This Device is phase-inverting

[andyrlb]

What actions do I need to take with this preamp? Should I swap cables around?
And I take it that RIAA stands for turntable? [emoji2373]
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200326/49de8839e4be6b7aa3321558f431a955.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200326/b6fcd98208cc9d50ac0024b76b6a8a2c.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200326/b16f53966d566c984bb6c84dccf45b36.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[anthonyTD]

Hi,Andrew,
Its nothing to do with cables, it means that the signal going into the input is inverted somewhere in the circuit, hence the output signal is inverted, compared to the input, hope this helps.
And yes, RIAA refers to the phono input.

[dave2010]

Really depends if you think you can detect the phase inversion, which I'd suggest that you probably can't. If it bothers you, you can put another phase inversion in - I think fairly simply if you connect to another unit, or to loudspeakers. If it's functioning as a pre-amp you just need cables with the signal wires swapped over. Otherwise just let the signal propagate through your replay chain, then swap the loudspeaker cables over - i.e. if you have a left speaker with (say) a red plug, and a blackplug - just swap those over - similarly for the right speaker. If it makes any difference at all, it would be at the start of a transient, such as a hard drum thwack.

I doubt that you'll notice a difference, but if you convince yourself you will, then you probably will!

[andyrlb]

Nop I hear nothing but beautiful sounds


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Barry]

The preamp inverts the phase, that is: a positive-going input signal results in a negative-going signal at the output. If the power amplifier is also phase inverting then overall there will be no change. But if your power amplifier is not phase inverting, then all you need to do is invert the speaker cables: that is plug the red lead into the black socket on the amplifier output, and vice versa. Do this for both channels.

The American audiophiles seem to be far more concerned about phase inversion than others. A good while ago I spent some time experimenting with this (my preamp has a phase switch, so I can invert the phase at will), and found I could not hear any difference. However others may find they can hear a difference.

[Firebottle]

If it's functioning as a pre-amp you just need cables with the signal wires swapped over.

NO NO NO>

It's an unbalanced signal, otherwise known as single ended, If you swap the signal wires you connect the screen to the 'hot'.

Swapping the speaker wires over is different and perfectly OK.

[andyrlb]

NO NO NO>

It's an unbalanced signal, otherwise known as single ended, If you swap the signal wires you connect the screen to the 'hot'.

Swapping the speaker wires over is different and perfectly OK.

So I still connect my red and black speaker cables to the red and black speaker outs on the monoblocks ( your monoblocks) ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Barry]

So I still connect my red and black speaker cables to the red and black speaker outs on the monoblocks ( your monoblocks) ?


Yes - red plug of the speaker cable to the black socket on the power amp, and black plug of the speaker cable to the red socket. Do this for both speaker cables.

[andyrlb]

I’ll try it now [emoji1303]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[andyrlb]

Nop I can’t hear any difference


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Barry]

Neither could I when I tried it. One less thing to worry about. :)

[Lekidbongo]

Conrad Johnson are hot on this topic and have a doctrine of 'absolute phase'. I could never tell the difference but I did it all the same, I.e. I swapped black and red on my speakers. If anyone can tell the difference on a blind test (consistently), then I may reevaluate my position and believe rather than subscribe on the off-chance.

[Barry]

For what it's worth, here were my thoughts on the matter: https://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?11839-Absolute-phase-and-integrated-cartridge-arms/page2&highlight=Absolute+phase (ignore the second part of the post).

[andyrlb]

For what it's worth, here were my thoughts on the matter: https://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?11839-Absolute-phase-and-integrated-cartridge-arms/page2&highlight=Absolute+phase (ignore the second part of the post).

Well agree with your findings Barry , I appreciate your help , stay safe [emoji1303]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dave2010]

NO NO NO>

It's an unbalanced signal, otherwise known as single ended, If you swap the signal wires you connect the screen to the 'hot'.

Swapping the speaker wires over is different and perfectly OK.Thanks. I think it would depend on the circuit - but you're right in this case I'm sure. So stick with the loudspeaker cable swaps - which should avoid any problems.

[hifinutt]

I just noticed audionote M-one pre amps are phase inverting , slightly puts me off them but from what i gather from this thread , it makes little difference

from the blurb

Audio Note (UK) M1 Line Pre Amplifier is a pure Class A, Zero Negative Feedback design, employing a single ECC82 dual triode valve.



It has been specifically engineered for sonic performance rather than technical specification, and offers an outstanding level of performance and value.



It fulfils all Audio Note (UK) Level 1 criteria: -



Pure Class A operation

Zero negative feedback

Materials and component quality

​

The M1 Line and M1 Phono are phase inverting.

https://www.audionote.co.uk/m1

[anthonyTD]

It won't make a huge diffrence phil, and you can always swap the negative, and positive leads around on the speakers, to see which you prefer.
Much of the equipment out there inverts the signal, they just don't advertise the fact! :)

[hifinutt]

Thanks , as far as I can see only the m1 and m2 are phase inverting , the m3 seems not , am I right in this ?

[HarryCrumb]

I've been curious about this as I'm about to start refreshing a Quad 405-1 and I know it is phase inverting as standard . Used with a Quad pre amp that would of course right itself. Some of the mods for this change it to non-inverting and I wasn't sure if it was necessary. Sounds like it isn't...

[Puffin]

Some Class D amps are phase inverting and I can hear a definite change when swapping RED for BLACK speaker cables.