Yamaha A-S500 Upgrade

[Hypnotist]

Looking to move up and upgrade my Yamaha A-S500 Amp.

Question is how much of a upgrade would a Rega Elex R Amp be ? I'd hate to spend that sort of money and switch on and play a piece of music I know well and think mmmhh is it a lot better or not, or would I see a big improvement?

Thanks for any input.

[steve-z]

I owned an AS500 a few years back and more recently (18 months ago) I owned its successor the AS501, I considered them to be pretty decent amps at their price point. Tbh you don’t really need to spend big bucks to improve on them, I changed from the AS501 to a Cambridge CXA60, on the day I bought it it took me no longer than 30 seconds of the first track to realise is was head and shoulders beyond the Yamaha, but at almost 3x the price it would be expected. There are plenty of very good amps around the same price point as the Cambridge, Rega Brio if you don’t need digital inputs, the Audiolab 6000A if you do, they are all excellent for the price. At a cheaper price point the Onkyo A9010 is better than the Yamahas imo, I use one in my second setup, mine is an EU spec one with a Wolfson DAC onboard (cheaper than the UK version without a DAC, bought mine from a supplier in Germany), it’s ridiculously good for a £200 amp.


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[Hypnotist]

I did have the Audiolab 6000a on the list, but not heard one, the Rega Elec R they rated above the 6000a but its 50% more in more so relative, but several s/h at the 6000a's money

Budget is around £600-£800 new or a lot more amp s/h not to fused either way

[steve-z]

I have a friend who has the 6000A having previously had a Yamaha AS701, he think it’s streets ahead particularly with regards to bass power and control as well as a very spacious presentation.


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[hifi_dave]

I have heard a few of the new Yamaha amps and they all sound a bit flat, uninteresting, lack of emotion if you like. Nothing wrong, just boring.

The Rega Elex-r is in a different league.

[steve-z]

I have heard a few of the new Yamaha amps and they all sound a bit flat, uninteresting, lack of emotion if you like. Nothing wrong, just boring.

Totally agree, very good description.


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[Hypnotist]

Just been off this after auditioning Amps.

First was a Rega Brio the new model, very impressive for what it is, and what it does with its 45w a channel is very very good.

Second was the Cyrus one thats not long came out, lot more punchy at 100w per channel and the Brio in a back to back, the Brio seems a bit laid back and not so punchy, sound stage didn't seem so wide though on the Cyrus One ?

Last was the Rega Elex-R and within 30secs I was like wow, same transport, same speakers.same track George Gershwins Rhapsody In Blue. My cousin who was with me just smiled and we sat back and took in the music, totally different and as Dave mentioned "In A Different League" and thats a understatement I can assure you.

I'm just about to play George Gershwins Rhapsody In Blue here on my Yamaha, I get the feeling I'm not going to say wow the Rega Elex-R is not any better that what I already have.

Back for a full test either Tue/Weds and place the order.

Only thing that worried me is the chap at the dealers I went to says the rule of thumb or words to that is "The speakers should be 3x the value of the Amp" :doh:

[Bluebeat13]

Do you need digital inputs? If not...

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F 264456905707

Brilliant amp, should be in budget, MUCH better than the Regas.

[steve-z]

Much as I love Rega I think that a completely analogue integrated amp these days is a bit ridiculous, even the £1700 Elicit-R has no digital inputs and no headphone output either, it’s time they woke up to the fact that music lovers don’t only listen to vinyl.


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[maxrob200]

Although the sonic character of the amps will be different, it may be useful to take into account speaker load/sensitivity and power requirements to drive them properly.

[Hypnotist]

All my digital inputs are handled by my Bresford so no problems they, likewise the headphones

[Hypnotist]

Been back and had another listen this morning and order placed for a Rega Elex - R.

Watch out for a review after another burn in :doh:

[meBob]

Hello Hypnotist,

What really interested me about this thread is your speakers!

Having owned the Zensor 3's (from new) and promptly boxed them back up again and then sending them onto Ebay after just two weeks, I have to say there's huge improvements to be made with your speakers. Upon reading the many 5 star reviews of the Zensors I had to give them a go, they were nice to look at, but holding them in my hands the build quality was definitely budget. Soundwise, they'll do well at the budget end because of the superior bass performance compared to other budget speakers, but that's about all there is to recommend them (in my opinion).

Right away at the start while listening to them I noticed something was missing compared to my old speakers (Mission 751f freedoms), a big hole where the mids should be and something was added, too much sparkle at the top end. I gave them every chance but the Missions were much better (only £50 ebay) and gave a much more balanced sound with rich mids (but lacked some bass) .

At the same time I bought on the recommendation of a very knowledgeable member of this site a pair of KEF Reference 103.2 speakers for £220 (a stunning bargain), these won by first round KO, neither the Missions or the Dalis where any competition for them. A solid well built speaker with smooth detailed treble, better/bigger defined bass than the Zensors and very nice mids ...... just simply way better.

The upgrade on your amp is a good one, but I would pay even more attention to your speakers If I was you.

Don't be frightened of used kit, you could significantly better your current setup for around £150-£300.

[Hypnotist]

Hi Bob interesting your comments on the Dali Zensor 3s, did you stick with the burn in recommended at 100hr mark, by others and Dali themselves? Mine opened up and changed a fair bit after that time period, from new they were very shrill at the top end, and that changed during the 100hrs.

[meBob]

Hello Dave,

No I didn't quite reach the full 100 hours burn in, but I came close at about 90 hours and come to the conclusion any further improvements (another 10% spent in time) was not going to make to make 50% difference in sound.

This is just my opinion, but I did have at one time 3 sets of speakers to interchange and the Zensors did not have the full bodied sound of the other two, but they did have little more bass than the Mission 751s at the bottom end.

You don't have too much to lose by trying used speakers especially if you buy them on here, most people on here are honest (if not all). What you buy for £100 - £300 you can generally put back onto the market at the same price if you don't like them, minus postage you paid.

I've had a pair of these and they were a very well regarded speaker, they are still good for very little money now, they would be in the £1K class by todays standards for less than £100 today:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Monitor-Audio-Speakers-r852/173988415306?hash=item288284874a:g:gRAAAOSwSwVdSYS 1

They are collection only but still a good example of what's out there.

The seller has sold a few HIFI items to very satisfied buyers, there wouldn't be too much risk in these, especially at the price. They may have the odd scratch or minor blemish, but for the money they'll be an obvious improvement over the Zensors build and sound quality. They're not ported and so can be placed anywhere.

[Hypnotist]

Thanks Bob only trouble is being almost on Lizard the very tip of Cornwall everywhere is a long way to get anything, if people say collection only I'm snookered really.

Rega arrived and installed, just a bit of TV audio trickling through it at the moment, till I can get to room to myself and play some music. I though the yamaha was heavy the Rega is more so.

[walpurgis]

Thanks Bob only trouble is being almost on Lizard the very tip of Cornwall everywhere is a long way to get anything.

That's where I'm going this Sunday. I'm visiting family by Manaccan.

[Hypnotist]

You'll be going past my place then to get there if you use the Redruth to Helston road, I'll put the kettle on:D

[Hypnotist]

6hr listening session and I'm blown away by the difference, to the point music I listen to sounds so different, another burn in session and looking forward to it opening up as the hours go on.

[Lawrence001]

Much as I love Rega I think that a completely analogue integrated amp these days is a bit ridiculous, even the £1700 Elicit-R has no digital inputs and no headphone output either, it’s time they woke up to the fact that music lovers don’t only listen to vinyl.


Sent from my iPad using TapatalkI'd much rather choose a dac and headphone amp of my own choice than have them determined by the maker of the amp. There were a few pricy amps coming up for sale recently and the dac specs were no longer competitive, a shame as it made the amps a less attractive proposition

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[Macca]

I'd much rather choose a dac and headphone amp of my own choice than have them determined by the maker of the amp. There were a few pricy amps coming up for sale recently and the dac specs were no longer competitive, a shame as it made the amps a less attractive proposition

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I bet the DAC specs were still better than the amplifier specs though. It isn't the DAC that is the limiting factor.

[steve-z]

I'd much rather choose a dac and headphone amp of my own choice than have them determined by the maker of the amp. There were a few pricy amps coming up for sale recently and the dac specs were no longer competitive, a shame as it made the amps a less attractive proposition

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I think from my own experience there’s very little difference in SQ between different DACS and tbh I’m all for minimising my box and cable count, I’ve had external DACS before and think the DACS in my Cambridge CXA60 and Onkyo A9010 don’t lose anything to any of them, it’s not like the addition of a DAC in an integrated amp costs the manufacturer very much, DAC chips cost pennies these days.


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[Hypnotist]

Cousins got a Yamaha A-S501 with inbuilt DAC but uses a Bresford Stand alone DAC which does improve on the Yamahas inbuilt one

[basslover]

I owned an AS500 a few years back and more recently (18 months ago) I owned its successor the AS501, I considered them to be pretty decent amps at their price point. Tbh you don’t really need to spend big bucks to improve on them, I changed from the AS501 to a Cambridge CXA60, on the day I bought it it took me no longer than 30 seconds of the first track to realise is was head and shoulders beyond the Yamaha, but at almost 3x the price it would be expected. There are plenty of very good amps around the same price point as the Cambridge, Rega Brio if you don’t need digital inputs, the Audiolab 6000A if you do, they are all excellent for the price. At a cheaper price point the Onkyo A9010 is better than the Yamahas imo, I use one in my second setup, mine is an EU spec one with a Wolfson DAC onboard (cheaper than the UK version without a DAC, bought mine from a supplier in Germany), it’s ridiculously good for a £200 amp.


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Could I ask where you got the Onkyo with dac from - I can't seem to find one and I'll really need it with dac

[steve-z]

Could I ask where you got the Onkyo with dac from - I can't seem to find one and I'll really need it with dac

I bought it from a German company called Sotel, unfortunately they don’t appear to be stocking it anymore.
You could try contacting Onkyo EU and see if they can advise a supplier.

https://www.eu.onkyo.com/en/products/a-9010-122158.html


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[philv]

Available on amazon.de.
If you have uk amazon, just log onto amazon.de using normal id/password.
Will ship to uk.

The a9130 also has digital inputs but costs more.
Maybe there will be sone deals come black friday.


Could I ask where you got the Onkyo with dac from - I can't seem to find one and I'll really need it with dac