icon audio and focal

[hifinutt]

i have had my focal 1028be for over a month and they are rather good. very lovely treble, very natural aand excellent bass .

i am currently using some rather nice bel canto ref 1000 [modded by coherant] which of course are class d. they sound fabulous and really grip the focal

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg160/phil125/Picture027.jpg

now i have a sneaky suspicion reading all your ravings about valves that valves would sound better.

my question is would a icon audio [who are fairly nearby]
mb 150 monoblock drive these beauties as well as the refs. ?
the focal are 91.5db sensitivity

my system is currently leema antilla into a music first silver classic preamp

[Ali Tait]

What's the impedance curve like?

[hifinutt]

ah, now being a bit thick , i haven`t a clue. i know they are 4ohm speakers tho .

and theres a cheap stereo 40 going in mint condition. would that be worth trying as a taster?

http://www.iconaudio.co.uk/Stereo40mkIII.html

[Ali Tait]

Might be an idea if you can borrow or get a dem with one on your speakers first.Sensitivity is not everything,the load presented by the speaker is just as,if not more important.

[Haselsh1]

I'll apologise now but I am going to sing the praises once again of Glen Croft and his hybrid designs. The Micro 25 preamp and Series 7 power amp is completely unbeatable at the price and not soft and mushy. The level of detail these amplifiers uncovers is truly astounding with a good dose of power and control as well. Treble is just so clean and clear with a stunning level of clarity and the midrange is to die for. The bass is a little tiny bit light though.

[hifinutt]

thanks shaun , and i guess the series r is even better. seems very well priced

http://www.croftacoustics.co.uk/series7_R.html

[Themis]

Yes, Croft is unbeatable, as Shaun says. ;)

[chris@panteg]

Hi Phil

I have heard those Focals and some of the stand mounters recently and my goodness they are good i want some:) i would think they are an easy load as they are all quite sensitive .

Such an exhilarating performer .

[Mr. C]

Phil,

If you going to look at valves, do look at some quality amps, not just Icon
Also with the way that 1028 is against the wall and its rearward firing port that close and in an small alcove, you are ceratinly not getting the best out of them by any means.
You may find (unless you find some class valve mono's) that in the current placement situation you are really going to struggle to get to work closer to the potential.
You also listen at quite low volume levels too Phil, I would suggest a high current amplifier design would be the place to start first.
Just an observation

[Ali Tait]

Hi Phil

I have heard those Focals and some of the stand mounters recently and my goodness they are good i want some:) i would think they are an easy load as they are all quite sensitive .

Such an exhilarating performer .

Speaker manufacturers often sacrifice an easy load for greater sensitivity.I think they see it as a good selling point IMO.

[chris@panteg]

Quite right of course Ali , Phill does state they are sounding fablulous with the Bel canto and i would advise not to change anything, valves might make them better ! then again why change something that's working superbly as it is ? .

[Ali Tait]

Very true,but there's always the temptation to fiddle! I can relate to that...

Are those Bel Cantos class T amps?

[Mr. C]

Ali,

They are ICE power modules in the E.one series not the PWM versions from Belcanto

[hifinutt]

Phil,

If you going to look at valves, do look at some quality amps, not just Icon
Also with the way that 1028 is against the wall and its rearward firing port that close and in an small alcove, you are ceratinly not getting the best out of them by any means.
You may find (unless you find some class valve mono's) that in the current placement situation you are really going to struggle to get to work closer to the potential.
You also listen at quite low volume levels too Phil, I would suggest a high current amplifier design would be the place to start first.
Just an observation

thanks mr c
unfortunately they have to be fairly close to the wall due to room design and the mrs floats past with her handbag!!! the sonority design stands really help to control the bass and sounds pretty damm good despite the positioning.

there is also high density insulation on the wall to absorb excessive waves

what high current amp would you suggest ? valve or ss , i believe there is better soundstaging to be had altho the lovely coherant modded refs are rather good

[hifinutt]

yes the refs sound fabulous but was reading martin colloms thoughts from 2007 on class d and he continues to knock it . even tho manufacturers like acoustic research are bringing out class d integrated.

one big advantage is you can leave them on all day at listen at any time with a warmed up amp. the coherant modifications have made a big difference to the stock model ref 1000 and the iec inlets fit my iec rock solid which i always prefer

[Spectral Morn]

yes the refs sound fabulous but was reading martin colloms thoughts from 2007 on class d and he continues to knock it . even tho manufacturers like acoustic research are bringing out class d integrated.

one big advantage is you can leave them on all day at listen at any time with a warmed up amp. the coherant modifications have made a big difference to the stock model ref 1000 and the iec inlets fit my iec rock solid which i always prefer

Hi Phil

Must say that I did not like the sound of the early Class D amplifiers from Bel Canto. They were flat 2 dimensional lifeless sounding with a suck out in the presence region. However the ICE amplifiers are very good and I have heard that they are supposed to go well with Focal speakers though I have not head that combination myself.

I would stick with them (Bel Cantos) myself.

Icon amplifiers are very good and great value for money but I don't think they will suit your speakers. However trying things out is part of the fun so home dem as many options as you can and only part with your money when you find a combination that does more than your Bel Cantos...problem is I suspect this will be costly.

I am in a similar boat myself with my Gallo References as they like power and control. I use a Music Reference RM 200, 100 watts and a BAT VK75, 75 watts valve amplifiers with them to good effect but the purity and clarity of lower power valves eludes them to a certain extent. This is the price you pay for speakers that like need/power.


Regards D S D L

[magiccarpetride]

I'll apologise now but I am going to sing the praises once again of Glen Croft and his hybrid designs. The Micro 25 preamp and Series 7 power amp is completely unbeatable at the price and not soft and mushy. The level of detail these amplifiers uncovers is truly astounding with a good dose of power and control as well. Treble is just so clean and clear with a stunning level of clarity and the midrange is to die for. The bass is a little tiny bit light though.

Riddle me this: when it comes to power amps, the received wisdom is that a good amp must demonstrate that it can double its nominal 8 Ohm wattage at 4 Ohm. In the case of Croft Series 7 power amp, its wattage at 8 Ohm is 45 wpc, and at 4 Ohm is only 50 wpc. Shouldn't it be 90 wpc at 4 Ohm? And if not, why?

[Stratmangler]

Try playing with this http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-ohm.htm

[Mr. C]

Hi Phil

Must say that I did not like the sound of the early Class D amplifiers from Bel Canto. They were flat 2 dimensional lifeless sounding with a suck out in the presence region


Regards D S D L

Neil,

I have just noticed your comment here, would you please elabourate for me your above statement.
It is the total anti thesis of the sound they generated, and in particular which models where you referring to.

Thanks Mr.C

[hifinutt]

not sure about the models you are mentioning here neil but bel canto have a huge amount of reviews 95% very very glowing, especially for the refs . i have about 1-2 inch thick pile of them i read !!

[leo]

Neil,

I have just noticed your comment here, would you please elabourate for me your above statement.
It is the total anti thesis of the sound they generated, and in particular which models where you referring to.

Thanks Mr.C

Just shows how tastes differ, for me it was the opposite, I always preferred the older ones with Tripath over the ICE powers, sounded more balanced to me
Can't remember the model numbers just that one was Tripath based the other was ICE :scratch:

[Spectral Morn]

Yes it was the Tripath ones I did not like. The ICE module fitted ones are very good imho.

As leo says we all have different tastes in audio.


Regards D S D L

[Mr. C]

Leo,

I completely understand were you are coming from :-)