Silver Interconnects

[Hypnotist]

Any one used and removed or kept silver Interconnect RCA's in their system ?

Just trying out some on mine, wife is in so have to wait to see what it sounds like, thats without hearing "Do you have to have it so loud":doh:

[Mike Reed]

I bought a pair of Artisan Audio RCA 1 metre I/Cs a year ago, and liked them. I used them from CDP to pre. and pre. to mono amps (all valved). I had a bake-off, pitting my Chord Indigo v the Artisan with CDP to pre., and half (3) of the participants preferrred the openness of the silver and 3 preferred the 'musicality'; of the Indigo.

There y'go ! There IS a difference in presentation, but I think that results are subject to taste and synergy with kit. The silver was slightly harder-hitting; more dynamic, even, but did lack the 'wholeness' of the Chord.

[anthonyTD]

Depends whether your talking about pure silver cables or silver plated.
Pure silver tends to be very much like pure copper, although more refind sounding, silver plated can sound bright, and dynamic at first, but can get tiresome rather quickly.
My opinion [for what its worth] stick to one metal, either can be very good, depending on the configuration of the rest of the cable.
Plugs can make a very marked diffrence when compared on the same cable too!

[Sondekker]

I bought a pair of Artisan Audio RCA 1 metre I/Cs a year ago, and liked them. I used them from CDP to pre. and pre. to mono amps (all valved). I had a bake-off, pitting my Chord Indigo v the Artisan with CDP to pre., and half (3) of the participants preferrred the openness of the silver and 3 preferred the 'musicality'; of the Indigo.

There y'go ! There IS a difference in presentation, but I think that results are subject to taste and synergy with kit. The silver was slightly harder-hitting; more dynamic, even, but did lack the 'wholeness' of the Chord.

Interesting results bearing in mind the significant price difference between those cables. Were you using the basic Silver Dream cable or the Ultimate Silver Dream cable?

Having read a bit about Artisan Silver cables and read a number of positive reviews, I purchased a set of Ultimate Silver Dream XLR cables for use between my DAC/preamp and power amp and was rather impressed with them. In my system they just sounded natural and fairly well balanced and I particularly liked their reproduction of vocals. In view of the obvious uplift in performance compared with the basic cables I was using previously I decided after about 4 months to take the plunge and I went even higher end.

To my surprise the Artisans have been offered for sale on here and elsewhere but didn't generate any positive interest..

[Bigman80]

I've made loads of trial cables and in terms of silver, the more 9's and the bigger the gauge, the better they sound IMO. Best pair I made were 1.3mm conductor, 99.999% purity (£26pm x 4m :stalks:) AECO Silver RCA plugs and 4% Silver Solder.

At the time, I much preferred the sound of high purity Copper. I may have to revisit that now as the system has changed massively. :scratch:

[Lawrence001]

I've tried and struggled with a few pairs. One was DIY of unknown purity and the other was by Silver Arrow I think with wound multi strand positive and flat ribbon negative. I decided they were all too harsh in my system but they could have been revealing weaknesses in the chain as my system is not high end (price wise at least).

Sent from my POT-LX1 using Tapatalk

[JohnG]

I trialed a custom built Solid Silver COAX vs Copper COAX between CDP and DAC.
The Copper COAX won through with the CDP in use at the time.
Mapleshade Ribbon was my final choice.
I might do this test once more as I have a different CDP in use.

[Hypnotist]

The ones I bought were from Westbury Audio,John Miller and solid silver, some good reviews. could even be from members here? Wife is out tomorrow so a interesting day burning in. They are replacing a Klotz MC5000 so a good cable already which lots here got from Brian, a quick listen and the top end is pretty shrill, but they need burning in.

[Mike Reed]

Depends whether you're talking about pure silver cables or silver plated.
Pure silver tends to be very much like pure copper, although more refined sounding; silver plated can sound bright and dynamic at first, but can get tiresome rather quickly.

My opinion [for what it's worth]is to stick to one metal; either can be very good, depending on the configuration of the rest of the cable.
Plugs can make a very marked difference when compared on the same cable too!

Yes, I've heard/read this in the past.

My I/Cs are Ultimate Silver Dream (pure silver) with WBT Ag plugs at each end.

SONDEKKER, I didn't know there was a model above mine; does it have more than 4 cores, or in which way is it supposedly better? B.t.w., the price of the Chord Indigo original wasn't much above the the Artisans at r.r.prices,. Considering that one is a large company with many levels of agency and t'other is a small direct sales cottage industry, I'd say the price difference yo mention isn't much at all. I also used my Chord Signatures as a comparison, but the Indigo is more refined and proved to be a better comparison, but not by much. The Chord Sig. would have been lower than the current Artisan price, I'd think.

[Ammonite Audio]

I was one of those at Mike's place who preferred the copper cables! One thing I've learnt in this hobby is that there are few absolutes and anyone expecting silver to sound automatically better than copper is likely to be disappointed, at least after extended listening; and the same applies to audiophile favourites like Teflon dielectric materials. The real cable sound differences lie in how a cable is physically constructed and (as Anthony says) terminations and connectors; and of course decent quality wire but even then chasing 9s does not necessarily yield better sound and music.

[Bigman80]

I was one of those at Mike's place who preferred the copper cables! One thing I've learnt in this hobby is that there are few absolutes and anyone expecting silver to sound automatically better than copper is likely to be disappointed, at least after extended listening; and the same applies to audiophile favourites like Teflon dielectric materials. The real cable sound differences lie in how a cable is physically constructed and (as Anthony says) terminations and connectors; and of course decent quality wire but even then chasing 9s does not necessarily yield better sound and music.If you put 5N silver in to neutrik profi's, then no, it won't sound better than a good quality Ofc copper cable into MS audio plugs IME & IMO

The thing nearly everyone misses, is just how important the physical connection Is.

The right material is paramount to the connection and if you haven't paid attention to it, no matter what gear you have, what cable you use or how many 9s it has, you aren't getting the best from it.

[maxrob200]

I was one of those at Mike's place who preferred the copper cables! One thing I've learnt in this hobby is that there are few absolutes and anyone expecting silver to sound automatically better than copper is likely to be disappointed, at least after extended listening; and the same applies to audiophile favourites like Teflon dielectric materials. The real cable sound differences lie in how a cable is physically constructed and (as Anthony says) terminations and connectors; and of course decent quality wire but even then chasing 9s does not necessarily yield better sound and music.

Absolutely agree. It can be system dependent and the construction/design of the cable has significant influence on the sound. I make my own pure silver interconnects with teflon dielectric and prefer it to the same construction/design using pure copper wires.

[The Black Adder]

I was thinking of making some silver interconnects.. So my question is, which type of plugs are good to start with? Would one also use a silver conductor on the ground? And would you not connect the ground to the opposite end?

[Sondekker]

Yes, I've heard/read this in the past.

My I/Cs are Ultimate Silver Dream (pure silver) with WBT Ag plugs at each end.

SONDEKKER, I didn't know there was a model above mine; does it have more than 4 cores, or in which way is it supposedly better? B.t.w., the price of the Chord Indigo original wasn't much above the the Artisans at r.r.prices,. Considering that one is a large company with many levels of agency and t'other is a small direct sales cottage industry, I'd say the price difference yo mention isn't much at all. I also used my Chord Signatures as a comparison, but the Indigo is more refined and proved to be a better comparison, but not by much. The Chord Sig. would have been lower than the current Artisan price, I'd think.

Ah! I see. The addition of the WBT plugs does make a significant difference to the cost of the Artisans. Artisan do offer an even higher priced pure silver interconnect called 'The Nth Degree' which uses eight conductors and numerous other improvements/refinements including Furutech's super expensive 'CF' RCA or XLR connectors. At around £750 for a 1 metre pair they were beyond me when I decided to upgrade. Furthermore, while Artisan say they are the best cables they are able to produce and which they believe will stand comparison against any others, I couldn't find any independent reviews when I was looking to upgrade.

[Bigman80]

I was thinking of making some silver interconnects.. So my question is, which type of plugs are good to start with? Would one also use a silver conductor on the ground? And would you not connect the ground to the opposite end?Josie,

AECO do a pure silver RCA plug for reasonable cost, around £120.

If using silver, And shielding is entirely necessary, there are worse cables than Neotech to start with.

If you don't need shielding, which I don't think is a problem in applications around digital replay, audiophonics have just launched a range of 5N pure silver wire. It needs a Teflon tube to insulate it, but I'd suspect the combination would be very pleasing on the ear. It's single lengths so you'd need 2 per side, or three if you're feeling experimental.

If you want any help, let me know. I will happily advise if necessary.

If you want a set made, let me know. I am very reasonable on price lol.

[Mike Reed]

Seems they've doubled up on the silver cores, then, John. Can't think I'd go there either at that price ! I have a mix of 2 x Chords, the Artisan and the T.Q. Black Diamond, using, presumably, their own mix of metals, plus a couple of also-ran I/Cs. Again these T.Q. cables have WBT plugs on. They're all good with my system,; just slightly different in my almost all valve kit.

[Sondekker]

Seems they've doubled up on the silver cores, then, John. Can't think I'd go there, either at that price ! I have a mix of 2 x Chords, the Artisan and the T.Q. Black Diamond, using, presumably, their own mix of metals, plus a couple of also-ran I/Cs. Again these T.Q. cables have WBT plugs on. They're all good with my system,; just slightly different in my almost all valve kit.

And I think that's the important factor Mike. There really isn't any such thing as the 'best' interconnect it all boils down to finding one(s) that suit your system and personal listening preferences. I think it's quite unusual these days to find any competently constructed interconnect that sounds truly awful, you just have to experiment and make your choices accordingly.

[Floyddroid]

I'm a Missing Link convert

[Hibster_2000]

I've made loads of trial cables and in terms of silver, the more 9's and the bigger the gauge, the better they sound IMO. Best pair I made were 1.3mm conductor, 99.999% purity (£26pm x 4m :stalks:) AECO Silver RCA plugs and 4% Silver Solder.

At the time, I much preferred the sound of high purity Copper. I may have to revisit that now as the system has changed massively. :scratch:

Did you try a higher percentage content silver solder, rather than just 4%?
I was wondering what the effect of pure silver cable, pure silver plug and a little bit of silver for the connection was in compared to a different material plug was, for example.

[Bigman80]

Did you try a higher percentage content silver solder, rather than just 4%?
I was wondering what the effect of pure silver cable, pure silver plug and a little bit of silver for the connection was in compared to a different material plug was, for example.I did use 9% silver on some WBT plugs for an order. Unfortunately I don't have subjective results as I haven't made any pairs like them again.

The issue with silver solder, especially at 9%, is how much heat you have to use to get a proper, nice connection. Using it with KLE, MS Audios or AECOs will cause a novice to melt the plastic mould of the RCA.

WITH WBT it's not an issue as they are metal construction, however I would never recommend WBT over KLE either.

4% silver solder is on everything I make. I just think it's better sonically than tin/lead stuff. Might be nonsense but that's life lol

In regard to using different metals, well, everything has an effect. I use pure copper cable, silver plated copper RCAs and silver solder. I felt that all silver was too lean. I felt that's silver plated cables were etched and shrill at times, I found that copper cables with silver RCAs were probably ad good, if not a little clearer in the HF than silver-plated copper plugs were.

I've used bare copper plugs, which sounded like old valve amps, I've used gold plated plugs which sounded bereft or 'air' or space.

The right combo can only be found by the experimenter

[karma67]

my two pennith,
i spent about 3 months on and off sodding about with various gauges of silver wire,different conductor numbers etc.
whilst the top end was amazing with great detail i found as bigman said it can sound lean.i then tried a mix of copper and silver conductors and still couldnt find the right sonic blend. i just use now a good occ copper.
i totally agree on the plugs too,kle are hard to beat for the price,the ones i use have been modded to have solid silver connectors.

[Bigman80]

my two pennith,
i spent about 3 months on and off sodding about with various gauges of silver wire,different conductor numbers etc.
whilst the top end was amazing with great detail i found as bigman said it can sound lean.i then tried a mix of copper and silver conductors and still couldnt find the right sonic blend. i just use now a good occ copper.You're a wise man. [emoji4]

[Hibster_2000]

I did use 9% silver on some WBT plugs for an order. Unfortunately I don't have subjective results as I haven't made any pairs like them again.

The issue with silver solder, especially at 9%, is how much heat you have to use to get a proper, nice connection. Using it with KLE, MS Audios or AECOs will cause a novice to melt the plastic mould of the RCA.

WITH WBT it's not an issue as they are metal construction, however I would never recommend WBT over KLE either.

4% silver solder is on everything I make. I just think it's better sonically than tin/lead stuff. Might be nonsense but that's life lol

In regard to using different metals, well, everything has an effect. I use pure copper cable, silver plated copper RCAs and silver solder. I felt that all silver was too lean. I felt that's silver plated cables were etched and shrill at times, I found that copper cables with silver RCAs were probably ad good, if not a little clearer in the HF than silver-plated copper plugs were.

I've used bare copper plugs, which sounded like old valve amps, I've used gold plated plugs which sounded bereft or 'air' or space.

The right combo can only be found by the experimenter

Why does silver sound lean, when it has higher conductivity than copper?
Does copper add a “bass boost” due to it’s lack of conductivity compared to silver?

[Bigman80]

Why does silver sound lean, when it has higher conductivity than copper?
Does copper add a “bass boost” due to it’s lack of conductivity compared to silver?I think it's down to resistance of a usually smaller core. As I said, when you get up to 1.5mm conductor for silver, thinks start to get a lot better. I think 2.5mm conductor could be wonderful, but 2 problems,

find some and then afford it.

Also, seems that the larger the conductor gets, the less pure the material becomes. If you then use two runs of 1mm, it's still not as good.

Cables have a lot of variables, I could go on all day about every little thing that affects them but in the end, as I said earlier, only you will know what works for you.

[karma67]

the highest i tried was 0.60,1 run for the + and 2 for the -

[Mike Reed]

Nobody's mentioned it, but may there be the element (!) of different resistances/inductances affecting different parts of the frequency spectrum? If so, this might explain to a certain extent the impressions gained of 'lean', bassy', 'rounded', 'transparent' etc.

The idea of the thicker the core (up to a point?) the better the conductivity holds water for me. I once had pretty long lengths of 2.5mm twin and earth feeding my garden speakers (Rogers LS6A) from my then Naim kit and I was surprised by the openness as I'd suspected a bit of a mismatch or whatever.

[Hypnotist]

10hrs on the cable have certainly improved the treble, its no longer like going to the Dentist, lets see what happens in the next 20? Not noticed any loss of bass though.

[maxrob200]

I use two runs (+and-) of .51 mm silver wire with Teflon tubing in a custom configuration with a floating ground connected to the amplifier end and have found them to be excellent in terms of tonal balace in my system.RCA plugs are Switchcraft (used by shindo?).

[Mike Reed]

Convoluted theory of value retention re. copper v silver I/Cs.

Copper is cheap as chips compared to silver. Therefore, your cables would retain more of their value because of the discrepancy in metal values.

Another way of putting it would be; c.u. losing money or gaining from ag grow ? Discuss or disregard.

[Hibster_2000]

I use this, with Aeco pure silver plugs.

https://www.hificollective.co.uk/wire/neotech-nei-1002-interconnect-cable.html

[Haselsh1]

Back around 1997 I used two pairs of Audion silver interconnects for CD to pre and pre to power connection. My ears couldn't really detect that they were better than any other I had used up to that time.

[karma67]

I use this, with Aeco pure silver plugs.

https://www.hificollective.co.uk/wire/neotech-nei-1002-interconnect-cable.html

i hope its worth it! Price per 0.25m
£26.58+vat+p&p :eek:

[Bigman80]

i hope its worth it! Price per 0.25m
£26.58+vat+p&p :eek:Expensive stuff.

[Hibster_2000]

Silver is not cheap, especially UP-OCC silver.
I don’t have many long runs in my system, fortunately.

The fact that I make my own means I don’t lose money paying someone to make them, so I get a much better cable at a lower price than commercially available offerings.

[karma67]

Silver is not cheap, especially UP-OCC silver.
I don’t have many long runs in my system, fortunately.

The fact that I make my own means I don’t lose money paying someone to make them, so I get a much better cable at a lower price than commercially available offerings.

ofc,that goes without saying as myself and oliver will testify,i really like the dynamics that silver brings but after all the cables ive made up using it,its put me off spending big money again. my favourite cable at the moment is this, https://www.hificollective.co.uk/catalog/neotech-nei3005-upocc-copper-interconnect-cable.html

[Hibster_2000]

I am sure that will hit the spot.