PDA

View Full Version : Beresford DAC as Pre Amp with £150 Behringer Power Amp



Labarum
12-06-2010, 09:53
And I am guessing this combination would be amazing at any price

http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/A500.aspx

http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/product/6383-behringer-reference-amplifier-a500.html

Why should am amp cost more - there's not much to them.

Has anyone tried this product?

Labarum
12-06-2010, 13:15
Technical review here

http://theaudiocritic.com/plog/index.php?op=ViewArticle&articleId=22&blogId=1

Stratmangler
12-06-2010, 13:21
Gets a fair mention here, Brian http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=6583

Krisbee
12-06-2010, 15:44
Who wants all that shiny new stuff? Follow Brian's example and just buy a (used) Quad 405-2 instead. ;)

Themis
12-06-2010, 19:15
Hi Brian,

why the heck would you need so much power ? :scratch:

technobear
13-06-2010, 19:31
Yes it's a good combo.

There is a wealth of modding information for the A500 on the web. The volume pots have to go for starters.

The A500 sounds significantly better if you use two and bi-amp.

Labarum
14-06-2010, 06:58
Hi Brian,

why the heck would you need so much power ? :scratch:

If you read the review it's over rated. 120w would seem to be a fairer rating.

Labarum
14-06-2010, 07:11
Who wants all that shiny new stuff? Follow Brian's example and just buy a (used) Quad 405-2 instead. ;)

I am certainly very happy with my refurbed 405-2. Bought it on eBay for £175 posted it 405man (who sells on eBay) at a cost of £20 and paid about £70 including return postage to have the op amp and capacitors replaced. £265 for an amp that will hold its own against some pretty expensive kit. 405man's ready refurnished 405s were going for about £300 last time I looked.

The Caiman drives the 405 beautifully.

I have tried the fixed out from the Caiman into the 405 and used the digital volume control on the Squeezebox. It is very marginally clearer that way, but it is more risky and less flexible - not all my other inputs to the Caiman have their own volume controls.

Krisbee
14-06-2010, 09:13
Brian I'm glad to see you've done your bit for recycling and saved a Quad 405 from the scrap heap. :)

I use my TC-7520 as preamp with an untouched Quad 306 (didn't have the shelf space for a 405) just right for Classical music. I suppose bassheads and rockers might prefer the Behringer beef .. horses for courses and all that. But I just couldn't pass up the chance to own a bit of audio classicism. Maybe I'll give it the dada treatment one day.

Codifus
14-06-2010, 13:29
If you think the A500 is some serious beef, then I gather that I must have the entire cow:ner:

I actually went thru 2 A500s before I got the 2000. The A500s seem to suffer from some sort of design flaw where the input section is too suscpetible to overload. If you set the gains properly, you may be good to go. When I had them they did sound good, until they didn't. I was drawn to them because they are cheap as dirt. The amplifiers sound very good. They don't look too good but I don't care.

Unlike the behringer A500, the EP series Behringers are more professionally oriented (no RCA inputs, a loud fan) but a few modifications and they become a robust, great sounding home amplifier. The EP series do not have the unreliable reputation of the A500 either.

To get my 7520 to work as a pre-amp with my EP, I did a fan modification and bought the samson s-convert to change the 7520 RCA output to balanced XLR input.

Sound quality is still excellent and that amp will destroy my speakers if it so much as sneezes:)

CD

leo
14-06-2010, 14:50
Does this A500 amp use an output coupling cap? from the pics I seen it looks like its ran from a single rail for each channel :scratch:

Codifus
14-06-2010, 15:26
Does this A500 amp use an output coupling cap? from the pics I seen it looks like its ran from a single rail for each channel :scratch:

It's actually 2 mono amps in one;

http://www.flickr.com/photos/linux-works/2640387307/

CD

Labarum
14-06-2010, 15:58
Some say the Quad amps lack transparency compared to the best modern amps, and are more susceptible to any digital or RF noise that comes out of DACs.

Any views?

leo
14-06-2010, 17:37
It's actually 2 mono amps in one;

http://www.flickr.com/photos/linux-works/2640387307/

CD

I was looking at the secondary wires from the transformer, its hard to see very clear on my netbook but there only seems to be two wires to each amp module so I'd have thought each amp would have +v gnd (single rail) rather than +V gnd -V with a centre tap transformer , normally single rail needs output cap because you get half the supply voltage on the output

Does anybody on here actually have one of these amps? I'm not really interested in buying one just interested in what its based around

Edited, no info longer needed :)

DSJR
14-06-2010, 18:13
Some say the Quad amps lack transparency compared to the best modern amps, and are more susceptible to any digital or RF noise that comes out of DACs.

Any views?

Then I would largely disagree with them Brian!

The 405-2 as supplied by Quad is still a bit power-limited and even driving my ATC20's at the time, the thing got very hot indeed, this inevitably shortening the life of the caps on board. If the limiting is removed or significantly further tamed, the amp is said to fly, but I suspect that it could melt-down if thrashed too much - just my opinion.

There is NOTHING wrong with the basic Dumping circuit and modern components have only seen it improve further. I'm not a fan of the 306, as it just doesn't "rock-it" at all, but the Dada mods apparently give it more musical breathing room.

I hope you're aware that apparently BOTH the older Quad preamps AND power amps invert the phase. This means that if either are taken out of a full Quad amplifier system, then the speakers have to have their positive and negative connections reversed (on both speakers) so that the amp +'ve connection sees the -'ve speaker terminal. Give it a go (with amp switched off while you change the connectors) and see.....

Brian, if you want to throw more dough at the amp, get a 606mk2 or a 707, which run cooler and have more real-world headroom than the dear old 405-2. These latter power amps have a lovely spacious quality to them, are easily fettled later on and don't take as long to warm-up as the mk1 606 does...

Labarum
15-06-2010, 13:58
Then I would largely disagree with them Brian!


I thought you might disagree with them, Dave!

Yes, I had thought of a 606-2, but I really am very happy with the 405-2 it drives my 4 ohm Quarts effortlessly and impressively and even when the room temperature exceeds 30 Celsius seems cool enough (unlike my laptop!)

I have been able to compare a venerable Quad with (say) a Cambridge 640, but 405man claims an reworked 405 is up there with the best of them. I believe him.

Ali Tait
15-06-2010, 14:10
Valves are best with Quads IMO,but if you're hankering after trying a new amp,try a Hlly T-amp 90.Will work nicely with them.

Labarum
15-06-2010, 14:28
Valves are best with Quads IMO,but if you're hankering after trying a new amp,try a Hlly T-amp 90.Will work nicely with them.

Can anything good come out of a valve?

:)

Ali Tait
15-06-2010, 16:53
Well I've had Quads,and now have two pairs of ER Audio's stats.All sound better to me driven by a good valve amp.The Hlly does do a very good job too.

DSJR
15-06-2010, 16:58
Brian has MB-QUARTs I believe..

4 Ohms is a lot for any solid-state Quad to take, as 6-8 Ohms nominal was the ideal they worked to (and have the graphs to prove it). In 30 degree C climates, I'd still pop the lid off the 405 every few years to check the supply caps aren't leaking, as in the UK and with respectful use, eleven years was the norm before little acidic mountains started to form on the tops of the caps.....

Ali Tait
15-06-2010, 17:23
Ah my mistake,thought you had stats Brian.I'll get me coat...

Ali Tait
15-06-2010, 17:24
Stll say give a Hlly a try though.Amazing for the money.

The Grand Wazoo
15-06-2010, 17:40
Stll say give a Hlly a try though.Amazing for the money.

Hehe! Tht spellng sems t b infctous!

Ali Tait
15-06-2010, 17:53
I'm doing this on my phone.Small keyboard! :)

Marco
15-06-2010, 18:44
Can anything good come out of a valve?


Oi, behave! ;)

Marco.

Codifus
16-06-2010, 01:06
What kind of power output do these Quads offer?

Themis
18-06-2010, 17:54
If you read the review it's over rated. 120w would seem to be a fairer rating.
Ah, ok. :)

Anyway, to answer your initial question : imho, the dac+power is a good alternative, but I prefer the advantages of a good preamp (inputs, good volume control, etc) to an poweramp combos.
I guess I'm a a bit of an "old school" guy... ;)

PS: I listened to the Behringer amp twice. It's a good amp. Not the best, but a good amp nonetheless. ;)

Labarum
18-06-2010, 18:09
Ah my mistake,thought you had stats Brian.I'll get me coat...

Big ones.

http://www.hifi-wiki.de/images/6/6a/MB_quart_980_s_1e_version.jpg

I would have loved a pair of Quad Electrostatics. At the time I bought the MB Quarts in Germany thy were trying to sell then in the UK for about the same price as the Quad Stats.

In the Army at the time, the Quads would not have moved well and I could not be assured of being able to place them in every future Married Quarter. The Quart towers don't seem at all fussy.

http://www.hifi-wiki.de/index.php/MB_Quart_980_S

The year I bought these they were all the rage in Germany.

Labarum
18-06-2010, 18:12
Oi, behave! ;)

Marco.

I always do, Marco. Solid dependable guy that I am. :)

Ali Tait
18-06-2010, 18:25
Looks like a slight accident on one of the cones there! :doh:

StanleyB
19-06-2010, 09:09
Easily removed with a vacuum cleaner nozzle.