Test records

[CageyH]

After experiencing an issue with my cartridge set up, I am wondering if a test record will help me set my bias more accurately?
Traditionally I always set it about 0.5g less than my VTF, but this is not very scientific.

So, a test record may help, but which one?

The popular ones seem to be "HiFi News Analogue Test LP - The Producer's Cut" and "ANALOGUE PRODUCTIONS THE ULTIMATE ANALOGUE TEST LP"

Any experience of them?
Are they useful, or a complete waste of money?

[worrasf]

After experiencing an issue with my cartridge set up, I am wondering if a test record will help me set my bias more accurately?
Traditionally I always set it about 0.5g less than my VTF, but this is not very scientific.

So, a test record may help, but which one?

The popular ones seem to be "HiFi News Analogue Test LP - The Producer's Cut" and "ANALOGUE PRODUCTIONS THE ULTIMATE ANALOGUE TEST LP"

Any experience of them?
Are they useful, or a complete waste of money?I have both the Hifi News and Shure discs but I don't think they are all that helpful for setting the bias.
After much searching the best approach I have come across is the one advocated by the Soundsmith guys. An explanation can be viewed here: https://www.sound-smith.com/faq/how-do-i-adjust-anti-skating-my-cartridge

Soundsmith view of test discs is not very favourable. Basically the idea is to have the bias set so the arm slowly moves towards the spindle when "playing" a blank/smooth area of vinyl. There is just such a track on the HiFi disc between bands 5 & 6.



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[CageyH]

Thanks.
I suppose an old laser disc would be good for this?

[Mixc]

I just listen to a few tracks to set the VTF too much bass reduce the force, too much top end then add a bit.
For anti skate i use the HiFi news disc and "True RTA" osciloscpe freeware this give a great image of the sweet spot.
I only use a groovless record for initial setup, as aparantly when the stylus is in the groove of a record there is quite a bit of friction and this effects the bias.
As a final check the Paul Simon Graceland album first track has 4 beats of a drum which when the stylus is set correctly go from evenly from one side to the other.

[paulf-2007]

Hi fi news record is good for many things but have to agree not for bias in my experience.

[Barry]

Setting the bias so that the arm/cartridge does not move when resting on a blank uncut portion of a rotating test disc is unrepresentative of what happens when the stylus is tracking a groove. The vinyl/diamond interface is different in the two cases and thus so are the frictional forces.

IMO the best way to set the bias, having first set the correct azimuth by playing a mono record and checking with an oscilloscope that the two channels have equal output, is then to check that equal amplitude is maintained at the beginning, the middle and at the end of the record. Some listeners, with very good hearing, might be able to do this using headphones, but I doubt if they could hear a 1dB difference between the outputs, whereas it is clear to see on a scope.

[The Vinyl Adventure]

After experiencing an issue with my cartridge set up, I am wondering if a test record will help me set my bias more accurately?
Traditionally I always set it about 0.5g less than my VTF, but this is not very scientific.

So, a test record may help, but which one?

The popular ones seem to be "HiFi News Analogue Test LP - The Producer's Cut" and "ANALOGUE PRODUCTIONS THE ULTIMATE ANALOGUE TEST LP"

Any experience of them?
Are they useful, or a complete waste of money?

Every audiophile with a turntable should have a test record, period.

I will put 1 in with your mingus do what you need to do then send it to whoever else wants to borrow it.

[CageyH]

My mingus? Can you get cream for that?

(Thanks for the kind offer by the way, but I think you have me mixed up with someone else).

[The Vinyl Adventure]

sorry boss mixed you up with rexton lol

[martinjohn308]

I’ve used the Hi Fi Sounds test record bought new in 1978 for the princely sum of £2 ! I mainly use it for channel identification. Setting up the Stiletto LP 12 was left to the late Derek Jenkins R.I.P who I knew since 1982. He once told me that the other person he’d recommend was a Phil March.

Regards,

Martin

[Lurch]

I generally set bias at 50-60% of vtf, no EoS distortion to my ears when set this way.

[Barry]

I generally set bias at 50-60% of vtf, no EoS distortion to my ears when set this way.

Depends to some extent on the arm and on the stylus profile, but I find that the bias required is usually only a fraction of the VTF. Spherical stylii require quite high bias, whereas those cartridges using a 'fine line stylus' need less.

[Pharos]

I’ve used the Hi Fi Sounds test record bought new in 1978 for the princely sum of £2 ! I mainly use it for channel identification. Setting up the Stiletto LP 12 was left to the late Derek Jenkins R.I.P who I knew since 1982. He once told me that the other person he’d recommend was a Phil March.

Regards,

Martin

Is that is the Derek whom I knew for a long time and who worked with Dave Wiley at the Sound Organisation, London Bridge?
I spoke to him shortly before he passed, he was at KJ, and set up my friend's Linn. Rather young, and very sad that he has gone.

[martinjohn308]

Yes the same person Derek Jenkins is sorely missed by me and many others. A genius on an LP 12 and knew he way round many other turntables, I used to watch him taking my Linn apart and rebuilding fascinating.

Regards,

Martin

[krugdoktor]

Depends to some extent on the arm and on the stylus profile, but I find that the bias required is usually only a fraction of the VTF. Spherical stylii require quite high bias, whereas those cartridges using a 'fine line stylus' need less.
Imho this is complete the opposite! A spherical stylus has a very small contact area versus a more elaborate profile like fineline microridge or shibata. So the skating force which is a function of offset angle and friction is far greater with „sharper“ stylus profiles than spherical.

[Pharos]

Yes the same person Derek Jenkins is sorely missed by me and many others. A genius on an LP 12 and knew he way round many other turntables, I used to watch him taking my Linn apart and rebuilding fascinating.

Regards,

Martin

He actually told me when he looked at my Linn that I had set it up very well.

[CageyH]

So, apart from a little lateral excitation at 7Hz, my Houdini equipped DL103 has flown through the test record. I only had to adjust the bias very slightly to remove some distortion on the bias setting track. So, was it worth the money? Not sure. It has confirmed that my deck is well set up.

[Stratmangler]

So, apart from a little lateral excitation at 7Hz, my Houdini equipped DL103 has flown through the test record. I only had to adjust the bias very slightly to remove some distortion on the bias setting track. So, was it worth the money? Not sure. It has confirmed that my deck is well set up.

What's it like without the Harry?
I thought you were doing a comparison ....

[CageyH]

What's it like without the Harry?
I thought you were doing a comparison ....

No idea, and I cannot be bothered to find out, being perfectly honest.
My system sounds superb at the moment, in a way that digital does not really do, so I am too busy listening to music while the family are out for the day.

:yay:

[Stratmangler]

I'm glad you're enjoying it.
It would be nice to hear the Tracy Chapman tune without the Harry, and with the deck set up properly this time.

[CageyH]

To be honest, I don’t think it was far out. The difference maybe in the tolerances of the coils.

[Stratmangler]

Adding a Harry isn't going to sort out a coil imbalance.
The recording with the Harry sounded best because it was set up properly.

Beyond that, your tonearm is one of Arthur's mod jobs, and was IIRC on the expensive side.
So an expensive arm with an expensive widget sounding so much better than an expensive arm without the widget doesn't exactly sit well, does it?
The poor recording really was poor, and I think it's due to poor cartridge setup as much as anything else.

[CageyH]

Fair enough, but all that cannot be down to just the bias.
The VTF was set within 0.1g. The bias was untouched between Harry, and no Harry.
Both alignments were done using my Feickert gauge. The only difference was the Houdini as VTA was set by spacing out the cartridge with a high density graphite block of a similar weight to the Houdini.

You are right that the arm is a Funk FX1200, but I am surprised at the difference the Houdini makes. That is why I am keeping it.
A component upgrade to equal the change would be far more expensive.

I am on holiday the week starting the 26th, so if I get time I will remove the Houdini and redo the TC track.
I will need your e-mail address to give you access to the file, as this one is not going public on here.

[Stratmangler]

I'll drop you a line with my email.

A couple of thoughts.
Does the FX1200 have sufficient range of movement to not require a spacer block?
If so, could you do a couple of recordings, one with and one without the spacer?
Obviously using the same phono preamp and cabling as before would negate the need to record again with the Harry in harness (that sounds like a bondage film title if ever there was one :rolleyes:).

[CageyH]

Yes, there is enough range to negate the need for a block.

[CageyH]

Tracks done. Just need the address...

[Stratmangler]

PM sent :)