DVD transport

[nbaptista]

Hello,
I´m using a DVD Denon 1740 as a transport with my Cambridge Dac Magic and I wonder if I should keep it or buy instead an old cd player like a Rotel RCD 555 and using it as a transport.The Denon so far seems a good transport,and I have the chance to get spare parts in case of transport failure.Most old cd players are not serviced anymore,that´s the problem.So if anyone has experience with DVD transports please tell me something.I think all the new cd players have now DVD transports,no?

[StanleyB]

The 1740 uses a PCM1780 series DAC chip, which I must say is an outstanding performer. I would be more inclined to mod the Denon myself, and actually considered doing just that at one stage.

[nbaptista]

The 1740 uses a PCM1780 series DAC chip, which I must say is an outstanding performer.
And the transport?Is OK?

[nbaptista]

I would be more inclined to mod the Denon myself, and actually considered doing just that at one stage.
I did not understand quite well,my english is not so good,you may explain better?Mod the Denon(improve?)how?I have bougth the Denon to use it as transport?If I aḿ using the Dac Magic why do I need the Denon Dac?

[StanleyB]

The 1740 has a DAC chip that can deliver 2V rms, which means it can be modified to be used as a passive output DAC. So there is no opamp etc in the signal path. The reproduction from it would be superior to the Dacmagic in that case. But you do need the correct knowledge to do such a mod.

[nbaptista]

The reproduction from it would be superior to the Dacmagic in that case. But you do need the correct knowledge to do such a mod.

Ah,OK Stanley.Now I understand :doh:
I´m asking a friend in order to make the mod if possible(I don´t know if is able to do it)
But what aboiut the Denon transport,is it OK?I have had a Marantz DV 3002 which I bought 2nd hand,but I didn´t like it
Anyway,I´m using the Dac mainly with the PC as a source
Or should I buy a 2nd cd player?I have a friend selling a Rotel RCD 955.

[StanleyB]

My main transport is a Denon. When you walk into a radio station studio you'll find that more often than not the transport they use to play discs are Denon.

[nbaptista]

A few dealers told me that DVD´s aren´t reliable as a transport.They suggest buying a cd player instead,because is more specific.I don´t know if they are right.Isn´t true that most new cd players use DVD´s transports?I think just a few firms ourdays produce CD transports,am I right or no?

[retro]

A few dealers told me that DVD´s aren´t reliable as a transport.They suggest buying a cd player instead,because is more specific.I don´t know if they are right.Isn´t true that most new cd players use DVD´s transports?I think just a few firms ourdays produce CD transports,am I right or no?

It is so relative (reliability).But the truth is that many companies use CD-ROM or DVD-ROM these days.Even the most expensive ones.CD-ROM is almost not produce anymore.CD transports is another pair of shoes :)
Regards,

[nbaptista]

CD transports is another pair of shoes :)
Regards,

Can you be more specific or what you mean?I´m not a native speaker,sorry.There are differences between DVD and CD transports?

[retro]

Can you be more specific or what you mean?I´m not a native speaker,sorry.There are differences between DVD and CD transports?
Me neither :) . I'm from Croatia.

What I thought was the huge difference between DVD-ROM which is supposed to be used in computers (but it is also used by many Lexicon,Classe... ),and for example Philips CD-Pro2 Transport used by let say Mark Levinson....
CD-PRO2 is superior to those DVD-ROM based CD player.
Hope you understand me now.
Regards,

[Marco]

Indeed, Robert :)

Nuno, you'll never hear CD properly on any DVD player, as the transport mechanism and internal electronics do not optimise audio-only playback.

Therefore the answer to your question:


I´m using a DVD Denon 1740 as a transport with my Cambridge Dac Magic and I wonder if I should keep it or buy instead an old cd player like a Rotel RCD 555 and using it as a transport.


...is 'yes'. Buy the Rotel, or another classic player like it from the days when CD transport quality mattered! Just make sure that replacement mechanisms are still available, as many aren't.

Another one to look out for is the Teac VRDS-T1. This is a CD transport only, built like a tank, and would be ideal to use with your DAC Magic.

Here's an interesting article, which shows the superb build quality of the TEAC (and VRDS mechanism), necessary for optimising CD-only playback. Observe the high standard of engineering, which is what accurate CD replay is all about!!

http://www.lampizator.eu/lampizator/REFERENCES/TEAC-T1/VRDS-T1.html

As for DACs, you should be using a Caiman! ;)

Marco.

[dave2010]

Great article about the TEAC. I assume you read it :-)

[Stratmangler]

Very illuminating article about the Teac - you should read it sometime Marco:lolsign:

[nbaptista]

I´m testing a Yamaha CDX 593 as a transport and right now the systems seems much more musical and the soundstage improved too.The timbre is much better
Why didn´t I tested the Yamaha before buyng the Denon?:doh:

[Marco]

Very illuminating article about the Teac - you should read it sometime Marco

No - it was merely to illustrate how well-engineered the Teac was! Why did I miss something? :lol:

Marco.

[Stratmangler]

No - it was merely to illustrate how well-engineered the Teac was! Why did I miss something? :lol:

Marco.

Well the guy did keep going on about how well put together the TEAC VRDS mechanism was NOT !!!!:lolsign:

This had me reaching for the incontinence pads

This player, despite the fact that compared to real sony players - is 10 x overpriced and it has a fake VRDS - plays nice. With the clock and good digital cable (Siltech) it serves as a decent transport. It sounds fine and is VERY reliable.
Having said that - if you need a good transport - buy something better. Leave this one to naive people who know no better.
We, real men, choose real women, leaving the supermodells to the guys without imagination.

[Ali Tait]

Yep! You need to read the article mate. :doh:

[Marco]

Hahahahahahahaha........! I merely searched quickly for a photo of the T1 and that came up first :lol:

Well - the guy clearly doesn't know what he's talking about (or is for some reason biased), as the VRDS-T1 is one of the best affordable dedicated CD transports around!!

Marco.

[Stratmangler]

Hahahahahahahaha........! I merely seached quickly for a photo of the T1 and that came up first :lol:

Well - the guy clearly doesn't know what he's talking about (or is for some reason biased), as the VRDS-T1 is one of the best affordable dedicated CD transports around!!

Marco.

I shall quote further

After removing - the bridge turns out to be a FAKE ONE. It is made of recycled car bumpers and has NO MECHANICAL ROLE. It is a mask, a decor. It is a push-up bra equivalent - to optically fool naive men who tend to "buy by eyes".

Under the rocket science bridge we reveal the steel piece of plate - not VERY RIGID for sure.
The motor is a standard Sony motor - a 3 dollar brushed Mabuchi from China.



I'd say this man knows his onions - more to the point he's not taken in by fake "quality engineering".

I was very taken aback by the article to be honest - I thought there was more substance to Teac's "engineering prowess" - they certainly know how to perform sleight of hand :eek:

As the chap in the article did say, it is a good transport, but very overpriced.

[leo]

looking at the spdif circuitry of various CD and DVD players I'm not surprised a lot make shite sources for an external dac. I've seen some CDP's fitted with excellent lasers and transport mech's let down with extremely poor spdif circuit on the output :doh:

I wouldn't touch a lot of cheapo DVD players, they tend to have all the important stuff crammed into one large integrated circuit which tends to be compromised , of course thats not to say all are shite, just quite a lot :)

[Marco]

Hi Chris,

The guy's entitled to his opinion. I think his point is that the VRDS mechanism isn't the be-all-and-end-all its reputation suggests, rather than it being overall of poor quality.

All I can say is that the T1 is one of the best mid-priced transports I've used - and I've used many different types in my time at various prices. It's certainly better for playing CDs than any bloody DVD player (or CDP using a DVD-ROM mech!), which is the point I was making to Nuno.


As the chap in the article did say, it is a good transport, but very overpriced.


As they're discontinued now, you can pick them up for around £100 on Ebay; hardly "very overpriced" ;)

I can guarantee that anyone using one of these to play CDs (in conjunction with a quality DAC) in place of a DVD player, or such like, would notice a significant sonic improvement :)

Marco.

[Stratmangler]

Marco

I was more amused that your evidence was more akin to shooting yourself in the foot than supporting your advice.:lolsign:

I used to have a Pioneer PDS703 - had the stable platter mechanism, and the chap didn't have a very high opinion of them either.
I quite liked the CD player, but eventually it went.
A friend bought it and it's still giving sterling service.

If the T1 can be bought for £100 on ebay then it is a bargain.
And the mechanism should be cheap to buy if it needs to be replaced, after all it's a cheap Sony, innit ?;)

[leo]

The PDS-703 was the first cdp I brought, it was also the first cdp I modded.
Learn't a lot from that unit

[Marco]

I was more amused that your evidence was more akin to shooting yourself in the foot than supporting your advice.:lolsign:


Lol - yes, that's what happens when you're trying to do too many things at the one time!


I used to have a Pioneer PDS703 - had the stable platter mechanism, and the chap didn't have a very high opinion of them either.


That's another example of a decent transport mech - simply ignore the uninitiated!


If the T1 can be bought for £100 on ebay then it is a bargain.
And the mechanism should be cheap to buy if it needs to be replaced, after all it's a cheap Sony, innit ?;)

Aye!

When I bought my T-1 brand new from Richer Sounds in 1997, along with its matching DAC, the DT-1, it cost me £550 for them both. Therefore, I don't think that the T-1 was ever overly expensive on its own. As a combo it was very good and I used it for a few years before entering into the world of Naim....

Where the VRDS mechanism gets expensive is when the likes of the Neo version (built to a much higher spec) is incorporated into players like the Esoterics - then you're talking big bucks!

Marco.

[Stratmangler]

I rather liked the funkiness of putting the disc label side down on the platter - non unlike the ceremony involved with playing vinyl.

The PSU IIRC was a small switched mode affair, was it not ?
The only mod I made to mine was to change the fitted mains cable with some heavy duty Arctic flex - that brought quite an improvement.

What mods did you get around to doing on yours, Leo ?

[Stratmangler]

Summat I should have added to my last post - the Pioneer is f***ing great feeding a Caiman with bits (I took my Caiman round to the friend who bought the Pioneer off me).

That said, I'm not going back to playing CD's again - I'm sticking firmly to using Squeezebox as transport.
CD's are a rip once and stick in a storage box proposition for me now;)

[leo]

I rather liked the funkiness of putting the disc label side down on the platter - non unlike the ceremony involved with playing vinyl.

The PSU IIRC was a small switched mode affair, was it not ?
The only mod I made to mine was to change the fitted mains cable with some heavy duty Arctic flex - that brought quite an improvement.

What mods did you get around to doing on yours, Leo ?

Mine had a weedy little transformer in it so I knocked up an external psu with a couple of E/I cores I robbed out of another unit.
I then tweaked the output stage, altered the LPF on the output of the dac and used a higher bandwidth op-amp , did some stuff to the rest of the output stage , cleaned up the decoupling and fitted one of the early Trichord clocks

It sounded way better than it had any right to, thats when the modding bug hit :lol:
I still got a Pioneer PDS904 in the loft and will give that a good going over one day

[Stratmangler]

Mine had a weedy little transformer in it so I knocked up an external psu with a couple of E/I cores I robbed out of another unit.
I then tweaked the output stage, altered the LPF on the output of the dac and used a higher bandwidth op-amp , did some stuff to the rest of the output stage , cleaned up the decoupling and fitted one of the early Trichord clocks

It sounded way better than it had any right too, thats when the modding bug hit :lol:
I still got a Pioneer PDS904 in the loft and will give that a good going over one day

So a full engine rebuild then, compared to my oil & filter change.:lol:

Isn't the PDS-904 the machine Trichord used as the foundation for the Genesis ?

[leo]

So a full engine rebuild then, compared to my oil & filter change.:lol:

Isn't the PDS-904 the machine Trichord used as the foundation for the Genesis ?

A mate of mine was shocked when he heard it, I later gave it him when I moved onto other things

Not sure about the Genesis tbh mate (it could be based on the 904) but I have heard an Eikos which was a highly modded 904 so know what its capable of :)

[Marco]

Yes the Eikos is sublime, particularly a judiciously modified one! :eyebrows:

Going back briefly to the Teac........

I was just reading the letters page in this month's HFW, and came across this reply from David Price in reference to a letter asking about budget CDP/DAC options and whether he should use his DVD player as a CD transport:


As far as front ends go, if you don't want to go the way of your DVD spinner and a modern DAC, then why not try a retro spinner?

In your part of the world [New Zealand] a Teac VRDS-10 or VRDS-20 would be a nice way to spend a couple of hundred quid, or try the transport-only version, the VRDS-T1, plus a Musical Fidelity V-DAC, as the ultimate budget new and old combination.

These Teacs are superbly built, should easily outperform a DVD-spinner as a transport and have the benefit of spares support.


Great minds think alike! ;)

Marco.

[nbaptista]

Guys,
and between the Yamaha CDX 593 and a new one like Cambridge 340 C which should I choose?The price is the same for both .BTW,the Yamaha is new,it is an old stock

[Stratmangler]

Guys,
and between the Yamaha CDX 593 and a new one like Cambridge 340 C which should I choose?The price is the same for both .BTW,the Yamaha is new,it is an old stock

http://www.hi-fiworld.co.uk/hfw/bgcdplayers.html

[nbaptista]

This is what they say about the Yamaha 593
"Lean and up-front, the Yamaha is involving on Rock but can sound rough."

[nbaptista]

Now that I heard the Yamaha I think I have to listen the Cambridge,and see the differences for myself.
What I think about the Yamaha?Well is better than the Denon DVD and there is no contest that a dedicated cd player is the way to go.But the Yamaha is not so good,the sound is not natural and is a bit artificial,on a few Jazz records.To play Rock and Indie is OK,but I have to listen the Cambridge,because I think that this shortcoming is a problem of Yamaha as a transport!

[retro]

Be sure to listen to the CD player mechanism.The sound of the laser also.At the time when starting to read especially.

I must share with you my worst hifi nightmare.

Two years ago I bought CA DVD 540V2.New one.The idea was to use it as a transport (all in one).From the beginning there was a problem with reading some types of CD media.As in tango, a one forward two back. :) Skipping, not reading,... various errors,and a faint sound of the laser trying to read the information.Twice I sent it to an authorized service,and...and...nothing.Couple mails to CA.No response.So much driven me mad that I wanted to throw it away from the balcony.I finally sold it for a donor, a third of the price.Cambridge Audio will never come to my house again.

I know that these are apples and pears,but I simply had to write it down.

[nbaptista]

Be sure to listen to the CD player mechanism.The sound of the laser also.At the time when starting to read especially.

I must share with you my worst hifi nightmare.



I know that these are apples and pears,but I simply had to write it down

I have all the weekend the transport with me.Thank you for the advice,because this Yamaha is an old stock

[Peter Galbavy]

Not wishing to sidetrack the OP's thread but anyone got an opinion on my Denon 3930 as an SACD player ? I currently use it as my upscaling DVD player in the TV room but I have too many SACDs to not listen to them properly and while I can play the Redbook layers through the Touch and the Caiman I am wondering if I should give the 3930 a go in the stereo dept. ?

[nbaptista]

Well,I bougth a Cambridge 340 C and I´m using it as a transport!Much better results than the Yamaha.Now the sound is more transparent,fluid and faster!
Yep,we shoult try before buying!But thanks all for the support!:guitar: