Silver plated copper vs copper speaker wires ? What's better ? Help !!!

[Denzil]

There's a long standing debate and I'm really confused.

Some say speaker wire makes no difference at all and any wire will work well, even if it's a decent bell switch wire. Others say copper is better. And many say silver plated copper wire brings out the highs and makes the bass tighter.

Please help, I'm confused !!!

Regards,

Denzil

[Gazjam]

Have owned silver plated copper and copper speaker cables, no real hard n fast rule one over the other imo.
Pure silver cables are another league altogether though, but be prepared to sell a kidney!

[Denzil]

Have owned silver plated copper and copper speaker cables, no real hard n fast rule one over the other imo.
Pure silver cables are another league altogether though, but be prepared to sell a kidney!

I've heard of pure silver being used from crossovers to the drivers. But not seen any commercially available pure silver speaker cables. Do you have any links ?

Regards,

Denzil

[Firebottle]

Go with PC-OCC copper and you can't go wrong.

[walpurgis]

Go with PC-OCC copper and you can't go wrong.

Yup.

Silver plated wires can sound brash and pure silver can seem bright.

[Denzil]

Go with PC-OCC copper and you can't go wrong.

So pure copper is better or as good as silver plated copper ?

Thanks,

Denzil

[walpurgis]

I've messed about with every type of wire, for speakers and interconnects and found I just don't like silver plated wire. Pure silver can be very good, but is system dependant, good pure copper is a safe bet and what I use.

[bumpy]

I've messed about with every type of wire, for speakers and interconnects and found I just don't like silver plated wire. Pure silver can be very good, but is system dependant, good pure copper is a safe bet and what I use.

I would second this. :)

[Yomanze]

Personally, it's silver or copper for me.

Plating adds something at the top end.

[Denzil]

I've messed about with every type of wire, for speakers and interconnects and found I just don't like silver plated wire. Pure silver can be very good, but is system dependant, good pure copper is a safe bet and what I use.

Thanks Geoff,

You are always so quick to respond. When you say that you don't like it, is there anything specific that you find with silver plated wire which you don't like ? What's the difference that you find between silver plated and copper wire ?

Thanks,

Denzil

[Denzil]

I would second this. :)

Thanks !

What's your experience, what's the difference between silver plated and copper ?

Regards,

Denzil

[Denzil]

Personally, it's silver or copper for me.

Plating adds something at the top end.

Thanks,

When you say plating adds something at the top end, can it enhance top end with more detail in any way or does it mess things up ?

Regards,

Denzil

[hornucopia]

I've heard of pure silver being used from crossovers to the drivers. But not seen any commercially available pure silver speaker cables. Do you have any links ?

Regards,

Denzil

Ocellia.My .21 Caliopes have internal wire that's MDI covered silver.
https://6moons.com/audioreviews/ocellia4/5.html
Costs a lot of course.
When I borrowed a speaker set, my aged ears couldn't hear any benefit.

[Yomanze]

Thanks,

When you say plating adds something at the top end, can it enhance top end with more detail in any way or does it mess things up ?

Regards,

Denzil

I am not really a fan of using cables to try to tweak the sound, but I think it'd be unfair for me to say it always messes up the sound. I think yes, subjectively, silver plating can sound a bit 'brighter'. A bit. These things don't make a massive difference. Component choices like speakers, amps and sources way way more important.

[fatmarley]

I've only ever tried Chord odyssey 2 (silver plated copper) against Naim Nac A5 (copper). To me the Odyssey sounded unnatural in the high frequencies. A little bright at certain frequencies but also overly smooth at others (very strange)

[Denzil]

I am not really a fan of using cables to try to tweak the sound, but I think it'd be unfair for me to say it always messes up the sound. I think yes, subjectively, silver plating can sound a bit 'brighter'. A bit. These things don't make a massive difference. Component choices like speakers, amps and sources way way more important.

Okay, I think I get the feeling from what you are saying, copper is more neutral, natural, while silver plated copper tends to be artificially bright.

Thanks,

Denzil

[Denzil]

I've only ever tried Chord odyssey 2 (silver plated copper) against Naim Nac A5 (copper). To me the Odyssey sounded unnatural in the high frequencies. A little bright at certain frequencies but also overly smooth at others (very strange)

Thanks Matt,

So assuming all things considered are as near perfect as possible with amp, speakers, source etc., would you use copper or silver plated copper ? Would you consider copper to be more faithful to what should be transmitted to the speakers ? Are they just different ? Or would you consider one more truthful than the other ?

Thanks,

Denzil

[RobbieGong]

I have QED silver Spiral speaker cable, which is silver plated copper. Never found the cable itself to be bright or unnatural in presentation.

[Denzil]

I have QED silver Spiral speaker cable, which is silver plated copper. Never found the cable itself to be bright or unnatural in presentation.

Ah, that's interesting to hear. So you are using a silver plated copper wire out of choice and find it completely "normal" in a sense. While many seem to think it's bright, compared to copper.

Thanks Robbie !

Regards,

Denzil

[WullieD20]

I've messed about with every type of wire, for speakers and interconnects and found I just don't like silver plated wire. Pure silver can be very good, but is system dependant, good pure copper is a safe bet and what I use.

I'm with Geoff on this one, having used many many different cables over my lifetime hobby. The bottom line is that most will suit you perfectly, but all may be system dependent to some degree and that's when you have to make up your own mind just as to what they do for YOU.

One of the best cables I ever used sort of 'went against the grain' as they were minimalist (by dimension) and contrary to most designs, being a very small coaxial type made by Audience, who use Mogami cable of pure copper.

When I retired I was fortunate enough to be able to try pure silver cables in my system, which brought noticeable improvements (to my ears)!!

So, although they are not commonplace, here is one website (Dram (http://www.dram-cables.com/)) that will give you an idea of what is available and their associated costs.........!!!!

Try different cables in your own system and make up your mind accordingly. Good luck.

[RobbieGong]

Ah, that's interesting to hear. So you are using a silver plated copper wire out of choice and find it completely "normal" in a sense. While many seem to think it's bright, compared to copper.

Thanks Robbie !

Regards,

Denzil


I always have a really good read and search as much info as i can get hold of towards an informed decision, after which i have a good idea of what I do and dont want.

Silver Spiral kept hitting my radar. I couldnt afford new so i waited and picked up 2 x 5 meter lengths for £180, terminated at one end as i wanted. Goes for around £40 a meter approx these days I believe.

They are great speaker cable, not bright to my ears as I dont like bright or fatiguing at all. They've been on the end of different speakers and amps too.

[fatmarley]

Thanks Matt,

So assuming all things considered are as near perfect as possible with amp, speakers, source etc., would you use copper or silver plated copper ? Would you consider copper to be more faithful to what should be transmitted to the speakers ? Are they just different ? Or would you consider one more truthful than the other ?

Thanks,

Denzil

I use Talk Cable 3 (https://willys-hifi.com/products/talk-electronics-talk-3-speaker-cable) (not to be confused with Cable Talk 3) and have no desire to change.
On a slightly different note I replaced the steel cable in my old Sennheiser HD25 ii headphones with copper and also noticed a more mature / realistic sound. But It's not just cables, I also prefer copper foil capacitors. Copper just seems more analogue or less bright / thin sounding than aluminium or tin foil. I haven't tried silver foil capacitors and TBH I very much doubt I ever will.

[Macca]

I've only ever tried Chord Odyssey 2 (silver plated copper) against Naim Nac A5 (copper). To me the Odyssey sounded unnatural in the high frequencies. A little bright at certain frequencies but also overly smooth at others (very strange)

I have some of that amongst an embarrassingly large collection of speaker cables. Works well with some combinations of equipment, doesn't with others. In general I've found the thicker the cable and the purer the copper the better. Could be my imagination of course. Never tried pure silver though.

[Columbo]

So pure copper is better or as good as silver plated copper ?

Thanks,

Denzil"Pure"? How "Pure"? Even cheap cables use OFHC (Oxygen Free High Conductivity) copper, which is 99.99% pure copper. You'd think that would be pure enough, wouldn't you?

PC-OCC/UP-OCC (Pure Copper Ohno Continuous Cast/Ultra Pure Continuous Cast - both basically the same thing, manufacturing process) manages to stretch-out the grains in the copper to exceedingly long lengths, the result of which is fewer impurities and purer copper. The purity is measured in Ns. 5N OCC is commonly found which is 99.999% pure copper. 8N is the highest available I've seen 99.999999%

The same process can be used with silver.

As to which is best? Well only you can decide that for yourself. Some think OCC doesn't offer any real advantage over OFHC. Some think silver is worth forking out for. Some think silver-plating is a waste of time. Tin-plating used to get used once. But that's fallen out of favour.

Not a lot of help. Just an explanation.

Belkin used to be the cheapest source for 5N PC-OCC cables. But they're not available now. Some years ago they used to do a speaker cable called "Silver Pure" I think. Not actually silver; that was just the product name. Quite a few here tried them and raved about them. You can get interconnects for video sometimes on eBay. But it's not often.

Some here £15:

http://ebay.co.uk/itm/303569225947

5N PC-OCC 15ft and silver-plated(!)

[Yomanze]

My cables are pretty much all LC-OFC or PC-OCC (copper). It doesn’t have to be expensive either, unlike the equivalent pure silver...

[anthonyTD]

From my own experience, always try to stick with one metal, ie; copper, or silver, mixing silver over copper adds an imbalance to the frequency transfer, which although on first listen; can have the affect that there is more detail, attack etc, but all too often; it soon becomes tireing, and can lead to listening fatigue.
Hope this helps.
A...

[walpurgis]

Compared to copper cored cables, the pure silver items are disproportionately expensive. Obviously the unit cost will be higher as it's a specialised market, but the prices do not reflect the modest amount of silver used. It's a 'luxury' product, so you pay accordingly.

In some implementations silver may be preferred, in others, not! I'll stick with copper thanks, it's consistent.

[walpurgis]

Audio Note prices are 'interesting'.

https://www.hificollective.co.uk/wire/audio-note-cable-9001-sogon96-silver.html

https://www.decoaudio.com/deco_audio_ic_unterm.html

[antonio]

Some silver speaker cables here if you did want to try. Been very happy with a digital interconnect from them. https://www.artisansilvercables.co.uk/speaker-cables
Just looked on ebay and here's a set at a more reasonable cost. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PURE-SILVER-and-COTTON-SPEAKER-CABLES-Pair-2-4m-8-ft-AUDIOPHILE-FREE-SHIPPING/352160676310?hash=item51fe6979d6:g:LhkAAOSwEK9T~hM l

[Columbo]

Silver's expensive simply because it's a precious metal and a trading commodity. At the moment it's over £14 an ounce.

It's always going to be an expensive option. (Some) people will remember Audio Note's Ongaku valve amp from '89. It used Italian Solid Silver with silk insulation wire in the transformers, silver capacitors and silver wiring. It made quite an impression on those that heard it. According to the designer, there was nothing special about the circuit. What gave it it's qualities, was it's use of silver throughout.

[sailor]

Hi Denzil,

anthonyTD's findings mirror my own. I have never felt comfortable with silver plated copper. If you wish to try silver, I've had good results with some soft annealed pure silver used for jewellery, and at sane prices. Good for tweeters and interconnects. Do not get the Stirling silver. Will see if I can find the link if you are interested.

However, isn't there always a however, I am now using Duelund Tinned copper in an oil impregnated cotton sleeve. Check out Duelund DCA16awg which for its performance is a bargain, especially as they are best with no connectors. Will suit your sensitive Tannoy speakers beautifully.

Jeff Day has much to say about the above at this link.
https://positive-feedback.com/audio-discourse/duelund-coherent-audio-dca16ga-premium-tinned-copper-vintage-tone-cable/

[Lawrence001]

What lengths do you need Denzil?

[Denzil]

I always have a really good read and search as much info as i can get hold of towards an informed decision, after which i have a good idea of what I do and dont want.

Silver Spiral kept hitting my radar. I couldnt afford new so i waited and picked up 2 x 5 meter lengths for £180, terminated at one end as i wanted. Goes for around £40 a meter approx these days I believe.

They are great speaker cable, not bright to my ears as I dont like bright or fatiguing at all. They've been on the end of different speakers and amps too.

Great, thanks for the clarification. So it's not just copper or silver plated copper but also the company/brand which makes a difference.

Regards,

Denzil

[Denzil]

I use Talk Cable 3 (https://willys-hifi.com/products/talk-electronics-talk-3-speaker-cable) (not to be confused with Cable Talk 3) and have no desire to change.
On a slightly different note I replaced the steel cable in my old Sennheiser HD25 ii headphones with copper and also noticed a more mature / realistic sound. But It's not just cables, I also prefer copper foil capacitors. Copper just seems more analogue or less bright / thin sounding than aluminium or tin foil. I haven't tried silver foil capacitors and TBH I very much doubt I ever will.

Okay, got it. So your over preference is copper.

Thanks,

Denzil

[Denzil]

I have some of that amongst an embarrassingly large collection of speaker cables. Works well with some combinations of equipment, doesn't with others. In general I've found the thicker the cable and the purer the copper the better. Could be my imagination of course. Never tried pure silver though.

:) send over all your extra wire. But yes, I get it. You think copper is overall better except for pure silver which you haven't tried.

Thanks !

Denzil

[Denzil]

My cables are pretty much all LC-OFC or PC-OCC (copper). It doesn’t have to be expensive either, unlike the equivalent pure silver...

Okay, good to know your opinion.

Thanks !

Denzil

[Denzil]

From my own experience, always try to stick with one metal, ie; copper, or silver, mixing silver over copper adds an imbalance to the frequency transfer, which although on first listen; can have the affect that there is more detail, attack etc, but all too often; it soon becomes tireing, and can lead to listening fatigue.
Hope this helps.
A...

Thanks Tony !

That makes sense.

Regards,

Denzil

[Denzil]

Compared to copper cored cables, the pure silver items are disproportionately expensive. Obviously the unit cost will be higher as it's a specialised market, but the prices do not reflect the modest amount of silver used. It's a 'luxury' product, so you pay accordingly.

In some implementations silver may be preferred, in others, not! I'll stick with copper thanks, it's consistent.

Yes, that makes sense. And I'm wondering what happens to pure silver in the long run because it gets tarnished.

Denzil

[Denzil]

Audio Note prices are 'interesting'.

https://www.hificollective.co.uk/wire/audio-note-cable-9001-sogon96-silver.html

https://www.decoaudio.com/deco_audio_ic_unterm.html

Wow. That's a small fortune for one metre !

Denzil

[Denzil]

Some silver speaker cables here if you did want to try. Been very happy with a digital interconnect from them. https://www.artisansilvercables.co.uk/speaker-cables
Just looked on ebay and here's a set at a more reasonable cost. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PURE-SILVER-and-COTTON-SPEAKER-CABLES-Pair-2-4m-8-ft-AUDIOPHILE-FREE-SHIPPING/352160676310?hash=item51fe6979d6:g:LhkAAOSwEK9T~hM l

Thanks Antonio !

Denzil

[Denzil]

Silver's expensive simply because it's a precious metal and a trading commodity. At the moment it's over £14 an ounce.

It's always going to be an expensive option. (Some) people will remember Audio Note's Ongaku valve amp from '89. It used Italian Solid Silver with silk insulation wire in the transformers, silver capacitors and silver wiring. It made quite an impression on those that heard it. According to the designer, there was nothing special about the circuit. What gave it it's qualities, was it's use of silver throughout.

But does silver speaker cable tarnish like silver jewellery ? Would that change the sound quality ?

Denzil

[sanchezxxx]

Played around with cables after getting sucked into WHF reviews and all the silver talk. There was clearly a difference that you could tell blind. I found silver very harsh, over the top in terms of transparency and unforgiving of poor recordings. Switching to copper and keeping runs of cable short let me just enjoy the music.

Got some cheap amazon 99.x copper on prime while waiting for my Van Damme and even that sounds better than the cheap 5* rated silver plated recommended stuff that IMO is junk.

[Columbo]

But does silver speaker cable tarnish like silver jewellery ? Would that change the sound quality ?

DenzilWell whatever is exposed to the air will react and tarnish - silver oxide. But the outer cable itself is going to be a barrier; the connection is likely to be nigh-on airtight, but over a period of time is likely to oxidize and discolour, requiring a periodic cleaning. But unless you can get silver speaker cables at a bargain price - they will cost a fortune, as has been indicated. No idea what you have as a system, but silver speaker cables would be not be a high priority for me. I would imagine the money could be better spent elsewhere on your system.

[Denzil]

Well whatever is exposed to the air will react and tarnish - silver oxide. But the outer cable itself is going to be a barrier; the connection is likely to be nigh-on airtight, but over a period of time is likely to oxidize and discolour, requiring a periodic cleaning. But unless you can get silver speaker cables at a bargain price - they will cost a fortune, as has been indicated. No idea what you have as a system, but silver speaker cables would be not be a high priority for me. I would imagine the money could be better spent elsewhere on your system.

Thank you Frank,

That makes sense.

Regards,

Denzil

[Denzil]

Played around with cables after getting sucked into WHF reviews and all the silver talk. There was clearly a difference that you could tell blind. I found silver very harsh, over the top in terms of transparency and unforgiving of poor recordings. Switching to copper and keeping runs of cable short let me just enjoy the music.

Got some cheap amazon 99.x copper on prime while waiting for my Van Damme and even that sounds better than the cheap 5* rated silver plated recommended stuff that IMO is junk.

Got it. So copper is the clear winner.

Thanks !

Denzil

[Denzil]

Hi Denzil,

anthonyTD's findings mirror my own. I have never felt comfortable with silver plated copper. If you wish to try silver, I've had good results with some soft annealed pure silver used for jewellery, and at sane prices. Good for tweeters and interconnects. Do not get the Stirling silver. Will see if I can find the link if you are interested.

However, isn't there always a however, I am now using Duelund Tinned copper in an oil impregnated cotton sleeve. Check out Duelund DCA16awg which for its performance is a bargain, especially as they are best with no connectors. Will suit your sensitive Tannoy speakers beautifully.

Jeff Day has much to say about the above at this link.
https://positive-feedback.com/audio-discourse/duelund-coherent-audio-dca16ga-premium-tinned-copper-vintage-tone-cable/

Yes Charles,

This is great info. And and more so, the gorgeous caps !!!

Regards,

Denzil

[zanash]

"Well whatever is exposed to the air will react and tarnish - silver oxide. But the outer cable itself is going to be a barrier; the connection is likely to be nigh-on airtight, but over a period of time is likely to oxidize and discolour, requiring a periodic cleaning. But unless you can get silver speaker cables at a bargain price - they will cost a fortune, as has been indicated. No idea what you have as a system, but silver speaker cables would be not be a high priority for me. I would imagine the money could be better spent elsewhere on your system. " reply by columbo

The main tarnish elements for silver are sulphides and nitrates from SO2 and nitrus oxides in the air ...very little silver oxide is formed ...

Interestingly silver salts are within a few percentage points as conductive as pure silver.

copper salts are semi conductive and some are diodic ...the very first diodes were made from copper salts. Copper will also tell you what the salts are as they are all differently colored...in my experience you almost never get copper oxide [which is black] its more likely to be red or greeny or bluey you can id them here ! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_copper_salts

[maxrob200]

I have always stuck to one type of metal as well, either pure copper or silver. Each time I tried silver-plated copper, it seems to be artificially bright or adds a "tizziness" to the sound which annoys me to no end. Sounds like a stylus with grit on it and needs to be cleaned....my analogy

[hifinutt]

Yes, that makes sense. And I'm wondering what happens to pure silver in the long run because it gets tarnished.

Denzil

it only gets tarnished on the exposed bits , i use chord epic in one system and sometime just have to peel back the teflon to re terminate infrequently

[maxrob200]

Copper tarnished = copper oxide which I believe is non-conductive, wheres silver tarnished = silver oxide which remains conductive

I have DIY silver interconnects with a teflon dielectric sheath and I have not noticed any tarnishing at all despite them being several years old since I made them

[Pegwill]

Hi

I found this article interesting - I have no association with the company.

http://www.laventure.net/tourist/cables.htm

Hope it helps

Regards