Top class CD player wanted

[farflungstar]

I'm looking for a top notch CD player, early Marantz, Sony or something better. Let me know if you have something lurking in the closet.
Adey

[Sixty2]

Adrian. Tried to pm you. Your inbox is full.

[mad-moon]

[url=https://flic.kr/p/2hCgZi7][img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48980914108_5ff2471593_c.jpg

[Sixty2]

Audio Note CD3.1x/11 on HFW.

[SteveW]

Never did sell this.
Little used, will get another photo if neededFS Kenwood DP x9010 cd transport

For sale: Kenwood DP-x9010 CD

The 9010 has that battleship build and has a cult following. This example works flawlessly but has some marks on the casing.

I have been feeding into Williams valve DAC and a Caiman from the Kenwood. It sounds authoritative yet detailed.

Here's Lampizator's opinion:
http://lampizator.eu/LAMPIZATOR/REFE...transport.html

The build quality is outstanding.This unit is in full working order, from a smoke free home.

[SteveW]

Oops.. sorry, that lampizator link doesn’t work anymore
Try this one
http://www.lampizator.eu/lampizator/REFERENCES/KENWOOD%209010X/Kenwood%209010x%20transport.html

Cheers
Steve

[Bigman80]

Oops.. sorry, that lampizator link doesn’t work anymore
Try this one
http://www.lampizator.eu/lampizator/REFERENCES/KENWOOD%209010X/Kenwood%209010x%20transport.html

Cheers
SteveNope, not working for me

[SteveW]

Sigh..
I dunno.
If you google the player, you can scroll down to the lampizator site and see the page.
It all works for me on the phone.
Bring on analogue internet.



Nope, not working for me

[RobbieGong]

I'm looking for a top notch CD player, early Marantz, Sony or something better. Let me know if you have something lurking in the closet.
Adey

You've got some sweet kit there Adrian so you'd want something that is both top notch in sound and looks and then gorgeous / classy and complimentary alongside that lovely kit you have too.

If it were me it'd be this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pioneer-Compact-Disk-CD-Player-PD-93-Remote-Good-Condition-Top-Range-Referece/283284281071?hash=item41f50f16ef:g:hH0AAOSwcH5cAYj Y

or one of these - beautiful ( My own cdp of choice and I love it ) https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/pioneer-pd-91-cd-player/163917240434?hash=item262a3a9872:g:GNYAAOSw07ddsaC y pics dont do it justice, they are gorgeous in the flesh, solid and beautifully made (copper chassis, offboard power supply attached at the rear .................. :)

[Alfonzo]

Inbox full mate

[Lawrence001]

I've had a couple of Marantz CD94 Mk2's and highly recommend them.

[loosend]

I’ve got a Moon 3.3 or a Proceed

[farflungstar]

Inbox cleared...

[SteveW]

Inbox cleared...

Still full?
Or at least not sufficiently clear

Cheers
Steve

[farflungstar]

No, it's empty, getting messages ok... Sent folder was full before.

[SteveW]

Hi Adey

I’m just getting this!

Cheers

Steve

he following errors occurred with your submission
farflungstar has exceeded their stored private messages quota and cannot accept further messages until they clear some space.

[struth]

Check your outbox as well as inbox Ady

[farflungstar]

Ok just emptied everything 0 inbox 0 sent on the aos site (not on tapatalk) - so should be ok...

[SteveW]

That seems to have worked!!

Cheers

[farflungstar]

Once again living in Spain is thwarting my plans. I've been offered the player I'd most like, but no box, no transport bolts. The seller doesn't want to try and double box. Bugger...

[farflungstar]

Have some interesting offers I'm considering - anyone else got something interesting looking for a new home?

[Tweedle-Dee]

Might a Marantz CD94 mk2 be of any interest?

[farflungstar]

Might a Marantz CD94 mk2 be of any interest?PM sent

[da2222]

Look no further than a Bel Canto CD2. Stand-alone cdp or transport as you prefer. Top loading Cd mechanism solid and durable...

[montesquieu]

Adey I would suggest you at least try and hear one of these old TD1541 players before you for out a large amount of money for one. The chip may be excellent and overall they are well built but the output stage is typically a bit meh. In my view the CDM1-based players are now stupidly overpriced for what you get - it's a fashion thing.

You'd be better off with something less fetishised ... something using the CDM12/CDPro mechanism or its derivates as a transport (such as the Bel canto mentioned above, or the Audio Note CDT2/II transport or above, or tons of others). Top notch performance and you get to try different DACs (I'd recommend Audio Note DAC 2,1x or upwards but there are tons of options).

Or if it needs to be one box I'd personally think about Esoteric.

[farflungstar]

Adey I would suggest you at least try and hear one of these old TD1541 players before you for out a large amount of money for one. The chip may be excellent and overall they are well built but the output stage is typically a bit meh. In my view the CDM1-based players are now stupidly overpriced for what you get - it's a fashion thing.

You'd be better off with something less fetishised ... something using the CDM12/CDPro mechanism or its derivates as a transport (such as the Bel canto mentioned above, or the Audio Note CDT2/II transport or above, or tons of others). Top notch performance and you get to try different DACs (I'd recommend Audio Note DAC 2,1x or upwards but there are tons of options).

Or if it needs to be one box I'd personally think about Esoteric.It's true that I haven't heard a TD1541 player for some years, Philips 960 was my last machine based on those chips I think.

I remember selling the top pioneer stuff back in the day but wasnt impressed by them. I heard a CD12 and liked it but ended up with a Roksan transport and dac which I was very happy with - feeding audio innovations triode monos at the time.

I don't want overly analytical and no soul, I like rich timbre and excellent soundstaging. I'd prefer a well executed design that can stand on its own merits and be within the top level of performance at a reasonable price.

The Esoteric ticks some boxes.
Easily repaired even here in Spain.
Extremely well built.
From reviews sounds excellent though perhaps a bit analytical and midrange a tad forward - the only negatives.

Reading up on AN players and Audio Research, which I know Tom rates highly.

[nonuffin]

You could do a lot worse than a Vincent CD player like this one:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vincent-CD-S1-1-CD-HDCD-Valve-tube-CD-Player/174055209879?hash=item28867fbb97:g:M8UAAOSwT7NdmdE N

I have the bottom of the range player and it is an absolute stunner, just wish I had the loot to buy the one above!

[cargar]

You could do a lot worse than a Vincent CD player like this one:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vincent-CD-S1-1-CD-HDCD-Valve-tube-CD-Player/174055209879?hash=item28867fbb97:g:M8UAAOSwT7NdmdE N

I have the bottom of the range player and it is an absolute stunner, just wish I had the loot to buy the one above!

This just sold. A very very good cd spinner.

[farflungstar]

I have the following options...

Esoteric x03SE
Unmodded CD94 mkII
Heavily modded, serviced CD94 mkI
CD95 transport

If I go for the 95 transport - what DACs are considered top notch for not silly money. (I'm reading up on AN DACs).

Adey

[montesquieu]

I have the following options...

Esoteric x03SE
Unmodded CD94 mkII
Heavily modded, serviced CD94 mkI
CD95 transport

If I go for the 95 transport - what DACs are considered top notch for not silly money. (I'm reading up on AN DACs).

Adey

The Audio Note DACs - higher end ones anyway - really start with the 2.1x. Beware of earlier DAC2/3/4 machines without the .1x suffix as these while they use the same AD1865 chip, they don't have the non-oversampling, non digital filtering approach that the later AN DACs popularised. You see some claiming to be upgraded but many don't have the necessary output transformers etc to really be factory level .1x upgrades, so whatever has been done will fall short. The factory 2.1x is a lovely bit of kit and can be upgraded as far as the 4.1x at a later date if you feel the need.

Don't pay too much for the 95 transport. I haven't owned one but I got my AN CDT2/II transport after a period of ownership of the Wadia WT3200, which is essentially the same machine made by Phillips/Marantz for Wadia, with a different faceplate, and while the Wadia was decent and have a lovely chunky feel to use, the AN sounded head and shoulders better. Again, some bits of kit acquire legendary status way back when, and somehow retain this glow long after their technical capabilities have been superceded.

I was looking again myself a couple of years ago at a CDM1 based transport with all possible recommended mods, and after much research and discussion around the place concluded that I was better off with what I've got.

Of the list above i'd be most tempted by the Esoteric.

[Dickymint]

Believe it or not, for small change, Beresford do the Caiman DAC and it is surprisingly good. Worth a punt! Add the Dorado power conditioner and a few other mods that Stan does and it fits well above its price tag.

[farflungstar]

I have to say this is by far harder than choosing a TT, arm, cart or phonostage.

[Batty]

I have just bought a Vincent CD-S4 and Denafrips Ares II DAC.
Quite impressed with build and sound quality of both.

[farflungstar]

Does anyone have a Marantz CD12 or 94mkii in champagne I can prise from their hands....

[Spectral Morn]

Does anyone have a Marantz CD12 or 94mkii in champagne I can prise from their hands....

CD12 was only in traditional Marantz finish, CD94mk2 is common in black, but I have never seen one in the traditional Marantz finish, but I believe for the Asian market it was.

[farflungstar]

CD12 was only in traditional Marantz finish, CD94mk2 is common in black, but I have never seen one in the traditional Marantz finish, but I believe for the Asian market it was.I missed out on a champagne 94 due to dithering the German seller had modded it extensively but had no feedback for sales and wanted direct transfer. Needless to say it sold.

[Spectral Morn]

I missed out on a champagne 94 due to dithering the German seller had modded it extensively but had no feedback for sales and wanted direct transfer. Needless to say it sold.

German Ebayers rarely use Paypal, bank transfer is their preference.

[montesquieu]

Remember a lot of that earlier German stuff is 220v.

[Macca]

Remember a lot of that earlier German stuff is 220v.

Not a problem if you are in Spain anyway.

[montesquieu]

Not a problem if you are in Spain anyway.

Good point!

[Florence]

"The Esoteric ticks some boxes.
Easily repaired even here in Spain.
Extremely well built.
From reviews sounds excellent though perhaps a bit analytical and midrange a tad forward - the only negatives."

I have the X-03 and for a long time I would have agreed with the above, certainly compared to my previous Electrocompaniet which had a wonderful natural feel and I quite regretted parting with. However a few months ago I changed the interconnects and lo and behold there was all of the resolution which I had appreciated but without the coldness and slightly harsh edge which I had previously experienced.

It is an ugly begger however!

Graeme

[flo1984]

you have PM

[sjs]

I know of a Sony X777ES in champagne which is available

Very good condition, with remote, Audiocom re-clock and no dents or scratches

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/1h8ngmhp7uyu3lt/SonyX777ES.jpg

Note: it isn't mine, if it is of interest I will put you in contact with the owner :)

[nonuffin]

German Ebayers rarely use Paypal, bank transfer is their preference.

I am on the lookout for another spinner and UK ebay is stuffed full of overpriced rubbish to be honest.

Spent the entire day yesterday trawling through the german site and now the vast majority of sellers accept paypal and even more surprising, they are a bit less reticent about shipping to the UK like they used to be. Got a nice list of potential candidates in my watch list now and as soon as my player sells that's where I am heading for to buy my next one.

[Spectral Morn]

I am on the lookout for another spinner and UK ebay is stuffed full of overpriced rubbish to be honest.

Spent the entire day yesterday trawling through the german site and now the vast majority of sellers accept paypal and even more surprising, they are a bit less reticent about shipping to the UK like they used to be. Got a nice list of potential candidates in my watch list now and as soon as my player sells that's where I am heading for to buy my next one.

Fair enough, my experience has been different.

[farflungstar]

So, im stuck between a Sony SCD-1 which has rave reviews but possible problems with future repairs or a heavily modded Marantz CD94 with non oversampling, new clock, recapped, bypass caps etc at a tad shy of half the price of the sony.....

[Macca]

I'd pass on the Marantz, if you want to move it on not everyone would want those mods - I wouldn't!

Sony are a safe bet.

[farflungstar]

Am.i worrying too much about servicing the Sony - from what I've read parts are hard to get if it goes tits up. There are shed loads of cd94's to scavange for parts - but of all players I've read up on the Sony gets the best reviews. This use the hardest purchase I've made.

[Spectral Morn]

So, im stuck between a Sony SCD-1 which has rave reviews but possible problems with future repairs or a heavily modded Marantz CD94 with non oversampling, new clock, recapped, bypass caps etc at a tad shy of half the price of the sony.....

Don't touch the SCD1, lasers hard to find and very expensive if found. I had its smaller brother, sold it on and a few years down the line the laser went, it was scrapped by the owner as a replacement laser mechanism could not be found.

From a collecting point of view a Marantz collector wont want a modified Marant, particularly a CD94/94mk2/CD12/CD95 etc

[batteredhaggis]

Hi Ade,

I had an Esoteric X-03SE which I loved, and had a similar experience to Florence above with cables. I got rid of it and regretted it soon after.

After much searching I settled on a Luxman D-08U which I find a total delight. Glorious density and timbre, superb soundstage with no digital nasties whatsoever. To me, it slightly eclipses a TAD D1000 Mk2 which I had for a fairly long loan. It is probably more a matter of personal taste. The sheer density of information coming off some one-off Peter Gabriel SACDs courtesy of B&W (and a very generous friend) was simply astounding on the TAD, but is no less on the Luxman, which just feels a touch richer, the other machine a (tad?) drier. The Luxman is so liquid I can listen for hours. Build quality is massive but I find the looks subtle compared to the TAD which was simply not as solid or slick. Both absolutely top notch and IMHO quite a jump up from the Esoteric. Also better than an Esoteric K-05 I borrowed and a Moon 750D I owned briefly before it developed a fault, although I liked the Moon. FWIW, I also had an Esoteric C-03x preamp which shared the sonic purity of the Esoteric SACD players but lacked the indefinable that makes my Modwright 36.5 DM pre so special. I don't subscribe to the view that Esoteric are sterile-sounding, but they are leaner than Luxman to my ears.

The Luxman also has an absolutely cracking DAC which surpasses the Luxman D-06 DAC I had before, itself no slouch. I've only used it over USB so far but it has SPDIF and optical inputs too.

Alas, I may have to get rid of it - PM if interested.

[ianlenco]

Hi Adrian.
It's obvious from your equipment list that you take your analogue music replay very seriously so I'm curious as to why you want to go back in time for your digital solution. My opinion of course but I think digital replay has come on leaps and bounds over the last few years. I've had some decent (and expensive) CD players over the years from the likes of Meridian and Primare but I didn't start to really enjoy digital until I moved to a computer based replay system and separate DAC. Dedicated computers from the likes of Innuos and Auralic with their fanless operation and no processing distractions like running display boards etc make for a hugely convenient solution with excellent sound quality. Playlists, no problem, finding music to play a piece of cake!

I've an Innuos Zen Mini with 1Tb of storage currently holding 450 cds taking up only 16% of the space so it's not a problem if you have a lot more. Couple one of these to a high quality DAC for superb sound quality with no worries about reliability or availability of spare parts. To my ears mine sounds more analogue than any CD player I've ever owned and I've also had fun trying different DACs over the years :) I don't do streaming from the likes of Tidal but people tell me the quality of these services is good too. What I do use is access to radio via the likes of BBC iPlayer - listen live or past broadcasts, great for comedies that are broadcast late at night :lol:

[Lawrence001]

Also worth mentioning the Zen makes ripping CDs a breeze I get through at least 10 an hour and you can listen to those you've already ripped (or stream) at the same time. Even if you don't stream you've got internet radio on there and it's not bad if you don't mind listening to someone else's selection of tracks.

If you prefer the sound of old DACs you can also buy a quality USB to SPDIF convertor. I'm more than happy with my JKenny but there are some much pricier ones out there.

Sent from my POT-LX1 using Tapatalk

[bronzeage]

I do stream, Qobuz, hires where available, via Bluesound. However, steaming does not sound as good as my CD player. Pulling tracks off a hard disk directly attached does to the same Bluesound does sound very good indeed, perhaps as good as the CD player. So, I would not discourage the OP from getting a top quality spinner, but only suggest hard disk as an additional option.

[struth]

Although I've about a thousand cds and a decent spinner. Oppo. I prefer files from rpi or even from pc. If done right they sound great. Cds run through rpi from a cdrom even sound decent, although not as good as a file.
But price to sound its a no brainer, and less likely to give grief

[montesquieu]

I think for most people the debate for or against streaming/file based replay is not about the sound (which may or may not sound better either way depending on how either are implemented) but on the user experience.

I simply can't imagine replacing the whole tactile ritual of vinyl - or even the experience of opening a jewel case, reading the cover or the booklet, putting a CD in the drawer - with the soulless experience of clicking a button on a pad or a screeen, which for me cheapens the whole thing.

I do have about a TB or so of files of various resolutions which I dip into from time to time, and access to Spotify, but the former does not excite in the least, and I use the latter primarily to find new music to purchase on proper physical media.

If the man is looking for a CDP, it's just tiresome to suggest he get a streamer. Anyone who likes that sort of user experience probably has one by now.

[struth]

Now now. Just giving options he may not have thought about.
I don't find it soulless, it's just different.
I have always been old school vinyl and have had a deck since I was 11.
But sound wise it's not always best unless you have a lot of money.

[Mikeandvan]

I also find streaming tiresome, there's simply too much choice, and it actually isn't that more bother getting up off your ass and changing a cd than it is to pick some new music via streaming, one benefit is you get suggestions after an lp has finished, so you may discover new stuff, which thinking about is actually pretty good, I'll get me coat.

[Bigman80]

Hi Adrian.
It's obvious from your equipment list that you take your analogue music replay very seriously so I'm curious as to why you want to go back in time for your digital solution. My opinion of course but I think digital replay has come on leaps and bounds over the last few years. I've had some decent (and expensive) CD players over the years from the likes of Meridian and Primare but I didn't start to really enjoy digital until I moved to a computer based replay system and separate DAC. Dedicated computers from the likes of Innuos and Auralic with their fanless operation and no processing distractions like running display boards etc make for a hugely convenient solution with excellent sound quality. Playlists, no problem, finding music to play a piece of cake!

I've an Innuos Zen Mini with 1Tb of storage currently holding 450 cds taking up only 16% of the space so it's not a problem if you have a lot more. Couple one of these to a high quality DAC for superb sound quality with no worries about reliability or availability of spare parts. To my ears mine sounds more analogue than any CD player I've ever owned and I've also had fun trying different DACs over the years :) I don't do streaming from the likes of Tidal but people tell me the quality of these services is good too. What I do use is access to radio via the likes of BBC iPlayer - listen live or past broadcasts, great for comedies that are broadcast late at night [emoji38]Big fan of streaming but like Ian, I own all of the CDs I've ripped.

There just no getting away from the fact that it's the future but good luck with whatever you choose.

[montesquieu]

I also find streaming tiresome, there's simply too much choice, and it actually isn't that more bother getting up off your ass and changing a cd than it is to pick some new music via streaming, one benefit is you get suggestions after an lp has finished, so you may discover new stuff, which thinking about is actually pretty good, I'll get me coat.

There's a lot of serendipity in having a look at what's on the record rack, with advantage that at some time you must have bought what's there, and therefore have some connection with it however fortuitous, tenuous or even troubled. There's something to be said for having a 'current' pile that you play a lot, shuffling the pack to make a new pile from stuff either newly arriving or pulled from the shelves every few weeks. You get to develop a deep connection with certain LPs, get to know what's on the covers intimately, get to know every note.

This sort of connection is possible I guess from the infinite diet available from streaming but I would suggest that it's more likely to give you indigestion than lead to strong connections to music you don't already know.

For us old timers I guess we already have our listening habits pretty well formed, having spent significant sums as youngsters buying albums and no doubt carry those associations into streaming listening, but will youngsters value music in the same way when the whole universe is a click away? I suspect not and indeed I also suspect that it's the need for that connection that driving the vinyl revival.

My 21 year old son buys the vinyl releases of his favourite bands, bring it home from gigs. His turntable is actually quite modest compared to the sound he can get from spotify + his DAC and headphone rig, but clearly he values LPs in a different way from the infinite 'free' music that's available to him.

[Mikeandvan]

My 21 year old son buys the vinyl releases of his favourite bands, bring it home from gigs. His turntable is actually quite modest compared to the sound he can get from spotify + his DAC and headphone rig, but clearly he values LPs in a different way from the infinite 'free' music that's available to him.

You mean you haven't forced him into upgrading, why on earth not! I agree I do like getting to know my music well, I have one LP I have played religiously for over 20 years. I don't hold on to all of my vinyl though, I like to rotate some of it. I even find CD copies of an LP cheapens it, a vinyl is thee statement of intent...….

[Sherwood]

I also find streaming tiresome, there's simply too much choice, and it actually isn't that more bother getting up off your ass and changing a cd than it is to pick some new music via streaming, one benefit is you get suggestions after an lp has finished, so you may discover new stuff, which thinking about is actually pretty good, I'll get me coat.

Sorry, i didn't realise that you were meant to stay seated when streaming. Likewise, I never have any problems in making a shopping selection in a large superstore. Perhaps, I need to give the old corner shop a try again!

[montesquieu]

There just no getting away from the fact that it's the future but good luck with whatever you choose.

It's part of the future Oliver but it's not 'the' future.

A common problem when people project into the future is that they always assume the old technology will completely vanish when new possibilities take hold.

I recall in about 1995 taking part in a debate at the National Library of New Zealand, broadcast to the country by TVNZ, entiled 'Do books have a future?'. I was a publishing guru ('Guru' was on my business card - God the 90s were naff) for a big IT vendor at the time. In the face of excitable youngsters (I was all of about 35, a dinosaur even then) showing off CD Rom and the early internet I was arguing that of course books had a future, and a very important one at that.

When printed books came along of course it revolutionised information transmission and communication, and illuminated manuscripts were soon very rare things. But it didn't destroy the written form altogether, calligraphy and illustration are still treasured things. Photography changed portraiture forever but it didn't abolish it. At one time streets of cities, towns and villages were full of working horses. Of course cars replaced them for most practical purposes, but for leisure purposes there is still a thriving hobby out there in all things equestrian. And so on and so on. Unless government's actually ban them (as opposed to making them simply expensive), electric/autonomous vehicles won't stop people tinkering with classic cars.

Those for whom streaming is 'good enough' or meets their needs, that is, all their needs, then that's all they will have. For people seeking a stronger connection to music (tactile, via objects, booklets, personal ownership) physical media will persist alongside. The pushback is happening already.

[Mikeandvan]

Sorry, i didn't realise that you were meant to stay seated when streaming. Likewise, I never have any problems in making a shopping selection in a large superstore. Perhaps, I need to give the old corner shop a try again!

You are if you wish to follow the correct hifi listening protocol re 'golden triangle', the listener must sit/kneel at the top of the triangle, you must not veer from the top of the triangle, not even to relieve yourself.

[montesquieu]

You mean you haven't forced him into upgrading, why on earth not! I agree I do like getting to know my music well, I have one LP I have played religiously for over 20 years. I don't hold on to all of my vinyl though, I like to rotate some of it. I even find CD copies of an LP cheapens it, a vinyl is thee statement of intent...….

I could probably get him a decent turntable and set it all up for him but where's the fun for him in that? I want him to seek it out for himself. If he asks of course I'll help him. I deliberately got him something quite modest, but safe so that he wouldn't destroy his precious albums.

[Sherwood]

I think for most people the debate for or against streaming/file based replay is not about the sound (which may or may not sound better either way depending on how either are implemented) but on the user experience.

I simply can't imagine replacing the whole tactile ritual of vinyl - or even the experience of opening a jewel case, reading the cover or the booklet, putting a CD in the drawer - with the soulless experience of clicking a button on a pad or a screeen, which for me cheapens the whole thing.

I do have about a TB or so of files of various resolutions which I dip into from time to time, and access to Spotify, but the former does not excite in the least, and I use the latter primarily to find new music to purchase on proper physical media.

If the man is looking for a CDP, it's just tiresome to suggest he get a streamer. Anyone who likes that sort of user experience probably has one by now.

I have a large vinyl collection and a huge cd collection. If I was starting today I would acquire neither. In fact, I am surprised that the sale of new CDPs has not plummeted.

For me, the physical possession of "music software" is unimportant. Indeed, had I not spent spent the bulk of my funds on vinyl and cds over the years I would no doubt own an obscenely expensive hifi. I would probably have held a different view in the past when digital was in its early days and when streaming meant low res mp3 files. Today, services such as Tidal offer a huge range of music at a high quality of reproduction. I am not intimidated by the huge range of choice available, nor do I find the process of streaming soulless. I guess my position is primarily about musical enjoyment rather than the physical ownership of "music". Aside from all of this, as someone who has spent much of my adult working life travelling and working overseas, the capacity to transport my music and replay it to a high standard "when on the road" is wonderful. I particularly appreciate being able to download Tidal files to my tablet. It has allowed me to listen to a wealth of "new" and "new to me" music. I probably average about five or so new albums a week.

[Sherwood]

You are if you wish to follow the correct hifi listening protocol re 'golden triangle', the listener must sit/kneel at the top of the triangle, you must not veer from the top of the triangle, not even to relieve yourself.

Perhaps I can interest you in my range of audiophile catheters! :)

[montesquieu]

I have a large vinyl collection and a huge cd collection. If I was starting today I would acquire neither. In fact, I am surprised that the sale of new CDPs has not plummeted.

For me, the physical possession of "music software" is unimportant. Indeed, had I not spent spent the bulk of my funds on vinyl and cds over the years I would no doubt own an obscenely expensive hifi. I would probably have held a different view in the past when digital was in its early days and when streaming meant low res mp3 files. Today, services such as Tidal offer a huge range of music at a high quality of reproduction. I am not intimidated by the huge range of choice available, nor do I find the process of streaming soulless. I guess my position is primarily about musical enjoyment rather than the physical ownership of "music". Aside from all of this, as someone who has spent much of my adult working life travelling and working overseas, the capacity to transport my music and replay it to a high standard "when on the road" is wonderful. I particularly appreciate being able to download Tidal files to my tablet. It has allowed me to listen to a wealth of "new" and "new to me" music. I probably average about five or so new albums a week.

I get the point that streaming fits your itinerant lifestyle, as it fits that of many young people who have yet to put down roots.

My main points across a couple of posts was that some people 1) don't like a digital user interface to their music collection 2) feel that the physical object is of value in deepening their connection to it and 3) have no plans to embrace non-physical media exclusively, indeed there's evidence that some younger people are actively rejecting the notion that access to music should be via some utility, like water out of a tap.

Those for whom streaming is sufficient are welcome to their embrace of it but they shouldn't try to push it on the rest of us.

EDIT - apologies to Adey I forgot for a bit that this is Wanted: thread in the classifieds

[Sherwood]

I get the point that streaming fits your itinerant lifestyle, as it fits that of many young people who have yet to put down roots.

My main points across a couple of posts was that some people 1) don't like a digital user interface to their music collection 2) feel that the physical object is of value in deepening their connection to it and 3) have no plans to embrace non-physical media exclusively, indeed there's evidence that some younger people are actively rejecting the notion that access to music should be via some utility, like water out of a tap.

Those for whom streaming is sufficient are welcome to their embrace of it but they shouldn't try to push it on the rest of us.

I am certainly not an evangelist for digital or streaming but I am an enthusiast. However, I do feel that CD is a declining technology. Unlike vinyl which has the attraction of large format artwork, I cannot see the CD format being resurrected by future generations for its "nostalgic charm". In fact, I do not see a mass demand by younger users for high quality music per se, let alone a format that takes up a lot of physical space for a decent sized music collection. The latter is potentially a huge consideration given the repeated failure of governments to stimulate the building of new affordable housing and the limited disposable income of those saving for a mortgage deposit. I may be wrong but I am guessing that in as few as five years time, the manufacture of CDP and pressing of new CDs will be in terminal decline.

[Johnny nocash]

I'm not suggesting your wrong Geoff, but if you insert 'vinyl' for every time you say 'cd' it has an old familiar ring to it.
Sure, the old black stuff has the nostalgia factor & is still the best but when people realise that that cd sound is still better than nearly all computer based reproduction then it may not die the death that is being predicted.

[montesquieu]

I am certainly not an evangelist for digital or streaming but I am an enthusiast. However, I do feel that CD is a declining technology. Unlike vinyl which has the attraction of large format artwork, I cannot see the CD format being resurrected by future generations for its "nostalgic charm". In fact, I do not see a mass demand by younger users for high quality music per se, let alone a format that takes up a lot of physical space for a decent sized music collection. The latter is potentially a huge consideration given the repeated failure of governments to stimulate the building of new affordable housing and the limited disposable income of those saving for a mortgage deposit. I may be wrong but I am guessing that in as few as five years time, the manufacture of CDP and pressing of new CDs will be in terminal decline.

We'll see. The sheer amount of discs out there suggests otherwise. Of course there is a huge amount of ephemeral dreck (just as there was in the LP era) but price of rare and indeed normal good quality second hand CDs from some artists is climbing, players are still being made and indeed continuing to get better. Vinyl lives on in large part because it's still the best playback medium for sound quality (in absolute terms at least - of course when it comes to sound per pound, streaming arguably has it), CD doesn't have that advantage but as I said in post above, new technologies don't always make the old ones entirely disappear.

(I still have the occasional night listening to 1930s Lieder recordings - often sets created for groups of subscribers - on 78, I have quite a bit of 1940s jazz as well. I get a huge buzz from getting a wonderfully musical sound from a 70 or 80 year old artifact.)

Also I think it depends on the market. Classical CDs are still being made and selling, and I think will continue to sell for some time.

[montesquieu]

I'm not suggesting your wrong Geoff, but if you insert 'vinyl' for every time you say 'cd' it has an old familiar ring to it.
Sure, the old black stuff has the nostalgia factor & is still the best but when people realise that that cd sound is still better than nearly all computer based reproduction then it may not die the death that is being predicted.

I had to laugh when I read this comment you are spot on of course.

As far as I'm concerned, the irony is not lost on my jumping to the defence of the the CD, after years back in the 80s and early 90s insisting to all and sundry that 1) CD could never sound as good as vinyl (which of course was true then and remains so now) and 2) CD would never actually replace vinyl because of the sheer amount of material out there that would never be issued in the digital domain (which also turned out to be true, though to a lesser extent that I argued at the time - a huge amount of back-catalogue material was, indeed, eventually issued on CD).

[Johnny nocash]

Agreed Tom.
Back to the thread title.... I've had a lot of CD players, a lot that were almost indistinguishable from each other, but there were a couple that have made listening to cd just as enjoyable as vinyl... & they're not new spinners. But then you have the age/ reliability question.
Sorry that I have nothing to offer you for sale, but someone will.

[Johnny nocash]

I'm sure Tom won't mind & especially the OP getting this chat getting moved from here so ... Do yer stuff mods..
In enjoy both formats because I don't spend too much time comparing. Vinyl is more 'real' & 3d for me but I get pissed off when the 'pop crackle' factor kicks in in on quieter tracks. So.. I buy quiet shit on cd & the rest on vinyl. If it's a mix, then I'm fooked��

[Bigman80]

It's part of the future Oliver but it's not 'the' future.

A common problem when people project into the future is that they always assume the old technology will completely vanish when new possibilities take hold.

I recall in about 1995 taking part in a debate at the National Library of New Zealand, broadcast to the country by TVNZ, entiled 'Do books have a future?'. I was a publishing guru ('Guru' was on my business card - God the 90s were naff) for a big IT vendor at the time. In the face of excitable youngsters (I was all of about 35, a dinosaur even then) showing off CD Rom and the early internet I was arguing that of course books had a future, and a very important one at that.

When printed books came along of course it revolutionised information transmission and communication, and illuminated manuscripts were soon very rare things. But it didn't destroy the written form altogether, calligraphy and illustration are still treasured things. Photography changed portraiture forever but it didn't abolish it. At one time streets of cities, towns and villages were full of working horses. Of course cars replaced them for most practical purposes, but for leisure purposes there is still a thriving hobby out there in all things equestrian. And so on and so on. Unless government's actually ban them (as opposed to making them simply expensive), electric/autonomous vehicles won't stop people tinkering with classic cars.

Those for whom streaming is 'good enough' or meets their needs, that is, all their needs, then that's all they will have. For people seeking a stronger connection to music (tactile, via objects, booklets, personal ownership) physical media will persist alongside. The pushback is happening already.I'm sure there are people still tinkering with cassette players and tapes, but CDs came along and made them obselete.

DVD has replaced video

VOD has largely replaced DVD

Electric cars will eventually be the only cars made

Streaming will see off CD. Its a format that is easier to distribute than CD, cheaper to sell, no manufacturing costs, no import taxes so its cheaper to buy. No losses in delivery. No breakages, no faulty copies, no carbon emissions. It takes up less space in your home, especially important these days as new build houses are smaller per SQFT and more crucially, it never degrades or scratches and becomes unplayable. All purchases are backed up by your account too.

It may not be the future for you, but it is the future.

[struth]

I'm sure there are people still tinkering with cassette players and tapes, but CDs came along and made them obselete.

DVD has replaced video

VOD has largely replaced DVD

Electric cars will eventually be the only cars made

Streaming will see off CD. Its a format that is easier to distribute than CD, cheaper to sell, no manufacturing costs, no import taxes so its cheaper to buy. No losses in delivery. No breakages, no faulty copies, no carbon emissions. It takes up less space in your home, especially important these days as new build houses are smaller per SQFT and more crucially, it never degrades or scratches and becomes unplayable. All purchases are backed up by your account too.

It may not be the future for you, but it is the future.

it may happen, it may not, but there are few quality cd players now made, and finding parts for a true cd player down the line may well be an issue, as it is now with many older units.

anyway, time to get back on track with cd players as thats what the man wants.. only reason streaming was mentioned was in case he hadnt considered it as an option.

[montesquieu]

It may not be the future for you, but it is the future.

I think you missed my point, it was primarily a semantic one but with meaning nonetheless: part of the future but not the [as in only] future.

Don't underestimate the risk too that content may not be available on single platforms - we already see this in the video world on Sky, Amazon Prime, Netflix, new arrivals such as Britbox, where there's a walled garden for certain content which is not available on other platforms.

Who is to say that those who have burned their boats and gone for streaming won't end up having to fork out for multiple subscriptions just to hear content that used to be 'free' because they owned it? Or that they won't be held to ransom by ever-increasing subscription charges? - remember that in the current phase of the industry it's all about building a customer base, none of them are making any money yet. The only way they can ever hope to turn a profit is to jack up prices.

[Bigman80]

I think you missed my point, it was primarily a semantic one but with meaning nonetheless: part of the future but not the [as in only] future.

Don't underestimate the risk too that content may not be available on single platforms - we already see this in the video world on Sky, Amazon Prime, Netflix, new arrivals such as Britbox, where there's a walled garden for certain content which is not available on other platforms.

Who is to say that those who have burned their boats and gone for streaming won't end up having to fork out for multiple subscriptions just to hear content that used to be 'free' because they owned it? Or that they won't be held to ransom by ever-increasing subscription charges? - remember that in the current phase of the industry it's all about building a customer base, none of them are making any money yet. The only way they can ever hope to turn a profit is to jack up prices.Streaming isn't just from subscription services. I don't have that here. I own every album I have and its streamed via a NAS.

I see what you're saying but those that rely on streaming services will only have themselves to blame.