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SteveW
05-04-2010, 21:12
Just to blow away the cobwebs...
Amazing 'installation' 100 cast iron figures of the artist set over 3 kms of shore north of Liverpool.

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/DSC_0022.jpg
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/DSC_0026.jpg
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/DSC_0045.jpg
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/DSC_0056-1.jpg
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/DSC_0061.jpg

aquapiranha
05-04-2010, 23:13
My job used to take me to Crosby nearly every weekday, so I have seen these many times. Often the locals will dress them in old clothes which is quite funny.

Marco
05-04-2010, 23:21
The second last one is really creepy looking and would act as a great basis for a Dr Who monster! :eek:

Marco.

The Grand Wazoo
06-04-2010, 05:41
I'm sure you can get some sort of ointment for a nasty rash like that.

SteveW
06-04-2010, 09:29
Without getting all arty farty about it...I love the lines these things make in this landscape

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/Gormley/DSC_0023.jpg
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/Gormley/DSC_0068.jpg

and I'd be hiding behind the sofa at this one !!
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/Gormley/DSC_0047.jpg

Marco
06-04-2010, 09:48
Very creepy indeed, Steve... Things like that are much scarier, IMO, than 'monsters' on sci-fi programmes created from any number of special effects! :eek:

That's what Doctor Who lacks now - imagination! Did anyone see the first episode of the new series at Easter? What a load of old shite! The story lines have gone far too 'kiddie-fied' (biased to suit kids) and lost all of their scare factor they once had in the golden era of Jon Pertwee and Tom Baker....

Marco.

Spectral Morn
06-04-2010, 16:35
Very creepy indeed, Steve... Things like that are much scarier, IMO, than 'monsters' on sci-fi programmes created from any number of special effects! :eek:

That's what Doctor Who lacks now - imagination! Did anyone see the first episode of the new series at Easter? What a load of old shite! The story lines have gone far too 'kiddie-fied' (biased to suit kids) and lost all of their scare factor they once had in the golden era of Jon Pertwee and Tom Baker....

Marco.


There were elements of the story which bugged me big time and sadly the ghost of Russell T seemed to be haunting things. I could list what was wrong, quite a lot but there were good elements to it.It is only the first episode so lets see where it goes from here.

The thing is, this is a children's TV show first and foremost, as it was in the sixties (children were imho more sophisticated then) and we who grew up with it, from back then watch it now for what reason ? For me I like sci-fi, Dr Who along with classic Star Trek was my first fix as a child so I have fond memories of those shows and some of the stories hold up to adult viewing and some don't. I therefore like to keep an eye on such series just to see what they are up to now. Every so often, a story like The Girl in The Fireplace and Blink turn up and raise the bar for sci-fi in general and not just because its DR Who. I hope there are at least a few great stories this series but I fear for the Silurians already who have had a makeover and no longer look like they should do :(

Also why bring a loan Cyberman back ? time to kill them off and bring back the originals.

Daleks in WW2 good idea but in England ? I myself have started a story based in an alternative universe (based on DR Who) but set in Germany just at the time of the attempt on Hitler's life in the bunker. The metal pepper pots are involved and their goal is to take over the Reich and then the world. Imagine ME 262 jets with Dalek disruptors fitted, as well as new Panzer and Tiger tanks shaped more like large Daleks and the new flying special weapons Daleks zipping across battlefields. The allied armies fall in their droves beaten back by a new revitalised Germany until they are offered help from an alien source.....?

Hitler himself is a mind controlled puppet as is his command staff, all dancing to a Dalek tune......I have been working on this for a very long time..just for fun you understand.

Torchwood was supposed to be adult DR Who, but failed miserably for the most part though the story Children of Earth was very good imho having shades of Quatermas about it...now there is/was an excellent TV series and the movies are very good as well.

The Gormley statues remind me a wee bit of the creatures from the Claws of Axos before they grow tentacles.


Regards D S D L

Marco
06-04-2010, 19:48
Good post, Neil - I agree with your sentiments. This bit for me though hits the nail on the head:


The thing is, this is a children's TV show first and foremost, as it was in the sixties (children were imho more sophisticated then)


Indeed - and I think the difference in the way Dr Who was then, and how it is now, comes down to exactly that point - and the writers in the old days catered for it (greater audience sophistication)!

But it's not just the downfall in standards of Dr Who... Look at Star Trek, and how it was in the days of Spock and Captain Kirk, compared to the modern version. It's night and day in terms of overall storyline quality and acting.

Marco.

Spectral Morn
06-04-2010, 20:05
Good post, Neil - I agree with your sentiments. This bit for me though hits the nail on the head:



Indeed - and I think the difference in the way Dr Who was then, and how it is now, comes down to exactly that point - and the writers in the old days catered for it (greater audience sophistication)!

But it's not just the downfall in standards of Dr Who... Look at Star Trek, and how it was in the days of Spock and Captain Kirk, compared to the modern version. It's night and day in terms of overall storyline quality and acting.

Marco.

Classic Trek had fantastic Sci-Fi writers writing for them Harlan Ellison, Jerome Bixby, Noman Spinrad, DC Fontana, Robert Block..I could go on. All of these writers were in their day and still are masters of the genre. Its like my comment in the other thread about DR Who the original stories are serious works of fiction not jokes, and written by quality authors. RussellT is not imho a good writer never mind a great one.

I agree about modern Trek, though there are some great stories among the spin off series.


Regards D S D L

Alex_UK
06-04-2010, 20:43
I'm not sure kids are any less sophisticated these days - but they are certainly more de-sensitised. I think that could be part of the issue - they are exposed to CGI in every film, computer games are ultra realistic, and they are bombarded with it all 24/7. When we were kids, it was a lot more to do with our imagination - less is more - plant the seed in the mind and the imagination will do the rest - if you get to see the gore and horror in all the detail the imagination has nothing to do.

Macca
06-04-2010, 21:22
What about Space 1999, UFO and Blakes Seven? Why not bring back one of those for the 'mature' - ahem - sci fi fan. There's a pitch for a new series of UFO somewhere on t'internet, remember reading it years ago. Keep the story quality of the original series and add modern production values.

BBC reckon they are saving 600 million scrapping Radio 6 - how many TV shows can you make for that (I know - not a lot - but more than a few).

Neil, agree a couple of the new DW have been pretty good and in the tradition of the series, but only a couple.

Joe
06-04-2010, 21:56
I'm not sure kids are any less sophisticated these days - but they are certainly more de-sensitised. I think that could be part of the issue - they are exposed to CGI in every film, computer games are ultra realistic, and they are bombarded with it all 24/7. When we were kids, it was a lot more to do with our imagination - less is more - plant the seed in the mind and the imagination will do the rest - if you get to see the gore and horror in all the detail the imagination has nothing to do.

I think kids today are much like kids ever were; I for one don't buy the 'they were more sophisticated' stuff. Was 'Tiswas' sophisticated?!

Spectral Morn
06-04-2010, 22:03
What about Space 1999, UFO and Blakes Seven? Why not bring back one of those for the 'mature' - ahem - sci fi fan. There's a pitch for a new series of UFO somewhere on t'internet, remember reading it years ago. Keep the story quality of the original series and add modern production values.

BBC reckon they are saving 600 million scrapping Radio 6 - how many TV shows can you make for that (I know - not a lot - but more than a few).

Neil, agree a couple of the new DW have been pretty good and in the tradition of the series, but only a couple.

First season 1999 was good with a few fantastic stories (Season 2 is crap). I loved UFO still do. Blake's Seven season 1 only for me after that poor imho.

I am aware of the UFO re-boot but I fear if it does happen it may end up being crap.


Regards D S D L

Alex_UK
06-04-2010, 23:17
Was 'Tiswas' sophisticated?!

What is this "Tiswas" of which you speak? Excuse me, need to make a telephone call... 01 811 8055 'hello? yes, I'd like to swap Tin Can Alley for an Eagle Eyed Action Man & Buckaroo, please...?'

Marco
06-04-2010, 23:38
Wasn't that 'Swap Shop'? :)

'Tiswas', for me, is memories of the Phantom Flan-Flinger, folk doing the 'dying fly', and kids being pulled up from the floor with their ears by Chris Tarrant - all huge fun! :eyebrows:

Marco.

Joe
07-04-2010, 07:41
Wasn't that 'Swap Shop'? :)

'Tiswas', for me, is memories of the Phantom Flan-Flinger, folk doing the 'dying fly', and kids being pulled up from the floor with their ears by Chris Tarrant - all huge fun! :eyebrows:

Marco.

And all so sophisticated!

I'm 'Crackerjack' vintage meself.

Joe
07-04-2010, 07:45
What is this "Tiswas" of which you speak? Excuse me, need to make a telephone call... 01 811 8055 'hello? yes, I'd like to swap Tin Can Alley for an Eagle Eyed Action Man & Buckaroo, please...?'

Both Tiswas and Swapshop were after my time, but I've heard so much about them from D-list celebs on 'I Love the 80s' and such that it seem like I actually watched them!

Marco
07-04-2010, 09:01
And all so sophisticated!


Lol - indeed!

Although, the point Neil was making (which I agree with) is that, in general, the children of the 60s and 70s, which the old Dr Who series was aimed at, were of a more discerning mentality in terms of their appreciation of sci-fi than in general are today's kids (other than their love of computer-generated special effects). As a (mainly) 70s & 80s child, and sci-fi lover, I certainly came into that category, and can thus note how standards have fallen in terms of acting (to a degree) and most certainly the quality of script writing.

As Neil and I have already covered in some detail, today's Dr Who series (and the likes of Star Trek) is more 'style over substance' and lacks the serious and imaginative storylines of the old programme writers. However, one cannot blame the current script writers for simply catering for the rather different demands of today's audience.


I'm 'Crackerjack' vintage meself.

I watched that, too! However, as I spent most of my teens in the 1980s, it's mainly the teens kids shows then that stick in my mind :)

Marco.

Stratmangler
07-04-2010, 12:38
I think kids today are much like kids ever were; I for one don't buy the 'they were more sophisticated' stuff. Was 'Tiswas' sophisticated?!

Was Tiswas aimed at kids ?
No-one told me. Seemed to me that adults got more out of it.

Spectral Morn
07-04-2010, 13:17
Was Tiswas aimed at kids ?
No-one told me. Seemed to me that adults got more out of it.

Indeed .....Sally James ;)


Regards D S D L

Joe
07-04-2010, 18:26
Lol - indeed!

Although, the point Neil was making (which I agree with) is that, in general, the children of the 60s and 70s, which the old Dr Who series was aimed at, were of a more discerning mentality in terms of their appreciation of sci-fi than in general are today's kids (other than their love of computer-generated special effects). As a (mainly) 70s & 80s child, and sci-fi lover, I certainly came into that category, and can thus note how standards have fallen in terms of acting (to a degree) and most certainly the quality of script writing.

As Neil and I have already covered in some detail, today's Dr Who series (and the likes of Star Trek) is more 'style over substance' and lacks the serious and imaginative storylines of the old programme writers. However, one cannot blame the current script writers for simply catering for the rather different demands of today's audience.


I haven't seen any post-Shatner Star Trek, so can't comment on that specifically, but I'd say that the best of sci-fi today (eg Buffy, Philip Pullman's books) is as good as anything that was around when I was a lad. Then, as now, there was plenty of dross around too.

Marco
12-04-2010, 13:27
Back to Dr Who.....

I looked out five DVDs of mine (which I will play later) from the old Tom Baker series (probably just edging the Jon Pertwee one as my favourite), with the following titles:

Horror of Fang Rock.

The Deadly Assasin.

Robots of Death.

City of Death.

Planet of Evil.

Can anyone spot the recurring theme there, which for me seems largely absent from the new series? ;)

....and then consider this question:

Is Dr Who designed to have the same 'scare factor' and dark, eerie, chilling and forboding atmosphere it once had - and if not, why not??

I don't know about other fans here, but that's what I watched it for, not to be 'amused' with special effects, inane humour and romantic interludes....

Marco.

DrMartin
12-04-2010, 19:16
Can't say I'm a massive long-term fan of Dr Who but I was around when the originals were shown and they were exactly as you describe Marco.

I totally agree with the sentiments expressed regarding the style over substance of current programmes although I think banality has crept in just about everywhere these days. It's all part of the whole "ooh, we mustn't upset anybody" nonsense that pervades everything and the evidence for that on TV is the constant warnings about content we now have to listen to. We certainly didn't have all that pathetic nonsense in the 60s and 70s.

Spectral Morn
12-04-2010, 21:19
Back to Dr Who.....

I looked out five DVDs of mine (which I will play later) from the old Tom Baker series (probably just edging the Jon Pertwee one as my favourite), with the following titles:

Horror of Fang Rock.

The Deadly Assasin.

Robots of Death.

City of Death.

Planet of Evil.

Can anyone spot the recurring theme there, which for me seems largely absent from the new series? ;)

....and then consider this question:

Is Dr Who designed to have the same 'scare factor' and dark, eerie, chilling and forboding atmosphere it once had - and if not, why not??

I don't know about other fans here, but that's what I watched it for, not to be 'amused' with special effects, inane humour and romantic interludes....

Marco.

All classic stories...my fave of those would be The Horror of Fang Rock which has a real HP Lovecraft vibe..despite the fact the aliens are the feared foes of the Sontarians the Reutans and not some other cosmic horror. Must say here the Reutan design is a bit naff as is their spaceship but the story is excellent with plenty of tension and scares....so that makes up for naffness elsewhere.

So far with the new Who only Blink (very Lovecraft), Girl in the Fire Place and the episode with them trapped in a shuttle bus on the surface of a very alien and hostile planet with a disembodied creature (can't remember the name of that one) have any quality.

Next week the Daleks are back....I hope they get a decent story...some how I doubt it. The new Dr is very good but the first two stories are piles of steaming crap imho.


Regards D S D L

goraman
13-04-2010, 02:34
Those barnical Bobs really creep me out.
From the looks of the last one the water is really cold.
Could they be linked some how in the sea water to create a battery?

The Grand Wazoo
13-04-2010, 07:38
I feel for Steve - his original post has been well and truly clobbered by all of this talk of Doctor Who - you lot need a thread dedicated to that so us grown ups can get on with proper culture.

So here are some photos of sculptures in Grizedale Forest, Cumbria to try to get this thread something like back on track.


http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/8786/dscf1182c.jpg

http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/2751/dscf1178m.jpg

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/6750/dscf1179c.jpg

http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/9551/dscf1181.jpg

http://img576.imageshack.us/img576/7302/dscf1151.jpg

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/5135/dscf1172x.jpg

http://img576.imageshack.us/img576/1264/dscf1173.jpg

Barry
13-04-2010, 07:45
I feel for Steve - his original post has been well and truly clobbered by all of this talk of Doctor Who - you lot need a thread dedicated to that so us grown ups can get on with proper culture.

So here are some photos of sculptures in Grizedale Forest, Cumbria to try to get this thread something like back on track.


Whilst I'm a follower of the more recent Dr Who series, I agree with you Chris, this is thread creep. It ought to have a dedicated thread.

Regards

Barry
13-04-2010, 12:48
At the risk of prolonging this 'hijacked' thread, I ought to point out that the latest Radio Times, has a Neil-friendly cover. There for your delectation is a a resident of New Skaro, decked out in party colours. You can choose which colour - I'm not letting on which one I chose.

'Vote Dalek'

Regards

SteveW
13-04-2010, 15:17
I feel for Steve - his original post has been well and truly clobbered by all of this talk of Doctor Who - you lot need a thread dedicated to that so us grown ups can get on with proper culture.

So here are some photos of sculptures in Grizedale Forest, Cumbria to try to get this thread something like back on track.



Yeah...buts its a brilliant hijack though. Makes me laugh when you can have this description of Anthony Gormleys Installation ..

"The work is seen as a poetic response to the individual and universal sentiments associated with emigration - sadness at leaving, but the hope of a new future in another place."

VS

Barnacle Bob.

:lolsign::lolsign::lolsign:

Love the pics of Grizedale though. Looks like that would be worth a day out and a picnic.