View Full Version : Spendor SP2s
Bargain alert*** These do not come up very often!
http://www.retrotechaudio.co.uk/spendor-sp2---160118.html
Firebottle
23-01-2018, 18:15
Ooh very nice :cool:
If only I needed some speakers .......
wee tee cee
24-01-2018, 15:19
My wife adores our SP1s....she wont let me sell them!
If the SP2 is similar it will be a lovely speaker for someone.
I am actually tempted by some SP1s myself but my room is not really big enough:-(
wee tee cee
25-01-2018, 10:10
if you can ....go for it.
Try and get the open stands on castors if possible.
The Spendor SP2's have sold. That was quick.
jandl100
26-01-2018, 13:13
I had a pair of SP1/2 for a short while.
Beautiful tonality, very natural - but dynamically they were a good cure for insomnia as far as I was concerned. :zzz:
https://i.imgur.com/i9Yf1Nj.jpg
I had a pair of SP1/2 for a short while.
Beautiful tonality, very natural - but dynamically they were a good cure for insomnia as far as I was concerned. :zzz:
https://i.imgur.com/i9Yf1Nj.jpg
What do you use now Jerry?
57charles
26-01-2018, 14:54
I'm not surprised they've sold so quickly because the price was very very low especially bearing in mind the apparent superb cosmetic condition.What a bargain!
The only proviso I would have is the issue of the ferrofluid in the tweeter bearing in mind the age and the possible stiffening of the roll surround in the bass/mid unit affecting bottom end performance again due to age which appears can be an issue with some older Spendors. I have the much newer SP2/3r2 but I would have certainly considered the older version if it hadn't been for the aforementioned possible performance issues.
I'm not surprised they've sold so quickly because the price was very very low especially bearing in mind the apparent superb cosmetic condition.What a bargain!
The only proviso I would have is the issue of the ferrofluid in the tweeter bearing in mind the age and the possible stiffening of the roll surround in the bass/mid unit affecting bottom end performance again due to age which appears can be an issue with some older Spendors. I have the much newer SP2/3r2 but I would have certainly considered the older version if it hadn't been for the aforementioned possible performance issues.
The tweeters are still available new - £50 each!
wee tee cee
26-01-2018, 15:49
Jerry yer cruel man....
They are listen all day/non fatiguing delights-they do female voices as well as 57s IMHO.
jandl100
26-01-2018, 16:11
Jerry yer cruel man....
They are listen all day/non fatiguing delights-they do female voices as well as 57s IMHO.
:lol:
Yep, certainly non-fatiguing!
They bore the pants off me, but I can understand others with other priorities enjoying them for what they do well.
jandl100
26-01-2018, 16:14
What do you use now Jerry?
MBL 116F.
But I don't have to go to that much of an extreme, Spendies are just a type of presentation that doesn't appeal to me.
wee tee cee
26-01-2018, 16:40
I will get my pipe and slippers!!!
My good lady adores them to the point she allowed them in HER room...
Makes for a lovely av set up!!
57charles
26-01-2018, 17:08
My newer SP2/3r2's have a more 'modern' presentation yet retain the 'lush' character of the older models. They can be 'pipe and slippers' and they can 'rock' as well - they seem to be happy with all types of music. Spendor have recently launched the new revised Classic range with new bass units. My SP2/3r2 is now called the Classic 2/3. The most interesting is the new Classic 1/2 which I believe replaces the SP1/2r2 - it sports an interesting new cone midrange together with the 8" bass unit. I'd be interested in these but the prices of these Classic Spendors are rocketing - they are now $7795 here in USA without stands. Has anyone heard this new Classic range?
The SP2/2 was thought to have a bass hump a little way up the spectrum which was slightly overblown.
It was recommended that damping the port with foam or straws was applied.
57charles
28-01-2018, 00:55
The tweeters are still available new - £50 each!
That may well be the case but your SP2's won't be up to spec because of the bass/mid surround hardening issue. It may not bother you that they're not to factory spec but you should be aware of it nevertheless. You probably haven't noticed the reduced bottom end response if you've had them a long time. Obviously ignorance is bliss or buy a new pair (or continue to fool yourself that everything's OK with your old chuffers).
That may well be the case but your SP2's won't be up to spec because of the bass/mid surround hardening issue. It may not bother you that they're not to factory spec but you should be aware of it nevertheless. You probably haven't noticed the reduced bottom end response if you've had them a long time. Obviously ignorance is bliss or buy a new pair (or continue to fool yourself that everything's OK with your old chuffers).
My mid/bass rubber surround has not hardened on my pair of speakers. Not doubt they are not the same specification as new but they sound great still. You haven't mentioned the deterioration in the caps on the crossover yet.
57charles
29-01-2018, 00:58
My mid/bass rubber surround has not hardened on my pair of speakers. Not doubt they are not the same specification as new but they sound great still. You haven't mentioned the deterioration in the caps on the crossover yet.
How do you know they haven't hardened? The effect of hardening takes place gradually over a long period of time - the low end response will be gradually reducing over this time period and you will be oblivious to it until you have an A/B demo between your own old speakers and the latest versions which incidentally will not suffer from this as Spendor have addressed the problem in newer versions. The effect of the surrounds hardening on your speakers is far far more noticable than any possible effect of aging caps - that's why I never mentioned the crossover. Glad you enjoy the sound of your speakers - just remember, they're probably compromised in the low end response due to this well know surround problem.
Maybe your right but I have never felt they lacked any bass response, certainly in my small room. They are 30 years old now so I expect they have drifted from their original specification. I believe the rubber cone surrounds can be replaced so this might be worth doing?
jandl100
29-01-2018, 09:31
Perhaps it's a case of be careful what you wish for.
Changing the surrounds and increasing the bass may sound better, or it may be too much if you have a small room.
Perhaps it's a case of be careful what you wish for.
Changing the surrounds and increasing the bass may sound better, or it may be too much if you have a small room.
Very true Jerry, I feel I have enough bass already. I have already been advised by a room acoustic expert that it's much better to have speakers that perform OK in a room rather than to overload the room and try and modify the acoustic structure.
IMO to use the deterioration in compliance of a driver surround as a design factor in a system is ethically wrong.
The surround is also used to absorb waves travelling along the cone from the V/C to prevent their reflection back to it, and a hardened one will be less absorbent, thus colouring the mid range with the reflected waves.
Changing bass O/P should be done in the driver/box alignment, and there are several means of doing it..
IMO to use the deterioration in compliance of a driver surround as a design factor in a system is ethically wrong.
The surround is also used to absorb waves travelling along the cone from the V/C to prevent their reflection back to it, and a hardened one will be less absorbent, thus colouring the mid range with the reflected waves.
Changing bass O/P should be done in the driver/box alignment, and there are several means of doing it..
Pity I can't get these drive units anymore, no one I have contacted will change the rubber surrounds either so I just have to live with them. Good job they still sound very good indeed.
57charles
29-01-2018, 21:24
Pity I can't get these drive units anymore, no one I have contacted will change the rubber surrounds either so I just have to live with them. Good job they still sound very good indeed.
So long as you know that basically your speakers are not Spendor SP2 original factory spec and that they don't sound as they were originally designed to do.
Bigman80
29-01-2018, 22:51
Well, by this logic, no one's sound "as they left the factory"
I've heard your speakers Jimbo, they were cracking!!
brian2957
29-01-2018, 22:56
So have I , and in James room they sound excellent :)
57charles
30-01-2018, 01:41
As long as Jimbo can live with the fact that they have deteriorated from the original spec then that's OK then. Ignorance is bliss.
jandl100
30-01-2018, 07:12
As long as Jimbo can live with the fact that they have deteriorated from the original spec then that's OK then. Ignorance is bliss.
Ah.
If only everyone's system was as perfect as yours undoubtedly is.
A hopeless dream, of course. :(
Bigman80
30-01-2018, 07:33
As long as Jimbo can live with the fact that they have deteriorated from the original spec then that's OK then. Ignorance is bliss.Everything deteriorates.
Replace the drivers in your speakers every year do you?
So long as you know that basically your speakers are not Spendor SP2 original factory spec and that they don't sound as they were originally designed to do.
Charles, I don't think many folk who have old speakers expect them to sound as original factory spec!!!:doh:
Everything deteriorates.
Replace the drivers in your speakers every year do you?
True Oli, everything changes in the audio chain, some for good and some bad. Most equipment needs to run in and will change slightly over the course of its life. Caps deteriorate as do stylus. So what, you live with those changes if they still sound good or you replace.
Not sure why Charles has got his knickers in a twist about "original factory spec". I expect many folk have speakers or equipped that has drifted from factory spec, especially if it's old.
Bigman80
30-01-2018, 08:43
True Oli, everything changes in the audio chain, some for good and some bad. Most equipment needs to run in and will change slightly over the course of its life. Caps deteriorate as do stylus. So what, you live with those changes if they still sound good or you replace.
Not sure why Charles has got his knickers in a twist about "original factory spec". I expect many folk have speakers or equipped that has drifted from factory spec, especially if it's old.Speakers are made with tolerance, the same as everything else mate. If a Capacitor or resistor is out of tolerance, we change it bur thats Not easy when you're using speakers from 1971!!! (mine) also, where are the specs for tolerance of rubber surrounds movement and vibration resistance and how is it measured!!! What a load of bollocks. Obviously, if there is sag or a bulge under the weight of a driver then sure, that'd need changing but come on!!!! I've NEVER seen that in a quality speaker of this calibre.
It's incredible that such a statement has been made that "ignorance" is playing a part in your pleasure and your speakers are inferior due to their age!!!
Ridiculous.
Enjoy your speakers mate. I really did.
Firebottle
30-01-2018, 08:43
I don't believe that the type of rubber used will harden over time.
In my experience when rubber hardens it takes on a matt looking surface and eventually starts to show fine surface cracks.
I also was under the impression that a woofers resonant frequency drops as it gets older due to lower stiffness, though this may be in the spider primarily.
I cannot remember the surrounds from seeing them in about '93, but I think they are similar to my own on LS 5/8 mid/woofers which are a PVC based plastic, though I have seen it described as neoprene. It is not particularly springy, less so than rubber, and has more damping.
This material was chosen for its longevity and stability, foam being the worst these respects.
Alan is right about rubber.
Speakers are made with tolerance, the same as everything else mate. If a Capacitor or resistor is out of tolerance, we change it bur thats Not easy when you're using speakers from 1971!!! (mine) also, where are the specs for tolerance of rubber surrounds movement and vibration resistance and how is it measured!!! What a load of bollocks. Obviously, if there is sag or a bulge under the weight of a driver then sure, that'd need changing but come on!!!! I've NEVER seen that in a quality speaker of this calibre.
It's incredible that such a statement has been made that "ignorance" is playing a part in your pleasure and your speakers are inferior due to their age!!!
Ridiculous.
Enjoy your speakers mate. I really did.
Just a bit annoying when someone makes statements in such a condescending manner. A good proportion of us folk here on AOS use old speakers and a aware of the possible changes in their structure due to their age but unless they sound terrible or even affect the sound audibly to a negative degree, we live with them.
One of the reasons I still use the original SP2 is because on later models they changed the cone material and specification and they did not sound as good. Maybe it was down to cheaper production techniques or cost cutting but to my ears the SP2/2 and SP2/3 don't sound as good.
So what does that say, buy new in spec speakers that sound inferior or live with old out of spec speakers that sound great!:lol:
Old speakers Don't need to have gone backwards at all. Mine are about as old as me and sound terrific. Wish I had fared as well
Old speakers Don't need to have gone backwards at all. Mine are about as old as me and sound terrific. Wish I had fared as well
:lol:
Bigman80
30-01-2018, 09:55
I wonder why so many of us have "old, out of spec" speakers? Must be because we're deaf :mental:
walpurgis
30-01-2018, 09:59
Speakers are generally regarded as having a 'break-in' period.
Surely once break-in has occured, the speakers are no longer at their 'as new' manufacturer's spec? The cones having established break-up patterns within their material structure and the suspension gaining greater compliance. So would the post 'break-in' spec be the aimed for and correct spec?
A comparison would be interesting. New speakers measured straight out of the box, then similar speakers tested after say six months of hard use.
Speakers are generally regarded as having a 'break-in' period.
Surely once break-in has occured, the speakers are no longer at their 'as new' manufacturer's spec? The cones having established break-up patterns within their material structure and the suspension gaining greater compliance. So would the post 'break-in' spec be the aimed for and correct spec?
A comparison would be interesting. New speakers measured straight out of the box, then similar speakers tested after say six months of hard use.
I have heard a lot of speakers 'break in' at my friends dealership. He has new stuff all the time which I get to hear out of the box as it were and I have heard some dramatic differences from new to 6 months 'break in' especially with a recent pair of YG Hailey speakers which have metal cones. Don't think the cone material changes much but the rubber surround surely does. Then does that stay the same for a period or does it constantly change?
57charles
30-01-2018, 14:47
I wonder why so many of us have "old, out of spec" speakers? Must be because we're deaf :mental:
The problem with the hardening of the surrounds on many of the old Spendor speakers is a well known one - I'm surprised you're not aware of this. Of course things age but this particular problem is well documented one.Apparently application of brake fluid has been used to good effect - mentioned by DSJR on this forum a number of times. Why don't you do your research before making general statements? It's common sense that many things age and deteriorate - everyone appreciates that - it's just that this hardening problem with old Spendors can be quite pronounced over time.:lol
doesn't have to happen though.
Bigman80
30-01-2018, 16:18
The problem with the hardening of the surrounds on many of the old Spendor speakers is a well known one - I'm surprised you're not aware of this. Of course things age but this particular problem is well documented one.Apparently application of brake fluid has been used to good effect - mentioned by DSJR on this forum a number of times. Why don't you do your research before making general statements? It's common sense that many things age and deteriorate - everyone appreciates that - it's just that this hardening problem with old Spendors can be quite pronounced over time.[emoji38]Is it general to say a lot of us have old speakers ? I don't think so,
So, do you change your driver's frequently?
The problem with the hardening of the surrounds on many of the old Spendor speakers is a well known one - I'm surprised you're not aware of this. Of course things age but this particular problem is well documented one.Apparently application of brake fluid has been used to good effect - mentioned by DSJR on this forum a number of times. Why don't you do your research before making general statements? It's common sense that many things age and deteriorate - everyone appreciates that - it's just that this hardening problem with old Spendors can be quite pronounced over time.:lol
I am fully aware of hardening surrounds on Spendor speakers but it does not affect every speaker they manufactured as this was dependent on their use and storage. I spoke to Spendor concerning brake fluid and they winced and advised very guardedly that this was not something they would recommend. I have owned my Speakers from new for the last 30 years, your presumption is that I am not aware of any issues with them!:steam:
Bigman80
30-01-2018, 16:38
I am fully aware of hardening surrounds on Spendor speakers but it does not affect every speaker they manufactured as this was dependent on their use and storage. I spoke to Spendor concerning brake fluid and they winced and advised very guardedly that this was not something they would recommend. I have owned my Speakers from new for the last 30 years, your presumption is that I am not aware of any issues with them!:steam:His presumption also appear to be that yours have hardened and are therefore inferior.
They sound great Jim, and there was no audible sign of hardened surrounds.
His presumption also appear to be that yours have hardened and are therefore inferior.
They sound great Jim, and there was no audible sign of hardened surrounds.
I really like advice and feedback on this forum as we all do and I appreciate your comments Oli. I would be concerned if there was any physical or audible signs of deterioration with the surrounds but there isn't. I knew of the possibility of hardening of the surround many years ago as a few early SP2 speakers did suffer however I have never seen any myself.
As a consequence I have kept mine in a room with and ambient temperature between 15-20oC and they have never been in direct sunlight or affected by the fire. I actually use heat deflectors when the fire is on!:)
57charles
30-01-2018, 17:38
His presumption also appear to be that yours have hardened and are therefore inferior.
They sound great Jim, and there was no audible sign of hardened surrounds.
If you read my posts carefully, you'll see I presume nothing. I merely pointed out that there can be an issue and that it can occur over a long period of ownership which means that it may not be noticeable as the bottom end response would tend to GRADUALLY reduce over a long time. So if the speakers are affected, the owner may not even realise the speakers have a problem. With regard to the brake fluid issue, I read it originally on this very forum and was only trying to offer information. If you don't like the advice then simply ignore it. I have no idea if these speakers are affected but they may be. Just pointing out possible issues. edited out
Bigman80
30-01-2018, 19:24
If you read my posts carefully, you'll see I presume nothing. I merely pointed out that there can be an issue and that it can occur over a long period of ownership which means that it may not be noticeable as the bottom end response would tend to GRADUALLY reduce over a long time. So if the speakers are affected, the owner may not even realise the speakers have a problem. With regard to the brake fluid issue, I read it originally on this very forum and was only trying to offer information. If you don't like the advice then simply ignore it. I have no idea if these speakers are affected but they may be. Just pointing out possible issues. edited out[edited] Oooh. Did someone get a bit spicy? 🤣
Lighten up Charles, no one is acusing you of being wrong about the degradation of materials. Just that in this instance, you seem to be directly assessing Jimbos speakers and you did say they weren't as good as they should be. You also said he was ignorant (which provided bliss).
It's not the point, it's the way you went about making it.
57charles
30-01-2018, 19:26
I really like advice and feedback on this forum as we all do and I appreciate your comments Oli. I would be concerned if there was any physical or audible signs of deterioration with the surrounds but there isn't. I knew of the possibility of hardening of the surround many years ago as a few early SP2 speakers did suffer however I have never seen any myself.
As a consequence I have kept mine in a room with and ambient temperature between 15-20oC and they have never been in direct sunlight or affected by the fire. I actually use heat deflectors when the fire is on!:)
I don't believe ambient conditions are a factor - as far as I know, it was the surround compound itself that was a problem and hardened over time - irrespective of any external influence... AGE basically affected the properties of the surround - restricted excursion of said surround and thus changed the basic response and presentation of the speaker.
Bigman80
30-01-2018, 19:28
I don't believe ambient conditions are a factor - as far as I know, it was the surround compound itself that was a problem and hardened over time - irrespective of any external influence... AGE basically affected the properties of the surround - restricted excursion of said surround and thus changed the basic response and presentation of the speaker.What about direct sunlight?
why the attitude? all your posts in this thread have it,strange.
57 Charles I want no more please. That goes for everyone else
No more or I will lock thread
brian2957
30-01-2018, 19:46
I am fully aware of hardening surrounds on Spendor speakers but it does not affect every speaker they manufactured as this was dependent on their use and storage. I spoke to Spendor concerning brake fluid and they winced and advised very guardedly that this was not something they would recommend. I have owned my Speakers from new for the last 30 years, your presumption is that I am not aware of any issues with them!:steam:
Brake fluid is pretty nasty stuff James and should be kept in its container until you need to top up the brake fluid in your car , at which point I would be taking it to the garage for a check :)
Brake fluid is pretty nasty stuff James and should be kept in its container until you need to top up the brake fluid in your car , at which point I would be taking it to the garage for a check :)
:lol:
I think Charles some of your posts came across as condescending especially when you suggested I would be 'fooling' myself into believing my speakers sounded ok.
I welcome advice but not when it's put across in the manner you have chosen. I have been using SP2s for 30 years and am fully aware of all the issues surrounding them including the fact that the modern ones that you have chosen don't sound as good, that is why I have held onto mine.
A good few folk on here have joined in this post because at least 3 of them have actually heard my speakers so they have experience of their sound.
The fact that some of your posts may have been 'edited' maybe because you went even further in your remarks in a rather negative manner. I have not seen these and would welcome Marco to review them.
This is a polite, friendly forum and it is always a good idea to respect this.
Charles, jamie and oliver... When i say stop, please do that. If you have an issue raise it correctly to a moderator, and don't start arguments and dish out insults no matter how funny you might think they are or how right you may think you are.
I've only just been made aware of the 'fracas' here, so will review matters and make comment accordingly, but that may not be until tomorrow (after which if everyone behaves the thread may be re-opened), as I'm rather busy just now!
Marco.
Ok guys having read through this thread, and witnessed the 'handbags' that occurred, I'm going to reopen it under certain conditions, after I've briefly dealt with what happened.
There was fault on all sides of the protagonists, some of it due to defensive behaviour, and an intolerance towards criticism and/or well-intended, but perhaps not best expressed advice, and some of the fault was due to folk not knowing when to shut up and let things go, or for rudely, and rather provocatively, referring to people as "sunshine", the same of which could also be said for abbreviating someone's name, without having asked them first, which is rather inconsiderate.
However, sometimes these things happen on forums, when knowledgeable and passionate people are discussing something close to their heart, and only have the power of a keyboard, and the limitation of the written word, to get their points across, so we'll let it go.
Therefore, I'll reopen this thread, as it was otherwise an interesting discussion, on the STRICT understanding that everyone moves on and doesn't attempt to question my summary above or fan the flames any further, by regurgitating the argument, which caused the thread to be closed in the first place.
Also, when a moderator tells someone to stop their unacceptable behaviour, then they must comply immediately, without any 'backchat', as the moderator in question will have taken the decision to pull up the offender for good reason, and so the matter is NOT up for debate. In future, anyone who fails to comply with that, after any more than two warnings, will be out for a week.
That also applies now to anyone who doesn't comply with what is stated above in bold. If so, not only will they be out for a week, without any further warning, but their posts on the matter will be immediately removed, so please don't waste your time, or make me have to ban anyone.
Ok, on that note, let's continue discussing the speakers in question, politely and constructively, with *no mention whatsoever* of the previous argument, any reference to it, or my above summary of the matter. Cheers! :)
Marco.
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