OH DEAR!

[Neil McCauley]

Gentlemen, to what extent - if at all - is the availability (or not) of spare boards … as distinct from spare parts … a purchasing influence on you?

Recent experience, somewhat unfortunate experience, regarding a Musical Fidelity Encore 250 revealed that all spares are kept in Austria, where are the new owners of the Company are based.

Investigation confirmed that prior to the remaining facets of MF being transferred to the new owner, a policy decision was made that all parts for all vintage items i.e. those which are not still in production were binned.

Now in some circumstances this isn't so much of a problem because, of course, some third-party / OEM components are still readily available and not necessarily specified to be precisely MF spec but that might not matter too much.

But on the other hand, complete boards (given the modern multi-layer complexity) ibeing resistant to replacing one or more individual components and, as I found out, a complete board is required. This is exactly the position I found myself in with the Encore 250 despite the fact it is still in production.

So in essence does it make sense these days to check availability of all main and secondary boards prior to investing substantial money in pre-owned classic equipment?

I've asked myself this question on a number of occasions and have yet to come up to a conclusion. Thoughts invited. Thanks. H

[hifi_dave]

I always consider backup service when taking on a brand and some are dire.

[Pharos]

That is true I have found difficulty with a company, my trying in VAIn to get service.

[Barry]

If an established and well regarded manufacturer is sold to new owners, the new owners are often not willing to repair, maintain or service older models.

SME and Harman International spring to mind, and I expect Quad will be not far behind. :rolleyes:

[Macca]

It's along time since QUAD were sold (20 years?) and it hasn't happened yet though.

[Barry]

It's along time since QUAD were sold (20 years?) and it hasn't happened yet though.

Only because the service department is still at Huntingdon and some of the staff there are old enough to be familiar with the older models.

I can't imagine them servicing a Corner Ribbon speaker, or the Series II valve gear now. In their hay day, when it was owned by the Walker family, I visited them in Huntingdon and showed them an old 'Acoustical' AM tuner (styled to match the Quad valve preamp, AM2 and FM2 tuners). They hadn't seen one for ages and knew little about it. I doubt if the situation has changed since.

Having said that, I should mention that every time I have spoken to the guys at Huntingdon, they have been very helpful, knowledgeable, friendly and reassuring.

[Jac Hawk]

Unfortunately this is the price you pay nowadays and to be honest most manufacturers don’t want to have to house spares for models 20+ years old, they want the kit to be irreparable and force you to buy new, it keeps them in business at the end of the day whereas having huge amounts of spares will cost them money and as they see it stop you making a new purchase.

[Macca]

The old stuff will always be repairable though, like the classic valve amps

And other classic gear has had a whole industry built up around restoring it, like with classic cars. I bet that barring an asteroid strike or something like that people will still be using Radford amps and Jensen Interceptors 200 years from now. The tat will fall by the wayside but that's no bad thing and there'll always be plenty of new tat to replace it.

[Barry]

The old stuff will always be repairable though, like the classic valve amps

And other classic gear has had a whole industry built up around restoring it, like with classic cars. I bet that barring an asteroid strike or something like that people will still be using Radford amps and Jensen Interceptors 200 years from now. The tat will fall by the wayside but that's no bad thing and there'll always be plenty of new tat to replace it.

Yes - old stuff will be repairable because it was made to be repairable: toasters, irons, TVs as well as cars, bikes etc. The only problem is obtaining the parts and components; which for semiconductors will become increasingly hard to source.

[Macca]

Be able to 3D print them in a few years time. Probably.

[Macca]

Actually I should answer the question which was would I buy something knowing there were no spare boards and it was landfill if one dies? Like a Class D amp for example.

I would, if I was keen on it, but I'd factor that into how much I was prepared to pay.

[Puffin]

The price of Class D amp boards and Dacs are anything from the price of a large glass of Sauvignonpinotproseccoblanc to a meal for 4. It's a throw away (or flush away) society:lol:

[Beobloke]

If an established and well regarded manufacturer is sold to new owners, the new owners are often not willing to repair, maintain or service older models.

SME and Harman International spring to mind, and I expect Quad will be not far behind. :rolleyes:

I'm not sure where this information is coming from. SME will still service everything that they would have serviced before their decision to stop selling arms. As far as I know, it's only the early 3009/12 models that they no longer support, but this has been the case for a number of years.

https://sme.co.uk/audio/support/service-repair/

[anthonyTD]

Try and stick to equipment that was built using conventional components, and good design practices, there is plenty of well designed, over engineered hence pretty much bomb proof equipment out there for the right money, Going back to digital, and CD in paticular, if your looking for a decent CD player, look at posible common issues, and try and find a source of the components beforehand ie; lasers, and transports, Dac chips etc, etc, if you have at least one spare of the most critical parts, then you shouldnt worry too much.
A...

[Mr. C]

This is the main reason I gave up repairing MF equipment even before Project bought them out, they would dump models that didn't sell within 12 months.
I could mention a couple of products that within 6 months were obsolete and then the MF 'offering' a p/x cost deal against its replacement :D

My suggestion would be to try John Sampson ex mf guy and he knows MF gear very well.

John Sampson Engineer (https://jsaudiorepairs.co.uk/story/)

[AJSki2fly]

I would confer this with respect to certain Meridian gear no longer manufactured and not supported anymore. Some of the 500 range is near on impossible to repair cost effectively if a board fails. The 562 surround sound processor unit is a good example, they can develop issues and if a board is needed then you are effectively looking for a donor or scraping it and buying another. I am not sure about earlier models or the later G range. They are pretty reliable though but can be costly if they fail.

[Barry]

I'm not sure where this information is coming from. SME will still service everything that they would have serviced before their decision to stop selling arms. As far as I know, it's only the early 3009/12 models that they no longer support, but this has been the case for a number of years.

https://sme.co.uk/audio/support/service-repair/

What about the 'M2' and 'M2-R' models? The website you cite does not give an information on servicing - presumably due to C-19.

[mikeyb]

One of the NAD M models is landfill if the board goes, someone on another forum was told that his was unrepairable due to the surface mount boards used and they didn't make them any more, from memory it was only a few years old at the time.

[Beobloke]

One of the NAD M models is landfill if the board goes, someone on another forum was told that his was unrepairable due to the surface mount boards used and they didn't make them any more, from memory it was only a few years old at the time.

It is usually possible to replace surface mount components if you have access to the right tools. The big issue is that if a programmable IC fails, even if you can buy a new chip, you have zero chance of getting hold of the software with which to re-program it.

[Mr. C]

However if it has a J-tag you can interrogate the processor/pfga with a serial decoder a Jtag programmer is peanuts these days, though like Adam has mentioned your need to understand the circuit before attempting a mem dump