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Bigman80
29-04-2018, 11:12
Hi All,

A few of us have decided to try and put together a Phonostage bakeoff in the Stoke area. This is going to be a one day event so early-ish start and we can carry on till late. Venue will be the Hotel used for the MiBO event last year. More details on this will follow.

Date: TBC (MAY/JUNE)

This is primarily going to be an AoS gathering but we've got a couple of folks from LH and TAS by special invite.

The List of possible phonostages in attendance are:

LDA Jfet - on loan from MCRU
LDS - on loan from MCRU
Aurorasound Vida - MartinT (TAS)
Audio detail NV-06 - LH member
Vivant - Firebottle
Wizard - Bigman80's DIY jobbie
Croft 25 - Jimbo

We are VERY keen to get a Paradise phonostage in attendance. If anyone would like to bring one please let me know.

I also know there's a Tom Evans mastergroove owner on this forum too [emoji6]

Any phonostage is welcome DIY, Unusual or otherwise.

System used will likely be selected from the following components:-

Technics SP10 MK2 with Kontrapunkt b.
Slagle AVC passive pre
Firebottle Monoblocks/ Krell power amp
JMLabs speakers

Again, if anyone has a better component for the system and wants to attend, let me know.

This event is open to any AOS member but space will be available for any MOD or site owner that wishes to attend.

Cheers

Oliver.

Yomanze
29-04-2018, 13:40
I assume you will be running MC carts?

Ali Tait
29-04-2018, 14:11
Have a Modwright I could bring, depending on the date chosen.

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 14:14
I assume you will be running MC carts?Yes. Don't really want to spent hours swapping carts and setups etc. You Could alway bring a second TT for MM if you wish but some stages only have MC capability

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 14:15
Have a Modwright I could bring, depending on the date chosen.Yes Ali, that would be fantastic! As soon as I have some potential dates I'll let everyone know

Cyrus
29-04-2018, 14:17
Cart alignment takes minutes, especially with a Dr Feickert or equivalent.

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 14:20
Cart alignment takes minutes, especially with a Dr Feickert or equivalent.Not sure I agree minutes

Ali Tait
29-04-2018, 14:33
Yes Ali, that would be fantastic! As soon as I have some potential dates I'll let everyone know

OK cool.

Cyrus
29-04-2018, 14:37
How are you going to decide which cart you are going to use then?

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 15:02
What do you mean? The TT and cart has been decided. Sp10 Mk2 and Kontrapunkt b. It's in the OP

If someone wants to bring a more extravagant MC cart then that will be on the SP10.

If someone wants bring a Second TT for a MM setup then fine but once setup whatever cart is on at the start, stays on. Not swapping until after the comparisons are done. Needs to have continuity.
How are you going to decide which cart you are going to use then?

Crackles
29-04-2018, 15:09
I might be up for this depending on the date. Could bring my Trichord Dino II if anyone's interested in hearing it.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

Cyrus
29-04-2018, 15:11
'System used will likely be selected from the following components' - doesn't say to me that it's finalised.

Listen, I'm only interested how a bake-off is developed because I wouldn't have the first clue how to satisfy a vast array of owners and equipment. It looks to me that you need to liaise with some veterans of the bake-off to make it a success; they will no doubt be able to advise you.

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 15:25
'System used will likely be selected from the following components' - doesn't say to me that it's finalised.

Listen, I'm only interested how a bake-off is developed because I wouldn't have the first clue how to satisfy a vast array of owners and equipment. It looks to me that you need to liaise with some veterans of the bake-off to make it a success; they will no doubt be able to advise you.You insinuate I haven't?

For any bake off a system must be used to wring the best out of the component you want to "Bake-Off" whilst there will be debate about amps, cartridges, speakers etc, there can be no debate about the Turntable being one of the finest DD TTs ever made.

The system is as flexible as I am and if someone has something that's better than anything listed in the "likely system" then I'm open to using it.

Nothing is finalised and I asking our membership for their input by suggesting that anyone who has anything better or exotic,that wants to attend and contribute a component to the "system" should bring it.

The one thing that must be "fixed" is that once the system has been finalised on the day, it remains intact for the duration of the Bakeoff for continuity and fairness.

Not sure how else you could go about setting a bake off up other than offering your own equipment until better is offered? Unless you owned the best stuff money could buy in the first place.

For instance, if Marco wishes to attend and brought his Valve amps, well, they'd be finalised now id have thought.

You're never going to satisfy all the members. For instance again, I went to a bakeoff which used Yammy NS1000m. I loved them, other didn't BUT that's the deal. Can't make everyone happy.

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 15:28
Absolutely! Bring it with you if the date suits.
I might be up for this depending on the date. Could bring my Trichord Dino II if anyone's interested in hearing it.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

Cyrus
29-04-2018, 15:31
Fire away then. As I said, I have no experience of how to arrange a bake-off.

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 15:32
Fire away then. As I said, I have no experience of how to arrange a bake-off.Get involved then! No harm having extra hands on deck. [emoji6]

Cyrus
29-04-2018, 15:35
I might do one day, but I'd be interested in hearing as many as humanly possible - entries from all manufacturers (professional and garden shed).

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 15:45
I might do one day, but I'd be interested in hearing as many as humanly possible - entries from all manufacturers (professional and garden shed).No worries. Set one up and you can do whatever your heart desires. Us garden shed phono stage builders love a bake off [emoji6]

Cyrus
29-04-2018, 15:53
Wow, hats off to you if you have built your own phono stage. It takes real skill to get it right - there are so many mediocre (or worse) efforts out there.

Firebottle
29-04-2018, 16:02
One thing that also needs continuity is the loading presented to the cartridge.
I believe Oli uses 220 ohm loading, that's fine for stages that are adjustable and have that particular choice fitted, or stages that use loading plugs that can be used.

If it turns out there are some stages that have, for instance, fixed 100 ohm loading then all adjustable stages need to be set to that.
Or the decision made that 100 ohm is the de-facto standard.
:)

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 16:10
Wow, hats off to you if you have built your own phono stage. It takes real skill to get it right - there are so many mediocre (or worse) efforts out there.I didn't do it all on my own. I had plenty of help!

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 16:17
I do use 220ohm. Hmm, 100 across the board sounds fair.
One thing that also needs continuity is the loading presented to the cartridge.
I believe Oli uses 220 ohm loading, that's fine for stages that are adjustable and have that particular choice fitted, or stages that use loading plugs that can be used.

If it turns out there are some stages that have, for instance, fixed 100 ohm loading then all adjustable stages need to be set to that.
Or the decision made that 100 ohm is the de-facto standard.
:)

YNWaN
29-04-2018, 16:29
On the contrary, it seems to me that Oliver has a pretty good idea as to what is required.

What may be worth doing, and somthing I have done when comparing phonostages, is to adjust the output of each one to be similar. All you need to do is quickly play a tone from a test record and measure the voltage at the speaker terminals (very easy to do). So, play the first stage at the volume you want, pop on the test record and measure at the speakers, make a note of the voltage. Then put on each subsequent stage and start by putting on the test record and setting the output voltage to the same as that for the first stage (by adjusting the volume control). This genuinely shouldn’t take more than a couple of mins each time.



'System used will likely be selected from the following components' - doesn't say to me that it's finalised.

Listen, I'm only interested how a bake-off is developed because I wouldn't have the first clue how to satisfy a vast array of owners and equipment. It looks to me that you need to liaise with some veterans of the bake-off to make it a success; they will no doubt be able to advise you.

Stryder5
29-04-2018, 16:33
On the contrary, it seems to me that Oliver has a pretty good idea as to what is required.

What may be worth doing, and somthing I have done when comparing phonostages, is to adjust the output of each one to be similar. All you need to do is quickly play a tone from a test record and measure the voltage at the speaker terminals (very easy to do). So, play the first stage at the volume you want, pop on the test record and measure at the speakers, make a note of the voltage. Then put on each subsequent stage and start by putting on the test record and setting the output voltage to the same as that for the first stage (by adjusting the volume control). This genuinely shouldn’t take more than a couple of mins each time.

I can bring my SPL meter, if considered useful?

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 16:49
I can bring my SPL meter, if considered useful?Great stuff Gary.

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 16:52
On the contrary, it seems to me that Oliver has a pretty good idea as to what is required.

What may be worth doing, and somthing I have done when comparing phonostages, is to adjust the output of each one to be similar. All you need to do is quickly play a tone from a test record and measure the voltage at the speaker terminals (very easy to do). So, play the first stage at the volume you want, pop on the test record and measure at the speakers, make a note of the voltage. Then put on each subsequent stage and start by putting on the test record and setting the output voltage to the same as that for the first stage (by adjusting the volume control). This genuinely shouldn’t take more than a couple of mins each time.Thanks mate. At least I've convinced someone i know what I'm doing [emoji23][emoji23]

Any chance i can rope you into bringing your Paradise????? I'll even let you set the Sound Level [emoji41]

Cyrus
29-04-2018, 16:55
On the contrary, it seems to me that Oliver has a pretty good idea as to what is required.

What may be worth doing, and somthing I have done when comparing phonostages, is to adjust the output of each one to be similar. All you need to do is quickly play a tone from a test record and measure the voltage at the speaker terminals (very easy to do). So, play the first stage at the volume you want, pop on the test record and measure at the speakers, make a note of the voltage. Then put on each subsequent stage and start by putting on the test record and setting the output voltage to the same as that for the first stage (by adjusting the volume control). This genuinely shouldn’t take more than a couple of mins each time.

Well, I was partly right; the small matter of loading has come up which is what I was getting at with satisfying a vast array of owners and equipment. You don't need something more 'exotic' than a Kontrapunkt B but you might need something more versatile.

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 17:35
Well, I was partly right; the small matter of loading has come up which is what I was getting at with satisfying a vast array of owners and equipment. You don't need something more 'exotic' than a Kontrapunkt B but you might need something more versatile.More versatile? Are you Joking? You must be because that's the most ludicrous statement I've read today. I suppose if you don't like a detailed, timbral, evenhanded, accurate approach to Vinyl reproduction, then i suppose i can see your point. [emoji849]

What would you suggest?


TBF when i play some Simon and Garfunkel it sounds fabulous but when i put some System of a down on its sounds fabulous. Oh, no, that example didn't work

Cyrus
29-04-2018, 17:51
Honestly, hifi brings out the hyperbole in people - the most ludicrous statement you've heard today? Well, versatile doesn't mean Simon and Garfunkel AND SOAD sounding good does it? I've only heard the cartridge sounding amazing at or below 100 ohm loading - and it did sound amazing, but versatile means it suits the requirements of every phono stage that will be showcased on the day. Some might not be set to 50 -100 ohms which would be a shame. However, they could just listen to your rig all day instead.

Cyrus
29-04-2018, 18:00
Oh, and for versatility I'd recommend the Hana SL. It would suit a number of different loading values on the multitude of phono stages you'll be testing.

Good luck.

YNWaN
29-04-2018, 18:01
I wouldn’t use an spl meter, I would measure from the speaker terminals with a multimeter, any cheap one will do, you don’t need anything special.

Im afraid Stoke is likely a bit far for me but it partly depends on whatever date is chosen :).

sq225917
29-04-2018, 18:04
Obvious troll is obvious.




Oliver, matching the output levels is a good idea, fixing a cart loading possibly isn't. Different phonostages have different input topologies with different native loading. Far better to allow people to choose the loading they think is best for the cart, and giving them time to fine tune it. Forcing a specific loading onto every stage doesn't match real world conditions of use where the user will likely adjust loading homing in on a preferred value.

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 18:06
Honestly, hifi brings out the hyperbole in people - the most ludicrous statement you've heard today? Well, versatile doesn't mean Simon and Garfunkel AND SOAD sounding good does it? I've only heard the cartridge sounding amazing at or below 100 ohm loading - and it did sound amazing, but versatile means it suits the requirements of every phono stage that will be showcased on the day. Some might not be set to 50 -100 ohms which would be a shame. However, they could just listen to your rig all day instead.I'm not sure what your issue is, Cyrus. You've been passively aggressive about this bakeoff all day, what's your deal?

It's an average cartridge in terms of output, loading, body weight, height and about any other specification you want to look at. It's DESIGNED to work with nearly any SUT or head amp and compatible with ANY phono stage I've looked at and i have looked into the ones on offer here. FFS surely Ortofon would've considered how to sell as many of them as possible and not make them difficult to pair up, don't you think?

The Kontrapunkt is what I have available to me and as with the rest of the system, if something better is offered, it can go in.

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 18:07
Oh, and for versatility I'd recommend the Hana SL. It would suit a number of different loading values on the multitude of phono stages you'll be testing.

Good luck.If you've just recommended a Hana SL over a Kontrapunkt, i suggest you get to the clinic and get your ears cleaned sunshine.

Cyrus
29-04-2018, 18:08
Why am I a troll? It's an absolutely relevant question - choosing the right cartridge gives everyone a chance. Please explain why and how I'm trolling, and if you are correct in your assumption I'll apologise and retreat back into the shadows.

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 18:09
Maybe value in both methods? I'll let a tech mined person handle that bit.

Where about are you? Surely stoke (Middle England) can't be THAT far?
I wouldn’t use an spl meter, I would measure from the speaker terminals with a multimeter, any cheap one will do, you don’t need anything special.

Im afraid Stoke is likely a bit far for me but it partly depends on whatever date is chosen :).

Cyrus
29-04-2018, 18:11
If you've just recommended a Hana SL over a Kontrapunkt, i suggest you get to the clinic and get your ears cleaned sunshine.

You still don't get it. I don't know why - you are obviously technically savvy but you seem to be focussing on how it sounds to you in your system, which is optimised no doubt. As for passive aggressive - I just don't see it.

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 18:12
Based on your recent experience at the last meet? I don't mind if people want to vary the loading as i want mine at 220 [emoji23]

Would everyone know what to load their phono stage with when using a Kb?


Obvious troll is obvious.




Oliver, matching the output levels is a good idea, fixing a cart loading possibly isn't. Different phonostages have different input topologies with different native loading. Far better to allow people to choose the loading they think is best for the cart, and giving them time to fine tune it. Forcing a specific loading onto every stage doesn't match real world conditions of use where the user will likely adjust loading homing in on a preferred value.

ianlenco
29-04-2018, 18:20
Thanks for organising this Oliver. Stoke is a bit far for me but you never know. As to controlling variables other than the phono stage, well, obviously use the same kit and substitute stages and do your best to keep volumes similar but that should be it. Surely the whole point of this is to enjoy the day and explore how different stages sound. I doubt it is to declare a winner as people naturally have different preferences. Just one problem I can foresee, my valve stage takes a while to fully come on song and I dare say this is true of other stages. How long do you intend giving each stage before (not too) serious listening?
If I don't come, have a great day and don't listen to knockers!

Stryder5
29-04-2018, 18:33
You still don't get it. I don't know why - you are obviously technically savvy but you seem to be focussing on how it sounds to you in your system, which is optimised no doubt. As for passive aggressive - I just don't see it.

I see it Bigman80, I know I'm "touchy" but really. I'm in awe of your patience .

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 18:42
I see it Bigman80, I know I'm "touchy" but really. I'm in awe of your patience .I've just shown your comment to my wife, Gary...... she said "you? Have patience" [emoji23][emoji23]

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 18:45
Hi Ian, its my pleasure.

Really, I'm being completely selfish. I just want to listen to how good the TOTL phonostages really are. How else do you do it!!!!!

I've got a plan to have power sockets available to the contributors so they have adequate time to warm up. It will be up to the contributor to ensure their kit is in top form. I can't manage everything lol.

Be good to see you if you can make it.

[emoji4]
Thanks for organising this Oliver. Stoke is a bit far for me but you never know. As to controlling variables other than the phono stage, well, obviously use the same kit and substitute stages and do your best to keep volumes similar but that should be it. Surely the whole point of this is to enjoy the day and explore how different stages sound. I doubt it is to declare a winner as people naturally have different preferences. Just one problem I can foresee, my valve stage takes a while to fully come on song and I dare say this is true of other stages. How long do you intend giving each stage before (not too) serious listening?
If I don't come, have a great day and don't listen to knockers!

Stryder5
29-04-2018, 18:52
I've just shown your comment to my wife, Gary...... she said "you? Have patience" [emoji23][emoji23]

Trust me in this you have far more than me. I know wives know best though.

Some years back for work I had to go through a days psychometric testing. There followed a four page assessment. Caroline said " I could have saved them the time, you're a nit, picky bastard" :goodnight:

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 18:52
Word has reached me that a couple of members (Marco & Barry) have really high end preamps.

Any chance of attendance from either or both of you?

Bigman80
29-04-2018, 18:53
Trust me in this you have far more than me. I know wives know best though.

Some years back for work I had to go through a days psychometric testing. There followed a four page assessment. Caroline said " I could have saved them the time, you're a nit, picky bastard" [emoji561][emoji23]

Yomanze
30-04-2018, 06:49
Yes. Don't really want to spent hours swapping carts and setups etc. You Could alway bring a second TT for MM if you wish but some stages only have MC capability

Ah I thought so, think that would spoil the bake-off a bit, too much fiddling a different gear muddying the comparison. Have fun!

take5
30-04-2018, 07:09
I would be interested in attending, depending on the final date.

I have an Audio Innovations P2 phono, with matching SUT.

It is MM only, but has a gain control on it, and together with the SUT, should be ok with your cartridge.

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 07:20
I would be interested in attending, depending on the final date.

I have an Audio Innovations P2 phono, with matching SUT.

It is MM only, but has a gain control on it, and together with the SUT, should be ok with your cartridge.You'd be very welcome. Not a phono stage I'm familiar with either so that's great!

take5
30-04-2018, 07:27
You'd be very welcome. Not a phono stage I'm familiar with either so that's great!


Great, thanks. Look forward to hearing when it is to happen, and hope Im free.

Its a valve phono, from the 80s , I think. It sounds really nice.

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 07:54
Great, thanks. Look forward to hearing when it is to happen, and hope Im free.

Its a valve phono, from the 80s , I think. It sounds really nice.Ye just been looking it up, I'm looking forward to hearing it. Some really great stuff knocking about.

Ali Tait
30-04-2018, 08:41
Word has reached me that a couple of members (Marco & Barry) have really high end preamps.

Any chance of attendance from either or both of you?

Just use the Slagle Ollie, less of a variable I’d have thought, and it’s as good as any pre out there imo.

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 08:51
Just use the Slagle Ollie, less of a variable I’d have thought, and it’s as good as any pre out there imo.Fair point, it will be available should we need it. I do agree though,

sq225917
30-04-2018, 13:09
The troll is strong in that one. perhaps he'll organise the next bake off.

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 13:11
The troll is strong in that one. perhaps he'll organise the next bake off.Have i missed a post?

Primalsea
30-04-2018, 13:22
I’ll be interested in this but Stoke is a bit of a trek for me, however, if I can make it I would like to. I can bring my WD clone and Leech step-up, if there are not too many phono amps already.

Just need to know the date.

walpurgis
30-04-2018, 13:27
The troll is strong in that one. perhaps he'll organise the next bake off.

Yes. What is this about?

Stryder5
30-04-2018, 13:38
The troll is strong in that one. perhaps he'll organise the next bake off.

I understand perfectly, a bit late maybe but nevertheless ......

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 13:42
Are we referring to yesterday's interaction?

Either way, let's crack on with what's important. A date!!!

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 13:44
I’ll be interested in this but Stoke is a bit of a trek for me, however, if I can make it I would like to. I can bring my WD clone and Leech step-up, if there are not too many phono amps already.

Just need to know the date.You're welcome to attend and bring your WD clone. Until a date is released, nobody can fully commit so once that's in place we'll have a look at numbers and see what's what. [emoji4]

Primalsea
30-04-2018, 14:54
Nice. It will be good to compare the WD clone to other phonos, if I can, especially the DIY valve offerings. The general topology tends to be similar, but mine doesn’t have the refinements that others have.

Cyrus
30-04-2018, 15:44
I understand perfectly, a bit late maybe but nevertheless ......
Pathetic.

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 15:46
Well, mine is a DIY valve stage so that's gonna be a good little comparison.

struth
30-04-2018, 15:46
Pathetic.

less of this attitude, or else.

back on subject only

Cyrus
30-04-2018, 15:48
less of this attitude, or else.

back on subject only

I asked a perfectly fair question, stated my opinion and then got the troll comments. So I stand by my comment.

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 15:48
Just noticed that about 10% of your entire contribution to this forum has been spent on this thread alone. Got anything constructive to add or are you just planning on being a PITA until the event? Either way, you keep bumping this thread to the top, so thanks [emoji6]
Pathetic.

Cyrus
30-04-2018, 15:58
Just noticed that about 10% of your entire contribution to this forum has been spent on this thread alone. Got anything constructive to add or are you just planning on being a PITA until the event? Either way, you keep bumping this thread to the top, so thanks [emoji6]

I tried but you seemed to take umbrage at both my comment about versatility and the Kontrapunkt B. You didn't have to take it personally.

Honestly, I love hifi but trying to plough through the quagmire of egos, shilling and general pettiness is truly difficult - across the internet, not pointed at this site.

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 16:08
I tried but you seemed to take umbrage at both my comment about versatility and the Kontrapunkt B. You didn't have to take it personally.

Honestly, I love hifi but trying to plough through the quagmire of egos, shilling and general pettiness is truly difficult - across the internet, not pointed at this site.I've taken nothing personally, but an opinion is just that, an opinion. My differed, as does Ortofon's

There's no ego involved. I'm well aware of three people who have incredible cartridges and if they offer one for the bake-off, id snap their hand off for it. I can only offer what I have at my disposal, as previously stated.

There's no shilling here, just an opportunity to listen to some fantastic KIT that ordinarily would be out of reach financially for guys like me. "Ego" suggests I seem to think i know best, well, im also well aware i do not but saying the Ortofon isn't versatile because a phono stage doesn't perform well with it is simply ridiculous. It points to the limitations of the phono stage, not the cartridge. If a cartridge operates outside of the Standardised parameters, then yes, id agree it isn't a versatile cart. The Ortofon isn't an oddball and is of very standard levels. Sorry if you think that's ego or shilling or whatever else, it isn't.

struth
30-04-2018, 16:15
ok, back to the topic in hand please

Yomanze
30-04-2018, 17:20
Word has reached me that a couple of members (Marco & Barry) have really high end preamps.

Any chance of attendance from either or both of you?

Oh, I don’t have an optimised MC stage, but I do have a high end preamp, LFD DLS, that I could bring.

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 17:22
Oh, I don’t have an optimised MC stage, but I do have a high end preamp, LFD DLS, that I could bring.Is that the TVC model?

Macca
30-04-2018, 17:25
Oh, I don’t have an optimised MC stage, but I do have a high end preamp, LFD DLS, that I could bring.

That would be great Neil, and would be good to meet you as well. Problem now is the venue we were going to use is closed for refurbishment and doesn't look like re-opening any time soon.

Yomanze
30-04-2018, 17:33
Is that the TVC model?

It’s an active pre, I don’t think LFD have ever used TVCs, but some of their older preamps did use line level signal transformers.

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 17:34
Ah, i see. Bring it!!!!!

TheMooN
30-04-2018, 17:45
less of this attitude, or else.

back on subject only

Ahhhhhh, but did he arrive...Or was he sent Grant!!!

I look forward to reading the events of the day.

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 17:52
Ahhhhhh, but did he arrive...Or was he sent Grant!!!

I look forward to reading the events of the day.Says banned, says it all.

Yomanze
30-04-2018, 18:59
Ah, i see. Bring it!!!!!

Keep me posted with dates and will bring the pre and two pairs of LFD interconnects that are matched to it. [emoji4]

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 18:59
Keep me posted with dates and will bring the pre and two pairs of interconnects that are matched to it. :)[emoji106]

STD305M
30-04-2018, 21:11
Hi Oliver

Id like to come too if the date is suitable, just to meet other members and listen to some great kit...

Regards Steve...

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 21:18
Hi Oliver

Id like to come too if the date is suitable, just to meet other members and listen to some great kit...

Regards Steve...No worries Steve, you're more than welcome.

STD305M
30-04-2018, 21:21
No worries Steve, you're more than welcome.

Great will keep an eye out for the dates

Steve...

Bigman80
30-04-2018, 21:21
Quick update:

The venue we were hoping to use in Stoke is currently closed for refurbishment. This has thrown a tiny spanner in the works but two of the "behind the scenes" guys are looking for alternative options in the Stoke area.

A potential date that has been floated between us is.....14/7/18. This is not the confirmed date but one that we're hoping for.

Confirmation will be given when the venue is confirmed.

Thanks for all of the interest.

Firebottle
01-05-2018, 06:18
I'm not available on the 14th or the weekend after.

Bigman80
01-05-2018, 07:04
I'm not available on the 14th or the weekend after.[emoji23][emoji23][emoji23] bloody typical, well seeing as you're part of the "behind the scenes" team, we'd better rethink it lol

walpurgis
01-05-2018, 07:42
I'm not available on the 14th or the weekend after.

Where yer goin' Alan. Anywhere good?

Firebottle
01-05-2018, 07:50
Oh yes!
Paramotorclub.org Summer Fly In then Upton Blues Festival the following week-end :yay:

walpurgis
01-05-2018, 07:51
Ah, sounds good. Have fun! :D

CageyH
01-05-2018, 08:42
Oh yes!
Paramotorclub.org Summer Fly In then Upton Blues Festival the following week-end :yay:

Sounds much more fun than sitting in a room comparing phono stages :eyebrows:

Qwin
05-05-2018, 20:54
Oh yes!
Paramotorclub.org Summer Fly In then Upton Blues Festival the following week-end :yay:

I'm doing the Tropical Pressure Festival near Truro, then Upton Blues back to back weekends, might see you at Upton Alan, this will be my 4th year in a row there, love it. :)

Barry
05-05-2018, 21:01
The Upton-on-Seven Jazz festival is great fun - especially if you like trad jazz. I love the way all the various pubs there host the acts and you can wander in and out with a glass of beer to your hart's content.

(Sorry for the thread drift.)

Qwin
06-05-2018, 07:32
I have an AQVOX Phono 2 CI I could bring, but it has very specific system requirements, so probably wouldn't suit a demo rig tailored for most others.

Just to clarify, it's a pro piece of kit designed for studio mastering and needs balanced XLR from cartridge, through amplification. Its a current amplifier rather than voltage amplifier, is designed to be MC only and because of the design, doesn't need loading adjustment.

It can cater for RCA input and MM and has adjustments for "normal" loading/capacitance operation, but that is not hearing it anywhere near its best, or how it is intended to work.

I might just come along for the crack and to hear some nice gear, so I'm keen to see if the date clashes with anything else I'm doing.
It's always difficult, organizing an event in the holiday season.

:popcorn:

Bigman80
06-05-2018, 08:03
You'd be welcome to join in matey, struggle is finding a venue that ticks all the boxes!!
I have an AQVOX Phono 2 CI I could bring, but it has very specific system requirements, so probably wouldn't suit a demo rig tailored for most others.

Just to clarify, it's a pro piece of kit designed for studio mastering and needs balanced XLR from cartridge, through amplification. Its a current amplifier rather than voltage amplifier, is designed to be MC only and because of the design, doesn't need loading adjustment.

It can cater for RCA input and MM and has adjustments for "normal" loading/capacitance operation, but that is not hearing it anywhere near its best, or how it is intended to work.

I might just come along for the crack and to hear some nice gear, so I'm keen to see if the date clashes with anything else I'm doing.
It's always difficult, organizing an event in the holiday season.

:popcorn:

Bigman80
09-05-2018, 10:22
Quick update:

We are hoping to have a venue confirmed in the next few days and with this, a date!

Venue will still be in the Stoke area and likely to be on a Sunday in June.

More to follow!

rubber duck
09-05-2018, 19:08
I have an AQVOX Phono 2 CI I could bring, but it has very specific system requirements, so probably wouldn't suit a demo rig tailored for most others.

Just to clarify, it's a pro piece of kit designed for studio mastering and needs balanced XLR from cartridge, through amplification. Its a current amplifier rather than voltage amplifier, is designed to be MC only and because of the design, doesn't need loading adjustment.

It can cater for RCA input and MM and has adjustments for "normal" loading/capacitance operation, but that is not hearing it anywhere near its best, or how it is intended to work.

The 2ci has been my main phono stage for the past couple of years. I prefer it to every phono stage I've had in my current system, including the Trilogy 907. It can run in balanced (current) or unbalanced (voltage) mode. Balanced is only for MC but unbalanced caters for both MM and MC. I've had excellent results with my Hana SH and AT33PTG, and the Shure M97xE is completely transformed and almost unrecognisable through the MM stage. I'm currently running a Stanton 681EEE and the combination of this on a 4gm Moerch DP6 arm tube and Aqvox (correctly adjusted for capacitance and gain) leaves very little to be desired. I think the 2ci would be an ideal candidate because it is flexible enough to configure manually in unbalanced (voltage) mode. Ideally you'd use RCA/XLR adaptors and use the balanced (current) mode but I suspect even in unbalanced mode it will sound very good, provided the system has enough gain.

Bigman80
09-05-2018, 19:27
The 2ci has been my main phono stage for the past couple of years. I prefer it to every phono stage I've had in my current system, including the Trilogy 907. It can run in balanced (current) or unbalanced (voltage) mode. Balanced is only for MC but unbalanced caters for both MM and MC. I've had excellent results with my Hana SH and AT33PTG, and the Shure M97xE is completely transformed and almost unrecognisable through the MM stage. I'm currently running a Stanton 681EEE and the combination of this on a 4gm Moerch DP6 arm tube and Aqvox (correctly adjusted for capacitance and gain) leaves very little to be desired. I think the 2ci would be an ideal candidate because it is flexible enough to configure manually in unbalanced (voltage) mode. Ideally you'd use RCA/XLR adaptors and use the balanced (current) mode but I suspect even in unbalanced mode it will sound very good, provided the system has enough gain.Plans are for everything to be as simple as possible and keeping the same conditions for the Phonostages on display. RCA cables will be used but having a quick read up on your phonostage, I doubt it will have any issues!

You are welcome to attend!

Qwin
09-05-2018, 20:43
The 2ci has been my main phono stage for the past couple of years. I prefer it to every phono stage I've had in my current system, including the Trilogy 907. It can run in balanced (current) or unbalanced (voltage) mode. Balanced is only for MC but unbalanced caters for both MM and MC. I've had excellent results with my Hana SH and AT33PTG, and the Shure M97xE is completely transformed and almost unrecognisable through the MM stage. I'm currently running a Stanton 681EEE and the combination of this on a 4gm Moerch DP6 arm tube and Aqvox (correctly adjusted for capacitance and gain) leaves very little to be desired. I think the 2ci would be an ideal candidate because it is flexible enough to configure manually in unbalanced (voltage) mode. Ideally you'd use RCA/XLR adaptors and use the balanced (current) mode but I suspect even in unbalanced mode it will sound very good, provided the system has enough gain.

I'm also running a MkII AT33PTG with the 2Ci phono stage, this combo does it for me. I have it on a Transfi Audio linear tracking arm and wired as balanced right through from cartridge to Power amp.
Aqvox recommend interconnects from TT should be unshielded twisted pair x2, have you tried this? I keep meaning to make some leads in this configuration to see if it makes a difference, just not got round to it yet.

PM me if you like, don't want to thread jack.

rubber duck
09-05-2018, 22:10
Plans are for everything to be as simple as possible and keeping the same conditions for the Phonostages on display. RCA cables will be used but having a quick read up on your phonostage, I doubt it will have any issues!

You are welcome to attend!

Thanks Oliver, I'd love to if I was closer. I was trying to encourage Ken to bring his 2ci along. Hopefully this will work out. Ken, I'll pm you.

Bigman80
10-05-2018, 07:35
Thanks Oliver, I'd love to if I was closer. I was trying to encourage Ken to bring his 2ci along. Hopefully this will work out. Ken, I'll pm you.Ah, didn't look at your location. Fair enough, you'd be welcome if you fancied the journey. Hopefully Ken is up for it!

Qwin
10-05-2018, 08:31
Ah, didn't look at your location. Fair enough, you'd be welcome if you fancied the journey. Hopefully Ken is up for it!

All down to the date you select Oliver, eagerly awaiting news on that.

Bigman80
10-05-2018, 08:32
Me too!! [emoji6]
All down to the date you select Oliver, eagerly awaiting news on that.

Marco
10-05-2018, 09:47
Venue will still be in the Stoke area and likely to be on a Sunday in June.


I'd advise not to make it the 24th (the day after the Cranage Hall show: http://audioshow.co.uk/ ) as folks won't want to use up the whole of their weekend going to shows/bake-offs, so for those interested in the Stoke bake-off or Cranage show, it would likely be one or the other, and so could affect attendance of the former on the Sunday.

Just a thought, guys :)

Marco.

Bigman80
10-05-2018, 10:46
I'd advise not to make it the 24th (the day after the Cranage Hall show: http://audioshow.co.uk/ ) as folks won't want to use up the whole of their weekend going to shows/bake-offs, so for those interested in the Stoke bake-off or Cranage show, it would likely be one or the other, and so could affect attendance of the former on the Sunday.

Just a thought, guys :)

Marco.Good shout Marco, we will keep it in mind.

Crackles
10-05-2018, 10:54
Another potential problem is that 17th June is fathers day so might create an issue (earache) for some!

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

Bigman80
10-05-2018, 11:12
Another potential problem is that 17th June is fathers day so might create an issue (earache) for some!

Sent from my SM-G920F using TapatalkOh bloody hell yes. Good grief, this is a pain in the arse. Let's go for July. Better?

struth
10-05-2018, 11:17
holiday season :eyebrows:

Marco
10-05-2018, 12:06
...not forgetting the annual cross-dressers convention in Coventry:D

Marco.

Jimbo
10-05-2018, 12:35
...not forgetting the annual cross-dressers convention in Coventry:D

Marco.

Damm I forgot I was going to that:D

Marco
10-05-2018, 12:45
Have you got your new frock yet for it, shweety?

Marco.

Crackles
10-05-2018, 13:26
Oh bloody hell yes. Good grief, this is a pain in the arse. Let's go for July. Better?Most Sundays in July are ok for me

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

Bigman80
10-05-2018, 17:34
Update -

Disappointingly, the venue we have enquired with is fully booked until November!

A third option, located in Penkridge, which is about 30 minutes south of Stoke, may be available.

Finding a suitable venue is proving harder than anticipated. Apologies that its now dragging on.

I'll post an update as soon as I get one.

ianlenco
10-05-2018, 18:01
I feel for you, all that enthusiasm and then.............. but you don't need to apologise. Himley's not far from you, maybe you should book the Crooked House (is it still standing?). Now that would be fun trying to level a turntable.

Bigman80
10-05-2018, 18:03
I feel for you, all that enthusiasm and then.............. but you don't need to apologise. Himley's not far from you, maybe you should book the Crooked House (is it still standing?). Now that would be fun trying to level a turntable.Lol. I'll persevere. Somewhere WILL have us!!!

Bigman80
11-05-2018, 18:51
Ok boys and girls, we have a Venue!!!!

*Penkridge Peace Memorial Hall*

Located in the village of Penkridge, just south of Stafford, access to and from the M6 is straight forward, being linked by the A449.

There are hotels, eating establishments and pubs on the doorstep who will also deliver if need be.

Car parking is also available and we should be able to get approximately 20-30 cars parked safely.

So the date **Drum roll**................

08/07/18 10:00 - 20:00

There will be a Donations box for the rental of the hall (£100[emoji54]) but it will NOT be mandatory to contribute. I am more concerned with getting the best phonostages available to the bakeoff.

So there we have it. If anyone needs any information, just drop me a message or post here and I'll do my best to offer an answer.

Cheers!

Oh, can a mod alter the title to
"Staffordshire Area Phonostage bakeoff"

Ta

Qwin
11-05-2018, 19:13
:eek: I can actually make that date.

Should I bring the Aqvox 2Ci Phono Stage?

Bigman80
11-05-2018, 19:17
:eek: I can actually make that date.

Should I bring the Aqvox 2Ci Phono Stage?Yes!!!! Why not?! Meet some forum members, listen to some great kit. What's the down side?

Jimbo
11-05-2018, 19:21
:eek: I can actually make that date.

Should I bring the Aqvox 2Ci Phono Stage?

Great you can come Ken, I will be there for certain.

Qwin
11-05-2018, 19:23
Yes!!!! Why not?! Meet some forum members, listen to some great kit. What's the down side?

Ok, will bring it.

Note full address of venue:

Penkridge Peace Memorial Hall
Pinfold Lane
Penkridge
Stafford
ST19 5AP

James, been a while, look forward to seeing you there.

Bigman80
11-05-2018, 19:24
[emoji4]
Ok, will bring it.

Note full address of venue:

Penkridge Peace Memorial Hall
Pinfold Lane
Penkridge
Stafford
ST19 5AP

Jimbo
11-05-2018, 19:28
Ok, will bring it.

Note full address of venue:

Penkridge Peace Memorial Hall
Pinfold Lane
Penkridge
Stafford
ST19 5AP

James, been a while, look forward to seeing you there.

There is a great pub / hotel next to the venue Ken so I will buy you a pint!

Qwin
11-05-2018, 19:32
Cheers!

ianlenco
11-05-2018, 19:50
Now that's a bit closer so it's becoming tempting :scratch:

Bigman80
11-05-2018, 20:00
Now that's a bit closer so it's becoming tempting :scratch:Come on Ian, you know you want to!

Bigman80
11-05-2018, 21:29
1st question!

Q: Is it attendance by invitation?

A: No, any AoS member is welcome, Members from TAS and the LH forums have already been invited. No other forum's members will be considered.

2nd Question!

Q: Can I attend if I bring other equipment?

A: No need! AoS members can arrive just for a listen and to be sociable. You don't need to provide any additional equipment

3rd Question!

Q: What Speakers will be used.

A: Macca has offered us the use of his JM Labs. I don't know the model, maybe he can help? There will also be Macca's Krell Poweramp on duty.

4th Question!

Q: What are the test tracks going to be and how many will there be?

A: This hasn't been confirmed yet but there is a poll running somewhere. Feel free to vote on Genre, we can go from there.

5th Question!

Q: Will pictures be allowed?

A: Pictures of kit: Yes! Pictures of attendees?, Not without their permission.

I have Consulted with Marco on this subject and it's his decision that there be NO wiggle room I'm this regard. "Failure to adhere to this will result in a ban" - Marco

This is to be a fun event for genuine AoS members. Therefore, a "Sign in" process via the forum, will be mandatory on the day to ensure we don't get any rogue elements just turning up of the street [emoji16].



I'll add any further questions as they come up!

Bigman80
11-05-2018, 21:38
So, anyone here want to bring the following?

Paradise phonostage?
Vida Aurorasound?

Typically, the ones I had lined up can't make the date SO any volunteers?

Crackles
11-05-2018, 21:59
Can I put my name down?

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

Bigman80
11-05-2018, 22:24
Can I put my name down?

Sent from my SM-G920F using TapatalkSure thing.

ijrussell
12-05-2018, 13:07
I have a Trilogy 907 phonostage I could bring along.

Bigman80
12-05-2018, 13:29
I have a Trilogy 907 phonostage I could bring along.Great stuff! See you there!

STD305M
12-05-2018, 14:51
Hi Oliver
I'll be there will be good to see you and Alan again.
Will probably stay at hotel due to the distance.
How do we make donations

Regards Steve...

Bigman80
12-05-2018, 15:07
Hi Oliver
I'll be there will be good to see you and Alan again.
Will probably stay at hotel due to the distance.
How do we make donations

Regards Steve...Great stuff, your presence is very welcome.

There will be a box for donations on the day mate. Easy that way isn't it!

STD305M
12-05-2018, 15:10
Sound good to me

Steve...

Macca
15-05-2018, 17:40
This is now going ahead, please see new thread here http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?58388-Phonostage-Bake-Off-08-07-18-Penkridge-*NOW-CONFIRMED*