Quad ESL 57s [Archive] - The Art of Sound Forum

dantheman91

24-12-2017, 19:51

Hi Guys

I'm looking out for a pair to complete my 60's Quad collection - I have found a pair for a very reasonable price of £240 but their untested and have been garage stored - are they worth the risk silly question i know they are but what are current value for new panels and EHT units if they need them? How would i go about full testing them if bought as i dont they they have been used for many many years...?

Look in really good condition but no legs...:scratch:

Let me know the +'s and -'s before committing Its one of those i'm going to have to try one day regardless pice is very very fair their in TQ13 Newton abbot if i agree to buy can anyone help get them to me here in bournemouth?

Thank you
Daniel

nutteronthebus

25-12-2017, 09:24

Hi I have just acquired a set of these and this site is a good place to start http://www.keith-snook.info/loud-speaker-stuff/QUAD-ESL57/QUAD-Hi-Fi-ESL57.html
the other thing they are large with a small sweet spot make sure that SHMBO likes them as my wife went ape ( they are now in my man cave AKA shed )

Dave

ps I also have a The Quad ESL Refurbishing
Picture Book
Sheldon D. Stokes Ph.D.
stokes@spinn.net
http://www.quadesl.com
in PDF form 7mb if you want it

Audio Al

25-12-2017, 09:43

Have £1K spare just in case they need a rebuild by Quad or One thing audio , Mid and treble are lovely slightly lacking in bass

You realy should go and audition them , Train bus walk or you may end up with a £250 project .

Barry

25-12-2017, 15:49

Have £1K spare just in case they need a rebuild by Quad or One thing audio , Mid and treble are lovely slightly lacking in bass

You really should go and audition them , Train bus walk or you may end up with a £250 project .

Yep - what Al says.

If it were me, I would jump at the chance to obtain a pair at that price. You don't need the legs if you put them on stands. I've listened to nothing but Quad 57s in my system for the last 45 years!

Go for it! :)

dantheman91

10-03-2018, 08:16

Hi Guys

Another pair has come my way we a discussing price at the moment again they have been sat for a while possibly years if purchased what would be the best way to test them and how will i come buy the Bulgin plugs as theirs not supplied with them i am Looking for help here guys and who knows i may have a very tasty pair of 57's on the way...

:)

Thank you

mikeyb

10-03-2018, 08:29

These.....[emoji4]

http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=56560

struth

10-03-2018, 08:39

its bulgin

wee tee cee

10-03-2018, 09:53

I would encourage you to hear them before purchase, to make sure they are ok.

You can get bulgin plugs on e bay..

Audio Al

10-03-2018, 09:53

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2380057.m570.l1311.R4.TR12.TRC2.A0.H1.TRS 0&_nkw=bulgin+plug&_sacat=0

dantheman91

10-03-2018, 11:57

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2380057.m570.l1311.R4.TR12.TRC2.A0.H1.TRS 0&_nkw=bulgin+plug&_sacat=0

Cheers Al...

dantheman91

10-03-2018, 11:59

I would encourage you to hear them before purchase, to make sure they are ok.

You can get bulgin plugs on e bay..

Hi Tony

Their from an auction so i am not sure i would be allowed to test them but i can only ask....:) How would i go about the process of testing what do i need to need to look out for fault wise can they just be plug and play i have see most for spares or repair - yours look blooming lovely....

Thank you

struth

10-03-2018, 12:26

trouble with these is, if they need redone by quad, its a lot of wonga.

hifi_dave

10-03-2018, 12:37

They can have numerous problems, especially if they have been stored in a shed or garage for years. The only way to check, is to fire them up to warm and then play.

wee tee cee

10-03-2018, 14:26

If they have not been in use for ages they will need quite a while-maybe an hour to charge up properly.

The should be silent when charging no crackles or rustling sounds.

On playing them you want to make sure all the panels are making sound-treble in the middle and bass panels either side.

They dont like damp or humid conditions-depends where and how they have been stored.

Look at them when playing, any sparks on the panels or crackles in the sound means they are arcing.

Ive found the 57s to be more robust than my 63s.

If you get a pair fit limiters to protect them and Ive found the OTA widgets to be an asset when using SS amps.

Hope that helps.

dantheman91

10-03-2018, 14:43

Thank you Dave . Grant and Tony

Here is hoping :)

wee tee cee

10-03-2018, 15:05

Dan,
Your welcome-they make music beautifully....female voices like Ella are spellbinding.

farflungstar

10-03-2018, 16:07

I would love to be in the UK and get these. I've always wanted to try them and can't imagine finding a better looking pair. Unfortunately shipping to me would involve a bloody lot of packing and worry grrr

speedracer

10-03-2018, 18:41

dantheman91

10-03-2018, 19:19

Dan, there is a guy in Poole who is a wizard with all Quad gear & electrostatics in particular. He is semi retired now but does take work in as & when he feels like it, I could give you his number if you like?
He is likely to be a whole lot cheaper than One Thing or Quad as well.

Hi Brook

Yes i know Ian Piper well and have known him for a good few years many times taking gear over their with my dad wonderful guy i may give him a shout to test them not seen him since march last year i hope he is well.

Thank you for recommendation

:)

dantheman91

12-03-2018, 09:27

I am collecting them either Wednesday or Friday this week

:yay:

struth

12-03-2018, 09:46

good luck Dan. hope they are workers:)

dantheman91

12-03-2018, 09:49

I hope so too grant....

dantheman91

12-03-2018, 09:50

Just some info the serial numbers are really close 13765 & 13753 also :) date from 1964.....

:)

wee tee cee

12-03-2018, 15:25

Fingers crossed for you Dan...Let us know how you get on.

Ammonite Audio

13-03-2018, 11:00

Quad 57s are simultaneously the world's best and worst speakers. Everyone should own a pair at some point since what they do well is utterly magical and their faults are relatively easy to overlook. It's a crying shame that any money spent on bringing a pair up to full working specs, either by Quad, One Thing etc, is not reflected in their market value. So, preserving and servicing these things is best done for love, and there's nothing wrong with that!

dantheman91

13-03-2018, 16:33

Hi Hugo

I'm going in with an open mind i am also getting the Professionally tested once collected if i knew the history of them i know they had power cables so may have been in regular use who knows i have got to get them either for ownership of the most iconic speaker ever made..

I also need to know the best way to transport them?

Thanks guys.

Firebottle

13-03-2018, 19:24

Wrap each one in a quilt and put then on the back seat of your car held by the seat belts.

Worked for me.

struth

13-03-2018, 19:56

And hope armed cops don't pull u. [emoji23]

Audio Al

14-03-2018, 04:14

I used a old duvet , I use it for conventional speakers as well ;)

dantheman91

14-03-2018, 15:36

They are Here

:eek:

Hopefully borrowing a pair of cables this weekend to test them....:)

walpurgis

14-03-2018, 15:38

They are Here

If you've not used a pair before, you're in for a bit of a culture shock Dan. There's nothing else quite like them.

dantheman91

14-03-2018, 15:53

Hi Geoff

i have never used a pair my dad has had 2 sets one pair in the in the late 90's and was given a pair in 2003 from a HI-FI shop in Poole. I do hope they work they are in very clean condition they were bought privately from a local Auction as on the day they did not sell so an offer approved couple days of waiting and i now officially out of room....

Fingers Crossed....:)

dantheman91

14-03-2018, 18:31

Quick Photo....:)

struth

14-03-2018, 18:54

Look decent Dan. Nice one

Barry

14-03-2018, 18:59

Quick Photo....:)

They look to be in excellent condition Dan. Mount them on 10" high stands and feed them with a suitable amplifier and you will be in for a treat! :)

wee tee cee

14-03-2018, 19:02

Give them plenty of time to charge up before making any judgements.

Hope they are gooduns.....you will hear what all the fuss is about!

Barry

14-03-2018, 19:19

Give them plenty of time to charge up before making any judgements.

Hope they are gooduns.....you will hear what all the fuss is about!

One hour should be ample. Usually 20 minutes is more than sufficient, but if they haven't been used for a long time, give them longer.

dantheman91

16-03-2018, 05:44

I have a pair of perfect stands Barry i am still looking for a pair of plugs decent ones are hard to find may i think i can borrow a pair this weekend here is hoping...

wee tee cee

16-03-2018, 09:18

OTA sell IEC sockets if you cant source bulgin plugs...

Pharos

16-03-2018, 13:34

What do you mean by "plugs"? Bulgin floating sockets or fixed chassis plugs?

dantheman91

16-03-2018, 15:40

Hi Dennis

These ones are what i need....:)

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=bulgin+3+pin&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjS0YWvlvHZAhXSxqQKHc-tBFMQ_AUICigB#imgrc=0bE2wpkFrl3RKM:

Cheers

walpurgis

16-03-2018, 15:45

dantheman91

16-03-2018, 15:56

Bulgin three pin mains line socket.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bulgin-3-Pin-Line-Socket-Power-Connector-Mains-Cable-Inlet-Plug/112166065595?epid=2254507923&hash=item1a1d9e55bb:g:dvgAAOSwmLlX~54z

Make sure the keyway is the same. I think there are more than one type.

Hi Geoff

Been thinking about these too being a novice does anyone have the dimension of the original Keyway i presume this is the size of the pins?

Thanks...

walpurgis

16-03-2018, 16:01

The slot and key on the side vary If I recall. One being squared and the other rounded, as in the ebay piccie.

Barry

16-03-2018, 16:05

dantheman91

16-03-2018, 16:13

The Bulgin cable-mounted sockets are no longer made (and are actually outlawed by the EU), but do occasionally come up for sale on eBay for around £15 apiece.

If you are going to have One Thing Audio service your speakers, it would be a good idea to have them change the Bulgin mains connectors for the current IEC type.

Hi Barry

I have looked at OTA and the IEC connectors are £9 i think i will go with this option they just got to get someone to fit them...:)

Keeping me busy :)

Barry

16-03-2018, 16:19

Hi Geoff

Been thinking about these too being a novice does anyone have the dimension of the original Keyway i presume this is the size of the pins?

Thanks...

Those Bulgin 3-pin connectors are too small. The Quad 57s use these: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bulgin-3-Pin-Plug/253448588637?hash=item3b02b68d5d:g:NKsAAOSw0BNakWl G. Hopefully you will be able to find a pair for a far more reasonable price.

nutteronthebus

16-03-2018, 17:58

try using these https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/products/2378894/?grossPrice=Y&cm_mmc=UK-PPC-DS3A-_-google-_-3_UK_EN_IEC+Connectors_Bulgin+Power_Exact-_-Bulgin+Power+-+IEC+Connectors+-+2378894-_-px0579%2F63&matchtype=e&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIg-3-n7Xx2QIV7TLTCh3gowt9EAAYAiAAEgJU0fD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds It is an IEC socket that is a drop in replacement for that Bulgin connector
You may have to file a couple of mm to make it fit
Dave

walpurgis

16-03-2018, 18:04

Me personally, if the panel mounted Bulgin plugs are intact, I'd leave them be and use the matching line sockets if available.

Ninanina

16-03-2018, 22:21

Dan if you get a nice, properly working, pair of 57's, and can give them the space they need, they are absolutely lovely

I had a pair years ago powered by Quad 33/303's and loved them to bits and if I could have fitted a pair into my current room I would have purchased another pair but they are just too wide for the the space I now have

Unfortunately a lot of 57's for sale will have problems with their panels either arcing or other nasties but if you've found a good pair you are in for a real treat

Pharos

16-03-2018, 23:42

Personally I would try to avoid the original Bulgins if possible. I remember when working with the MoD in '79 that they were outlawed, the reason being that the casings are Bakelite which is brittle, and if it breaks you can end up with a handful of live terminals.

The quality of the connectors they contain is also rather primitive and crude by today's standards.

But space may be too limited for an IEC, and if you are insistent and determined, I may be able to find some in the loft. I still don't know if you are referring to the 'miniature' or other.

I've just recalled that there is an XLR plug and socket designed specifically for mains input into equipment, and which I put into my A77 many years ago. It is three pinned with fine pins and a red coloured plastic to differentiate it from the normal audio types.

Ninanina

17-03-2018, 01:16

When I owned 57's they had their original Bulgin plugs and they seemed fine to me.. however I guess if you could fit in the standard IEC socket/plug that would probably be better suited

dantheman91

17-03-2018, 06:41

2 Originals Bought last night at £15 each...:)

So keeping with the Original Bulgin for Originality

wee tee cee

17-03-2018, 10:05

I used a shielded mains cable to cut down on rfi.

Silver or gold plated mk plugs and dare i say it fancy fuses all make a difference.

I found the 57s really benefited from being on balanced mains.

spendorman

17-03-2018, 11:56

2 Originals Bought last night at £15 each...:)

So keeping with the Original Bulgin for Originality

Not too bad, they are a ridiculous price though. I have four, but then I have two pairs of 57's

dantheman91

17-03-2018, 15:02

Hi Guys

Are the plugs fairly easy to wire up can i do it myself or do i need to get a proper technician to do it?

Thank you

walpurgis

17-03-2018, 15:08

Should be dead easy Dan. Google for details.

walpurgis

17-03-2018, 15:11

This any help?

http://www.plugsocketmuseum.nl/Bulgin1.html

dantheman91

17-03-2018, 18:11

Perfect Geoff - I will be uploading pictures of progress with fitting them

I have found 5A cables....:)

Barry

17-03-2018, 18:38

Hi Guys

Are the plugs fairly easy to wire up can i do it myself or do i need to get a proper technician to do it?

Thank you

The screw terminals within the connector are marked "L", "N" and "E". The cable 'clamp' is rudimentary and would probably not be acceptable by today's standards, so make sure there is no chance the mains cable will suffer being tugged or pulled.

(Incidentally the reason why the Bulgin cable-mounted mains connectors were outlawed by the EU was because the cap can be easily unscrewed, thereby exposing the terminals which might be connected to the mains and hence pose a serious risk of electric shock.)

Barry

17-03-2018, 18:44

This any help?

http://www.plugsocketmuseum.nl/Bulgin1.html

It always amazes me that such enthusiast web-sites exist. But I'm glad they do.

Audio Al

17-03-2018, 21:28

Not too bad, they are a ridiculous price though. I have four, but then I have two pairs of 57's

I will up your count as I have 3 pairs :D and 1 pair of 63s

Barry

17-03-2018, 21:34

I will up your count as I have 3 pairs :D and 1 pair of 63s

Show off! Anyway, the late Mr Alastair Robertson-Aikman of SME had 7 pairs of Quad 57s in his system, later replaced with 2 pairs of heavily-modified 63s.

dantheman91

17-03-2018, 22:34

Hi Barry

Precaution i will get the plugs expertly fitted :)

Audio Al

17-03-2018, 23:01

I think I will fire up my 57s tomorrow :)

wee tee cee

18-03-2018, 15:39

put mine in my 2 channel av set up last night-they dont really do crash/bang/wallop like john wick 2 but me and my good lady watched Fences last night-they were terrrifc with voices and the subtle score.

Horses for courses..

dantheman91

19-03-2018, 16:23

Hi Guys

Please advice if this is fine i have had ago but if not will get my technician to do them?

Thank you

dantheman91

19-03-2018, 17:24

Cable 2....

Firebottle

19-03-2018, 17:29

That looks absolutely fine Dan, just make sure there are no loose strands of wire.
:)

spendorman

19-03-2018, 19:46

Possibly pic 1 shows the outer black sheath trimmed ever so slightly short?

Barry

19-03-2018, 23:52

There should be a rudimentary cardboard cable clamp - but it seems to be missing in both connectors. So make sure the connections are tightly screwed up (and as Alan says: check there are no stray strands of wire), and dress the cables so the connectors cannot get pulled out by someone tugging on, or tripping over the cables.

Let them charge up for about an hour (since I assume they haven't been used for a good while) and you're "good to go".

What amplifier will you be using with them?

dantheman91

20-03-2018, 05:22

Thanks guys i know the clamps is missing very rarely get a pair that has them fitted...

I warmed one up last night for about an hour and half it does power up Fine doing the other one today - The amplifiers i am considering Barry are the Quantum 1A100 first test and the Marantz PM4 after but also have 33/303 / 34 / 405 , Sugden A28 , Luxman 507x all a possibility

:)

dantheman91

20-03-2018, 05:34

Possibly pic 1 shows the outer black sheath trimmed ever so slightly short?

Hi Alex,

I know i re done them now covered by the sheath...:)

dantheman91

20-03-2018, 06:09

1st Cable Redone

Pictures

:)

dantheman91

20-03-2018, 07:24

Considering the Yamaha cr 820
Also

nutteronthebus

20-03-2018, 07:25

Hi the 33/303 is fine for these but if using the 405 fit the limit resistors to it as a burnt out esl 57 is very expensive to repair

Dave

walpurgis

20-03-2018, 08:56

spendorman

20-03-2018, 09:01

Just my thoughts, but I suspect the PM4 may not be too happy with the kind of load offered by the ESL's. As mentioned, the 33/303 will be fine, if a bit dull compared to some. A Leak Stereo 20 would drive them well enough and probably sound rather better.

Strange, never found the 303 dull into 57's, I was not using a 33 as pre though, in fact found the 303 a pretty a good match, surprisingly, the Quad II's sounded a little dull in to 57's. Radford STA25 III was good too.

walpurgis

20-03-2018, 09:15

I think of the 33/303 combo, the 303 power amp is probably the most capable of the two. Funny thing is, I've not used one on its own, only with the 33. Although I have heard them used separately.

dantheman91

20-03-2018, 09:17

Got a Hiss Problem with the 303 at the mo but will give it a try - understood Geoff wont use the PM4 then

spendorman

20-03-2018, 09:19

I think of the 33/303 combo, the 303 power amp is probably the most capable of the two. Funny thing is, I've not used one on its own, only with the 33. Although I have heard them used separately.

It's worth a re-try, using one at the moment. I'm not saying that the 33 is rubbish though. As you probably know, a 303 has to be set up spot on to sound really excellent, not set up in decades, can sound OK, but set that one up and it should be excellent.

walpurgis

20-03-2018, 09:26

It's worth a re-try, using one at the moment. I'm not saying that the 33 is rubbish though. As you probably know, a 303 has to be set up spot on to sound really excellent, not set up in decades, can sound OK, but set that one up and it should be excellent.

Not used or heard them for donkeys years. The only Quad gear I've come across recently is the little 306 I have in my system at the moment and sounding very good.

spendorman

20-03-2018, 09:34

Got a Hiss Problem with the 303 at the mo but will give it a try - understood Geoff wont use the PM4 then

I can alter the volume of the Yamaha - 20 can i do this just to test them or is it too powerful for them a 55 watts rated?

Thank you...

It's voltage that will kill a 57, however, if the 57 is fitted with the extra filtering that was fitted at the introduction of the 303, or retrofitted to 57's already in service, the 57 can withstand the voltage generated by the Quad 405 (with the limiters in), and the 405 then had an output of 50 Watts per channel in to 8 Ohms.

So your Yamaha is probably slightly too powerful for the 57's.

Details of the Quad extra filtering: https://flic.kr/p/9CvfGT

dantheman91

20-03-2018, 09:35

Any thoughts on using the Quantum Electronics 1A100?

walpurgis

20-03-2018, 09:39

Any thoughts on using the Quantum Electronics 1A100?

Not sure, but symptoms of a mismatch can be 'buzz, crackle, BANG, smoke'. ;)

spendorman

20-03-2018, 09:39

A 303 gives very good protection to the 57, Possibly a small transistor noisy in yours.

dantheman91

20-03-2018, 09:43

Quantum is Rated at 25 watts another option is the Original NAD 3020 that is 20 watts too :) Choices Choices...

spendorman

20-03-2018, 09:43

Interesting, Geoff's post above and mine, exactly at the same time, appear to be along similar thoughts.

spendorman

20-03-2018, 09:45

Quantum is Rated at 25 watts another option is the Original NAD 3020 that is 20 watts too :) Choices Choices...

It's how those two amps will handle the wicked low impedance of the 57 at high frequencies, not just their voltage output. Some normally robust amps will just smoke. I have no experience of the Quantum, but I suspect that the NAD will be OK.

walpurgis

20-03-2018, 09:47

I suspect that the NAD will be OK.

Yes. I believe that combination has been used successfully.

dantheman91

20-03-2018, 09:52

Thanks guys the NAD it is.

Pharos

20-03-2018, 10:10

Those floating sockets are the large variety, and they did originally have two fibre washers, one with three semicircular circumferentially positioned cut-outs for the three mains conductors, and the other with one central hole through which the larger whole cable passed.

The three holed 'washer' went underneath the three conductors and against the plated brass terminal screws, and the other washer went above the three conductors and clamped them between the two when the cover was tightened.

I have a few of the larger ones in my loft from 1969, and also the two terminal ones which were used by the BBC for loudspeaker connection to amplifiers.

dantheman91

20-03-2018, 10:53

Warming them up...

struth

20-03-2018, 11:17

The grill or the grille ?:)

spendorman

20-03-2018, 11:47

Long term, the 303 is a good choice. I forgot to mention that the 57 is almost a short circuit to the amp at DC due to it's input transformer, a bit like the LS3/6. This is fine on direct coupled amps when their offset is close to zero, however, if this drifts, one could be in trouble. There may be circuits in the amp to protect, but there may not be.

The 303 is capacitor coupled, so removes the above problem, that is, if the output caps haven't failed, but good ones should last for many years.

I believe that the early 303's were fitted with better quality output and smoothing capacitors, indeed, I have a 303 from about 1967 with it's original output and smoothing caps, still fine, however, much later 303's including one built in the 80's, have needed them replacing.

Roy S

20-03-2018, 12:58

Warming them up...

:popcorn:

dantheman91

20-03-2018, 14:28

Initial Testing not good i don't think

Both Treble units no output i think no expert - 1 speaker down on output the other Bass units working Couple of Hours charge up i presume if the treble units are working they should work right away?

How long for a prolong test?

Should i leave them on over night and test them again tomorrow?

spendorman

20-03-2018, 16:37

Sorry to hear that.

Charge depends on several things, but I would expect to hear treble by now.

If it is just the treble unit, they can be changed reasonably easy with care. It must be over 30 years since I changed mine, but I seem to remember that the units came with fairly simple instructions. You can probably get from Quad the 57 service supplement, or download from the internet.

wee tee cee

20-03-2018, 17:10

Feck.....

Firebottle

20-03-2018, 18:02

It might be the high voltage block, they are known to 'sag' over time. Sometimes one or a few of the individual rectifiers fail, so you end up with a lower voltage than should be.

The treble panels should have about 1500V on them and the bass panels about 6000V on them. If the voltages are low you do still get some output but dependent on the voltage level.

To measure these voltages you need a very high resistance probe to connect to a multimeter, otherwise the measuring kit can pull the voltage down.
I have a self made high resistance probe that you are welcome to borrow if you feel confident to use it.

dantheman91

20-03-2018, 18:09

goodkeys

18-01-2019, 11:40

On Monday I managed to finally get to hear the venerable Quad ESLs. I could do an extensive listening test and comparison between the ESL 57 (revised by Quad Musikwiedergabe some two years ago) and the ESL 63, both driven by a Quad 606. Almost immediately it was clear that I like the ESL 63, and absolutely love the 57! I've never heard electrostats before, and the 57 was a revelation. Instrument separation and presence are simply jaw dropping. I was simply enjoying the music, forgetting everything around me, and the speakers disappeared completely. Never heard an orchestra, or chamber ensemble reproduced with such clarity. Similarly impressive: the reproduction of the human voice. On Dire Straits' 'Brothers in arms' I thought I could touch Mark Knopfler if I stretched out my arms.

As my current living situation is basically ideal to accommodate this bulky pair of speakers I am looking to buy a nice pair. Is there anything I should be looking out for?
I've seen a pair completely rebuilt by Quad Musikwiedergabe 5 years ago, offered for 1900$, including the special stands by Quad Musikwiedergabe, and the original stands too (I hope I can negotiate the price a bit).
If I were going for these, anything special I should test or be looking out for during a listening test?

Thanks for the help.

Firebottle

18-01-2019, 12:38

spendorman

18-01-2019, 13:31

With any rebuilt 57s there should be absolutely NO fizzing, buzzing or crackling noises.

Put you ear close to the speaker with no music playing and listen over the whole area. If there is any noise then there is some leakage in the panel(s), this can be exacerbated in damp conditions.

With 57s ask if they have the clamp boards fitted, this prevents damage if overdriven, they are only rated at 25W.

This was the Quad 57 modification for use with 303's that I fitted to my two pairs of 57's about 33 years ago!

https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5304/5663955715_59b2c308e2_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/9CvfGT)ESL 57 mod (https://flic.kr/p/9CvfGT) by A60man (https://www.flickr.com/photos/41679262@N02/), on Flickr

spendorman

18-01-2019, 13:49

"On Dire Straits' 'Brothers in arms' I thought I could touch Mark Knopfler if I stretched out my arms."

You actually can if the 57's are in good condition!

goodkeys

18-01-2019, 16:24

Thank you for the tips, that's very helpful. I will do exactly that. Normally Quad Musikwiedergabe does fit a clamp board, but I'll ask explicitly. If these don't have them for whatever reason: is there a way to check the panels for arcing without removing the front grill?

sq225917

18-01-2019, 22:10

If actively arcing youll see and hear it. If they have arced previously youll hear a high pitch pitter patter.

goodkeys

19-01-2019, 11:24

Thank you all. I have a much better idea now about what to look and listen for.

JohnG

19-01-2019, 13:15

HiFi Shark sales portal will give you a broard window into the available units in Countries esily accessed from Switzerland.
A little further investigation into a rebuilt models Treble Panel, will be prudent, as a Original
Treble Panel, that is substituted to one that uses a different material to the Original, will have a effect on the sound being reproduced.
This is a matter of personal choice, if a Original or New Material Version is producing a preferred sound.
My choice is for the New Material Version, even though at present, I am about to Stack a
OTA, OTEC Treble Panel Speaker Pair and a Original Panel Speaker Pair, to gauge the overall presentation.
If it doesn't perform satisfactory, the OTA second pair search will continue.

goodkeys

21-01-2019, 09:36

Awesome John. I am monitoring HiFi Shark, and every other month or so a feasible offer shows up. It's probably better to rule out all offers from private sellers that I can't listen to before buying, otherwise it's quite a leap of faith. If stacked Quads are even more impressive I have to hear them one day. I hope your stacked configuration works the way you imagined John!

On another note, does anybody know if ESL Labs (quadesl.nl) is still active? I read on a forum that they quit. But then again google registered changes to their website from after that forum post. I sent them an email but haven't heard back yet. Does anybody hear have any experiences with this dealer?

Bencat

23-01-2019, 11:45

Hello only just joined this forum so playing a little catch up not sure if it is of interest to others but if it helps or has some merit will add . I bought a pair of Quad ESL57 speakers in November . Thye seemed in very good condition and sounded pretty good . However when I used an Dspeaker Antimode unit on them it became obvious that there were issues with the bass panels.

Following a recommendation from another Quad enthusiast I took the plunge and delivered my speakers to Andrew at A QuadThing Limited who after stripping them down gave me the good news / bad news . Good news was the spaekers had been fitted with One Thing new mains input boards and there Widget to protect the speakers from too powerful amplifiers. Also the treable units were newish One Thing Aduio panels in both speakers and they were fine.

Bad news the bass panels were original Quad Units and all four were in dire need of full strip and refurbishment . Andrew was also a little concerned at the quality of the wiring so we agreed this would be fixed and he would respray the speakers my preferred black. All of this has now been done and Andrew says they are sounding excellent equal to the ones he has and I heard when I delivered my speakers. Sadly not able to collect till Friday (the tension and anticipation is killing me) and even when I get them back they will need a full set up with Dirac Live before I can settle down and play some music.

Would anyone be interested in me giving details here of how they sound ? If you do just add to the thread and I will put something on over the weekend . Do not expect anything too much from me on Friday as it is going to be a music binge and the panels will need to get up to charge and get run in before they truly sing . Andrew gave me advice which I had found to be correct that due to the thickness of the mylar film they take quite a while to get fully charged and should be left on all the time . After about two days they will sound even better .

Bencat

25-01-2019, 13:18

Just to follow up I have arrived home about ten minutes ago and now have the fully refurbished Quad ESL57 speakers back . After a break for a little rest and a cup of tea I will start the work on putting my system back together getting the Quads back on stands and placed correctly and then get a full DIRAC Live measurment session completed so the around 16.00 today i should be able to get my first full listen to my system with these speakers giving their best , fingers crossed .

Bencat

23-02-2019, 10:08

Morning all this is a follow up to my expereince of the refurbished Quad ESL57 speakers I bought . Firstly a huge thenks to Andrew at Quadthing Audio who did an exceelent job refurbished all the bass panels in both speakers , rewired the one thing gizmos fitted and made the wiring in the speakers a little neater and more secure. Finally he spray painted my grills and the units are resplendent in black .

All the above is good and sadly it all ends there . I use my Quads in a different way I employ a MiniDSP DDRC 24 between my streamer andthe power amp using it in by pass mode for the crossover but utilising the DIRAC Live software that it contains . This takes nine seperate measurements (one from the listening position then two each side above and behind the listening position and two each side below and in front of the listening position) then it combines all the measurements and spits ouit both the readings for the room and an automatic target curve to get the in room response closer to the house curve they reccomend.

Measurement went well and the system (using the auto target curve) when played at low to medium levels sounded very good . Then add higher volume and music with large bass content and huge distortion . Certainly not an ideal sound by any stretch of the imagination . A ittle more study by me and lots of help from some fellow DIY users who know the MiniDSP and things have had to be changed . Firstly I need to be able to read the graphs I am producing much more in detail and understand what it is I am looking at and its impact on what I hear . You can not change physics and if a speaker is just not able to produce low notes then it is best not just pump wasted power trying to change that . So I have had to redraw my target curve and get it to reduce any major peaks but get the curve to mimic the reading of the speakers were there are large lows and not try and fill them . I have had some gains now and I can play music at very reasonable levels with out any issues but every now and then some distortion is creeping in .

So the Quads sounf amazing they do all the things that i wanted them to and with the help of a little DSP they lose many of the issues that people always speak about . But I still have some fine tuning to do and I need to be able to get another pair of ears and views to look at what I have done . I will most likely do this at Kegworth were I can talk to a few freinds there who know lots more about graphs and how to read them that I do so I can get a better insight in to what I need to do.

I know I am on the right track and all I need to do is a little tweaking as the system now sounds so gret for 85% of time I just need to get that last percentage sorted.

goodkeys

03-03-2019, 08:19

A few tipps: usually you can set the maximum amount of boost a dsp program applies. I suppose Dirac has such an option too (I've tried the demo a while back, but I don't remember). Set it to 6 or 8db or so. Otherwise if there is a room mode, you will be pushing a lot of energy into boosting a frequency that can not be boosted in your room due to physics. This can lead to distortion, and in the worst case it can damage your amp or your speakers. So do limit the maximum boost.

Secondly, and most importantly, set the target curve in such a way that it is lower than your measured curve. This way, instead of boosting frequencies that have a lower output than the others, reversely you will be cutting frequencies that have a higher output. And cutting is a) always possible independently of your room, and b) can not cause damage to your equipment. Your dsp corrected output signal will be one or two db lower in volume, but that can be easily adjusted for.

Macca

03-03-2019, 09:05

I don't think you will be able to overcome the limitations of the ESL with DSP. What they do well they do better than almost any other speaker, but what they don't do they will never do, at least not on their own.

If it were me I'd add adjustable super-tweeters and a sub - ideally a dipole sub - and use the DSP just on the sub, and concentrate on passive room treatments and positioning to get the panels sounding as optimal as possible.

Liffy99

12-11-2019, 09:59

Dan, there is a guy in Poole who is a wizard with all Quad gear & electrostatics in particular. He is semi retired now but does take work in as & when he feels like it, I could give you his number if you like?
He is likely to be a whole lot cheaper than One Thing or Quad as well.

Does your contact still do Quad stuff. It would be good to know for if and when my gear may need attention, and a lot closer to me than Huntingdon or Leicester.
Thanks

Bencat

05-04-2020, 11:10

Okay been having a rather difficult time with my main system main system my Krell has developed a bad hum on the left channel so had to be removed and is awaiting things to settle down so i can take it away for repair. Then my Denafrips Pro-8 DAC went rogue on the right channel and I have had to post that off to France (Audiphonics) to get them to sort it .

I have also done a swop of one of my MiniDSP DDRC 24 units for a MiniDSP DDRC 22D which is much better suited as it only does the DSP and sends out digital signals no Crossover or DAC work which is not needed. Like most I imagine I have lots of time on my hands at the moment and this just started me thinking . My music room is not that big and the Quads are not anything like far enough away from the back wall as they are reccomended . Sound is fine and using Dirac Live 2.0 it is much improved . However how far can that go ? This is waht started me thinking the Dirac software is very powerful and the new sessions use 13 different point measurements to get enough data on the room to make a real difference.

So I just because it only costs me a little time and energy to try something that goes against all normal wisdom with Electrostatics and Dipole speakers. I moved the Quads back as close as i could to the rear wall (about 9 inches) got them both measured as being the same distance from the listening seat kept them almost flat firing down the room (1/2 inch toe in ) . Then did a full Dirac Live 2.0 session taking as much care as I could with accurate microphone placement . As always when the filter was created in this new version of Dirac the bass cut off was too much so tweaked it back a little but made sure the filter line was close the speaker reading line so that there would be no deep troughs that the amplifier was being asked to fill in .

I have to be honest I was not expecting too much as the sound waves from the backward exit of the panels would most likely smear the front travelling sound . Much to my surprise this proved with the Dirac treatment not to be the case . Sound was clear and nicely focused vocals in paticualr were as good as I have heard with these speakers. Bass was a little too light so a quick second tweak on the filter moving the bass cut off a little further down cured that . I have now been listening to the treated Quads for about three days and I know that the image depth has lost a bit but not as much as I thought. All the rest is excellent and very musical . I did take the DDRC 22D out of the chain and fed from the DAC straight to the Quads and all the problems I thought I would hear were there to a great extent sound was smeared and softened with a strange hollowness . Put the DDRC 22D back and all things snap back in to focus . Now I do realise that I could get possibly even better results by getting the Quads as far out as is possible and then doing anothe Dirac session but given that I am now suffering from tinitus critical listening is just not possible. Thye sound great were they are they are also less dominating in the room and I think they are going to stay just were they are.

Audio Al

05-04-2020, 11:49

:eek: You do all that , Blimey , I must be a Dinashor. , My set up is

1 Find the Quad 57's
2 Put them on 2 low level speaker stands
3 Connect everthing up
4 Power on and sit and listen
5 Adjust the forward elevation until I find the sweet spot when in my chair
6 Once fornd wedge the rear of the speaker with one or two Observer book ( From my childhood 55 years ago )

7 Sorted , sit back and enjoy :D

Bencat

19-07-2020, 09:57

Not said much on this for a while and I really should have . I have been having the most frustrating time with the MiniDSP DDRC 2D unit as it has become very unstable in its connection to DIRAC Live . Due to issues with my Krell KSA50 I have had to conscript in a replacement power amp XTZ Class A unit and have moved the quads back to the wall with about 6 cm gap . I know that this is against what everyone says to use the Quads but it gets them out of the way and gives the maximum distance from the listening seat .

The DDRC 2D is being packed off to MiniDSP for them to look at and I have bought a second DDRC 2D to use . This one is rock solid and has made me realise that the original one was indded faulty . I have now run through two seperate DIRAC sessions with different image focus one wide and one narrow aimed at a single listener. Results after making changes to the original curve while listening to music and being at the listener seat I use has produced the best sound of any system I have yet had in this room and currently in the house as well . The music is just wonderful with life energy and that lovely Quad image window that I remember from my first hearing of a pair .

Bass as always is not really exisitent very loww down and is never going to rattle the windows but it can be powerful and deep and drive music along when it needs to . Above all it is as one with the mid and treble it sounds natural and unforced and quite imprtant there is difference to the sounds of the bass , texture and tone are now obvious . Vocals always a strenght of ESL are just great natural or treated they are just there in the room with you . This has been a long road and only now am I hearing the full extent of the work done by A Quadthing to these units . I am so happy that I am calling a halt on any further tinkering for at least three months and just going to enjoy the tune and buy more music .