Advice - SPU-G

[farflungstar]

I'm interested in adding another Tonearm (or maybe a second deck) and using an SPu-G type cart - I have to admit I know nothing about them other than I love their looks. What is the best SPu-G available?
Adey

[Smegger68]

:popcorn:

[montesquieu]

Well you need something heavy, the lighter arms don't really cut it with an SPU. Arms suitable include (all 12in - though quite a few 9ins will suit if massy enough):

- Thomas Schick 12in - I've had one of these, nicely made but a shade basic I think .. depends on what you are after, looks cool with a Garrard 301.
- SME M2-12R - I've had one of those too, works good with SPU though you need to adjust the length as it's made to work with the SME headshell which puts the stylus in the 'wrong' place for an SPU. Thankfully that's easy on the sliding base they come with.
- SME 3012 - the later ones are OK with SPU but ideally you need an early, higher mass one which are like hen's teeth and becoming very expensive.
- Ortofon RMG 309i or RMG 309 Limited - my current 12in tonearm, Japanese re-issue of the 1960s Danish original and rather better made than the original too. Perfect with an SPU as you'd expect, it's what it was made for. Top quality bearings and lovely dynamic balance arrangement. No anti-skate (like the schick, though it's static balance) but I don't feel you need it on an arm that length - this is one of the 'longer' 12in arms.
- Jelco 750L - Excellent for the money but to be fair, somewhat outclassed by most if not all the others on this list
- Audio-Creative GrooveMaster II - Dutch I think, super cool looking, affordable and been on my check it out list for a while. No idea if it works as good as it looks.
- Jelco TK-850 and TK-950L - Jelco's latest tonearms, great value for money and I'm seriously thinking of swapping the RMG out for this out of curiosity - both have the same high-quality knife-edge bearing, the difference between them is static vs dynamic balance
- Ikeda IT-407 - the 12in version of my 9in Ikeda, my lottery win choice!
- Fidelity Research FR66S - the 'original' 12in Ikeda arm that the one above is largely a recreation of (albeit with a few improvements notably in the bearing arrangement) - not worth the money they fetch these days IMO.
- Alfred Gerd 'Ortofon' off ebay - Modified Ortofon AS-212 which is not a bad budget choice. (I had one of his early ones).

There are other vintage arms by Audiocraft, SAEC and others (including Ortofon of course), made of various grades of unobtanium, but I think the above are the main 'available' choices suitable for an SPU. Though doubtless I've forgotten some!

[montesquieu]

And I've just realised you asked about cartridges and not tonearms - well I'm damned if I'm deleting that list after typing it!

Too tired to give my view of SPUs tonight but I must have owned 8-9 over the years and heard quite a few more. Cut to the chase the best one I've heard is Petrat's 95th Anniversary model. My SPU Royal N (same as the SPU Royal without a headshell) is very good too. Vintage ones getting pricey but a lot of fun.

[Shovel_Knight]

I think Audio-Technica ATP-12 (10 in) or ATP-16 (12 in) or their siblings AT-1503/1501 can be recommended for SPU as well. They are very basic but very well made and inexpensive.

[montesquieu]

I think Audio-Technica ATP-12 (10 in) or ATP-16 (12 in) or their siblings AT-1503/1501 can be recommended for SPU as well. They are very basic but very well made and inexpensive.

Yes forgot those, I have an AT-1503 on my Garrard at the minute and previously had an ATP-12T. To be honest I don't think either are that brilliant as standard, but I had my AT-1503 modified by Angus (Phonomac) of this parish - rewired, tube damped and with hybrid ceramic bearings fitted - and the transformation was nothing short of stunning. Without the mods the sound was a bit coarse compared to the likes of an SME M2-12R.

[Shovel_Knight]

Yes forgot those, I have an AT-1503 on my Garrard at the minute and previously had an ATP-12T. To be honest I don't think either are that brilliant as standard, but I had my AT-1503 modified by Angus (Photomac) of this parish - rewired, tube damped and with hybrid ceramic bearings fitted - and the transformation was nothing short of stunning. Without the mods the sound was a bit coarse compared to the likes of an SME M2-12R.

I have a Phonomac-modified AT-1503-II as well... :)

[montesquieu]

I have a Phonomac-modified AT-1503-II as well... :)

Didn't know there was a club! :)

Mine is the MK1, slightly different base but otherwise pretty much the same. The improvement was dramatic - I was genuinely shocked.

[Shovel_Knight]

Didn't know there was a club! :)

Mine is the MK1, slightly different base but otherwise pretty much the same. The improvement was dramatic - I was genuinely shocked.

I haven’t heard mine unmodified, bought it already fettled. But I really like it.

[farflungstar]

Tom I'm also looking at arms so your thoughts are welcome. And the Audio-Creative GrooveMaster II is beautiful! Right now Carl is making me up a new, less colossal plinth for the sp10 and the audio creative would soooooo match the sp10. And it's cheap! Ok - my brains ticking.....

What about the silver meister?

[farflungstar]

Sorry just remembered you're tired. Carts another day...

[montesquieu]

What about the silver meister?

Had one and sold it to SpeedySteve - it has its fans but it was a bit too detailed for my taste .. silver coils ... I preferred the Royal N which I think has gold coils, softer and less detailed but more musical to my ears .. Steve loves the Silver Meister though and he has a Royal N too.

[montesquieu]

Tom I'm also looking at arms so your thoughts are welcome. And the Audio-Creative GrooveMaster II is beautiful!



If I was to change the Ortofon - and I'm reluctant to do that as it's very good - it would be either that or the new Jelco TK 850L or 950L. They look superb value for money.

[farflungstar]

Ortofon are out of stock of the Royal N - trying to find one in Spain.

Would you recommend the heavier titanium wand of the Audio Creative Tom?

[hifi_dave]

If you can find an FR-64S, that's about as good as it gets.

[montesquieu]

Ortofon are out of stock of the Royal N - trying to find one in Spain.

Would you recommend the heavier titanium wand of the Audio Creative Tom?

Yes if I was going for that over the Jelco TK 950L I'd definitely go titanium and get the movable base for good measure.

Do look at the Jelco, it's far and away the best arm they've ever sold under their own brand. Hugo (Ammonite) here has them in stock.


If you can find an FR-64S, that's about as good as it gets.

Agreed ... but only if you get a good one. The youngest of them is going to be 30 years old. Most at a minimum need rewiring these days and many have shot bearings and even rusty springs on the dynamic balance. I've had a couple, a good one and a bad one! My Ikeda IT-345, that is similar in most ways including all dimensions, also doubles up on bearings (vertical motion is only supported on one side of the FR vs a pair on the Ikeda). Having said that Angus (phonomac) has figured out how to service them, many tonearm people won't touch them, too complicated.

[keith1962]

I run an Audio Creative Groovemaster II with Arche headshell and Shilabe cart. Had a Moerch dp6 before it and prefer the A.C. They are modelled on the EMT arm and were made for use with SPUs as explained on the website, and A.C. are SPU dealers. My next move cart wise will be a Royal N (would love the GM for the looks alone but already have the Arche headshell and £650ish for the "grinded , wood" headshell grates (grinds) a bit). Would stick with the Shilabe if it was not for their ridiculous price now. £1100 for the Royal N is a bargain although I would forgo the Arche headshell for the A95GM!
Back to arms and I think no higher recommendation for the A.C. can be made than Matt / Audio Grail uses one on his Garrards to run high zoot Koetsus and an Audio Note Io Ltd. and it does them justice.
KR
Keith

[farflungstar]

Deleted after doing a little research!