Ethernet cables

[Jimbo]

Anyone recommend an Ethernet cable supplier - thanks.

[struth]

Last one i got was a Duronic WE 10m Network Cable CAT6a Ethernet LAN Patch Cat 6 A RJ45 Wire Gigabit FTP Gold Headed Shielded - High Speed 600MHz .... nice quality... amazon supplied it.https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00FSAKO6M/ref=oh_aui_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[Stryder5]

Remember to maintain the Cat status performance the minimum bend radius should be maintained :)

Gary

[Jimbo]

Last one i got was a Duronic WE 10m Network Cable CAT6a Ethernet LAN Patch Cat 6 A RJ45 Wire Gigabit FTP Gold Headed Shielded - High Speed 600MHz .... nice quality... amazon supplied it.https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00FSAKO6M/ref=oh_aui_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

:cool:

[goraman]

:cool:
James,
That looks like very nice cable.
I have been using CAT 7 because it is supposed to be better shielded , each wire in its own mylar jacket ,less cross talk and better RFI rejection .
What I have found is early CAT 7 can be 27 awg and newer is 26 awg. as there is no regulation or cable standards for CAT 7 for the telecommunications industry and no official specs so buyer beware ,It is supposed to support up to 600mhz. Is it any better than your CAT 6A probably not and doesn't matter,it's fast enough for my sons gaming computer.

CAT 8 coming soon!

https://planetechusa.com/blog/ethernet-different-ethernet-categories-cat3-vs-cat5e-vs-cat6-vs-cat6a-vs-cat7-vs-cat8/

This looks good. https://www.amazon.com/Ethernet-ShineKee-Heavy-Duty-Networking-Gigabit/dp/B01MY6D2SC/ref=pd_sbs_147_5?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B01MY6D2SC&pd_rd_r=599a3be6-2f50-11e9-af4d-7fcf5515c0e8&pd_rd_w=1o2cz&pd_rd_wg=gdPNa&pf_rd_p=588939de-d3f8-42f1-a3d8-d556eae5797d&pf_rd_r=HGAVSSCQ7622EYXKK18P&psc=1&refRID=HGAVSSCQ7622EYXKK18P

[Stratmangler]

I have been using CAT 7 because it is supposed to be better shielded

Shielding means diddly if it isn't properly referenced to ground!
If it ain't properly referenced to ground it's called an aerial.
It needs to be referenced to your CMET.

What you need to create is a Faraday Shield, and without an appropriate ground connection you do not make one.

[goraman]

Shielding means diddly if it isn't properly referenced to ground!
If it ain't properly referenced to ground it's called an aerial.
It needs to be referenced to your CMET.

What you need to create is a Faraday Shield, and without an appropriate ground connection you do not make one.
Chris ,
Sorry but shielding dose NOT have to be shunted to ground to be effective.
Shielding can work with no connection to anything what so ever.
I learned this in Armature radio years ago , and mylar can be very effective at rejecting RF .
In fact so can a well placed Ferrite RF choke that is also ungrounded.
In the case of mylar it simply reflects RF away from the signal wire, think of it as a physical barrier like a brick wall .

[Stratmangler]

Chris ,
Sorry but shielding dose NOT have to be shunted to ground to be effective.
Shielding can work with no connection to anything what so ever.
I learned this in Armature radio years ago , and mylar can be very effective at rejecting RF .

If you look at the Cat6A and Cat7 spec, you'll see that it's an integral part of the spec.

[goraman]

I am not saying it isn't grounded , I am just saying mylar can be used as a shield with no ground.

[Stratmangler]

I'd be much more concerned about the induced RFI from the SMPS that power network devices, to be honest.

[Light Dependant Resistor]

I am not saying it isn't grounded , I am just saying mylar can be used as a shield with no ground.

However would require other material such as graphite added to be partially effective as a conductor, with then shielding as perhaps one flamboyant use

Mylar on its own is a excellent electrical insulator, which unfortunately does not have properties as a electromagnetic shield https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_shielding

[goraman]

However would require other material such as graphite added to be partially effective as a conductor, with then shielding as perhaps one flamboyant use

Mylar on its own is a excellent electrical insulator, which unfortunately does not have properties as a electromagnetic shield https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_shielding

Yes, but the mylar used for shielding has a thin aluminum alloy metalized layer that acts as a shield.
I think we are debating semantics.

[Crackles]

Last one i got was a Duronic WE 10m Network Cable CAT6a Ethernet LAN Patch Cat 6 A RJ45 Wire Gigabit FTP Gold Headed Shielded - High Speed 600MHz .... nice quality... amazon supplied it.https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00FSAKO6M/ref=oh_aui_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1Hi Gran, would you recommend this cable to connect from router to a streamer?

Cheers

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

[Jimbo]

Hi Gran, would you recommend this cable to connect from router to a streamer?

Cheers

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

I have used this cable in that same position and it is superb. Just bought another to connect Laptop to router.

[Crackles]

I have used this cable in that same position and it is superb. Just bought another to connect Laptop to router.Thanks Jimbo. I have been looking at the Chord and QED stuff but this is a fraction of the price so will give it a go.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

[Stryder5]

Yes, but the mylar used for shielding has a thin aluminum alloy metalized layer that acts as a shield.
I think we are debating semantics.

I have been in a similar discussion, it's not semantics.

Mylar is a film and non-conductive, Aluminium is a foil and conductive. So the shield is the aluminium and conductive, the Mylar film is acting as a supporting carrier.

Gary

[goraman]

Thank you for explaining that.

[Marco]

This is the best ethernet cable I've used at reasonable cost: https://www.futureshop.co.uk/supra-cat8-flame-retardant-ethernet-cable

It significantly improved both the sonic performance and stability of my music streaming, over the 'bog standard' CAT6 cable I was using previously. Never misses a beat. Highly recommended!:)

Marco.

[Jimbo]

This is the best ethernet cable I've used at reasonable cost: https://www.futureshop.co.uk/supra-cat8-flame-retardant-ethernet-cable

It significantly improved both the sonic performance and stability of my music streaming, over the 'bog standard' CAT6 cable I was using previously. Never misses a beat. Highly recommended!:)

Marco.

I believe cat8 has all strands of the cable individually shielded?

[struth]

I believe cat8 has all strands of the cable individually shielded?Probably why it's 10timez the price.

[Jimbo]

Probably why it's 10timez the price.

Yes, they are a tad pricey, wonder if they are worth the extra expense?:scratch:

[Discopants]

Yes, they are a tad pricey, wonder if they are worth the extra expense?:scratch:

I think its worth having the quality where it counts but not in your whole network.

Into the streamer is where it counts the most. Im using chord C stream , which is similarly priced but only cat 7 spec equivalent. Thinking of trying a short length of this from my network switch to the streamer , which in my case is actually the amp.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Jimbo]

What is the difference between Cat 6 and Cat 7?

[struth]

you have cat 6a too;)

[Jimbo]

you have cat 6a too;)

Yes Grant, I have the Cat 6a.:)

[struth]

6a goes up to 500mhz, 7 goes a bit higher. sure there are other differences too... for our needs i dont think there will be any improvement.

[Jimbo]

6a goes up to 500mhz, 7 goes a bit higher. sure there are other differences too... for our needs i dont think there will be any improvement.

Certainly cheap enough and works fine with the RPi.

[Stratmangler]

This is the best ethernet cable I've used at reasonable cost

It's not ethernet cable.
It's patch cable.

[struth]

a straight patch :eyebrows:

[Stratmangler]

There's a difference between ethernet infrastructure cable and patch cable, and it's not trivial https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patch_cable

[struth]

There's a difference between ethernet infrastructure cable and patch cable, and it's not trivial https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patch_cable

hows you doing Chris? not seen you about of late mate:)

[Jimbo]

There's a difference between ethernet infrastructure cable and patch cable, and it's not trivial https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patch_cable

What Ethernet cable would you recommend Chris?

[Stratmangler]

hows you doing Chris? not seen you about of late mate:)

I'm OK Grant :)
How's tricks with you?

I have been lurking, but to be honest there isn't anything of any real interest going on here or anywhere else, hence my almost complete lack of activity.

[Marco]

I believe cat8 has all strands of the cable individually shielded?

Dunno, mate. Does it say so on the blurb for Supra? If not, best Google it:)

Marco.

[struth]

I'm OK Grant :)
How's tricks with you?

I have been lurking, but to be honest there isn't anything of any real interest going on here or anywhere else, hence my almost complete lack of activity.

yup, not too bad at moment.. speak to ya sometime :) city still up there:D

[Marco]

I think its worth having the quality where it counts but not in your whole network.


Yup, I agree. I only need 3 x 0.5m lengths, to connect my hard-drives to my router, which are sat right next to each other. The rest is done wirelessly, so no great expense. Switching to the Supra though, from bog-standard CAT6a did make a difference, as outlined.

I get 350mbps (often more, up to nearly 400mbps) broadband here, and the Supra removed the occasion glitches I had before, when streaming music and movies. It's now super-fast and totally rock steady!:)

Marco.

[Stratmangler]

What Ethernet cable would you recommend Chris?

Your basic infrastructure should be solid core, of whichever variant you want to try. Cat6 UTP is excellent good, or if you want shielded variants Cat6a or Cat7, of which the latter two require screen connections going back to your CMET.
Commercial installations are usually UTP, because using STP the costs go up considerably, both from a materials perspective, and from an earthing requirement
Your patch leads should be short. No longer than needed.

One thing you will find using STP types of cable is that they're very good conduits for RFI if they're not earthed properly. The RFI I mention is from cheap and nasty, down and dirty SMPS units that proliferate with just about piece of electrical kit sold today.

[Marco]

One thing you will find using STP types of cable is that they're very good conduits for RFI if they're not earthed properly. The RFI I mention is from cheap and nasty, down and dirty SMPS units that proliferate with just about piece of electrical kit sold today.

Yup. We've been here before though - you're not going to create much of an 'aerial' from a 0.5m piece of wire;)

Marco.

[Stratmangler]

yup, not too bad at moment.. speak to ya sometime :) city still up there:D

We have a lot of games coming up in a short period of time, although thankfully not a lot of trekking around Europe for the next CL round :D Lots of trips to London are involved, which ain't exactly cheap .....

[Jimbo]

I think my router works off a SMPS so that could also be an issue too. I have Cat 6a so may have an RFI issue. How can I earth this cable?

[Stratmangler]

Yup. We've been here before though - you're not going to get much of an 'aerial' from a 0.5m piece of wire;)

Marco.

Who said anything about aerials?
The RFI I mentioned is mains borne.
You still using the PSU Virgin provided with your router, or have you got a linear job powering it?

[struth]

a linear psu would probably cure any from the psu

[Marco]

Who said anything about aerials?
The RFI I mentioned is mains borne.
You still using the PSU Virgin provided with your router, or have you got a linear job powering it?

Router and hard-drives are all powered from a fully-regulated linear PSU, dude:)

You mentioned the aerial factor before when this subject came up.

Marco.

[Stratmangler]

a linear psu would probably cure any from the psu

It would cure the worst of it.
There is likely to be a switching regulator or two in the router, so there's another RFI problem to overcome. Thankfully there are ferrite chokes that can deal with that :)

[Jimbo]

a linear psu would probably cure any from the psu


Using a LPS to power my router....more expense:rolleyes::)

[Stratmangler]

You mentioned the aerial factor before when this subject came up

I did.
The conduit thing applies whether you're using UTP or STP, and the switching noise (aka RFI) is induced over the cable.

[struth]

Using a LPS to power my router....more expense:rolleyes::)

i just dont worry...cant afford to :D

[Jimbo]

i just dont worry...cant afford to :D

I have just bought a LPS form China but it has taken 5 weeks to get here. Cheap at £50 delivered. If it made a significant difference I would consider one for my router.

[Marco]

I did.
The conduit thing applies whether you're using UTP or STP, and the switching noise (aka RFI) is induced over the cable.

Ah ok, interesting. Not relevant though, with an LPS in the equation.

In terms of cost, well, when you consider how cheap it is to get an RPi up and running, compared with a network streamer from a 'high-end' manufacturer, or a 'high end' CDP, then a few hundred quid for an LPS [Duncan built mine for £350], it really peanuts!:)

Marco.

[Stratmangler]

Ah ok, interesting. Not relevant though, with an LPS in the equation.

In terms of cost, well, when you consider how cheap it is to get an RPi up and running, compared with a network streamer from a 'high-end' manufacturer, or a 'high end' CDP, then a few hundred quid for an LPS [Duncan built mine for £350], it really peanuts!:)

Marco.

A switching regulator or two in the router .....

[Marco]

If effective filtering was built into the design of the LPS, wouldn't it negate the deleterious effect of switching from said regulators? If not, then like you say, there are ferrite chokes!:)

Marco.

[Jimbo]

I am sure one of these may help?

https://jcat.eu/featured/m12-switch-gold/

[Jimbo]

And a review of the m12-switch-gold.

http://www.highfidelity.pl/@main-823&lang=en


However, I think only Marco maybe able to afford one!:lol:

[Marco]

Interesting... I didn't catch the price, plus where exactly in the 'streaming path' would such a device be connected?

Marco.

[Jimbo]

Interesting... I didn't catch the price, plus where exactly in the 'streaming path' would such a device be connected?

Marco.

The review article explains all mate.

[Marco]

Ok, I'll have a closer look after lunch. I only scan-read the article. We're having our first barbecue of the year today, as it's gloriously spring-like here, so I'll have some lovely charcoal-grilled lamb cutlets to devour shortly!:)

Marco.

[Stratmangler]

If effective filtering was built into the design of the LPS, wouldn't it negate the deleterious effect of switching from said regulators? If not, then like you say, there are ferrite chokes!:)

Marco.

The router is upstream from the PSU - the switching takes place regardless of what's providing the power.
Your typical LAN voltage is + 2.5v , so considerably lower that the typically 12vdc that's powering the router.

[Jimbo]

Ok, I'll have a closer look after lunch. I only scan-read the article. We're having our first barbecue of the year today, as it's gloriously spring-like here, so I'll have some lovely charcoal-grilled lamb cutlets to devour shortly!:)

Marco.

That sounds rather delicious, grilled lamb cutlets are a favourite of mine.:cool:

[Marco]

The router is upstream from the PSU - the switching takes place regardless of what's providing the power.
Your typical LAN voltage is + 2.5v , so considerably lower that the typically 12vdc that's powering the router.

Ya, dat's true... So you address the issue at the other end with ferrites:)

Marco.

[Marco]

That sounds rather delicious, grilled lamb cutlets are a favourite of mine.:cool:

Here ya go.... It was lovely:

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1024x768q90/923/vDwIXW.jpg

Charcoal grilled Welsh double-lamb cutlets, marinated in lemon juice, fresh rosemary, garlic and celery salt, with assorted fresh vegetables and hasselback potatoes.

Marco.

[Jimbo]

That looks top quality nosh! You got be drooling now!:drool::drool:

[Discopants]

I think my router works off a SMPS so that could also be an issue too. I have Cat 6a so may have an RFI issue. How can I earth this cable?


Jimbo I think if you have the metal body RJ45 connectors then the shielding is grounded to the metal. Then I think that if you have an earth connection lug on the body of a network switch , ground that to the mains earth.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Jimbo]

Jimbo I think if you have the metal body RJ45 connectors then the shielding is grounded to the metal. Then I think that if you have an earth connection lug on the body of a network switch , ground that to the mains earth.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Thanks Martin.