Cartridges

[Matt_J]

I've tried a fair few but there's obviously too many to make any sort of headway into hearing anything approaching all of them.

The sort of sound I'd like is one that doesn't sacrifice detail, space, air and imaging for a bit of fluidity/warmth to the sound, I'm definitely NOT a fan of the typical "analogue" sound that people talk about when they mention warmth or smoothness etc, likewise I don't want something that is so clinical I may as well be listening to a CD Player. Has to be MC as well.

Carts that intrigue me that I haven't heard, or have any sort of clue, about are the Ortofon Cadenzas, higher end AT MCs, anything from ZYX, Hana. I'd rather not get dragged into cables/phono stages/amps/speakers debate but keep it isolated to carts if we could.

I currently use a high mileage Benz Glider SL and I'm starting to plan ahead, either to get it rebuilt or to replace it. I really like it but obviously this gives the chance to improve if it's possible at a sensible cost.

[Bigbird]

To me the AT Art 9 just does everything right and is the best iv heard up to 1500 squid .

Its hard s to find a single bad review anywhere. Seems to be one of those rare hifi products that is widely regarded. Amazing value

[Nonnegativ]

If you already has a Benz I would make use of their exchange program to move higher up the latter.

To me it sounds as if an LP-S would be the perfect fit for you. I have heard it many times and it is probably my next cartridge-upgrade. I am currently running a Lyra Delos & Benz Ruby Z. The Benz is the best of the two to my ears: Lyra Delos plays hifi where as the Benz plays music.

[Matt_J]

To me the AT Art 9 just does everything right and is the best iv heard up to 1500 squid .

Its hard s to find a single bad review anywhere. Seems to be one of those rare hifi products that is widely regarded. Amazing value

Yes I must admit the ART 9 seems universally well reviewed and was certainly on my list.


If you already has a Benz I would make use of their exchange program to move higher up the latter.

To me it sounds as if an LP-S would be the perfect fit for you. I have heard it many times and it is probably my next cartridge-upgrade. I am currently running a Lyra Delos & Benz Ruby Z. The Benz is the best of the two to my ears: Lyra Delos plays hifi where as the Benz plays music.

Thanks but I think the LP-S is out of my league, that's a bit of a jump from a Glider.

[moodybuilder]

I use the hana sl and for me it’s a giant killer, l had a Benz karat d2, and find the hana all round better. I’d like to hear the new ml they now have.

[p147]

To me the AT Art 9 just does everything right and is the best iv heard up to 1500 squid .

Its hard s to find a single bad review anywhere. Seems to be one of those rare hifi products that is widely regarded. Amazing value

1+

[DiveDeepDog]

If you really like the Benz, Art 9 may not be for you. I had Benz Ace L and moved it on fairly quickly. Art 9 is my staple go to cart.

I would add Shelter 501 to the list.

[JohnG]

If anybody has a well used or damaged Shelter 501 they may want to sell on, I am interested in any that may be offered.

[Idlewithnodrive]

Another Big fan of the Hana SL here. Very even handed, doesn't favour any frequencies and just seems to get out of the way.

[Matt_J]

If you really like the Benz, Art 9 may not be for you. I had Benz Ace L and moved it on fairly quickly. Art 9 is my staple go to cart.

I would add Shelter 501 to the list.

Interesting, thanks Mark. What didn't you like about the Benz? I've owned AT carts previously and enjoyed them, the Benz was the first cart where things seemed to come together and nothing seemed to be missing.

I forgot to put DV carts on the list as well, another I've never heard anything from aside from a shonky old 10x5 that was well past its best.

[DiveDeepDog]

Interesting, thanks Mark. What didn't you like about the Benz? I've owned AT carts previously and enjoyed them, the Benz was the first cart where things seemed to come together and nothing seemed to be missing.

I forgot to put DV carts on the list as well, another I've never heard anything from aside from a shonky old 10x5 that was well past its best.

Benz was a bit too polite, all very nice but I prefer a sharper leading edge?
I've had DV's, 17/2 and XX1 which have sounded great, but ones lost cantilever, and ones lost its tip, I can't recommend them off those experiences.

All personal choice, I still haven't heard an Ortofon I'd buy, but they're liked well enough here and about...

[montesquieu]

I've tried a fair few but there's obviously too many to make any sort of headway into hearing anything approaching all of them.

The sort of sound I'd like is one that doesn't sacrifice detail, space, air and imaging for a bit of fluidity/warmth to the sound, I'm definitely NOT a fan of the typical "analogue" sound that people talk about when they mention warmth or smoothness etc, likewise I don't want something that is so clinical I may as well be listening to a CD Player. Has to be MC as well.

Carts that intrigue me that I haven't heard, or have any sort of clue, about are the Ortofon Cadenzas, higher end AT MCs, anything from ZYX, Hana. I'd rather not get dragged into cables/phono stages/amps/speakers debate but keep it isolated to carts if we could.

I currently use a high mileage Benz Glider SL and I'm starting to plan ahead, either to get it rebuilt or to replace it. I really like it but obviously this gives the chance to improve if it's possible at a sensible cost.



Depends entirely on your arm and turntable, your phono stage and what your aural preferences are.

Can you tell us a bit more?

[Jac Hawk]

If you are going to the Bake off planned in Sheffield then you can hear my Art 9 as i'll be taking my TT over

[dwhistance]

montesquieu: "Depends entirely on your arm and turntable, your phono stage and what your aural preferences are."

I couldn't agree more, though when you read the threads on here matching cartridges to arms, phono stages, turntables and SUT's is almost always ignored!

[walpurgis]

If anybody has a well used or damaged Shelter 501 they may want to sell on, I am interested in any that may be offered.

This belongs in a 'wanted' thread of its own in the Private Exhibitions area, not piggybacked on somebody else's cartridge thread.

[Matt_J]

Depends entirely on your arm and turntable, your phono stage and what your aural preferences are.

Can you tell us a bit more?

Depending on how I get on with it, Rega P8. Phono stage is a Ryan Sound Lab MC stage. I like a holographic/3D/spacious sound but not at the expense of everything else, it just has to be good at that. I'm definitely not overly concerned with bass performance as a priority.

[petrat]

Last year, I was impressed by a Rega Ania on the lowly P3 (with the NEO speed controller). I heard it at Signals in Ipswich, and I'd certainly recommend you give it (and the Apheta 2) a listen at a local Rega dealer ... there was definitely some synergy there. Whether it'd out-perform your Benz, though, I don't know. The other one I'd consider, given your description of what you like, is the Lyra Delos. Again, that was on demo at Signals on the Rega turntables.

[Opti-cal]

Carts that intrigue me that I haven't heard, or have any sort of clue, about are the Ortofon Cadenzas, higher end AT MCs,

Not necessarily in the "high end" class of the ART range but I've just started to break in an AT OC9XEN (nude elliptical) cart. So far its up there with a friends Hana and I would say the only MC under a grand that I like as much as my Benz Micro ACE SL. There is literally nothing missing from its performance so far.

[Matt_J]

Last year, I was impressed by a Rega Ania on the lowly P3 (with the NEO speed controller). I heard it at Signals in Ipswich, and I'd certainly recommend you give it (and the Apheta 2) a listen at a local Rega dealer ... there was definitely some synergy there. Whether it'd out-perform your Benz, though, I don't know. The other one I'd consider, given your description of what you like, is the Lyra Delos. Again, that was on demo at Signals on the Rega turntables.

Thanks, I'm not a fan of Rega carts, even less so after owning an Apheta 1, so I don't think I'll be adding either of those to the list, cheers anyway.


Not necessarily in the "high end" class of the ART range but I've just started to break in an AT OC9XEN (nude elliptical) cart. So far its up there with a friends Hana and I would say the only MC under a grand that I like as much as my Benz Micro ACE SL. There is literally nothing missing from its performance so far.

Interesting, I did wonder why AT have released about 12 new different versions badged as OC9s. Seems a bit of an odd line up now.

[helma]

Depending on how I get on with it, Rega P8. Phono stage is a Ryan Sound Lab MC stage. I like a holographic/3D/spacious sound but not at the expense of everything else, it just has to be good at that. I'm definitely not overly concerned with bass performance as a priority.

If imaging is what you want, Goldring Elite might be worth checking out.

[petrat]

Thanks, I'm not a fan of Rega carts, even less so after owning an Apheta 1, so I don't think I'll be adding either of those to the list, cheers anyway.

Yes, the Apheta 1 was horrendous. The Ania isn't.

[Clive197]

Not necessarily in the "high end" class of the ART range but I've just started to break in an AT OC9XEN (nude elliptical) cart. So far its up there with a friends Hana and I would say the only MC under a grand that I like as much as my Benz Micro ACE SL. There is literally nothing missing from its performance so far.

I’ve just started to brake in an AT-OC9XSH which even out of the box shamed my Hana SL and AT33PTG/II. I am convinced that it also beat the Cadenza Black (it shouldn’t as it’s a 3rd of the price). I love the sound of Shibata tipped styli, which may have something to do with it.

[Matt_J]

Does anyone else find the current AT MC line up really confusing? Are they planning on phasing some of the older models out or is this line up going to run as is? You've got all these new variants of the OC9 which cross over with current variants of the AT33 with eliptical, ML and Shibata stylus', so where does that leave models like the PTG and 33Sa?

It all seems a bit daft if you ask me, how on earth someone is supposed to pick one of those lot is beyond me.

[Clive197]

Does anyone else find the current AT MC line up really confusing? Are they planning on phasing some of the older models out or is this line up going to run as is? You've got all these new variants of the OC9 which cross over with current variants of the AT33 with eliptical, ML and Shibata stylus', so where does that leave models like the PTG and 33Sa?

It all seems a bit daft if you ask me, how on earth someone is supposed to pick one of those lot is beyond me.

Your right of course. Trying to get a demo of a Phono cartridge is nigh on impossible and with the huge choice that Audio Technica gives us it very nearly guesswork. I chose my new cartridge because a) I like Shibata styli and b)it’s the only AT cartridge range that has threaded fixing holes which makes fitting easier with my 70yr old fingers and thumb.
I have used Ortofon cartridges for over 5 decades and at a recent dealer event I attended they all sounded remarkably similar with prices from a few hundred to many thousands so I became a little dissatisfied with the current Ortofon range and thought I would try another cartridge from Audio Technica. I already owned a AT33PTG/II which I used as an emergency spare. So far, I’m blown away by the OC9XSH which is an absolute bargain at it’s price point.

[graham67]

Hi Clive, the results of your oc9 xsl sound promising. I have a 33ptg2 and an oc-9 ml ii which I prefer and am wondering what step next on the at ladder.
I agree with matt, the AT range is confusing. My experience with the 33 ptg2 and 33ev suggests they have a fuller sound in the lower mid and bass, where the oc9 range is a little more neutral. In some decks such as technics, they can be a bit on the lean side so the 33 range will probably work better. On my Garrard 401, the 33ev was far too lush yet it is one of the cart Dave Cawley recommends for his timestep 1200s.
The topend of the oc9 range is bewildering, microline, shibata and line contact variants. Based on my experience with the 150mlx microline and 150sa shibata, I would expect the shibata oc9xsh to outperform the microline oc9xml. However where does the line contact oc9xsl fit in? Is it 'better' or just different?
I suspect whatever model one buys, one.will be left with the nagging thought of "have I bought the right one??!!"

[Clive197]

Graham I understand where you are coming from and I can only state what I have found with my new AT-OC9XSH it cannot be described as lean. While I use a Technics SL1210, I have replaced the arm with an Origin Live Encounter arm which has proved far more coherent than the original arm. Interestingly I spent over 2 hrs setting up the arm and cartridge and somehow managed to find the sweetspot, which is easier said than done. The Shibata stylus is notoriously hard to set up but with time and a significant amount of patience it can be done. The sound I’m now getting after approx 12 hrs of wearing in can only be described as sublime, better even than a Cadenza Black I owned previously. I’m beginning to feel that I never managed to get the sweetspot of the Cadenza Black!! As I said, the Shibata is difficult to get right.

[Opti-cal]

I have to say I have been consistently pleased (if not amazed) by the performance of the budget to mid priced AT carts. I started with 95e's then 440MLa and 150MLx now the OC9XEN. There were consistent improvements on the way up the ladder. I don't think you can go wrong if you match the compliance of your arm and then choose the tip you like.

This is likely the reason for AT offering so many variants. Some models may not suit certain TT's/arms so AT have got everything covered. As Clive points out he is a Shibata man. I myself have been happy with the ML ones (although I've never stumped up for a Shibata yet!).


I really can't find much wrong with the OC9XEN so I would imagine the ML and SH versions are even better.

[Matt_J]

Finally got the P8 up and running, now I've heard it the cartridge hunt is on hold. One step forward and three steps back is basically how my vinyl journey has gone.

[hifi_dave]

Enjoying the P8 ?

[Matt_J]

Without waffling and mincing my words, no, not really.

[Slawts]

I had a Benz Wood SL which I did quite enjoy until the diamond tip fell off.

In sensible fashion instead of repairing it I bought a factory refurbed Ortofon Jubilee direct from Ortofon. I have had it for a couple of years and absolutely love it.

As you have a Glider which is pretty decent something along the Cadenza range should be a step up although the Jubilee has a nice shibata tip!

[JohnG]

I've got a Hana SL, which I am familiar with in my home system.
I have a standard Ortofon K'b, but I am only familiar with a standard K'b, in a friends system.
I have rebuilt K,b with to date approximately 30 hours usage, that I am familiar with in my system as well as in a few different friends systems.
I have not compared the above cartridges on the same TT, Tonearm and Stand, so there will be very noticeable differences in presentations.
The PTP Solid 9 > Audiomods Series V Micrometer > Hana SL, when played through the home system, presents itself as a OK MC, if it is the only MC listened to, it will leave a good impression.
The standard Ortofon K'b, on a pristine serviced 401 in a 9 stone Granite Plinth > pristine serviced SME 3009, played in a friends system sounds OK, but when compared to the rebuilt K'b in the exact same system, the rebuilt K'b surpasses the standard one in all areas, leaving a very good impression.
The rebuilt K'b in another friends System, used on the same TT, Tonearm and Stand, when compared to rebuilt a Ortofon Vienna, sounds superb, even though in my view the Vienna gets more from the lower end of the scale, that I feel makes it the better cartridge.
As the rebuilt K'b receives more usage, there may be a little more to show in the lower registers ;).
When the Pristine Serviced SP10 > PMAT 1010 > rebuilt K'b are used in the home system, compared to the PTP set up stated above, the set up with the rebuilt K'b is my preferred presentation, but that does not discount the PTP, as it is a very adept and enjoyable TT that I am pleased to be able to use.
I feel the OP will get great rewards if they were to go down the investigative route to find out where a rebuild could take the
Benz cartridge, that their ear seems to have a bond with.

[Matt_J]

I had a Benz Wood SL which I did quite enjoy until the diamond tip fell off.

In sensible fashion instead of repairing it I bought a factory refurbed Ortofon Jubilee direct from Ortofon. I have had it for a couple of years and absolutely love it.

As you have a Glider which is pretty decent something along the Cadenza range should be a step up although the Jubilee has a nice shibata tip!

Good info, thanks.

My previous opinion on the P8 is on hold as I think it's either a) a poor match between the glider and P8/arm or b) the glider is worn as it is getting on in hours.

I've got another cart to try before making up my mind, but it's interesting to hear your thoughts on the Ortofons, the only thing putting me off something like a Cadenza is the requirement for endless arm adjustment to set up the VTA, it would mean spacers and a lot of faffing around I think. If you do a search around the net there's lots of posts from people unsure whether it's set up right or not with the arm in all manner of funky positions.