Aquired a new turntable

[Richardl]

I should say, I already own a Technics SL-1200 with a Audiomods arm and a Nagaoka MP500.

The story is, I was selling an AV amplifier for £599 or best offer on Ebay, someone offers me a swap or £490 in cash. I have a choice of either a Leak stereo 20 refurbished with an extra set of valves or a Garrard 401 turntable with a Rega arm.

I've picked the turntable, the plinth isn't great, the Rega arm, which I think is a polished RB300 (Ithink??) which needed a bit of a clean up, the turntable itself looks in amazing condition considering its age, all the surfaces are clean the light and eem to work fine and it's quiet.

Problem is, I haven't a clue what I'm going to do with it, are these better than a SL1200? I do love the look of some of the plinths you can get for 401's.

I was thinking put the Audiomods arm and the Nagaoka on the 401 with a nice looking plinth, then sell the technics with the Rega arm, but it's not worth it if it's going to degrade the sound.

27705

27706

[graham67]

Hi richard, I think you did very well. That is the sought after early flush strobe model. And the rega looks like an rb300 as you say with the tungsten cw and also a polished tube. Would be worth looking at the cable to see if that is original rega cheapie or has been replaced and check if the tube been foam filled?
The question of what is better is very subjective. In my experience, the 401 can be made into a top notch tt more on the level of an sp10 but with a very different presentation. But it requires a fair bit of investment (in time and money) to realise it's potential.
An unserviced 401 in a cheap plinth is unlikely to impress after your 1210 which is more fit and forget but can also be easily improved.
The audiomods arm.would be a great arm for the 401 .
So the main challenges will be the
. Plinth, no shortage of options and opinions on what is best !
. Getting it serviced by a reputable business and running as it it should
. Personally I would get a PSU as the pitch variation on 21st century mains on the early gen 401 is a problem (but once solved kicks the garrard into the major league)

So not a trivial undertaking but get it right and the 401 may well be your deck for life :)

[Ali Tait]

+1 on a decent PSU for the Garrard, such as the Longdog. Makes a massive difference imo.

[Mikeandvan]

You got quite a bargain on that, so wouldn't worry too much about spending another £500 on refining it. I've also recently started using my long ago acquired 401 with jelco arm, and Nag mp200 cart. The more I play old records the more it impresses, digs deep, and puts real feeling into the music, by that I mean drums for instance sound fully fleshed out, rather than just a 'beat' you hear other aspects of the drumming, overall music has a propulsive quality, often bringing a smile to one's face. I like what I hear and will try to further refine mine. Thing is with plinths you can pay a £100 or £800, but it seems you're basically getting the same thing, a big lump of ply, and not much else. I started looking at skeletal plinths, they are just two bits of ply with some metal posts in between, and 4 sorbathane balls, for that you must pay £700, I think not. I mean how easy is it to make your own ? Das acoustics make a nice piano black plywood plinth for about £450, looks nice, but as I said should sound the same as a £100 ply cheapie. I'm guessing you don't wanna spend £700 on a power supply? Some recommend the AG1500 (power Inspired) which can be had for £300 or less used, and you can also plug 3 other units into it, be it amps or whatever. Does it make much difference? I'll unplug mine over the next few days and see.

[losepete]

You may want to talk to Dominic at NorthWest Analog about service and plinth options for Garrard desks see https://www.northwestanalogue.com/

[dwhistance]

I disagree with Mike's comment suggesting all ply plinths are the same, the devil as they say is in the details. I have a Martin Bastin plinth on my 401 which looks very, very simple when you just see the outside, particularly as mine is the naked ply version. It's only when you remove the deck that you can see the amount of thought he has put into the design, particularly the way the deck is fastened to the plinth and then the decoupling of the motor from the rest of the deck. His plinths aren't at all expensive but I would thoroughly recommend them to anyone looking for a plinth for a 401. You won't find a website for him but he is available by phone, PM me if you want the number.

Re the alternative "Loricraft" approach I do agree that with a bit of research it is possible to make something similar for much less money. Have a look at the Vinylista website, I think it still available, as Martin gives a lot of information on how he put together his plinths. He is sadly no longer with us but did produce some nice looking and sounding Garrard plinths.

David Whistance

[dwhistance]

PS, Martin Bastin also services Garrards rather well and doesn't overcharge

[Mikeandvan]

I disagree with Mike's comment suggesting all ply plinths are the same, the devil as they say is in the details. I have a Martin Bastin plinth on my 401 which looks very, very simple when you just see the outside, particularly as mine is the naked ply version. It's only when you remove the deck that you can see the amount of thought he has put into the design, particularly the way the deck is fastened to the plinth and then the decoupling of the motor from the rest of the deck. His plinths aren't at all expensive but I would thoroughly recommend them to anyone looking for a plinth for a 401. You won't find a website for him but he is available by phone, PM me if you want the number.

Re the alternative "Loricraft" approach I do agree that with a bit of research it is possible to make something similar for much less money. Have a look at the Vinylista website, I think it still available, as Martin gives a lot of information on how he put together his plinths. He is sadly no longer with us but did produce some nice looking and sounding Garrard plinths.

David Whistance

Do you know where one can see pics of how the motor is decoupled? Or of a Bastin 401 plinth without motor unit?

[dwhistance]

As far as I know there aren't any images on line anywhere showing how Martin decouples the motor or indeed the other tweaks he uses in his plinth designs. I looked long and hard for them as I thought I had a much more basic plinth from him and wanted to implement the "full monty" in mine. It wasn't until I took it apart to get at the bearing that I realised what I had. As it's a proprietary, and clever, design I really can't post any images of mine but if you phone Martin I suspect he'll talk you though what he does. I should say that I thought the cost of him servicing my 401 and putting it into one of his plinths was incredibly cheap compared to anyone else, that was the main reason I assumed I had a basic plinth. Having taken it apart and seen the details he builds in I'm even more impressed with the value for money.

David Whistance

[DiveDeepDog]

That looks decent enough to play and enjoy. See if you like it as it is. No amount of fettling, new plinth or PS will alter the basic tone of the deck and there's a chance you'll prefer the presentation of DD.

I'm the other way, Garrard's are my thing despite having all sorts of belt drive TT's and a Sony TT8000 I keep coming back to idlers.

If you feel the same after playing what you've got, get stuck in with the mods above...

[Richardl]

Thanks for all the advice.

I've had another look today, it does seem a bit noisy when I push the platter round by hand, as though there's some dry bearings?? The cable on the RB300 is a cheap one, but I'm not too bothered by that, as I won't be using it anyway.

There's some really nice looking plinths on Ebay for not too much money, they all seem designed for SME 9/12" arms rather than Rega fit. There does seem to be mounting plates for Rega arms, maybe I could just get a SME and using a mounting plate (www.soundsupports.com/shop/categories/Garrard%20301%20and%20401)??

How much does it cost to get one serviced? I know Northwest analogue are very reputable, but I'd imagine they are pricey??

[DiveDeepDog]

There's a brake which will be the noise. Switch it on unplugged, it should spin freely.

[Mikeandvan]

I'm sceptical of all so called upgrades, and the differences are often too small to be really appreciated. Think i'll just go cheapy cheapy Moldovian plinth when he starts selling again, purely cos this SME bath tub style plinth I got looks shite.

[karma67]

im liking your avatars mike,first the lunatic from dirty harry and now poltergeist

[Mikeandvan]

im liking your avatars mike,first the lunatic from dirty harry and now poltergeist

Scorpio, my favourite lunatic, I know all his lines from that film.

[karma67]

hubber hubber! i love the scene when he's screaming row row row your boat to get the kids singing,then he tells them he's gonna kill all your mummys an daddys lol great film.

[Mikeandvan]

hubber hubber! i love the scene when he's screaming row row row your boat to get the kids singing,then he tells them he's gonna kill all your mummys an daddys lol great film.

'Hubba Hubba pig bastard', is the full line. 'That man had rights', 'Well, I'm all broken up about that man's rights'.
Don't wish to derail the thread so i'll move to the AV studio...…..

[Gianfranco]

I have 2 turntables in my hifi, a Technics SL1200G, and a Thorens TD124 mkII that I have completely refurbished,
I have installed the Rega RB2000 arm and a rega Aphelion mc head.
I let you imagine its sound, there is none for anyone, its sound is incredible.
So .. if you want to have a really top analog sound you just have to do like me.
Hi.

[Mikeandvan]

I have 2 turntables in my hifi, a Technics SL1200G, and a Thorens TD124 mkII that I have completely refurbished,
I have installed the Rega RB2000 arm and a rega Aphelion mc head.
I let you imagine its sound, there is none for anyone, its sound is incredible.
So .. if you want to have a really top analog sound you just have to do like me.
Hi.

What do you prefer the 1200 or 124?

[Gianfranco]

They are 2 distinctly different sounds, the technics is my forklift truck since I can interchange my different heads,
while on the thorens there is a fixed one.
Anyway .... when I want to enjoy a truly spectacular sound I am the thorens able to excite me, the sound sound is pure magic!

[RobbieGong]

Some 124 goodness :)


https://www.woodsongaudio.com/service/thorens-td124-restoration-service

https://www.woodsongaudio.com/plinths/thorens-td124-classic

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1a/Thorens_TD124_MkI_SME3009_SII_%2814107216623%29.jp g
https://image.jimcdn.com/app/cms/image/transf/dimension=1920x400:format=jpg/path/s54d1560a18b2479e/image/ifad7a4313cdb24a7/version/1534336185/image.jpg