What's the story... [Archive] - The Art of Sound Forum

Haselsh1

12-01-2019, 10:28

This is my state of play so far. January 2019.

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4878/46711571621_98bfc85f65_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2eaK1Qv)Hi-Fi 2019 January (https://flic.kr/p/2eaK1Qv) by Shaun Haselden (https://www.flickr.com/photos/156648964@N02/), on Flickr

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4819/46658926622_516e419996_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2e66cj7)Hi-Fi 2019 January (https://flic.kr/p/2e66cj7) by Shaun Haselden (https://www.flickr.com/photos/156648964@N02/), on Flickr

Really happy with the sound of my system now that I have removed vinyl from the equation.
Did have a foray into digital optical connect for the CD to DAC but kept getting lots of dropout so back to coax where it all sounds peachy.

The Spendor's have the most gorgeous vocal sound combined with the valves especially on female jazz vocal, helped no doubt by the EL34's. I've had various valve types since I first got into valves in 1997 but always end up back with the EL34. Very definitely my personal fave.

antonio

13-01-2019, 06:54

Very nice, love the photos.

jandl100

13-01-2019, 07:58

Yup, great looking system and lovely photos, of course!

I'm an MDAC fan as well, have used one in one of my systems for a few years now to excellent effect.
Personally, el34 are at the bottom of my power valve list, just goes to show how opinions and experience can vary.

Haselsh1

13-01-2019, 09:59

Yes Jerry it sure does. It is a bloody good job we are not all the same or there'd only be the one. The finest valve sound I've ever had was from a single ended Audion 300B but it was just so limited that the then setup had to go. I was running it into Audio Note AZ-2's and the sound was so bloody wonderful but only really on simple 'acoustic' type music. At that time I also had an Audion Sterling ETSE amp running single ended EL34's and the midrange was stunning but with a little more guts. I have not really tried out the bigger KT valves so maybe that will be a thing for the future.

My personal preference is very definitely for single ended though, I have not yet heard push pull that comes close. Current situation though means I have to use push pull.

Haselsh1

13-01-2019, 10:01

Very nice, love the photos.

Hello David I am only a short way down the road from you. Thank you for your comment.

Macca

13-01-2019, 10:50

Very sexy photos.

Haselsh1

13-01-2019, 15:10

Very sexy photos.

Thanks Martin, as usual it's all about the light.

Marco

13-01-2019, 22:49

Looking great, Sean, and glad you're also happy with the noise it's all making!:)

So how long do you think you'll keep this lot for, then?:eyebrows:;)

Or is this system *the* one, so job done, stop the box-swapping and just kick back and listen to the music?:cool:

Marco.

Haselsh1

14-01-2019, 08:21

I guess the noise our systems make is all relative to how we perceive emotion from music. For me, I am now pretty close to the end of the road with what I have. The pre/power is stunning with the correct blend of everything, the speakers add an immense midrange clarity and realism, the MDAC does what it does extremely well. There was something missing though and I couldn't place what it was until something else gave me the idea of a subwoofer. This has now made the sound complete. Emotionally it makes me amazed at how it can stir feelings of sadness, euphoria and tranquility.

One thing though; I started this journey in 1978 whilst recovering from a motorbike smash so along the way I have had some really interesting experiences. Is it that I now have my perfect system or is it that my state of mental health has now reached 59 years old and ridiculous things like hi-fi addiction no longer matter. I no longer have anything to prove to anyone but myself which is obvious by the fact that Sue and I now listen alone and no longer have the need to invite people around to share the experience with. The sound we get is just the sound the system reproduces, take it or leave it and if it doesn't please everyone but us then who gives a shit. We don't invite people around anymore to attempt to prove to them how good our sound is. There is simply no need.

It could be that the competitive edge that so many people suffer from has finally left me and that I no longer give two hoots about what others think and how my system has to be better than theirs. It will never be better it will only ever be different in the same way that everyone else's is different. I went through a similar change with my photography many years back when I gave up the club scene and entering competitions only to realise that the so called 'judge' who was passing her/his 'expert' opinion over everyone's work was actually no better qualified than I was was. Maybe I'm just getting old.

;)

jandl100

14-01-2019, 08:29

struth

14-01-2019, 08:39

been same for years. still like hearing others efforts tho, and dont mind if folk hear mine and dont like it. we all hear different, and that has been hammered home by using my nura headphones. in fact ive found that my hearing can change on a daily basis.

nice pics and set up by way Shaun.

edit. I might add as much as i like others systems ive never striven to copy them. You should choose your own road.

walpurgis

14-01-2019, 09:07

My system has got where I want it to be and I actively discourage audio visitors these days. And I am no longer interested in how other folks' systems sound. I no longer go to Hifi Shows. I can find my own way

Same here, I admit.

I know what I want and like and know how to achieve it. A simpler setup can give me that, so I'm going to radically alter my system.

Haselsh1

14-01-2019, 09:55

so I'm going to radically alter my system.

I admire you for that decision.

southall-1998_mk2

14-01-2019, 09:57

Are you still using Grado's, Shaun?

S.

Haselsh1

14-01-2019, 10:01

Grant I also have never tried to copy others with the purchase of 'their' system. I have 'my' sound, a sound I love and that is what I currently experience on a day to day basis. What I always wanted was a beautiful vocal tone and air and space so I knew it had to be valves, but these Spendors are just sublime. Their resolution is amazing. Once I discovered subwoofers I had the cream as well as the cake, and, once I shifted vinyl out of my life I simplified and destressed everything.

Haselsh1

14-01-2019, 10:02

Are you still using Grado's, Shaun?

S.

Shane no, I sold them a year or so back.

Haselsh1

14-01-2019, 10:05

Haselsh1

14-01-2019, 10:11

Interesting!
And I find myself in exactly the same place.

My system has got where I want it to be and I actively discourage audio visitors these days. And I am no longer interested in how other folks' systems sound. I no longer go to Hifi Shows. I can find my own way.

Maybe I'm just getting (even more) antisocial. :)

LOL Jerry, maybe it is an age thing.

I understand totally what you've just said. Of course I'm not about to start streaming or any such bollocks and I do not own any kind of pad or tablet but I so understand your comments. I do not visit dealers and shows, I have no interest in another's system, I only follow the music. We very definitely can find our own way.

walpurgis

14-01-2019, 10:28

And Geoff, even though I admire what you are about to do, I have to admit that I couldn't do the same. I am so pleased with my system at the moment that I just couldn't do it.

A year down the line though and things could be so different. They have been in the past.

It's partly 'cos I'm getting older mate and just want less 'stuff'. Particularly big stuff. So the hefty valve monos and big Tannoys will eventually go, even though they sound fantastic. I hardly play records, so one simple deck for occasional use will be kept.

RobbieGong

14-01-2019, 10:54

Marco

14-01-2019, 12:40

Hi Sean,

Thanks for sharing your (carefully considered) thoughts earlier, particularly this, which I think is quite insightful:

Is it that I now have my perfect system or is it that my state of mental health has now reached 59 years old and ridiculous things like hi-fi addiction no longer matter. I no longer have anything to prove to anyone but myself which is obvious by the fact that Sue and I now listen alone and no longer have the need to invite people around to share the experience with. The sound we get is just the sound the system reproduces, take it or leave it and if it doesn't please everyone but us then who gives a shit. We don't invite people around anymore to attempt to prove to them how good our sound is. There is simply no need.

It could be that the competitive edge that so many people suffer from has finally left me and that I no longer give two hoots about what others think and how my system has to be better than theirs....

The bit in bold, for me, says it all - and if you *truly* mean that, then you've arrived in happy place my friend!:)

An out of control Hi-fi addiction, for me, is a form of neurosis. It can seriously (and adversely) affect your wellbeing and state of mind (not to mention bank balance), and unfortunately forums such as this are populated by its victims, and indirectly probably also help create it!:doh:

The main problem is, males in general are prone to (often unhealthy) bouts of competitiveness, involving any activities that they're interested in or passionate about, which includes hi-fi!

Therefore, the desire to 'show off' their systems to others of a similar mindset, and try to 'beat' them, by proving that theirs sounds better [how 'bakeoffs' were born], is powerful and controlling, and it can be destructive in all sorts of ways, mentally and/or financially, and crucially also in causing the breakdown of relationships. I know of instances where that's sadly been the case.

For me, of all the box-swappers I've seen on forums and also met over the years, IMO, only Jerry hasn't allowed his 'hi-fi addiction' (or more in his case, his hobby) to control him, negatively impact on his life or erode his love of music. Others who qualify as 'box-swappers' may *think* that's the case, but are clearly victims of a genuine hi-fi addiction - and they have a serious problem too, which in some cases has spiralled out of control and needs addressing ASAP.

The key to ensuring that your (healthy) hobby doesn't turn into a destructive addiction, is in *some point* reaching the realisation that the equipment/boxes are simply a means to an end, and that that end is enjoying your favourite music, either yourself or with your partner/friends or family, with your system producing a sound that you can RELAX with, and not sit there analysing (for faults).

You acknowledge its sonic limitations, as all hi-fi systems have, but those are easily overridden by how the sound connects you emotionally with the music, and turns the whole listening exercise into one that's stress-free and enjoyable, which you look forward to participating in every day, instead of being a chore and fraught with stress and ultimately disappointment, no matter how much you try and convince yourself differently!;)

Anyway, I'm glad that you're in a happy place now and hope that what I've written may make some folks stop and think...

Marco.

Jimbo

14-01-2019, 13:12

Haselsh1

14-01-2019, 14:06

James I so agree that we all like a little fiddle every now and again. With that in mind I'll acknowledge that I would love to try a set of JJ KT88's ;)

Regarding vinyl replay, I agree again. I've been into that since 1978 but reached a point early last year where for me, it was no longer worth the intensity that it requires from the user. My personal situation changed once again house wise and I just used this as an opportunity to reassess things regarding music reproduction and just how important it was (or wasn't). I love the combination of valves and Spendor speakers even though I came upon the combination almost by accident and with the addition of some good low frequency reinforcement, things are currently where I want to be.

I tried a set of borrowed KT88's a year or two back and things didn't turn out too positively so I would like to reinvent that wheel hopefully with more success. They very definitely sounded different but when switching the power amp off something caused a cracking sound out of both speakers. Once I had swapped back to the EL34's I had no problem and since then I have changed to JJ EL34's with no problems. Can't really explain it.

Haselsh1

14-01-2019, 14:11

Marco yes, I truly think it is a form of neurosis possibly obsessive compulsive type disorder and yes again, I think that this particular type of obsession afflicts mainly men.

Marco

14-01-2019, 14:35

I used to be a hifi box swapper many years ago but I needed to go through this phase of my life in order to understand what sound I liked. Others can give you advice and you can hear as many systems as you like but ultimately it is your own ears that tell you if its the sound and correspondingly the gear you are looking for. Once you have established what aspects of sound are important too you then you can start to build a system that accomplishes this goal.

Absolutely, and we've all been box-swappers at some point in our respective audio journeys, as *done properly*, with some sort of plan/end-goal firmly in mind, it acts as a valuable learning curve. However, the key is in the word "learning"...

Unfortunately many of us learn the sum total of bugger all, and spend all of our box-swapping days going round in never-ending circles, chasing a 'sound in our heads', which we want and think we can get, but simply never achieve.

If you don't want to fall into that trap, then you need to *actually learn* something useful, and use it to your advantage, by assembling a system that truly delivers musical satisfaction, and then give up the box-swapping, certainly the major stuff, and just lightly tweak the performance of the kit you've got, and spend the bulk of your money on music!

That, I believe, is where Jerry's at now, which shows he eventually got it right!

I've often thought it'd be a rather enlightening exercise if we could jump back in time and listen to all the systems we once owned, and which we ripped up and replaced for something else, and compare them with what we have now... I wonder in how many cases we'd find that we've gone backwards, more than forwards, in terms of the performance of our systems, how much musical pleasure they've given us, and exactly how much we've *genuinely* learned?;)

Marco.

AJSki2fly

14-01-2019, 14:39

I no longer have anything to prove to anyone but myself which is obvious by the fact that Sue and I now listen alone and no longer have the need to invite people around to share the experience with. The sound we get is just the sound the system reproduces, take it or leave it and if it doesn't please everyone but us then who gives a shit. We don't invite people around anymore to attempt to prove to them how good our sound is. There is simply no need.

It could be that the competitive edge that so many people suffer from has finally left me and that

;)

Your words struck a chord with me as well. I started on the hifi/audiophile holy grail of listening to various systems, buying and selling equipment and so on about 42 years ago. The trouble was when younger I would all too easily get sucked into the new this and that, hyped up in too many HiFi mags, with reviews effectively saying this is the must have. So after at least half a dozen unique systems and various permutations, bits upgraded sometimes for the worse I effectively stopped listening to music seriously for about 10 years. Even though I owned a respectable Meridian 500 based system, with some decent speakers. I think I had become disheartened by it all, having never really getting to find the sound I wanted and within my budget. Then I heard my best friends system, he had returned to his system about 4 years earlier, as he had moth balled his whilst a family grew up and started to leave home. He had effectively replaced his original system that he had for many years, but had gone down the valve amp and bigger speaker route with good front end for record and CD. He gave me some good advise pointing out that I already had a very good CD player in the Meridian and that the power amp I had was pretty good, so all I needed to think about was TT and speakers (mine at the time I felt were a bit uncontrolled in the lower regions). Also he said "Think second hand and value for £'s, but be careful with TT's as they may need money and effort to get right if their history was heavily used". He also said think about what sound you want and then audition new or secondhand and take your gear along to see how it works together. I had sort of done this in the past, but never seemed to have or make enough time and was sometimes impetuous. So I took his advice, I wanted a similar sounding system to my friend as I liked its tone, musicality and openness. Initially I purchased a second hand Project Xperience to get the record side going not too much outlay with a view to upgrading if I did like the return to vinyl. Then I started looking for a replacement amplifier, with valves being the key, and ended up with what I have now, a smooth musical sound but also detailed. Things were still not what I wanted in the speakers department so after more listening to my friends system I went for the same speakers as him, and this combination worked very well giving me the sound and experience I wanted. So the next and nearly final step was to go for a better TT, I decided not to go for the secondhand route, which in hindsight was probably a mistake, for what I paid I now think I could have done better if I had searched for a good TT, not necessarily the same as I have. However I took advice on arm, phono and cartridge and these work well. For various reasons I am changing speakers now, mainly because I have been presented with some I would have never considered which are more acceptable in the lounge by Sue, my wife. However it was not until I listened did I make the decision to have them and primarily because they produced the sound and musical feeling I want.

I think I am nearing the end of the HiFi chase, I am more interested in listening to the music and enjoying it than picking holes in the system. However I think the TT could be improved on (arm, cartridge and phono stage are all fine), but it does sound very good, so I may just sit back and listen and forget it. As you say I am not that bothered any more whether others like it or think it sounds good or not, all that matters to me is my enjoyment.

Marco

14-01-2019, 14:47

Marco yes, I truly think it is a form of neurosis possibly obsessive compulsive type disorder and yes again, I think that this particular type of obsession afflicts mainly men.

Yup, and hi-fi attracts obsessive/compulsive types, and so promotes said neurosis! The key is in recognising the condition and doing something positive about it if you have it, which you appear to have done:)

Btw, I've been through the valves you mention many times over the years, and in the right amp/circuit, KT88s (and 120s, then 150s) easily outperform EL34s, in virtually all important parameters. However, you'll *never* discover that simply by tube-rolling the respective valves in the same amp, simply because no one amp can get the best from any single valve type, as it won't have been designed for it.

The only way, therefore, to come to any meaningful conclusions about specific valves, is to use them in an amp that's been designed, from the ground up, to get the most from the output valves it's been built to optimise.

Plus....and you've touched on this already, if you love the single-ended sound, done well, then no matter what valves you use, you may never like the push-pull one the same - and much will depend on the type of music you listen to!:cool:

Marco.

Marco

14-01-2019, 14:48

Your words struck a chord with me as well. I started on the hifi/audiophile holy grail of listening to various systems, buying and selling equipment and so on about 42 years ago. The trouble was when younger I would all too easily get sucked into the new this and that, hyped up in too many HiFi mags, with reviews effectively saying this is the must have. So after at least half a dozen unique systems and various permutations, bits upgraded sometimes for the worse I effectively stopped listening to music seriously for about 10 years. Even though I owned a respectable Meridian 500 based system, with some decent speakers. I think I had become disheartened by it all, having never really getting to find the sound I wanted and within my budget. Then I heard my best friends system, he had returned to his system about 4 years earlier, as he had moth balled his whilst a family grew up and started to leave home. He had effectively replaced his original system that he had for many years, but had gone down the valve amp and bigger speaker route with good front end for record and CD. He gave me some good advise pointing out that I already had a very good CD player in the Meridian and that the power amp I had was pretty good, so all I needed to think about was TT and speakers (mine at the time I felt were a bit uncontrolled in the lower regions). Also he said "Think second hand and value for £'s, but be careful with TT's as they may need money and effort to get right if their history was heavily used". He also said think about what sound you want and then audition new or secondhand and take your gear along to see how it works together. I had sort of done this in the past, but never seemed to have or make enough time and was sometimes impetuous. So I took his advice, I wanted a similar sounding system to my friend as I liked its tone, musicality and openness. Initially I purchased a second hand Project Xperience to get the record side going not too much outlay with a view to upgrading if I did like the return to vinyl. Then I started looking for a replacement amplifier, with valves being the key, and ended up with what I have now, a smooth musical sound but also detailed. Things were still not what I wanted in the speakers department so after more listening to my friends system I went for the same speakers as him, and this combination worked very well giving me the sound and experience I wanted. So the next and nearly final step was to go for a better TT, I decided not to go for the secondhand route, which in hindsight was probably a mistake, for what I paid I now think I could have done better if I had searched for a good TT, not necessarily the same as I have. However I took advice on arm, phono and cartridge and these work well. For various reasons I am changing speakers now, mainly because I have been presented with some I would have never considered which are more acceptable in the lounge by Sue, my wife. However it was not until I listened did I make the decision to have them and primarily because they produced the sound and musical feeling I want.

I think I am nearing the end of the HiFi chase, I am more interested in listening to the music and enjoying it than picking holes in the system. However I think the TT could be improved on (arm, cartridge and phono stage are all fine), but it does sound very good, so I may just sit back and listen and forget it. As you say I am not that bothered any more whether others like it or think it sounds good or not, all that matters to me is my enjoyment.

Could we have a few paragraphs, Adrian, when you get a chance?:eyebrows:;)

Marco.

AJSki2fly

14-01-2019, 15:05

Could we have a few paragraphs, Adrian, when you get a chance?:eyebrows:;)

Marco.

Brevity I am not known for!:eyebrows:;)

Marco

14-01-2019, 15:10

Lol, that doesn't excuse you from pressing a 'return' key!":ner:

Marco.

Macca

14-01-2019, 15:31

Hi Sean,

Thanks for sharing your (carefully considered) thoughts earlier, particularly this, which I think is quite insightful:

The bit in bold, for me, says it all - and if you *truly* mean that, then you've arrived in happy place my friend!:)

An out of control Hi-fi addiction, for me, is a form of neurosis. It can seriously (and adversely) affect your wellbeing and state of mind (not to mention bank balance), and unfortunately forums such as this are populated by its victims, and indirectly probably also help create it!:doh:

The main problem is, males in general are prone to (often unhealthy) bouts of competitiveness, involving any activities that they're interested in or passionate about, which includes hi-fi!

Therefore, the desire to 'show off' their systems to others of a similar mindset, and try to 'beat' them, by proving that theirs sounds better [how 'bakeoffs' were born], is powerful and controlling, and it can be destructive in all sorts of ways, mentally and/or financially, and crucially also in causing the breakdown of relationships. I know of instances where that's sadly been the case.

For me, of all the box-swappers I've seen on forums and also met over the years, IMO, only Jerry hasn't allowed his 'hi-fi addiction' (or more in his case, his hobby) to control him, negatively impact on his life or erode his love of music. Others who qualify as 'box-swappers' may *think* that's the case, but are clearly victims of a genuine hi-fi addiction - and they have a serious problem too, which in some cases has spiralled out of control and needs addressing ASAP.

The key to ensuring that your (healthy) hobby doesn't turn into a destructive addiction, is in *some point* reaching the realisation that the equipment/boxes are simply a means to an end, and that that end is enjoying your favourite music, either yourself or with your partner/friends or family, with your system producing a sound that you can RELAX with, and not sit there analysing (for faults).

You acknowledge its sonic limitations, as all hi-fi systems have, but those are easily overridden by how the sound connects you emotionally with the music, and turns the whole listening exercise into one that's stress-free and enjoyable, which you look forward to participating in every day, instead of being a chore and fraught with stress and ultimately disappointment, no matter how much you try and convince yourself differently!;)

Anyway, I'm glad that you're in a happy place now and hope that what I've written may make some folks stop and think...

Marco.

Don't even know where to start with this.

I think you're confusing people who are constantly changing kit chasing rainbows with people (like me, Jerry, Roy and a few others) who like to try different equipment just out of curiosity and for fun. I'm actually more of a box hoarder then a box swapper as I rarely sell anything.

Anyone who ends up with hifi having a 'negative impact' on their lives has issues that would probably impact them heavily regardless of being into hi-fi or not.

Some of us do not regard hi-fi as simply 'means to an end' and are interested in the equipment just for the sake of it. It's a hobby. There's nothing intrinsically negative about it. In any case getting 'neurotic' about your hi-fi system is clearly a first world problem for people whose lives are so perfect they've got nothing more serious to worry about.

That aside the 'competition' element is interesting. Yeah I've heard better systems than mine but never thought of it as a competition and I'm the competitive type. Usually they've spent a shedload of money to get where they are and my only thought is 'I wonder if I could get that same sound on the cheap?' Which is a good incentive to learn about how the equipment works, how sound reproduction works and so on in order to facilitate that.

And other people's opinions - I've had people come round and say 'your system sounds really good' whilst I'm thinking 'No, I think it's got a long way to go yet.' A friend once said to me 'You're just tinkering round the edges now.' - Since then every component in the system has been replaced at least twice or three times!

And finally why is spending money on more equipment bad but spending it on more music is good? Like I need 5000 albums which I won't have enough time left in my life to get round to listening to. I had a friend, now long gone who had several hundred albums still in the wrappers when he died because he bought them compulsively and his listening could not keep up.

Joe

14-01-2019, 16:04

That aside the 'competition' element is interesting. Yeah I've heard better systems than mine but never thought of it as a competition and I'm the competitive type.

I'm not even the competitive type. I'm a sort of very slow box-swapper. Every few years I get bored with what I've got and monkey around with new/different stuff. I bought an 'end-of' pre/power/CDP combination 21 years ago. 15 years or so back, I decided to try a passive pre and valve power amp; then about 6 years ago I got fed up with the multiple boxes, sold the valve set-up and bought an integrated DAC/amp.

I've still got the solid state pre/power/CDP system that was displaced by the valve system in the top room and it still sounds great, so I guess you could say I should have just stuck with that and saved myself lots of time and effort. (I've also tried a variety of speakers, but have bought and sold these as I've gone along, so have only ever had two pairs in the house).

Macca

14-01-2019, 16:23

I'm not even the competitive type. I'm a sort of very slow box-swapper. Every few years I get bored with what I've got and monkey around with new/different stuff. I bought an 'end-of' pre/power/CDP combination 21 years ago. 15 years or so back, I decided to try a passive pre and valve power amp; then about 6 years ago I got fed up with the multiple boxes, sold the valve set-up and bought an integrated DAC/amp.

.

Didn't you get one of those Devaliet things? You do know that you are supposed to go round the forums tut-tutting at all of us still using half a dozen boxes to make sound and wondering aloud about the inconvenience and clutter of 'legacy systems'? I think it's on page 37 of the manual. Somewhere near the back anyway.

Marco

14-01-2019, 16:34

I think you're confusing people who are constantly changing kit chasing rainbows with people (like me, Jerry, Roy and a few others) who like to try different equipment just out of curiosity and for fun.

Firstly, I'm not confusing anything. I'm simply commenting on the subject, based on my experiences, and relating how it has *directly affected people I know*, and so stand by every word I wrote. Interesting that you thought I was referring to you... Did you think you fitted the profile?:eyebrows:;)

I can assure you that you weren't in my mind, and neither was Roy. Jerry, I've already discussed. We've known each other for years, I've met him a few times and visited him at his home, so by now I'd like to think I've got a reasonable handle on his 'hi-fi habits'. However, he's free to correct me if I'm wrong!

This is rather like the recent discussion on retirement... There's nothing wrong with anything, *if* you ENJOY doing it, and it's FUN, hence why I've highlighted the above. Therefore, whether you're working into your dotage doing a job you love, or dicking around with hi-fi gear for the same length of time, and you can afford it and it MAKES YOU HAPPY, there is no argument.

My argument here, as indeed it was on the retirement/pension thread, solely refers to the behaviour of those who claim to be doing something that they enjoy, as you've outlined, BUT deep down are far from happy or having fun. And trust me, in terms of hi-fi enthusiasts, there are plenty of them about. I've met them not only on forums, but in real life at bakeoffs, hi-fi shows, and sold to them when I worked in the industry, so they *do* exist.

Also, you're right, hoarding excessive collections of records or CDs, or any other form of physical music media, largely for the sake of it and gaining no real pleasure from the exercise, is just as bad as doing the same with hi-fi equipment. It doesn't matter WHAT it is you're collecting or doing. If it's no longer fun, and worse causing you financial hardship or affecting your marriage/relationship, then it's time to think about stopping and doing something else!

Anyway, Sean's Gallery thread isn't really the place for this sort of discussion, so we should leave it there. I only commented, as I did, because Sean had indulged in a little introspection, which appeared to have been beneficial for him, as he's now in a happy place, when once he wasn't, and I think that others could learn from his experience:)

Marco.

Macca

14-01-2019, 16:48

Well there was this bit:

For me, of all the box-swappers I've seen on forums and also met over the years, IMO, only Jerry hasn't allowed his 'hi-fi addiction' (or more in his case, his hobby) to control him, negatively impact on his life or erode his love of music.
.

Marco

14-01-2019, 16:54

Ha - well, I've never really thought of you as a box-swapper, certainly not in Jerry's league!:D

And by your own admission:

I'm actually more of a box hoarder then a box swapper as I rarely sell anything.

So which one would you like to be known as from now on?

Marco.

Macca

14-01-2019, 16:58

Either, I'm not fussy.

Marco

14-01-2019, 17:06

Then I think I'll just stick with daftee!!:lol:

;)

Marco.

Audio Al

14-01-2019, 17:27

Then I think I'll just stick with daftee!!:lol:

;)

Marco.

Cough :nono: Thats me , We can't have 2 daftee's :)

Marco

14-01-2019, 17:31

No your status has been elevated to the rarified and honourable position of 'Super-daftee', as you've well earned that title... Martin, in comparison, is just playing at it, so is merely a 'daftee'!:D

Marco.

Joe

14-01-2019, 17:33

Didn't you get one of those Devaliet things? You do know that you are supposed to go round the forums tut-tutting at all of us still using half a dozen boxes to make sound and wondering aloud about the inconvenience and clutter of 'legacy systems'? I think it's on page 37 of the manual. Somewhere near the back anyway.

Indeed. I used some of my pension lump sum to buy it, and very nice it is too. I'm also supposed to go on about how valve amps are full of distortion so can't be 'hifi' by definition. (To be fair 'legacy systems' is copyrighted by the AVI bloke who thinks we should all be using teeny-weeny active speakers). Anyway the clutter in our house is almost exclusively books. I should get a Kindle then I could tut-tut about 'dead trees' as well.

Audio Al

14-01-2019, 17:37

No you've been elevated to the rarified and honourable position of 'Super-daftee', as you've well earned that title... Martin, in comparison, is just playing at it, so is merely a 'daftee'!:D

Marco.

OK :D

jandl100

14-01-2019, 18:24

That, I believe, is where Jerry's at now, which shows he eventually got it right!

No, I don't think that's the correct way to look at it.

Over the years I tried enough gear, that with the excellent (for me) items I have now I wouldn't have anything more to learn by swapping in major new stuff, it would just be going over the same or very very similar ground again.

So I have kept "spare" preamp and have a choice of excellent (to me) solid state and valve power amps. I even have a spare pair of speakers (Podium panels) for the rare occasion when a short change from the MBLs feels right.

I really do not feel I have been forever searching with my box swapping, I've been exploring and learning, and genuinely enjoying the journey. No "boxswap angst" for me. And the "hifi space" there is to learn within is large so it's been a very enjoyable few decades of boxswapping. :)

Marco

14-01-2019, 18:50

No worries, Jerry That's cool. I respect and accept your summary of events:)

Marco.

Haselsh1

14-01-2019, 19:00

In any case getting 'neurotic' about your hi-fi system is clearly a first world problem for people whose lives are so perfect they've got nothing more serious to worry about.

Or possibly people who suffer from extreme anxiety as is similar to those who suffer road rage.

Haselsh1

14-01-2019, 19:11

The only way, therefore, to come to any meaningful conclusions about specific valves, is to use them in an amp that's been designed, from the ground up, to get the most from the output valves it's been built to optimise.

Marco.

Marco, a very sound (geddit) statement. Makes a lot of sense as I know that Prima Luna valve poweramps are designed to be used with EL34's. Yes they are compatible with KT88, 120 and 150 et al but they are designed for EL34 usage.

Cheers for that. One satisfied customer.

Marco

14-01-2019, 19:20

No worries, mate. I can safely predict that if your amp has been designed around EL34s, putting KT88s in will simply result in a different, but not necessarily overall better sound.

Now if Prima Luna make a dedicated KT88 amp, then it could be a different matter...;)

Marco.

AJSki2fly

15-01-2019, 06:37

Firstly, I'm not confusing anything. I'm simply commenting on the subject, based on my experiences, and relating how it has *directly affected people I know*, and so stand by every word I wrote. Interesting that you thought I was referring to you... Did you think you fitted the profile?:eyebrows:;)

I can assure you that you weren't in my mind, and neither was Roy. Jerry, I've already discussed. We've known each other for years, I've met him a few times and visited him at his home, so by now I'd like to think I've got a reasonable handle on his 'hi-fi habits'. However, he's free to correct me if I'm wrong!

This is rather like the recent discussion on retirement... There's nothing wrong with anything, *if* you ENJOY doing it, and it's FUN, hence why I've highlighted the above. Therefore, whether you're working into your dotage doing a job you love, or dicking around with hi-fi gear for the same length of time, and you can afford it and it MAKES YOU HAPPY, there is no argument.

My argument here, as indeed it was on the retirement/pension thread, solely refers to the behaviour of those who claim to be doing something that they enjoy, as you've outlined, BUT deep down are far from happy or having fun. And trust me, in terms of hi-fi enthusiasts, there are plenty of them about. I've met them not only on forums, but in real life at bakeoffs, hi-fi shows, and sold to them when I worked in the industry, so they *do* exist.

Also, you're right, hoarding excessive collections of records or CDs, or any other form of physical music media, largely for the sake of it and gaining no real pleasure from the exercise, is just as bad as doing the same with hi-fi equipment. It doesn't matter WHAT it is you're collecting or doing. If it's no longer fun, and worse causing you financial hardship or affecting your marriage/relationship, then it's time to think about stopping and doing something else!

Anyway, Sean's Gallery thread isn't really the place for this sort of discussion, so we should leave it there. I only commented, as I did, because Sean had indulged in a little introspection, which appeared to have been beneficial for him, as he's now in a happy place, when once he wasn't, and I think that others could learn from his experience:)

Marco.

Loving the paragraphs[emoji3]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Marco

15-01-2019, 07:58

:lolsign:

See how easy it is, sweety?:D

Makes what you've written *so* much easier on the eye, and encourages folks to read it, rather than ignore it...;)

Marco.