which reel to reel ?

[singh108]

Hi there i am looking into buying a reel to reel however not sure which one to get. Am thinking between the Akai 747 and the famous revox b77. Any information between these two, comparisons etc.

[singh108]

sorry that would be the akai gx 747 dbx

[Rare Bird]

Hi there i am looking into buying a reel to reel however not sure which one to get. Am thinking between the Akai 747 and the famous revox b77. Any information between these two, comparisons etc.

I personally wouldnt touch that 747 with a barge pole.

AOS police will be coming for yer ;)

[DSJR]

yeah, we need more info about you, your system and musical tastes before we dispense shedloads of free advice..... ;)

[Spectral Morn]

Yes please pop into the welcome section and say hello properly. We would like a first name, basic location and what your system is, taste in music and anything else you would like to share.

We feel all of this leads to a more friendly forum and thus is a basic requirement of joining our community.

After that we can talk loads about reel to reel decks...


Regards D S D L

[Spectral Morn]

I personally wouldnt touch that 747 with a barge pole.

AOS police will be coming for yer ;)

We're here panic over ;) Move along nothing to see :lol::lol::lol::lol:

Regards D S D L

[Barry]

Hi there I am looking into buying a reel to reel however not sure which one to get. Am thinking between the Akai 747 and the famous Revox B77. Any information between these two, comparisons etc.

The Revox B77, without doubt. I'm sure Akai made some good stuff, but my only experience of them was with the model 4000D, a machine that was very popular here in the late '60s - early '70s. I much preferred the Tandberg 3000X, a machine comparable with the Akai 4000D.

The only advantage the Akai had was the ability to be operated in the vertical position. It also looked 'sexier', but that is somewhat irrelevant.

I used a Tandberg 3000X for a mammoth taping session. After 24 hours non-stop use it was hardly warm at all. The Akai would have overheated in the same situation.

Regards

[Hypnotoad]

Tascam

Otari MX5050BIII

[Beechwoods]

Otari MX5050BIII

Nice machine, and still manufactured. Pricey though. $5,500 up?

4-track / quarter track machines are good for compatibility with other people's tapes (most consumer oriented gear was 4-track). The Otari is 2-Channel; great for home recording, definitely, but not so easy if you want to swap stuff with your mates, unless they've got 2-track (half track) gear obviously.

I would have no hesitation in recommending a Pioneer RT-707 (I love mine) or RT-909 if you need to play 10" reels. The Technics RS-1500/RS-1700 et al were very neat machines with both 2 and 4 track switchable heads in some of the configurations. I think they're probably pricier than the OP wants to splash out. If he's set on an Akai versus a B77 I'd go for the B77.

It'd be useful to know a bit more about what the OP wants to do with his deck...

[Spectral Morn]

Nice machine, and still manufactured. Pricey though. $5,500 up?

4-track / quarter track machines are good for compatibility with other people's tapes (most consumer oriented gear was 4-track). The Otari is 2-Channel; great for home recording, definitely, but not so easy if you want to swap stuff with your mates, unless they've got 2-track (half track) gear obviously.

I would have no hesitation in recommending a Pioneer RT-707 (I love mine) or RT-909 if you need to play 10" reels. The Technics RS-1500/RS-1700 et al were very neat machines with both 2 and 4 track switchable heads in some of the configurations. I think they're probably pricier than the OP wants to splash out. If he's set on an Akai versus a B77 I'd go for the B77.

It'd be useful to know a bit more about what the OP wants to do with his deck...

It would be nice to know a bit more about him period.....


Regards D S D L

[Marco]

Give him a chance, Neil, before your mad Davros-addled mind mentally exterminates him! :lol:

Marco.

[Barry]

Tascam

Otari MX5050BIII

'Singh108' was asking for advice on models such as the Revox B77 and Akai 747. To suggest he considers machines that are way beyond this price bracket, is as much use as suggesting machines such as the Studer C37, A62 or the Telefunken M15A. Not a lot of help!

Regards

[Hypnotoad]

'Singh108' was asking for advice on models such as the Revox B77 and Akai 747. To suggest he considers machines that are way beyond this price bracket, is as much use as suggesting machines such as the Studer C37, A62 or the Telefunken M15A. Not a lot of help!

Regards

OtariMX5050 MkIV for sale over here, 4 of them in fact for around 400 quid each.

OTARI MX5050 Bll for sale for 150 quid over here as well.

Was just throwing it out there, bargains can be had.

Sorry to offend.

[Barry]

OtariMX5050 MkIV for sale over here, 4 of them in fact for around 400 quid each.

OTARI MX5050 Bll for sale for 150 quid over here as well.

Was just throwing it out there, bargains can be had.

Sorry to offend.

No offence taken Phillip - indeed it is I who should apologise. Like Nick I had assumed that Otari machines were studio quality and thus very expensive.

You're right there are a few machines on ebay in the region of $500 - $650, which does place them at a similar price to used B77s that are in virtually mint condition.

I did notice one Otari machine, an MX5050 BQ II. A four-track machine, presumably for quadrophonic use (it has four recording level meters). The owner is asking $3749 for it!

Thanks, and again apologies for my presumption.

Regards

[Rare Bird]

Sony 'TC765' or even a 'TC880' if you dont mind modern bar VU's!.. If money is no object tho: Something like a Sony 'APR5000' ! I wish :(

[Beechwoods]

Like Nick I had assumed that Otari machines were studio quality and thus very expensive.

No assumptions here, Barry ;) The initial mention was of an Otari MX5050BIII, which has a list price of around $5,500... http://www.broadcaststore.com/store/model_eq_list.cfm?intModelID=812624. Otari machines can be found second hand, but I'd watch that they haven't had heavy use in radio stations and small recording studios!

[DSJR]

The TC880 was a true luxury machine, better IIRC than the 765 and 766-2 I spent hours playing with (and occasionally listening to - ahem!).

The B77 is probably the safest of the lot out there, as there are hundreds of thousands in circulation still, prices are low and service and spares are readily available (including the now ludicrously over-priced fancy "pro" NAB adaptors).

The "trouble" for me with the B77 (and earlier A77) is that it's so common it's boring, if you see what I mean, yet it does its job year in, year out and has proven itself over the decades as a well-thrashed pro or semi-pro workhorse. I think a number of small-label-solo albums were recorded or mastered to A and B 77's as well.

Another distant possibility could be the Tandberg TD20A possibly, although it feels a bit tinny compared to the B77..

[Rare Bird]

The TC880 was a true luxury machine, better IIRC than the 765 and 766-2 I spent hours playing with (and occasionally listening to - ahem!).

The B77 is probably the safest of the lot out there, as there are hundreds of thousands in circulation still, prices are low and service and spares are readily available (including the now ludicrously over-priced fancy "pro" NAB adaptors).

The "trouble" for me with the B77 (and earlier A77) is that it's so common it's boring, if you see what I mean, yet it does its job year in, year out and has proven itself over the decades as a well-thrashed pro or semi-pro workhorse. I think a number of small-label-solo albums were recorded or mastered to A and B 77's as well.

Another distant possibility could be the Tandberg TD20A possibly, although it feels a bit tinny compared to the B77..

The Revox is the safest bet because of the tons of spare you can lay your hands on, i don't like Revox tho!...Don't like 'TD20' either..give me a Tandy '10XD' over that anyday.But it's not about me.

[Beechwoods]

I have a TD20A and it sounds really good, but I have to admit that I agree with Dave R that the transport is a bit heavy-handed at times!

[Spectral Morn]

No belts to worry about (except the counter), excellent build quality, no spare parts issues, excellent sound quality, nice to use, nice to look at (imho) and boring (allegedly) I vote for the REVOX B77 mk2 or a late A77 say a Dolby model.

However if you can't collect in person or all the original packing is not available (and that + lots of extra packing) then my advice is walk don't buy or bid.




Regards D S D L

[DSJR]

Neil, it's only "boring" to me because it just goes about its business in a classically "Germanic" kind of way.

The A77 doesn't have the headroom in the electronics for the tapes that were coming along in the mid seventies, but this could be modified by an engineer who knows what to do (the 15IPS Dolby A Dark Side of the Moon copy-master we had, had massive levels on it and our dem A77 IV had its playback boards modified to suit). The B77 has better logic for ham-fisted idiots like me as well.

[Rare Bird]

The A77 doesn't have the headroom in the electronics for the tapes that were coming along in the mid seventies

But it's not all about Headroom,figures & other technical things expected these days, it's about nostagia with a lot of people, it's the whole vintage sound with the electronics of the day, i'm personally not intrested one bit about Sound stages, fancy stands,wires & all that new fangled hi-fi technical crap tbh..remember as advances were brought forward throughout the years the products also sufferd by cost cutting & general cheap build compared to the earlier units.If youd rather have a medicore product compared to earlier over super figures on paper well good for you. I heard so much shit in my time thats had sparkling figures on paper it hurts..I've grown out of the specialist hifi thing back to Sq one with a very sour taste in my mouth...

Vintage guys are in whole different world to modern day hi-fi man & i find it's not entirely healthy for the two to be in the same place without many many disagreements
:sofa:

[Spectral Morn]

Neil, it's only "boring" to me because it just goes about its business in a classically "Germanic" kind of way.

The A77 doesn't have the headroom in the electronics for the tapes that were coming along in the mid seventies, but this could be modified by an engineer who knows what to do (the 15IPS Dolby A Dark Side of the Moon copy-master we had, had massive levels on it and our dem A77 IV had its playback boards modified to suit). The B77 has better logic for ham-fisted idiots like me as well.


If Brian Reeves at service sound does your Revox then your onto a winner imho. My A77 was set up and serviced by him. Any deck he does has his sticky paper badge signed by him and dated. He sticks them every where on the outside and inside. If you have no labels on yours then he did not service it. Mine has been set up for Ampex 456 (yes I know about the issues that tape can have).

I love both my Revoxs and an Akai I have as well :)


Regards D S D L

[Marco]

Well said, Andre... I think what you've just written makes a lot of sense :)

The difference with AOS is that a lot of people here love vintage AND modern gear, and can see the benefits of both, particularly in terms of incorporating BOTH technologies into the one system.

Look at my system, for example, you've got a brand new current production turntable, although with its roots in the 70s, (which I know you hate with a passion :eyebrows:), mixing it with a classic CDP from the 80s, and 1960s speakers - and all sorts of stuff in between!

In my view, often the most sonically satisfying results are obtained by mixing the best of both old and new technologies, particularly by taking the best vintage equipment and modifying it with modern components. Some of the best kit I use was born from exactly those principles - the Lockwoods being the most valid case in point.

I get the nostalgia thing (to an extent), which is cool, but I'll only use vintage gear if in my opinion the item concerned is likely to outperform its modern counterpart, especially when suitably modified. Thing is though, dude, how can it be genuine nostalgia? You were either not born or only a kid when most of the gear you love was built! ;)

I could see the point if you were Barry's age (no offence, Barry!) and had grown up using Quad amps, Garrards and the like - that's genuine nostalgia - but you're not old enough for that...... Genuine nostalgia for you would be to use the kind of kit you had in your first serious hi-fi system, which is why I revisited the Lentek I last used in one of my first proper systems in 1981 when I was 16.

You're a year or so younger than me, so unless you got into proper hi-fi at a VERY early age, you're not old enough to feel truly nostalgic about most of the kit you rave about. Do you see my point, dude? :)

With me, I couldn't give a f*ck whether something is vintage or modern, as long as it sounds great to my ears! Absolutism one way or the other (vintage is best or modern is best) in my experience rarely leads to owning a genuine top-notch system, because like with most extremes in life, the truth usually exists somewhere in the middle..........

AOS, though, is a friendly place to discuss stuff like this, so never feel that you'll ever be slagged off for liking vintage gear! :cool:

Marco.

[Rare Bird]

Well said, Andre... I think what you've just written makes a lot of sense :)

The difference with AOS is that a lot of people here love vintage AND modern gear, and can see the benefits of both, particularly in terms of incorporating BOTH technologies into the one system.

Look at my system, for example, you've got a brand new current production turntable (which I know you hate with a passion :eyebrows:) mixing it with a classic CDP from the 80s, and 1960s speakers - and all sorts of stuff in between!

In my view, often the most sonically satisfying results are obtained by mixing the best of both old and new technologies, particularly by taking the best vintage equipment and modifying it with modern components; some of the best kit I use was born from exactly those principles - the Lockwoods being the most valid case in point.

I get the nostalgia thing, which is cool, but I'll only use vintage kit if in my opinion the item concerned is likely to outperform its modern counterpart, especially when suitably modified. Thing is though, dude, how can it be genuine nostalgia? You were either not born or only a kid when most of the gear you love was built! ;)

I could see the point if you were Barry's age (no offence, Barry!) and had grown up using Quad amps, Garrards and the like - that's genuine nostalgia - but you're not old enough for that...... Genuine nostalgia for you would be to use the kind of kit you had in your first serious hi-fi system, which is why I revisited the Lentek I last used in one of my first proper systems in 1981 when I was 16.

You're a year or so younger than me, so unless you got into proper hi-fi at a VERY early age, you're not old enough to feel truly nostalgic about most of the kit you rave about. Do you see my point, dude? :)

With me, I couldn't give a f*ck whether something is vintage or modern, as long as it sounds great to my ears! Absolutism one way or the other (vintage is best or modern is best) in my experience rarely leads to owning the genuine top-notch system, because like with most extremes in life, the truth usually exists somewhere in the middle..........

AOS, though, is a friendly place to discuss stuff like this!

Marco.

I hear yer. I actually did grow up with equipment which was very old, hifi & music was very important in my parents household, so i do know the gear i love, so you see i have had an early hand in it..I obviously couldn't buy that type of gear as it was the very early 80's when i got my first income coming in to buy my own equipment..The gear in the early 80's was good stuff but it never gave me the enjoyment that the older gear i was used to listerning to at home..But i followed the magazines & what they said,reading em back to back every night, it was gospel to me what was said back then, till i eventually dug myself into a very expensive hole. So it's kinda back to before Sq one for me & has been for some time now.I was never happy with vinyl from the offset even though i had some of the best many years ago, it's not that i don't like records it's that the music i listern to sounds appauling on vinyl..you can't change that, these new re mastered vinyls don't impress me one bit.

What i like to do is rebuild the old gear i use with modern day specialised components, it's not entirly the sound benefits (which are welcoming) it's that the parts back then were mostly poor quality & not very reliable in most cases & will no doubt be out of tolerance now, so to have a classic which performs in a more stable way as well as guarenteeing it's sees me out then then i'm cool with that, i'm not one for defacing by modification tho, a little harmless alteration will do.

CD for me is a revelation & so is SONY (Thanks Sony for the best sounding CD players)..The recordings you can get on open reel tape taken from CD of my fav albums leaves the original vinyl to tape recordings standing..

So yeh mixing old & new is good but only a CD player will be the modern part for me dude..I keep my missions as they were the second pair of speakers & most fav i ever bought when younger

[Barry]

Well said, Andre... I think what you've just written makes a lot of sense :)

The difference with AOS is that a lot of people here love vintage AND modern gear, and can see the benefits of both, particularly in terms of incorporating BOTH technologies into the one system.

Look at my system, for example, you've got a brand new current production turntable (which I know you hate with a passion :eyebrows:) mixing it with a classic CDP from the 80s, and 1960s speakers - and all sorts of stuff in between!

In my view, often the most sonically satisfying results are obtained by mixing the best of both old and new technologies, particularly by taking the best vintage equipment and modifying it with modern components. Some of the best kit I use was born from exactly those principles - the Lockwoods being the most valid case in point.

I get the nostalgia thing (to an extent), which is cool, but I'll only use vintage gear if in my opinion the item concerned is likely to outperform its modern counterpart, especially when suitably modified. Thing is though, dude, how can it be genuine nostalgia? You were either not born or only a kid when most of the gear you love was built! ;)

I could see the point if you were Barry's age (no offence, Barry!) and had grown up using Quad amps, Garrards and the like - that's genuine nostalgia - but you're not old enough for that...... Genuine nostalgia for you would be to use the kind of kit you had in your first serious hi-fi system, which is why I revisited the Lentek I last used in one of my first proper systems in 1981 when I was 16.

You're a year or so younger than me, so unless you got into proper hi-fi at a VERY early age, you're not old enough to feel truly nostalgic about most of the kit you rave about. Do you see my point, dude? :)

With me, I couldn't give a f*ck whether something is vintage or modern, as long as it sounds great to my ears! Absolutism one way or the other (vintage is best or modern is best) in my experience rarely leads to owning a genuine top-notch system, because like with most extremes in life, the truth usually exists somewhere in the middle..........

AOS, though, is a friendly place to discuss stuff like this!

Marco.

Much of my gear is vintage or 'classic' (call it what you will), acquired not out of a sense of nostalgia, but because it was the best gear you could get in its day, received very good reviews and still sounds good today and I could afford to buy it (albeit second hand in very good condition). Some of it is built for professional use (and was used by professionals) and that means it is reliable; a property that is very important to me. Most of my gear is at least 30 years old, and it is only recently that I have had to return the preamp for attention.

The system I have put together provides most of what I want from a music system. I enjoy it's strengths and ignore its shortcomings; it's my system for my ears. I appreciate other people's systems for what they do, but at the end of the day, it's their system put together to satisfy their ears. If I had to start again, I would obviously be looking at new and current products to build a system, hell - I would be into computer audio!

If I was after nostalgia, I would still be using the cartridges I once used, would be tracking down some Wharfedale RS8DD drive units and rebuilding Mullard valve amplifiers. Oh - and trying to find a Garrard 401. The only vintage items that interest me now are Radford or Lowther valve power amps. My last nostalgia trip was to acquire a Leak Troughline tuner.

I'm very much of a "mix 'n' match, old with new". As I think has been mentioned elsewhere in this forum, it's not the technology that matters so much, it's how it is implemented.

Regards

[Marco]

I wholeheartedly agree with that last sentence, Barry!

Good stuff, chaps :)

Marco.

[Beechwoods]

hell - I would be into computer audio!

:eek:

I can't believe that -- turn your back on the gorgeous sensory delight that is an LP, or even a CD? Hold it in your hands, caress it! 2000 albums on a hard drive doesn't even come close Barry!

[Barry]

:eek:

I can't believe that -- turn your back on the gorgeous sensory delight that is an LP, or even a CD? Hold it in your hands, caress it! 2000 albums on a hard drive doesn't even come close Barry!

You've forgotten the most important attribute of vinyl, Nick - it's not the sound at all, it's the smell! :lol: CDs? Ha - I'm sick of having to renew the jewel cases!

No, I would still want back-up copies of the software. What happens if there was a disc crash?

Regards

[DSJR]

Legally, you need the donor CD's and LP's if they've been ripped..

[Marco]

You've forgotten the most important attribute of vinyl, Nick - it's not the sound at all, it's the smell!


Lordy, so you're a vinyl sniffer then eh, mmmmm.... Sweety, have I got just the outfit for you next time you come up! :bum: :eyebrows:

Marco.

[DSJR]

Nah, it's the smell of those old circuit boards ;)

[Beechwoods]

That's the one!

[Barry]

As Stephen Fry once remarked: " redolent of dust on Mullard valves"!

[eziodoc]

I'm very happy with my Revox B77 MKII, two tracks, 19-38 cm/sec..
Heavy, friendly, high quality sound..:)

But also my two Grundigs, the TS-925 and the TS-1000 are not so bad..;)

Ciao.