View Full Version : Not a Copper DAC
Well...my pre-amp says it all.
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/DSC_0002.jpg
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/DSC_0004.jpg
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/DSC_0073.jpg
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j280/Stevewaller/DSC_0066.jpg
The Vinyl Adventure
26-02-2010, 19:28
Ha that's amazing, I been planning on making my majik ds say "I work best with a copper dac" for ages now!!
I'm only following your lead in kit you know Hamish...
...anyway. Just to say that this Dac is gob-smackingly wonderful.
Thankyou Duncan.
Looks great in your system and no doubts sounds even better
Hi Steve,
Looking good! Is it settling in nicely now? :)
I thought it sounded excellent in my system the other day. All you need is some glowy things elsewhere now :eyebrows: ;)
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
26-02-2010, 19:50
I'm only following your lead in kit you know Hamish...
Ahh, tis the path of the rightous! (or something ;) )
you got your eye on a majik ds then matey?
The Vinyl Adventure
26-02-2010, 19:51
Hi Steve,
Looking good! Is it settling in nicely now? :)
I thought it sounded excellent in my system the other day. All you need is some glowy things elsewhere now :eyebrows: ;)
Marco.
+1 ... In fact I'd be willing to give up my place in the AnthonyTd cue for my phono pre amp for another aos member to get a tube distinction aos custom valve amp
Ahh, tis the path of the rightous! (or something ;) )
you got your eye on a majik ds then matey?
Well.... sort of had other thoughts about that now.
Again its down to Duncan. His Sony PS3 playing FLACS through one of his DACS is just sublime...and of course a fraction of the cost.
But in honesty, I'd have to hear to compare.
Hi Steve,
Looking good! Is it settling in nicely now? :)
I thought it sounded excellent in my system the other day. All you need is some glowy things elsewhere now :eyebrows: ;)
Marco.
Settling in?? I don't know where to start. Its just brilliant.
To explain, after Marco and I had listened in his system I tootled off home to sort it all out.
Thank god I had heard what it can do in a serious system. Comparing it with Marco's Sony DAC was interesting. Was it better? I'll leave that for Marco to say.
A different presentation is what I would say..more pronounced in some areas...less subtle.. I dunno.
Anyway...after a bit of heaving Klouts around in a constricted space, I was good to go.
edit to clarify...the dac is fed by a linn Ikemi, via co-ax cable.
It sounded horrible.
I tried all sorts of CD's but the high end was just toooo screechy. Van Morrisons voice set your teeth on edge. I was considering all sorts... Was it a system synergy thing? The Linn set up not appropriate for such a revealing DAC ??
There was detail in abundance, but I couldn't have lived with it.
In the morning I swapped for Linn Genki I use in the kitchen.... not a lot better really.
Then I swapped the coax for optical.
HALLELUJAH as my old mate Leonard would have said.
Just wonderful.
(suspicion lies with the cable I was using)
Now, I recognise speakers as small as mine just cannot shift the air and have the same presence as Marcos'...but I've never heard my system sound like this.
In fact I never thought it could.
Music is presented with REAL sound stage..
Its a joy to revisit CD's I thought I knew well... all that malarky.
Glowy things...:eek::eek::eek: Now, there's a thought. But that's for next January, and the funds to do it with.
Hi Steve,
Thank god I had heard what it can do in a serious system. Comparing it with Marco's Sony DAC was interesting. Was it better? I'll leave that for Marco to say.
A different presentation is what I would say..more pronounced in some areas...less subtle.. I dunno.
Dunc's Wolfson (your DAC) was VERY good. It had that 'valve thing' going on, and thus had more air and space around upper frequencies than the Sony, and as a result was able to resolve more filigree detail, making voices and instruments sound that little clearer and better defined.
Bass was very good, too - perhaps too good in my system - and had an addictive and propulsive rhythmic quality, which drove the music along with precision and pace. The midrange was very open and revealing too, but not 'forensic' to the point of being fatiguing - all in all I was very impressed.
The Sony, though, as we both thought when listening, was just that bit more finessed and refined sounding, and held music 'together' better in a more cohesive whole, so that you were really drawn into the musical performance and not simply sitting back admiring the sonic fireworks. It also made Dunc's DAC appear as a little 'rushed' and slightly 'uncouth' in comparison in terms of their respective ways of music-making, but this did not detract at all from its 'fun factor'.
One must remember that we're comparing a highly 'race-tuned' statement, cost-no-object DAC from a major multi-national manufacturer, against a design from a very talented D.I.Y-er, with the former being considerably more expensive than the latter, yet the latter still able to compete with, and in some areas better the Sony, which is a major achievement for Duncan's DAC :)
Was the gain ok then in your system? It was a bit too much in mine, with it kicking out 4.5V - more than double that of a normal DAC, which meant that I didn't have ideal control of the volume on my preamp. In fairness, though, your DAC wasn't really designed to be used with an additional active preamp, as the high output allows it to be used as preamp itself, via an external volume pot, which is how Duncan uses his designs.
You've got a very special piece of kit there, which will have even more to come from it after all the components run-in. Knowing Duncan, I'm sure there is still some further tweaking to go that will likely raise its performance still further, and which will be easily implemented into the existing circuitry - so you've got that to look forward to still. However in the meantime, just sit back and enjoy the music reproduced by a very fine DAC, which I'm sure you will do.
Anyway, enjoy your new DAC and when the time comes to upgrade your system, you know that I'll be on hand to offer any advice, and you're more than welcome to come round again any time for a sesh :cool:
Marco.
We should get the Marketing people at Williams Audio to look at their 'branding'.
I mean, what sort of name is 'Not a Copper DAC' ??
In my view, a much better name would have been, ' Not an Op Amp DAC'.
Didn't have any problem at all with gain.. which is a relief.
If I can get my act together, I will bring this along to Scalford. (Love to hear what a DS sounds like through this Hamish !!)
The Grand Wazoo
27-02-2010, 09:58
We should get the Marketing people at Williams Audio to look at their 'branding'.
I mean, what sort of name is 'Not a Copper DAC' ??
NACDAC's not so bad though!
The Vinyl Adventure
27-02-2010, 10:36
Steve
it's not looking like I'm going to make it to scalford now, I had my doubts about going anyway and then I had an last minute enquiery about a wedding job - nothing has come of it, but then last week I took a booking for photographing the equipment and owner of a kids disco and ball pit hire company(she wants photos of her froliking in the ball pit.. HA!!).
If you really want to hear a majik your welcome to pop in at some point... I'm going to try and borrow a ps3 see what all the fuss is about.
The Vinyl Adventure
27-02-2010, 10:53
that makes mine an ACDAC and if you watch this trailor for baraka at exactly one minute in you will see some people praying to the same god that duncan must summon when making his creations
"ACDAC DAC DAC DAC DAC DAC DAC DAC"
check it -
XO1nSVy8q8I
The Grand Wazoo
27-02-2010, 10:57
hahahaha...
Or what about this?
KYK3Fz6pXnA
The Vinyl Adventure
27-02-2010, 11:48
ha! ace!
I was planning on bringing a copper DAC It might not have the same resolution as yours Steve as earlier model but creates music
Steve
it's not looking like I'm going to make it to scalford now, I had my doubts about going anyway and then I had an last minute enquiery about a wedding job - nothing has come of it, but then last week I took a booking for photographing the equipment and owner of a kids disco and ball pit hire company(she wants photos of her froliking in the ball pit.. HA!!).
If you really want to hear a majik your welcome to pop in at some point... I'm going to try and borrow a ps3 see what all the fuss is about.
Be interesting to see if there is a difference in performance. We have a PS3 down in the basement where we normally store children..:eek:
We have an Arcam surround system for movies (it does blue-ray) and my son's games. I've got it hard wired by ethernet to an apple imac... but cannot get it to play music. Very occasionally I get it to work with a media server...but it often freezes. Possibly an instance where a pc is actually better than a mac.
Anyway...thanks for the offer, may well take you up on it !
I was planning on bringing a copper DAC It might not have the same resolution as yours Steve as earlier model but creates music
I bet it does !
Well, as I've experienced this last couple of days a lot of these things are very system dependent.
The Vinyl Adventure
27-02-2010, 17:11
agreed, before the lowering of the voltage i had crazy ott treble .. somthing that others had aparently not experienced
I had no issues with the treble myself It goes directly into my power amp
agreed, before the lowering of the voltage i had crazy ott treble .. somthing that others had aparently not experienced
Maybe this is the same issue I have... I'm presuming the optical output wouldn't be subject to high output?
The Vinyl Adventure
28-02-2010, 14:07
I dunno how these things work mate, but For me it wasn't anything to do with the signal going into the dac, i only used coaxial as I had had mike homar make me one of his snazzy cables... But I don't think the situation would have been any different if I had used optical... When I fisrt got the copper dac it had a much higher output (9v instead of the 2v it has now I think?) and for whatever reason it didn't cause my system to distort as such it just made the trebble sound over ephasised and almost too detailed!
Hasn't your one got a slightly higher output?
Maybe you should try some of Paul's ("primalsea" is his name on here) in line atenuators, I bought them as a stop gap before Duncan changed the level on my dac, but I actually still use them on and off, I have been doing a lot of late night listening recently and they give me a bit more ability to get the volume right for late nights with the stepped atenuator in my pre. It would apear that they don't have much if any negative effect on the sound quality, although it is very difficult to tell for sure...
....sorry, its me being bleedin thick. Of course the optical is an input and sounds great...so the coax should be the same, except it isn't and therefore the problem must be with the cable i used between cd and dac.
I have a hangover.
The Vinyl Adventure
28-02-2010, 14:47
....sorry, its me being bleedin thick. Of course the optical is an input and sounds great...so the coax should be the same, except it isn't and therefore the problem must be with the cable i used between cd and dac.
that sounds fairly logical to me, try one of these if your keen to use coax http://markgrantcables.co.uk/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=40_3&products_id=183 or ask mike homar to make you one of his cables. i have both and have settled on mikes cable - im not sure if there was much if any difference but mikes cost me more so i use it :eek:
http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww282/hamish_gill/59d38dd1.jpg
I have a hangover.
right there with you buddy!
........
for referance, these are pauls attenuators
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/14db-HIFI-Attenuators-Reduce-Harshness-Fatigue_W0QQitemZ300401497057QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH _DefaultDomain_3?hash=item45f15313e1
http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww282/hamish_gill/0c14ae1f.jpg
Just to finish off my particular tale...
My initial problems of screechy treble seemed to stem from the cable. This is absolutely correct.
I ordered a Mark Grant G1000HD co-ax with the BNC (?) end to it. (and thanks for the offer Ian, but decided to give Mark's cable a try...OK, fueled by a couple of large glasses of red :cool:)
It arrived yesterday. After an initial panic of hearing nothing, I realised I'd put a DVD into the CD player (damn these 2 disc sets)
Suffice to say, it now outperforms the optical. Sounds have gone all 3D.
In fact, I'm amazed just how good my system is sounding now.
Thanks again Duncan. :clap:
...and also Mark for producing such superb cables at an affordable price ;)
:)
Marco.
Well, Dave, we've got some wonderful people (and products) at our fingertips here on AOS, n'est-ce pas? :)
Marco.
Ian Walker
12-03-2010, 15:53
Just to finish off my particular tale...
My initial problems of screechy treble seemed to stem from the cable. This is absolutely correct.
I ordered a Mark Grant G1000HD co-ax with the BNC (?) end to it. (and thanks for the offer Ian, but decided to give Mark's cable a try...OK, fueled by a couple of large glasses of red :cool:)
It arrived yesterday. After an initial panic of hearing nothing, I realised I'd put a DVD into the CD player (damn these 2 disc sets)
Suffice to say, it now outperforms the optical. Sounds have gone all 3D.
In fact, I'm amazed just how good my system is sounding now.
Thanks again Duncan. :clap:
No worries Steve glad you got it sorted..
Thats the "only" downside to the PS3,it has optical only which sounds good but it would be nice to be able to experiment with coax too.
Ian.
No worries Steve glad you got it sorted..
Thats the "only" downside to the PS3,it has optical only which sounds good but it would be nice to be able to experiment with coax too.
Ian.
Well...that 'downside' isn't really. I've now tried the airport express into Duncan's DAC via optical. It is OK, or even rather good, but doesn't have that 3D presentation I'm now getting from CD.
So...I have a cunning plan.
Playstation feeding optical. If I can run a very long optical cable, I could have a PS3 under the telly giving its display but audio through the main system.
Playstation feeding optical. If I can run a very long optical cable, I could have a PS3 under the telly giving its display but audio through the main system.
That's exactly how mine works (6m cable) - sounds much better into the Caiman than direct into the amp via RCA.
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