View Full Version : am i being to fussy or anal?
as above i bought this as 'new old stock' the seller confirmed 0 hrs on it.
i noticed straight away the cantilever was slightly off but thought it would bed in.
it hasn't after 2 days of long listening,dont get me wrong it sounds great and i always align the cantilever anyway,perhaps the body is out?
what do you think guys?
send it back for a full refund?
live with it?
send it off to be sorted?
https://s26.postimg.org/pbcd48tx5/IMG_2039.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/6j0i0oko9/IMG_2057.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/d9gza4n9l/IMG_2062.jpg
i know its not badly leaning to the right but it makes me wonder if it has 0 hrs on it?
about 5 hrs use from me?
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/868/41074269172_9383bd0ea0_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/25zAndG)Fri Mar 30 17-05-29 (https://flic.kr/p/25zAndG) by [/url], on Flickr
[url=https://flic.kr/p/25Dphpa]https://farm1.staticflickr.com/805/41117372711_746de32fa0_z.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145822004@N02/)Fri Mar 30 17-00-41 (https://flic.kr/p/25Dphpa) by , on Flickr
Maybe it comes right when anti skating is applied? Otherwise not sure what to say, doesn't look too wonky but many would be concerned. You aren't being anal in my book...
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paulf-2007
30-03-2018, 16:18
as above i bought this as 'new old stock' the seller confirmed 0 hrs on it.
i noticed straight away the cantilever was slighty off but thought it would bed in.
it hasn't after 2 days of long listening,dont get me wrong it sounds great and i always align the cantilever anyway,perhaps the body is out?
what do you think guys?
send it back for a full refund?
live with it?
send it off to be sorted?
https://s26.postimg.org/pbcd48tx5/IMG_2039.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/6j0i0oko9/IMG_2057.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/d9gza4n9l/IMG_2062.jpg
i know its not badly leaning to the right but it makes me wonder if it has 0 hrs on it?if you do send it back Jamie, make sure you clean off all that crap hanging on the stylus, the seller might think you bent the cantilever. Not always a good idea posting on forums then wanting to return stuff as Adrian found out with his amplifier troubles.
paulf-2007
30-03-2018, 16:19
Oh and no I don't think you are being anal, I wouldn't expect to buy something unused to look like that
Spectral Morn
30-03-2018, 16:25
Michael Fremer wrote an article about this once, giving off about many new carts and pretty high end ones often having a cantilever that is not square on to the body. If this one sounds fine its probably ok. Always align by cantilever and not the body anyway.
Michael Fremer wrote an article about this once, giving off about many new carts and pretty high end ones often having a cantilever that is not square on to the body. If this one sounds fine its probably ok. Always align by cantilever and not the body anyway.
i always do mate,it sounds fine,also the rarity of it makes me reluctant to send it back. its just an annoying niggle that will be in the back of my mind.
pretty minor. doubt it will affect it.
+1 I wouldn't worry about it - unlike your orthography Jamie! ;)
lol i had to look that up and i still dont understand it barry??
Boyse6748
30-03-2018, 17:03
as above i bought this as 'new old stock' the seller confirmed 0 hrs on it.
i noticed straight away the cantilever was slightly off but thought it would bed in.
it hasn't after 2 days of long listening,dont get me wrong it sounds great and i always align the cantilever anyway,perhaps the body is out?
what do you think guys?
send it back for a full refund?
live with it?
send it off to be sorted?
https://s26.postimg.org/pbcd48tx5/IMG_2039.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/6j0i0oko9/IMG_2057.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/d9gza4n9l/IMG_2062.jpg
i know its not badly leaning to the right but it makes me wonder if it has 0 hrs on it?
about 5 hrs use from me?
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/868/41074269172_9383bd0ea0_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/25zAndG)Fri Mar 30 17-05-29 (https://flic.kr/p/25zAndG) by [/url], on Flickr
[url=https://flic.kr/p/25Dphpa]https://farm1.staticflickr.com/805/41117372711_746de32fa0_z.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145822004@N02/)Fri Mar 30 17-00-41 (https://flic.kr/p/25Dphpa) by , on Flickr
I don’t think you are being anal at all, but perhaps slightly concerned.
Tried to take a picture of my 103 Pro (see below) and not quite the offset you are showing. Perhaps a few more hours for the suspension to free up is in order.
If not then back to the seller.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180330/3adf16d9a8701f81953eaffe5a307e79.jpg
Peter
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
lol i had to look that up and i still dont understand it barry??
I was just teasing you over your spelling: writing "to" rather than "too". ;)
But more importantly I go along with Neil and Grant. The generator can sometimes be slightly misaligned with respect to the cartridge body, both the azimuth in the horizontal and vertical plane.
If all of that debris was already on there, then I doubt it is “new” with zero hours.
If it wasn’t, then you need to clean your records or invest in a record cleaner. ;)
yes yes i know,im cleaning tomorrow lol
Spectral Morn
30-03-2018, 17:32
i always do mate,it sounds fine,also the rarity of it makes me reluctant to send it back. its just an annoying niggle that will be in the back of my mind.
I understand, not saying I would not have that niggle myself.
I would send it back. A skewed cantilever can affect channel balance and it's what has happened internally that would concern me.
Bigman80
30-03-2018, 17:35
I'd send it back. There's no telling if it left the factory like that or is something had gone amiss in the guts of the cartridge. A mate of mine had a misalignment in the cantilever, guy he bought it off said it was due to never using antiskate. Turns out the rubber inside was sheared and the cantilever was being pulled to one side. Left him with uneven stylus wear. Cost him £400 to replace the guts etc. New stylus too.
I wouldn't risk it personally, regardless of rarity.
Spectral Morn
30-03-2018, 17:37
If all of that debris was already on there, then I doubt it is “new” with zero hours.
If it wasn’t, then you need to clean your records or invest in a record cleaner. ;)
I recently sold an unused in its box Ortofon MC2000 and it had gathered up some crude despite never having left its storage box, go figure.
I recently sold an unused in its box Ortofon MC2000 and it had gathered up some crude despite never having left its storage box, go figure.
And a nice bit of fluff around the stylus?
montesquieu
30-03-2018, 17:44
I was just teasing you over your spelling: writing "to" rather than "too". ;)
But more importantly I go along with Neil and Grant. The generator can sometimes be slightly misaligned with respect to the cartridge body, both the azimuth in the horizontal and vertical plane.
I'm in this camp as well. If it sounds fine I wouldn't worry.
However, I agree with Paul as well and for that reason I'm not going to ask you what it is! (curious as I am).
Stratmangler
30-03-2018, 17:55
And a nice bit of fluff around the stylus?
OP did say it has worked hard the last couple of days.
It ain't got zero hours on it now!
If think a return would've been best contemplated before pressing it into use.
Spectral Morn
30-03-2018, 19:37
And a nice bit of fluff around the stylus?
No, fair point.
RobbieGong
30-03-2018, 20:46
I'd send it back. To use your word and just knowing the importance of set, alignment etc, I am very anal when it comes to this stuf and it would bug the hell out of me, being it like it is.
I feel for you that it's come like that - the 'joys' of hifi....:rolleyes:
cheers rob,
id estimate it to be only a degree off line and to be fair to the seller i have put some hours on it so i have decided to keep it.
its really sounding great so i think there's no damage or misalignment inside ,it could after all be just the body that's off center?
after all it can always be sent of to be checked.
Unless I am mistaken because it is late and I am tired, both the centring and antiskate forces will tend to displace the cantilever towards the platter spindle, I have had this happen over time with cartridges.
Your deviation is the other way and may well become lessened and so it will be more accurate with time as it moves slightly with those forces.
RobbieGong
30-03-2018, 22:24
cheers rob,
id estimate it to be only a degree off line and to be fair to the seller i have put some hours on it so i have decided to keep it.
its really sounding great so i think there's no damage or misalignment inside ,it could after all be just the body that's off center?
after all it can always be sent of to be checked.
Fair enough Jamie and at least you're aware of it so you can align with that in mind / to the cantilever as best you can - glad it's sounding great too :)
Unless I am mistaken because it is late and I am tired, both the centring and antiskate forces will tend to displace the cantilever towards the platter spindle, I have had this happen over time with cartridges.
Your deviation is the other way and may well become lessened and so it will be more accurate with time as it moves slightly with those forces.
it has the effect as if not enough anti skate has been used
What is it anyway Jamie? Looks a bit A T
it has the effect as if not enough anti skate has been used
Agreed, but your cartridge is NOS, so I still think it's a minor misalignment of the generator with the housing.
What is it anyway Jamie? Looks a bit A T
its a denon 103m grant
Agreed, but your cartridge is NOS, so I still think it's a minor misalignment of the generator with the housing.
yep id go along with that,i can get the cantilever to align perfectly
Wakefield Turntables
31-03-2018, 07:36
What do you define as NOS? I've seen many valves listed as NOS only to mean that they've been used slightly but still look like NOS, my belief is that NOS means an article never used and still wrapped.
that would be my ideal of new old stock too.
Wakefield Turntables
31-03-2018, 09:21
that would be my ideal of new old stock too.
IVe not read this all way through. Is yours proper NOS?
Frazeur1
31-03-2018, 12:24
I say just get out a nice pair of needle-nosed pliers and.....nah, never mind! :)
Haselsh1
31-03-2018, 12:54
I personally think you have every right to be too fussy. This is your bloody money.
Primalsea
31-03-2018, 13:45
The wonkyness can be down to incorrect anti skate as already mentioned and on my cartridge this happened to me until I stared to use the correct setting and then it righted itself. If you have a test record you can verify the performance.
jandl100
01-04-2018, 07:47
Many years ago I bought a new Ortofon MC30 Super from the local hifi dealership.
Not a cheap cartridge.
Its cantilever was way more off beam than Jamie's.
I was horrified - but the ortofon rep insisted it was normal.
Bugger that. I howled like hell and got a replacement.
And then another replacement.
The 3rd one was OK.
But that was way worse than yours, Jamie.
I'd be fine with it if it were me.
Enjoy! - those Denons are great. :)
Floyddroid
09-04-2018, 15:43
It would do my head in and i would need to send it back.
Jamie, you’ll always worry about it so if I were you, I’d send it back.
Sherwood
09-04-2018, 17:15
I reckon it is possible to be too fussy and anal at the same time! If it worries you though, best say goodbye! :eyebrows:
Same principle with relationships BTW! :rolleyes:
My AT 33 PTG II is out by the same amount. I can't hear any channel imbalance and it sounds fine to my ears. Filed it under 'CBA' as life's too short...
speedracer
10-04-2018, 12:07
If you are the kind of guy who obsesses about things then returning it would be a good idea I think, if not just enjoy it if it sounds good.
My AT 33 PTG II is out by the same amount. I can't hear any channel imbalance and it sounds fine to my ears. Filed it under 'CBA' as life's too short...
the CBA attitude rather depends on what i'd paid for this supposedly 'never been used' cartridge.
fortunately i could be arsed and today received a refund,the seller was genuine and honest enough to do that.
My AT 33 PTG II is out by the same amount. I can't hear any channel imbalance and it sounds fine to my ears. Filed it under 'CBA' as life's too short...
the CBA attitude rather depends on what i'd paid for this supposedly 'never been used' cartridge.
fortunately i could be arsed and today received a refund,the seller was genuine and honest enough to do that.
If it has given you 'peace of mind', then fair enough.
A friend of mine was unhappy with a Benz cartridge he had bought on ebay. There was a problem with channel imbalance (I could hear it), however the seller was decent enough to provide a full refund.
the CBA attitude rather depends on what i'd paid for this supposedly 'never been used' cartridge.
fortunately i could be arsed and today received a refund,the seller was genuine and honest enough to do that.
I agree Jamie and wasn't meant as a criticism. As I couldn't hear anything wrong (and there might be!) I left alone. But the offset bugs me, visually! So I totally understand your concerns.
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