Budget high compliance cart for SME 3009s2 improved?

[Mr Neds]

As above. Posted this on the Wam a few months ago. There seems to be very limited choice for this particular version of the 3009. I originally had an AT 110e on it, which I seem to remember working fine, until I bent the cantilever. I wondered if the new AT 95 VM range would work? Or indeed, any other modern carts? It’s got a Pickering V15 on it at the moment, but with a stylus of unknown age/ hours. It plays ok, but can be sibilant, which suggests some wear

[Shovel_Knight]

Hi Neds, is your tonearm S2 improved (with detachable headshell) or Series II Improved (non-detachable headshell)? The former's effective mass is 9.5g which makes it compatible with many of today's cartridges including AT-VM95, Ortofon 2M series etc.

[Mr Neds]

It's the detachable headshell version, which I think means it's the lightest?

[Shovel_Knight]

I don't think so, the headshell socket adds quite a bit of mass. The non-detachable version is 6.5g — now THAT is problematic. S2 Improved (9.5g) is fine with many of today's cartridges including even some MCs (e.g. Goldring Eroica).

[Mr Neds]

You've opened up my world! The gist from elsewhere on the web was that a high compliance cartridge would be best, which aren't manufactured in such great numbers/ varieties. The Pickering sounded good when I was using the Audiolab as an integrated, but when I used it as a phono preamp, coming out of the tape sockets, it sounded very muffled?

[struth]

not had an issue using carts with the sme 2 imp. just add extra weight to the back weight. itll do 2 grams or so tracking easily too. ive used loads of carts with mine, when i had one.

[Barry]

Pavel is correct. Your SME is the 3009 Series II (Improved) S2, with a detachable headshell. Assuming you will use the arm with the SME headshell the effective mass is 9.5g.

It is not possible to quote a preferred cartridge compliance to suit the arm, as you need to take the mass of the cartridge into account as well. Without actually suggesting a particular cartridge, ideally any cartridge that satisfies the following will be OK:


175 < MC < 400

where M is the total mass in gram (= effective mass of the arm (9.5g for your arm) + mass of the cartridge + mass of fixings (say 0.5g)) and C is the compliance (in compliance units (e.g. 6.5 for the Audio Technica AT95)).

Information for other cartridges can be found on the vinylengine.com cartridge database.

[high.spirits]

I use an SME Series III which is lighter than your arm and it has worked well with Ortofon 2M series and the latest AT VM95 ML. The AT's are a real bargain and suprised me how good they sound.

[Mr Neds]

This is all very useful. I can’t understand how I was sent down a high compliance blind alley! All the carts that you’re now talking about are the ones that I was considering before that distraction. Thanks all and a Happier New Year 😉

[walpurgis]

There's nothing to stop you adding a bit of mass to the headshell if it helps. Suitable weights are available.

[kirstysdad]

Sorry to hijack this, I'm new to the 3009, have the removable SME head shell S2 Improved as well, and am using a Goldring 2022GX as it came out to be within compliance/mass calcs. My issue is mounting the cart against the finger pickup mounting bar underneath the head- doesn't seem to be much contact area unlike perfectly flat shells I've used before. Is this correct?

[Shovel_Knight]

Sorry to hijack this, I'm new to the 3009, have the removable SME head shell S2 Improved as well, and am using a Goldring 2022GX as it came out to be within compliance/mass calcs. My issue is mounting the cart against the finger pickup mounting bar underneath the head- doesn't seem to be much contact area unlike perfectly flat shells I've used before. Is this correct?

Yes, the stock SME headshell is horrible.

[Mr Neds]

No problem. I just checked my SME headshell. It’s not contemporary- I think it’s from the early noughties and the lift is bolted onto the side. I seem to remember someone saying that if you’ve got the other version, just take the finger lift off! They seem to be stupidly expensive now. Mine was from a friend in the trade- a customer ordered it and never collected it

[Mr Neds]

Yes, the stock SME headshell is horrible.

Sorry, Mail crossover. I’ve never heard anyone call that headshell “horrible”! I must admit, when I saw how much a new boxed one was going for, I almost sold it to buy a cartridge, but then I decided to keep the arm as close to original as possible. I don’t know when the finger lift fixing was moved to the side, but no doubt someone out there does! I also use an old Rega headshell, but that also has a side mount lift?

[Barry]

Yes it is correct; at the time when the 3009 was designed such concerns about the contact area were not considered, or even if they were, were regarded as being quite unimportant. As long as the screw fixings are fastened firmly (but not over tight) you shouldn't experience any problems.

However you could try packing the gap between the top of the cartridge and the underside of the headshell with some BluTak, which some users find effective.

[Shovel_Knight]

Well, I do not like it because it is not rigid, the fingerlift arrangement is dubious at best, and the pins on some versions of the headshell are very prone to oxidation. When I got my 3012, I couldn't understand why my cartridge sounded rather muffled, when I tested continuity I got ~8 Ohms between the cartridge tags and the RCA plugs! I replaced the headshell with a Jelco one and got less than 0.1 Ohm. Cleaning the pins with emery paper solves the problem but the procedure has to be repeated every now and then. I decided to keep the headshell only because it's the desirable "raised logo" version which is likely to raise the resale value of the tonearm.

[Barry]

The later S2 headshells (with the 'flat' name badge) had gold plated contact pips and gold plated cartridge lead tags, an improvement over those of the 'raised' badge headshell.

The best SME headshell is the S2-R: made of heavier gauge aluminium, and having the finger lift attached separately on the side, presents a flat mounting surface for the cartridge. There was also an unperforated version available.

Otherwise, most of the Fidelity Research headshells are eminently suitable

[Shovel_Knight]

Even with gold plating, I have no idea why would anyone want an SME headshell except for the name. The good old Technics headshell is made of cast magnesium, weighs just 1g more, is more rigid, has gold-plated pins and you can buy 4 of them for the price of one SME headshell. Even the the length of the headshell is perfect for SME tonearms...

ADC LMG-1 is another excellent alternative - much better than the stock shell!

[kirstysdad]

Thanks gents, thought it was just me- I was scared of being a heretic! Horrible, horrible headshell indeed. ;) Any particular technics 'shell? They seem to do several. Ironically I have thrown away several in the past, along with my alignment gauges and collection of cart bolts and nuts. :doh:

[Mr Neds]

Yup,it’s the S2-R that I’ve got. I can’t say that the Rega shell, which I think is probably from an RB 200, seems any different. I mean, I haven’t weighed it in comparison or anything! Head shells do seem quite pricey, even used, but I’ll look out for the others mentioned.

[Jac Hawk]

I’m using a Dynavector 10x5 on my S2 improved with fixed headshell and it sounds great

[Shovel_Knight]

Thanks gents, thought it was just me- I was scared of being a heretic! Horrible, horrible headshell indeed. ;) Any particular technics 'shell? They seem to do several. Ironically I have thrown away several in the past, along with my alignment gauges and collection of cart bolts and nuts. :doh:

Technics SFPCC31001K - as supplied with SL-1200 etc.

But beware of cheap knock-offs, they're much worse.

[Shovel_Knight]

Yup,it’s the S2-R that I’ve got. I can’t say that the Rega shell, which I think is probably from an RB 200, seems any different. I mean, I haven’t weighed it in comparison or anything! Head shells do seem quite pricey, even used, but I’ll look out for the others mentioned.

Rega R200 headshell - the same as supplied with Acos Lustre GST-1 - I have one and don't care for it either. Frankly, I much prefer Audio-Technica AT-MS and AT-LH series shells, but they're pricey and the magnesium ones (AT-MS) are quite rare...

[Mr Neds]

This now says “moved” at the start. Why? Where to?

[struth]

its in analogue where is should be. if you look at the line above thread title at top it will show you where it is.