpets.

[Barry]

If the Albert Hall in London, minimised the echo from the domed roof by hanging dozens of 'flying saucers' of various diameters from the roof, then maybe hanging baskets of various sizes from the ceiling of the listening room might help.

[guy]

Bring the garden in to the room :) could be quite therapeutic .

[Barry]

A well watered plant in a pot placed near the turntable can work wonders for those who are plagued with static.

[Mr Neds]

I’ve had abamboo floor for some years. It was glued to the existing chipboard panel floor using bamboo adhesive- thick goop in a tub. It’s satin finish, so isn’t especially slippy. My speakers are 6ft apart and about 8ft from the sofa. In between the sofa and the speakers is a 7 x 5 rug, around 15 mm thick. Works for me. I don’t think I did a comparison without the rug- it’s my lounge, not a listening cell and I have no urge to install a box of illuminated rock wool on my ceiling 🙄

[Pharos]

Currently being debated on many forums is the degree to which the listening room is deadened, this really addressing the problem of the degree to which we allow the listening room to have an acoustic footprint, this being added to the recording venue footprint.

At one stage I was going to remove the ceiling plasterboard and have drooping loops of a porous material hanging from the joists, these containing BAF or similar between the loops and the above floorboards.

[Mr Neds]

Loops hanging from the bared joists? Texas chainsaw massacre😵

[guy]

I’ve had abamboo floor for some years. It was glued to the existing chipboard panel floor using bamboo adhesive- thick goop in a tub. It’s satin finish, so isn’t especially slippy. My speakers are 6ft apart and about 8ft from the sofa. In between the sofa and the speakers is a 7 x 5 rug, around 15 mm thick. Works for me. I don’t think I did a comparison without the rug- it’s my lounge, not a listening cell and I have no urge to install a box of illuminated rock wool on my ceiling ��

Thanks - does the bamboo wear well?

I agree with you about it being the lounge and not a dedicated "listening room" (perhaps in my twenties I would have thought differently :))

[Mr Neds]

I don’t know what the split is between people with a listening room and people who just use their living room, but I’d be interested to know!
Our ex neighbours introduced us to bamboo flooring. They threw a sample across two gardens, which dug a lump out of my hand- it’s very hard! I’ve scratched ours numerous times, but I rub in either brown shoe polish or a walnut, which sorts that. I think ours came from The Bamboo Flooring Company. High gloss seemed like a liability and Matt seemed like a dumb idea for something that would be walked on- I could see horrible shiny patches in my minds eye, so that’s why we got the satin. I’ll try and upload a picture, but I’ve never done it on here 😉

[guy]

:cool:

[Fergus]

If you have curtains, a sofa, a table... a wood floor should be fine no? An empty room with a wood floor would be a totally different story.

[Macca]

You'll get some bounce off the wood floor which is probably best avoided. How much depends on the design of the loudspeakers. Deploying a rug on the floor in front of the speakers would probably make a positive difference.

[fatmarley]

My other half is on about replacing our carpet with a solid floor, so I'm thinking about a thick rug, and maybe some acoustic foam or something on the ceiling (I haven't looked into it yet).

[Mikeandvan]

Do a blind test, see which you prefer:sofa: