Cambridge 640P compared to Cambridge Duo or Trichord Dino for Dynavector DV-20X2L

[LateJunction]

I would appreciate any comments from anybody with experience of the Cambridge Duo (discussion of which seems to be notable by its absence) or Trichord Dino MM/MC Phono stage .

i'm currently supporting a DV-20X2 L (the low output version) on my Rega P9 via Cambridge Audio 640P MM/MC photo stage. Even so the signal presented to my Audiolab 8000Q/8000P combination is pretty low so I have to have the input gain selectors and volume control turned a long way up and hope that I don't switch to Radio or CD input by accident! The gain from the 640P is only 60 dB. in contrast that from the Duo is quoted at 65 dB; am I going to experience much of a difference in gain terms? Or would I be better looking at something like Trichord Dino, which apparently has 80 dB gain (maximum).

In quality terms, given the known limitations of my Mark I ears and the possible limitations of my amplification stages plus Spendor SP100 speakers from about 1985, am I going to detect any musical 'improvement' above the 640P by moving to a Duo or Trichord Dino? I have to say that I am somewhat skeptical about claims of 'huge gains in quality' by this sort of upgrade. Emperor's new clothes and that sort of thing.....

[Stryder5]

I think your 640p may be out of place in your system, the cartridge definitely deserves a better phono stage.

I had a 640p and wasn't too impressed.

There are good reports of the Tisbury Audio Domino which retails at around £150 new and I believe can be had on a sale or return basis. So you can try and you don't hear any enhancement at probably just postage costs you incurr.

There are many more expensive options, someone on here may have a used item for sale.

Only my view I'm sure you will get other comments.

Gary



I would appreciate any comments from anybody with experience of the Cambridge Duo (discussion of which seems to be notable by its absence) or Trichord Dino MM/MC Phono stage .

i'm currently supporting a DV-20X2 L (the low output version) on my Rega P9 via Cambridge Audio 640P MM/MC photo stage. Even so the signal presented to my Audiolab 8000Q/8000P combination is pretty low so I have to have the input gain selectors and volume control turned a long way up and hope that I don't switch to Radio or CD input by accident! The gain from the 640P is only 60 dB. in contrast that from the Duo is quoted at 65 dB; am I going to experience much of a difference in gain terms? Or would I be better looking at something like Trichord Dino, which apparently has 80 dB gain (maximum).

In quality terms, given the known limitations of my Mark I ears and the possible limitations of my amplification stages plus Spendor SP100 speakers from about 1985, am I going to detect any musical 'improvement' above the 640P by moving to a Duo or Trichord Dino? I have to say that I am somewhat skeptical about claims of 'huge gains in quality' by this sort of upgrade. Emperor's new clothes and that sort of thing.....

[walpurgis]

I think your 640p may be out of place in your system, the cartridge definitely deserves a better phono stage

I agree. The 640P is fine in a basic, budget system. But not good enough here.

[LateJunction]

I agree. The 640P is fine in a basic, budget system. But not good enough here.

Any suggestion of what is, within budget of about £400, give or take ?

[LateJunction]

I think your 640p may be out of place in your system, the cartridge definitely deserves a better phono stage.

I had a 640p and wasn't too impressed.

There are good reports of the Tisbury Audio Domino which retails at around £150 new and I believe can be had on a sale or return basis. So you can try and you don't hear any enhancement at probably just postage costs you incurr.

There are many more expensive options, someone on here may have a used item for sale.

Only my view I'm sure you will get other comments.

Gary

If I care to admit myself, I probably agree, which is why I am seeking to replace the 640P. Are you also saying that the CA Duo and the Trichord Dino are similarly not adequate for this cartridge, whereas something that retails at a much lower price is? (and yes, I know that retail price is not a definitve guide to performance).

[Stryder5]

What I'm trying to impart is that the skies the limit with phono pre-amps, will you hear the differences with your current setup is the question?

I'm not familiar with your speakers, but contentiously, not a lot has changed, some vintage (?) speakers are very well regarded. We are all different as to what we consider sounds better, or can hear the difference.

What I'm saying is that here's a way to try something different with minimal outlay. I am in no way connected with Tisbury but various reports indicate that it is good enough in very high level systems. Have a Google see what you can find, take some with a pinch of salt though.

If you have a dealer near that will let you have a demo, in your own system, in your own environment, some alternatives do it.

Only you can decide what you hear. What do you have to loose?

Many people consider their systems to be a status thing, having named items to quote as their cost, not necessarily SQA.

Sorry to go on:)

Gary



If I care to admit myself, I probably agree, which is why I am seeking to replace the 640P. Are you also saying that the CA Duo and the Trichord Dino are similarly not adequate for this cartridge, whereas something that retails at a much lower price is? (and yes, I know that retail price is not a definitve guide to performance).

[walpurgis]

I'm not familiar with your speakers

I am. They are a true classic and well suited for use in a seriously good system.

[Stryder5]

I am. They are a true classic and well suited for use in a seriously good system.

A definitive answer on your speakers:)

Gary

[struth]

Lots of good stages that will beat the Cambridge with that cart under 400, even new but second hand you will do better again.
You could put a wanted ad up for a stage under 400. Sure there will be a few the members will have assuming you will go second hand of course

[LateJunction]

I absolutely agree: the physics of speakers hasn't changed much in the nearly 60 years since I have been buying them. That's why I have stayed with my Spendor SA2 (1981) in one room and Spendor SP100 (ca. 1985) as the main ones. Of course others would say that I stay with them only to avoid the loss of face that would be implied by changing them! However, I am the least status conscious person I know, possessing nothing flashy, so the label or price on a bit of kit is far less important to me than the way it performs..

In that regard it is very difficult to know, through the services of Google, how a device will perform in my environment, with my ears. But I do know enough to know that a pinch of salt is the bare minimum: bucketfuls are required to 'neutralise' the torrent of arrant cods-wallop, self-aggrandisement and barely concealed 'product placement' that is found within so many reviews. More-over, the whole hifi industry seems steeped in an 'Emperor's new clothes' syndrome and an almost fanatical religious belief in marketing propaganda. It all got too much for me once when a hifi dealer was comparing my £40 (purchased used) 640P with a £1200 alternative in an A-B test and got the two mixed up!

I am inclined to give the Tisbury a home demo test under their 14 day money back offer.


What I'm trying to impart is that the skies the limit with phono pre-amps, will you hear the differences with your current setup is the question?

I'm not familiar with your speakers, but contentiously, not a lot has changed, some vintage (?) speakers are very well regarded. We are all different as to what we consider sounds better, or can hear the difference.

What I'm saying is that here's a way to try something different with minimal outlay. I am in no way connected with Tisbury but various reports indicate that it is good enough in very high level systems. Have a Google see what you can find, take some with a pinch of salt though.


Many people consider their systems to be a status thing, having named items to quote as their cost, not necessarily SQA.

Gary

[LateJunction]

Excellent suggestion.



Lots of good stages that will beat the Cambridge with that cart under 400, even new but second hand you will do better again.
You could put a wanted ad up for a stage under 400. Sure there will be a few the members will have assuming you will go second hand of course

[walpurgis]

Graham Slee products are available for home trial. I believe you have to register on their forum first. I've had some very nice sounds from Slee phono stages. I don't know what MC models they offer currently though.

[Stryder5]

There is of course our own forum member Firebottle's OTP, If he's still making them.

Gary

[Natara]

I use a Trichord Dino/NCPSU with a Dynavector 20x2L and it is a fantastic combination I have never tried just the Dino without the psu but I would imagine it would sound great. A cartridge as good as the 20x2 really deserves a decent phono amp.

[hifi_dave]

The Rothwell Rialto is excellent and very reasonably priced.