Friendly and helpful?

[Steve Toy]

I've just had a pleasant chat (not) with the customer services lady at this place: http://www.jfa.org.uk/ regarding the EIKOS Precision CD player (based on the Pioneer PD904) I want to buy from AnthonyTD.

I've made my mind up that I want the player but for peace of mind, not least because should this player ever fail and replacement parts, notably the laser pick-up assembly, were no longer available I would be forced to spend around £10,000 for a new player that would equal it in terms of performance.

The good news is that I've found a supplier of the pick-up assembly and even have a part number from Pioneer themselves who confirm that stocks are still plentiful. :) The cost is £58.05 incl VAT and carriage. However, it is unlikely that this will remain the case forever so it seems prudent to order a couple of these parts now to put on a shelf for the future.

Unfortunately JFA refuse to fit any part they did not supply themselves. I said that I would have no problem with that if they could guarantee always to be able to source supplies of this part, which of course they cannot. I explained my reasoning for wanting to purchase the part in advance of actually needing it and then being able to send it along with the player to someone with the requisite alignment jig to fit if/when the laser pick-up assembly fails in the future.

There was no flexibility on this so I can conclude that I'm disappointed with their levels of service. :steam:



J F Associates has been serving the Oxfordshire, Buckinghamshire & Berkshire communities since 1984. We offer the complete after sales solution for all your Plasma & LCD televisions & audio equipment. From Installation, including wall mounting, through to service & repair.

Our friendly & professional staff are here to help you.


:rolleyes:

Needless to say I shall go ahead with the purchase of the player and try to find a used PD 904 player to cannibalise given that swapping the entire transport mechanism from one player to another would be much simpler than fitting the pick-up assembly to an existing transport mech.
[/URL]
I've refered the matter to these guys:

[URL]http://www.thenoiseuk.com/contact (http://www.thenoiseuk.com/contact)

[Steve Toy]

Update: I've tracked down and placed an order for a second-hand Pioneer PD S 904 player for £178 :)

[Rare Bird]

Steve i wouldnt loose any sleep long as you get a spare lazer..

[Steve Toy]

I need spare laser + someone with the alignment jig. Or alternatively a Pioneer PD S 904 to cannibalise. :)

[DSJR]

You won't get a better CD player for £10,000 IMO, merely a better looking one and a very rich supplier. I think this view is more fact than *just* opinion these days when DAC chipsets are a few quid.

Worth reading this courtesy of Andre-

http://www.lampizator.eu/lampizator/REFERENCES/TEAC-T1/VRDS-T1.html

Shows how to take a good cheap Sony mech and dress it up into something looking far more expensive and then hide the evidence under a sophisticated moulding...

The best CD players really don't need to cost many thousands of pounds to perform properly I believe. Just think of the quality of components that has always gone into the recording process (and barely a cerafine or black gate among them, let alone finest silver wire...)

[Steve Toy]

I disagree. There are CD players and there are CD players. It's not down to the chipsets. It's down to the clocks, power supplies, noise regulation and output stages. These don't come cheap.

The EIKOS player was very expensive in its day. My ears tell me it is one of about four CD players I've heard* that I would wish to own and they include the DcS Puccini/Word Clock which is around £14,000, The Esoterc X-O5 at £12,000 and the Naim CDS 555 at £16,000.


Just think of the quality of components that has always gone into the recording process (and barely a cerafine or black gate among them, let alone finest silver wire...)

This has to be the best (or worst) example of reductionism I've read in a while. To faithfully reproduce what's on the recording is all I ask for. That is not as easy as it can be made to seem.

*Using those God-given thingies on either side of your head. They aren't optional!

Regarding the link above, I've read it before. There are different types of VRDS transport and the one above was the cheapest. A bit like an X-Type Jag that's really a Ford Mondeo. It still doesn't detract from the quality of the XF and the XJ Jags though.

[StanleyB]

I need spare laser + someone with the alignment jig. Or alternatively a Pioneer PD S 904 to cannibalise. :)
Be careful with the four springs in each corner under the mech deck. If you put each one back in a different location you'll experience a lot of pain and utter many foul words afterwards. I learnt to tie a label on them and give it a number plus position.

[Steve Toy]

Thanks for that Stanley although I wouldn't undertake the job myself. Worth knowing to the guy who may do the job for me. :)

[Rare Bird]

I disagree. There are CD players and there are CD players. It's not down to the chipsets. It's down to the clocks, power supplies, noise regulation and output stages. These don't come cheap.



There is no need to spend silly money tho steve..Work on the outputs, the regulators & clock for starters & your cooking, even flash Caps required for CD players don't cost the earth.. Yeh agreed there is some real shit that aint worth taking the hood off but there is also a lot of sensible money players you can work on the be giant killers.

[Marco]

The EIKOS player was very expensive in its day. My ears tell me it is one of about four CD players I've heard* that I would wish to own and they include the DcS Puccini/Word Clock which is around £14,000, The Esoterc X-O5 at £12,000 and the Naim CDS 555 at £16,000.


LOL! What's happened to the Sony, Steve, which you've raved about on many occasions, and which spawned the realisation that it wasn't your speakers which needed upgrading (although they do, too), but rather your front end? ;)

My Audiocom-modified DAS-R1 DAC, in conjunction with either your Bel Canto transport, or my Audiocom-modified Sony transport, is every bit as good as the Eikos, although both have their particular strengths. We agreed on this, remember?

I also think it would give the Esoteric and Naim a run for their money, overall, although both those players, like the Eikos, have their particular strengths.

Personally, I wouldn't use ANY DCS player if I were given one for nothing, as I loathe the (easily heard to me) artifice of up-sampling - and I don't care WHAT system it's used in! :spew:

Marco.

[Steve Toy]

Marco, this may seem a bit pedantic but we are talking CD players. Your Sony is a DAC but agreed its up there with the aforementioned in terms of performance.

Regarding the poor performance of the DCS Scarlatti at the Manchester show in January 2008, I was there. It was dreadful. There was no texture or timbre to instruments and everything sounded kind of shiny. However, I have since twice heard the Puccini/Word Clock through valves and was twice extremely impressed. There was no loss of texture in either case.

[Marco]

No worries, but it's not just the DAC that's good, is it? When you've been round at mine for a sesh, you didn't just listen to the DAC on its own! CD transport + DAC = CD player ;)

Marco.

[leo]

The pioneer laser mech's are reliable and should last for ages, probably the motor will go before the laser head unit.

Do you have the service manual for the PDS-904 Steve? I've got it in PDF, let me know if you want it, it contains useful info ;)

I may mod the one I have, mainly to be used as a transport for my dacs

[Steve Toy]

Aye. Anyway it's been good to exchange pedantries ;) :)

Remember also that your DAC is a one-off. The standard unmodified DAS R1s are not in the same league as the abovementioned although yours certainly is.

[Steve Toy]

Leo, thanks. The PDS 904 I've ordered comes with all the packaging, remote and instruction manual as well as a 90 day warranty.

However, the service manual could prove useful. :)

[Marco]

Remember also that your DAC is a one-off. The standard unmodified DAS R1s are not in the same league as the abovementioned although yours certainly is.


Yep, it's still a viable option to own, though. Both transport (CDP) and DAC come up fairly regularly for sale on Ebay, and Mark is of course on-hand to modify them :)

Oh, and the total cost of such is also a damn sight less than the Esoteric, Naim and DCS options! Remember, SPPV is what we champion on AOS, mon ami ;)

Personally, I'd rather a small, specialist, business like Mark's got the bulk of any sales than any of the aforementioned commercial companies.

I'd always advocate that people buy quality vintage CDPs (with proper transport mechs), and have them judiciously internally modified, than paying through the nose for a new 'desirable badge' CDP, or some of the shite that's sold these days, posing as 'CD players', at the bottom/mid of the market.

Marco.

[leo]

No probs, its about 5mb's in size though so you'll need space in your inbox, just pm me your email if you want it, The service manual contains the part numbers, schematics and waveforms etc, useful when repairing :)

[Steve Toy]

KJ West One will be sending my mint and complete with all packaging, instructions and remote Pioneer PD S-904 player via courier on Monday. :)

Many thanks to Richard at KJ West One.

[DSJR]

My mate Richard - remind him I exist will you if you speak to him again - he'll know what you mean if you mention his long lost pal from Suffolk he used to work with ;)

[Steve Toy]

I did mention to him that we have a Dave who posts on our site as DSJR who used to work at the Northampton branch about ten years ago. He said he'd only worked there for 6 years.