Clean power supplies and phonostages

[Wakefield Turntables]

Guys, I'd like to try and get a general consensus of opinion. I'm in the process of altering my current setup. My valve setup runs through a PS Audio P10 regenerator to very good effect but I've run out of sockets into the P10. So, my question is, do you think a clean power supply into a Paradise phonostage will improve it's performance? If the answer is no then I'll simply use the good old wall sockets, else I'll look into a solution to get a clean power supply into the Paradise. Thanks in advance

Andy.

[Light Dependant Resistor]

Hi Andy
What are the power requirements ? ie Voltage AC or DC and amperage

I would recommend the rectifier instead of diodes be a LT4320 with 4x N channel mosfet
https://www.analog.com/media/en/technical-documentation/data-sheets/4320fb.pdf

i am presently designing a pcb for the LT4320

[Clive197]

I think a good power supply, preferably linear is crucial. I’ve just upgraded my SMPS to a linear SBooster supply on my Qutest Dac and even out of the box the difference was there to hear, it can only get better.
On owning and trying out different phono-stages over the last couple of years with and without SMPS I’m convinced linear is best. Earlier this year I owned a Whest phono-stage and I couldn’t get it to sound as good as I had hoped but a friend and I spent a day playing about with different ways of getting power to it, and were surprised to find that plugging straight into a wall socket with the standard cable gave the best result but no matter what it was not a keeper.

[walpurgis]

People seem keen to remove SMPS units from their systems and replace them with linear power supplies. I'm not sure I understand why, DC is just DC. If the current is adequate and the voltage right, there's surely no benefit. A decent SMPS will add no more artifacts than an LPS.

[YNWaN]

I think you gents are misunderstanding Andy’s query - he doesn’t make any mention of a SMPS and for good reason, because there are none! Nor is Andy asking advice regarding application of rectifiers (that one just strikes me as bizarre).

All he is saying is that he normally powers his Paradise phonostage via a PS Audio mains regenerator but now, because it has a limited number of outputs, he is having to, instead, plug his phonostage directly in to the wall. The Paradise phonostage already has an elaborate and sophisticated linear power supply of its own so he is wondering if not using the PS Audio regenerator will really make any difference. My opinion is it will not.

[Clive197]

People seem keen to remove SMPS units from their systems and replace them with linear power supplies. I'm not sure I understand why, DC is just DC. If the current is adequate and the voltage right, there's surely no benefit. A decent SMPS will add no more artifacts than an LPS.

Geoff, if you read my post to the end, I made it clear that plugging straight into a wall socket with a standard mains cable gave the best result (in those circumstances). Which was an answer to the OP’s post.
However I beg to differ with you about even well designed SMPS’s being the same as a well designed LPS.

[Light Dependant Resistor]

I think you gents are misunderstanding Andy’s query - he doesn’t make any mention of a SMPS and for good reason, because there are none! Nor is Andy asking advice regarding application of rectifiers (that one just strikes me as bizarre).

All he is saying is that he normally powers his Paradise phonostage via a PS Audio mains regenerator but now, because it has a limited number of outputs, he is having to, instead, plug his phonostage directly in to the wall. The Paradise phonostage already has an elaborate and sophisticated linear power supply of its own so he is wondering if not using the PS Audio regenerator will really make any difference. My opinion is it will not.

Not everyone would know the specifications of a Paradise phonostage, or a PS audio regenerator and ideally a link should be provided explaining its specifications and features to acclimatise those wishing to assist.
Does that sound like a good idea ?

[YNWaN]

Honestly, I think a more careful reading of Andy’s original question would have been more useful (not just for you). It would then have been clear that this isn’t a question about power supply topology (although your recommendation is quite a controversial one even then).

Personally, when people ask advice about components I don’t know I don’t vouch an opinion as.....it’s about gear I don’t know about...... (if I’m particularly interested I Google the components in question - just as I did for this thread to make sure that the PS Audio component does not use a SMPS and within a few seconds it was clear that it does not).

[Lawrence001]

If it was me I'd have a think about which component is probably least susceptible to mains noise and plug that one on the mains. Intuitively I would think that a phono stage would be rather susceptible since it amplifies very low voltages but I've no technical knowledge to back that up. If it had a very good power supply already inside then it might be pretty immune to noise.

Trial and error in the weekday daytime might be the best way to tell ( l believe this is when the mains supply is noisiest but again I could be wrong). If you can't hear any difference then forget about it and enjoy [emoji16]

[Mr. C]

Without question YES

[YNWaN]

To be blunt, I wouldn’t be surprised if the whole system didn’t sound better when disconnected from the PS Audio unit. I’ve actually attended an A/B demo of this design and whilst it did change the sound I was far from convinced it was actually for the better.

[struth]

If mains isn't good then it will likely help. If mains is OK then there are better ways.
Keep it as simple as you reasonably can. Same with cables. I a cable makes a huge difference, the the old one is likely compromised in some way

[Blackdog]

To be blunt, I wouldn’t be surprised if the whole system didn’t sound better when disconnected from the PS Audio unit. I’ve actually attended an A/B demo of this design and whilst it did change the sound I was far from convinced it was actually for the better.

I tend to agree. The operating principle of these re-generators is such that they have an oscillator producing a high frequency signal. That signal is then divided down to produce the desired signal (50 or 60 Hz) which in turn is sent to a high powered amplifier that must be at least 30% bigger than the maximum output rating. So they are very inefficient beasts, which produce noise of their own that needs to be filtered out.
I have a big one here for repair right now, and it's a monster, not to mention a pain to work on.
A dealer friend of mine won't bring them in as he can't see the logic of a noise maker then a filter to get rid of noise. Vicious circle he calls it.
If you have hydro that bad, then better call the power company, if it is reasonable, then a good passive filter will do just as good or better.
Also I always recommend amps be plugged directly into the wall for best power delivery.

[Stinky Britches]

do you think a clean power supply into a Paradise phonostage will improve it's performance?
Hey Andy - Many moons ago I lived in one room in a multiple occupancy house, so my system ran off a single wall socket on a ring main that also ran everyone else's crap: cookers, computers, printers, fridges, hair dryers, everything. My amp was a humble Cyrus integrated. When I eventually upgraded the amp with an external Cyrus power supply (a PXR if memory serves) the only place I noticed a clear and significant improvement was in the performance of the phono stage.

[AJSki2fly]

A dealer friend of mine won't bring them in as he can't see the logic of a noise maker then a filter to get rid of noise. Vicious circle he calls it.
If you have hydro that bad, then better call the power company, if it is reasonable, then a good passive filter will do just as good or better.
Also I always recommend amps be plugged directly into the wall for best power delivery.

I completely agree due to recent experience. A dealer wanted me to try a couple of mains leads and said plug them into the mains socket only especially the amp. I like most have several 12-15v power supplies, an amp, phono amp and cd player a total of 9 sockets needed for hifi. So I did as told and initially plugged amp into dedicated socket and there was immediate improvement this was with original cable and the dealers. I then made a short lead extension heavy duty 35amp cable and hard wired two socket extension so I could use with phono amp, this improved it slightly again. I organised the two extension blocks so the CD player is nearest to the power socket and then followed by all the 12-15v power supplies. Overall an improvement but mainly from the amp and phono amp straight into the mains socket.

[DaveFred]

Hi Andy
What are the power requirements ? ie Voltage AC or DC and amperage

I would recommend the rectifier instead of diodes be a LT4320 with 4x N channel mosfet
https://www.analog.com/media/en/technical-documentation/data-sheets/4320fb.pdf

i am presently designing a pcb for the LT4320

Did you ever finish the board?