View Full Version : Inexpensive MC preamp required
The Vinyl Adventure
22-02-2010, 20:25
Alright Hifi People
since i sold my nac82 with built in phono stage i dont have one... When Anthony built the pre for me, we talked briefly about him building one into it but decided to do it at a later date for both finansial reasons and me impatiently wanting the pre. my turntable has been at Dave's since way before xmas so it didnt seem to important at the time anyway.
anyway, the insurance are paying out on the replacment of the damaged tonearm and cartridge that the cats did and im also buying MartinT's jelco st250 off him so in a few weeks time i will have my techie with st250 and brand spanky new oc9 cart ... happy days! (although not quite as happy as Martins going to be with his dynavector i would guess :) )
Anthony has said he will, when he has time later on this year build me a stage into my pre. but until then i need to get some kind of stand in... unfortunatly (especially as im buying this tonearm) my finances are somewhat restricted..so..
i need a MC pre for less than £100 preferably more like £50
the most obvious option seems to be hunting down a second had cambridge 540p or 640p ... but i thought i would get a bit of advice from you clever-than-me lot
any second hand gems to be had?
has anyone on here got anything i could buy?
The Vinyl Adventure
22-02-2010, 22:12
boring thread eh?...
The Grand Wazoo
22-02-2010, 23:02
boring thread eh?...
Thorny problem mate!
Nad do one for under £100 - or they did. I seem to half remember someone here had one going begging a short while ago..........
Alternatively you could look out a classic integrated with an MC stage & run it's tape outputs into a line stage in your pre. That'd be a reasonable & cheap stop-gap.
The Vinyl Adventure
22-02-2010, 23:25
Thorny problem mate!
Nad do one for under £100 - or they did. I seem to half remember someone here had one going begging a short while ago..........
Alternatively you could look out a classic integrated with an MC stage & run it's tape outputs into a line stage in your pre. That'd be a reasonable & cheap stop-gap.
thats what i did with my first turntable and an old "realistic" amp.. perhaps not quite a "classic" but it worked...
not a bad idea i guess... but it does open me up to a much more vast relm of possibility... i was kinda hoping for a relativly simple solution
chris@panteg
22-02-2010, 23:37
Hi Hamish
A 640p should be good enough with your oc9 ' i would have thought £60 ish off eBay !
A 250st from Martin ' happy day's indeed :)
The Grand Wazoo
22-02-2010, 23:43
Hamish:
Here's the Nad - it's £55 here new
http://www.hificorner.co.uk/nad-pp-2.html
Hi Hamish,
Here's a rather left-field option.... You could buy one of these superb little units from Joynet Mall (I've heard one and they sound fab and look gorgeous, too!) I've also used JM before and they're very professional to deal with :)
http://www.joynetmall.com/shop/product_info.php?cPath=60_69&products_id=511
The PEQ3 works out at roughly £57 (and, as it's tiny, you should manage to sneak it through customs without having to pay any duty)... *Then* I simply lend you my spare Denon HA-500 MC head amp until you can afford a better permanent solution, and you'll be spinning tunes when your Techy comes back fixed, with no worries :cool:
Also, I think the combo will sound very good, as I've heard an OC-9 through the Denon head amp, and the AT MM stage should be perfect, too...
Job done!
Marco.
P.S My solution will sound WAY better than the Cambridge or NAD options! ;)
The Grand Wazoo
22-02-2010, 23:50
Aha!
So Marco can get you stepped up!
Another option apart from the PEQ3 to get you to MM level is to contact Green Home Dave - about this:
http://www.usedhifishop.co.uk/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=13&products_id=877
A Graham Slee Gram Amp 2 Communicator in "as new" condition £70
Good call, Chris. However, having heard both the GS (some time ago) and the PEQ3, I can say quite confidently that the latter is superior, and likely to be a better synergistic match, sonically, with Hamish's OC-9 :)
Don't wanna lose Dave a sale, but that's my honest opinion. And of course the PEQ3 will be brand new :cool:
Marco.
The Grand Wazoo
22-02-2010, 23:58
I've never heard either, so I bow to your experience. Dave'll be quicker though!
Well Hamish, there's some options for you!
..........but if you go for the vintage classic option it could be the cornerstone of a third system when you get your amp from Anthony!!!!
The Grand Wazoo
23-02-2010, 00:05
Dave's knocked some lolly off the price for his sale too. Now its a tenner cheaper!
The Vinyl Adventure
23-02-2010, 00:32
the peq3 does look like a good option... what with it being AT an all???... i remember asking you about the 20 when i was first worrying about this problem a few months back marco .. and you sure you wouldnt mind the loan??
but the
..........but if you go for the vintage classic option it could be the cornerstone of a third system when you get your amp from Anthony!!!! is tempting though ...might have mooch on ebay see if i can find anything that looks interesting... let me know if you spot anythin that fits in that category Chris :)
The Vinyl Adventure
23-02-2010, 00:50
Dave's knocked some lolly off the price for his sale too. Now its a tenner cheaper!
it says on tweb in various places "works with all mm and some mc" what does that mean??... surly thats the same for all mm units if the output is high enough from the cart... or am i missing something?
sorry - another area of hifi my knowledge is lacking somewhat
the peq3 does look like a good option... what with it being AT an all???... i remember asking you about the 20 when i was first worrying about this problem a few months back marco .. and you sure you wouldnt mind the loan??
Niento problemo, dude - be glad to help out, and you can have it for as long as you need :)
Btw, this is the Denon HA-500 head amp in question (which is almost identical to mine):
http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/1430/denonha500.jpg (http://img251.imageshack.us/i/denonha500.jpg/)
It's a superb sounding unit (costing around £500 in its day during the late 70s!) The only reason I'm not using it is because I *slightly* prefer the presentation of my A23 SUT, but the combo between it and the PEQ3 with your OC-9 should be fab :cool:
Marco.
it says on tweb in various places "works with all mm and some mc" what does that mean??... surly thats the same for all mm units if the output is high enough from the cart... or am i missing something?
It means that high-output MCs can be used straight into a MM stage (such as the Graham Slee). Unfortunately your OC-9 (being low-output) doesn't qualify, so the GS stage would be useless to you without an SUT or head amp :)
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
23-02-2010, 01:16
hmm .. so i wasnt missing anything then i guess....
...so whats the difference between a step up transformer and a head amp?
cheers for the offer of the loan marco... it would apear to be the best solution! im guessin the the peq3 would be a winner in my second system with most basic mm's?
You're welcome, matey :)
Gosh, yes - it would be excellent. Those are special Jap-only products which are fantastic for the money, and WAY better than the budget options available here in the UK. Just look at the build quality!
A head amp is active (i.e. it's mains powered), whereas an SUT is passive (no mains involved).
You'd simply plug your Techy into the head amp input, then connect the output to the PEQ3, which would then connect to a line input in your preamp. Just make sure that you have enough interconnects to connect everything together.
The Denon HA-500 loads MC cartridges at 100Ohms, which is perfect for an OC-9, and the PEQ3 provides the RIAA phono equalisation with the requisite input impedance of 47k Ohms...
So, Bob's yer auntie - high end MC performance on the cheap! :cool:
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
23-02-2010, 02:30
Righto... Cheers for that, I'm not entierly sure I get the idea of a SUT but I guess the explanation for how such a thing works would probably go right over my head!
Good stuff on the Peq3t and the head amp loan front though, inexpensive and (aparently) good sound :)
just noticed you said £500 in 70's ... That is pretty dear eh!!!??
The Grand Wazoo
23-02-2010, 07:28
Righto... Cheers for that, I'm not entierly sure I get the idea of a SUT but I guess the explanation for how such a thing works would probably go right over my head!
Have a read of this:
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=2907&highlight=step+plate
......it explains what a step up does & how.
Marco's unit was the dingo's doughnuts in it's day!
Hi Hamish,
Righto... Cheers for that, I'm not entierly sure I get the idea of a SUT but I guess the explanation for how such a thing works would probably go right over my head!
No worries, dude.
(Very) basically, an SUT or active 'head amp' increases the output voltage of low-output MC cartridges (such as your OC-9) to match the levels normally 'seen' at the input of a 47k Ohm MM phono stage (around 5 mV), in order to ensure that the correct gain structure for the incoming audio signal is accordingly provided, and noise is attenuated to an acceptable level.
If you attempted to feed the (much lower than the approximately required 5 mV), 0.4 mV output voltage of the OC-9 directly into the PEQ3 (via your preamp), all you'd obtain is masses of hiss and a very faint signal, with the volume full-on. Stepping-up the output voltage of the OC-9 to the required level, however, by inserting the HA-500, ensures that there's enough signal for the phono stage to process, and in turn to be amplified through your preamp.
'Head amps' (such as the Denon) do this job actively using mains voltage, whereas SUTs do it passively via a transformer, with different effects on the sound as a result.
Does that incoherent ramble make any sort of sense? :)
Good stuff on the Peq3t and the head amp loan front though, inexpensive and (aparently) good sound
just noticed you said £500 in 70's ... That is pretty dear eh!!!??
Indeed. The HA-500 was pretty much state-of-the-art then, and thus given its 'provenence', not too far away from that now ;)
The PEQ3 and HA-500 combo should therefore give you a very good sound. Just let me know when you need the head amp, and I'll send it off :cool:
Marco.
Why does everyone here grudgingly recommend then pass over the 640P?
I mean, it's properly designed, under £100 with a UK warranty, can be boutiqued later on if that's your bag, has a decent low-output MC input and is readily available in a chain of popular and busy audio shops (Richer Sounds).
Importing a £57 AT phono stage with iffy overload margins (for some cartridges) and apparently supplied with a 110V only wall-wart and a Japan warranty may be fraught with problems IMO, although the performance may be excellent for an mm stage..
I don't mean to rain on Marco's parade, but be practical folks.....;)
The Grand Wazoo
23-02-2010, 10:56
Dave,
I thought Hamish recognised that this could be a good option for him in his OP, then he asked for opinions about alternatives.
That's what we offered him!
Now he's got at least 4 different routes he could go down, many more if he likes the vintage integrated option.
There's no 'rain' here, Dave - your points are entirely relevant :)
First of all, I'm pretty sure that the PEQ3 will have been designed to operate on various mains voltages, and is thus supplied with the appropriate PSU, depending on which country the unit is being exported to. However, this would be easy for Hamish to check with the supplier via email, prior to purchase.
Secondly, the 640P is a valid (and good, 'safe') option, however, on AOS we encourage thinking outside of the box and achieving the highest SPPV, as often the rewards are much greater by doing so, and when not simply choosing the 'safe', bog-standard options that every other Tom, Dick and Harry does... ;)
Warranty is of course an issue, but based on my experience of using these types of items, they are usually built to an extremely high standard, and so I doubt (although of course cannot guarantee) that there would be any reliability problems. I don't think there would be any "iffy overload margins" with an OC-9 and the PEQ3/HA-500 combo either.
The decision of course is entirely Hamish's, but in my view the potential sonic rewards are far greater by implementing my suggestion than obtaining the decent quality (but nothing special) 640P, given that he wants as good an MM stage as he can buy for the money to use later with MM cartridges of his choice.
Also, with the 640P, Hamish would be paying for an MC stage that is nothing particularly special, which he would only likely abandon later for something of better quality, when funds permit. Going for the PEQ3 gives him a good quality MM stage, which he won't have to abandon later (unless he's going to spend serious money on a high-end phono stage of some description), and allows him the option of simply adding his own SUT or head amp, or obtaining a high-quality MC-only phono stage and keeping the PEQ3 solely for MM duties.
The PEQ3 is in my opinion sonically superior to the 640P by a considerable margin - it may 'only' be (approx) £57, but it's very much in that respect like the AT33PTG cartridge is 'only' £230, or thereabouts, but offers the performance of much more expensive designs, mainly because it's not intended for the UK market. In that respect, it's the same with PEQ3, in terms of its sonic performance being relative to that of other more expensive phono stages sold here in the UK... See it as an opportunity to introduce people to another possible 'giant-killer'!
Pending confirmation from the supplier that the PEQ3 will work safely on UK mains, I'd recommend Hamish to go down the route of the PEQ3 & HA-500 until such times as he chooses a permanent solution, as he will enjoy far better sound quality that way than buying the Cambridge, but of course it's up to him :cool:
Marco.
OK Marco, as long as you've tried the 640P at home for a reasonably extended time to fully condemn the MC input :eyebrows: ;)
:peace:
I'm not condemning it - far from it - merely stating what it is: a decent but fairly unremarkable budget phono stage. It's reputation amongst the so-called 'cognoscenti' elsewhere, however, IMO vastly exceeds its actual sonic capabilities.
For some reason, Cambridge equipment appears to be the current 'darling' of the objectivists and the measurement-obsessed ;)
Anyway, the ball is in Hamish's court. He's now got plently of info and choices to consider :)
Marco.
Cambridge has a good designer and access to modern devices which measure better anyway than the transistors and caps available in the 70's and even the 80's. Ignore them at your peril, even if you don't wish to use them at home..... ;)
No-one's saying ignore them, Dave - simply to put them in their proper context.
Personally, I find Cambridge equipment well-built, reliable, decent sounding, but ultimately rather unremarkable, sonically - in fact, a bit like ADM9s (coincidence?) ;)
And anyway, since when did 'perfect measurements' always guarantee the best sound quality? :lol:
Let's not go there!! :eyebrows:
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
23-02-2010, 14:05
It would seem based on Marcos more than generous offer of a loan of his posh head amp going for an inexpensive mm unit is sensible.
Now if I was buying a couple of hundred ££ worth of something from japan then I might ferther take into account waranties and the such like, but for £57 I would be willing to take a gamble....
I'm gonna have a think but marco has definately shouted loudest so far ;)
Take your time, Hamish, and consider all the possibilities...
Since you've gone with the idea of using my head amp with an inexpensive MM stage until you find a permanent MC cartridge solution, which is entirely sensible, you may wish to consider the Rega Fono Mini, if you can't be arsed with the hassle of importing the PEQ3 from Japan:
http://www.noteworthyaudio.co.uk/PhonoStages.html
At £55 it's superb value and, IMO, given Rega's excellent reputation for producing good sounding analogue devices, likely better than any other budget UK-available option. That's not to say, of course, that it would outperform the PEQ3, but it would put the situation to bed quickly and hassle-free, and no doubt form a rather nice combo with my 'posh' head amp ;)
If you decide to go for it, buy it from Hi-fi Dave though, as being a trade member here, he deserves the sale :)
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
23-02-2010, 14:34
Yeah just been mooching for a integrated amp on eBay ..
I guess a preamp with a built in stage would do the job to eh
I'm just weighing up the option of having a part for a new system (integrated or pre-amp) but not getting quite as high end.. Or getting this peq3 and borrowing the head amp - getting me better quaity tt playback in both current systems at one time on another...
I think the turn table is the current priority (what with the new bits on the way) and the other advantage of the peq3 is I don't have to find the money so quick as I would if buying second hand...
Anyway that's prob a pointless post just getting my thoughs out my head like :)
No worries... Btw, see the recent edit to my last post, regarding the Rega ;)
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
23-02-2010, 15:03
Coolio, noted, il contact the people about the peq3 in a bit and see what comes of that, I guess it will help me make a decision if I know the score with it is anyway
Personally, I find Cambridge equipment well-built, reliable, decent sounding, but ultimately rather unremarkable, sonicallyIf you're having the amps in mind, then, I would tend to agree. Although I find that the "rather unremarkable sonically" is good for most SS amplifiers. ;)
On the other hand, when I consider the (modest) price of CA amps and their remarkably stable electrical design (which makes them pair with a large variety of "difficult" speakers), they end up staying in my short-list.
The CD players (and dac) are another matter : there's nothing "sonically unremarkable" about them. The small/middle models are perfect for young people investing in their 1st hifi setup : cheap, robust, detailed and mellow sounding, imho. :)
No-one's saying ignore them, Dave - simply to put them in their proper context.
Personally, I find Cambridge equipment well-built, reliable, decent sounding, but ultimately rather unremarkable, sonically - in fact, a bit like ADM9s (coincidence?) ;)
And anyway, since when did 'perfect measurements' always guarantee the best sound quality? :lol:
Let's not go there!! :eyebrows:
Marco.
Well if you want to deliberately add distortions to your music system to make it sound "better"... :ner:
By the way, wouldn't you rather have a mellow cheaper CD player than a brighter - more impressive - one? The extra impressiveness usually means oscillation or added distortions of some sort - just the kind of thing WTF used to like and possibly still do..
Hi Dimitri,
If you're having the amps in mind, then, I would tend to agree. Although I find that the "rather unremarkable sonically" is good for most SS amplifiers. ;)
On the other hand, when I consider the (modest) price of CA amps and their remarkably stable electrical design (which makes them pair with a large variety of "difficult" speakers), they end up staying in my short-list.
Point taken. However, read my "unremarkable sonically" as another way of saying 'bland' or 'boring' - i.e. not very musically engaging to the extent that I'd rather read a book than listen to the music they make, which for me kind of defeats the point of their existence, n'est-ce pas? ;)
That's just my opinion, however, and perhaps a slightly unfair one, given the benchmark I'm used to in that respect.... YMMV.
At around that price point new I'd opt instead for gear from Marantz, Rotel, Onkyo or (budget permitting) Harman Kardon or Creek - all of which in my view make equipment that plays music with more 'passion'. I also hate owning the same bloody stuff as everyone else does, hence why I generally baulk at buying 'flavour of the months' or 'popular choices' (unless, like the Techy, it's very much worth owning) but that's just me! :eyebrows:
The CD players (and dac) are another matter : there's nothing "sonically unremarkable" about them. The small/middle models are perfect for young people investing in their 1st hifi setup : cheap, robust, detailed and mellow sounding, imho. :)
Can't disagree with that, although personally I wouldn't entertain buying a budget CDP these days, as IMO they're all crap, and simply go the computer streaming route instead with as good a DAC as you can afford, which at the budget end, is where the Beresford comes in!
Marco.
At around that price point new I'd opt instead for gear from Marantz, Rotel, Onkyo or (budget permitting) Harman Kardon or Creek - all of which in my view make equipment that plays music with more 'passion'.
You make a point here, esp with HK : very engaging amps, indeed.
My fav SS amps (as a brand) are the Denons and the Yamahas, anyway... :o
But the CA amp designer is a talented one, although I'm not fond of his general hifi views (and I say this in a polite way :steam:).
Hi Dimitri,
You make a point here, esp with HK : very engaging amps, indeed.
Indeed, and yet how often is it advertised or reviewed in magazines or mentioned on forums?
I'm afraid that I'm always suspicious of products which are heavily marketed and/or always reviewed or mentioned in the hi-fi press, and which thus become the mainstream 'automatic considered choice' at a specific price point. I'm far more likely to buy something which is born from the opposite approach!
After all, as the saying goes: 'He who shouts least is often most worth listening to' ;)
Yes, I've liked HK stuff most times when I've heard it - I'd sooner own (and listen to) their gear than anything from Cambridge Audio.
But the CA amp designer is a talented one, although I'm not fond of his general hifi views (and I say this in a polite way ).
Interesting... Could you give me an example (perhaps a link to something he's said) of what you're referring to? :)
He's not one of these blinkered measurement obsessives, is he??
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
23-02-2010, 19:05
After all, as the saying goes: 'He who shouts least is often most worth listening to' ;)
Marco.
TO FUCKIN EASY :lolsign::lolsign::lolsign:
Hi Dave,
Well if you want to deliberately add distortions to your music system to make it sound "better" :ner: ...
Hehehe... Unfortunately, that remark assumes available measurement data is conclusive in terms of ascertaining what type of distortion belongs in the music signal, and what doesn't, which we know to be bullshit - hence why valves often sound better than transistors, depsite the former having inferior measured distortion characteristics ;)
By the way, wouldn't you rather have a mellow cheaper CD player than a brighter - more impressive - one?
Not necessarily. Besides, the point is moot as I'd NEVER be using a cheap CD player.
The extra impressiveness usually means oscillation or added distortions of some sort - just the kind of thing WTF used to like and possibly still do..
Perhaps, and you could well be right in reference to WTF, but it could be said that your first point exhibits somewhat over-simplistic thinking :)
Marco.
No Marco - fact in many cases of award winners from this mag - the amps I'm thinking of were crippled to slightly oscillate and this made them sound "deeeeetailed..." Horrid things when listened to in a proper system and room.....
I'm too tired to argue about distortions, of which there are many, but distortion is distortion, however you word or hear/not hear it at the end of the day - and it's rapidly becoming the end of mine...:zzz:
No Marco - fact in many cases of award winners from this mag - the amps I'm thinking of were crippled to slightly oscillate and this made them sound "deeeeetailed..." Horrid things when listened to in a proper system and room.....
*THAT* I don't doubt :)
I'm too tired to argue about distortions, of which there are many, but distortion is distortion...
I disagree. Not all types of distortion are the same, or necessarily bad, as some forms of distortion/coloration are naturally present in real instruments or human speech. Remove this, and the sound of both becomes rather insipid, and thus they appear as less natural and convincing when reproduced through equipment designed (and therefore voiced) using such parameters...
That's my view anyway, and one reason why solid-state equipment often sounds 'flat' and 'grey' (lacking in natural colour) in comparison to valves, even though it 'measures better' ;)
Marco.
Interesting... Could you give me an example (perhaps a link to something he's said) of what you're referring to? :)
He's not one of these blinkered measurement obsessives, is he??
Marco.
Well, as an amp designer he's obliged to measure, in a way or another. All designers do. This is not what bothers me.
This bothers me a bit more : http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/ampins/pseudo/subjectv.htm#R
Thanks for the link, Dimitri :)
Well, as an amp designer he's obliged to measure, in a way or another. All designers do.
Of course, but it's when you become blinkered and obsessed about it, and believe that measurements are the be-all-and-end-all in audio, that it becomes a problem!
Oh, FFS, just as I thought (from the website link):
I have studied audio design from the viewpoints of electronic design, psychoacoustics, and my own humble efforts at musical creativity. I have found complete scepticism towards Subjectivism to be the only tenable position.
... Another dogmatic and blinkered measurements-obsessive! :doh: :wanker:
No wonder idiots like Ashley James (and some of the 'objectivist' clowns who post on other forums) rate CA gear so much :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
I knew there must have been some sort of connection! No wonder I find their equipment bland sounding - it's always the same with this type of stuff!!! Any lingering notion that CA gear was half-decent for me has now completely evaporated!! :lol:
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
23-02-2010, 23:19
you have missed the most important point marco... all the text is on a background of graph paper.... graph paper is sciency, and science is always right
F*ck, you're right - how did I miss that? :doh:
Can you feel the love now in owning a 640P phono stage because it's been designed using the bestest sciency-wiency principles by a nice man in a white lab coat? ;)
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
23-02-2010, 23:41
do you know what, when push comes to shove.... even if i actually cant hear the differences in various bits of kit or whatever... and it actually is psycoacoustic... frankly i couldnt give 2 shits!
if i chose to spend the money that i have earnt on stuff that my brain decides sounds better for what ever reason then thats my choice and my business!
science proves nothing, my brain wins everytime!
chris@panteg
23-02-2010, 23:53
I have to say ' the 640p cost me £60 and its pretty decent ' yes you can better it but £60 ! you can't knock it for that money .
The Vinyl Adventure
24-02-2010, 00:03
I have to say ' the 640p cost me £60 and its pretty decent ' yes you can better it but £60 ! you can't knock it for that money .
that was exactly my idea
but, if i can borrow marcos headamp that peq3 seems even more sencible to me
Stratmangler
24-02-2010, 00:07
Well, after trawling through all of the pages in this thread I'm confused about phono stages now, and I'm old enough to have grown up with vinyl as the medium to purchase music on.
What gets me is that you buggers claim that computer based audio is difficult to get your head around.:lolsign:
Seems to me it's the easy option.
Chris;)
What gets me is that you buggers claim that computer based audio is difficult to get your head around.:lolsign:
Seems to me it's the easy option.
Chris;)Computer audio will soon -even- be the only valid option for digital.
The industry just needs to wrap a computer in a sexy, nice-to-put-in-a-living-room package. They've started doing so. ;)
Well, after trawling through all of the pages in this thread I'm confused about phono stages now, and I'm old enough to have grown up with vinyl as the medium to purchase music on.
What gets me is that you buggers claim that computer based audio is difficult to get your head around.:lolsign:
:lol:
So, Chris, given that you're the correct 'vintage' for vinyl, why didn't you learn all the stuff you find confusing here years ago when you were growing up with turntables and records? ;)
It's interesting that you've learned how best to use the latest technology, but not that with which you grew up - just an observation, mate, that's all!
Marco.
If a Techie is too much, a Rega P1 or good used P3 would be a fantastic place to start and will continue to hold value..
Primalsea
28-02-2010, 10:32
Just to throw in another question here has anyone got any thoughts on Step U Transformers?
I have a rather humble Pro-Ject Tubebox (Mk1) that I actually rather like, it gels really well in my system. However I think I could get the sound to be cleaner if I went down the SUT route so I could reduce the gain on the Project and hopefully lower the noise floor.
I have an Ortofon Rohmann that has .25mV output and recommended load is >10ohms, I would need 20:1 ratio on the SUT.
Any ideas?
I have to shout for SOWTER (as should AlexUK) as they're based in Ipswich. They do a standard model and for a little extra they'll wire them with OFC wire. You have to put in your own box though, although you may be able to hard wire the wires coming out..
I have to shout for SOWTER (as should AlexUK) as they're based in Ipswich.
Indeed - support our local businesses please!
The Vinyl Adventure
28-02-2010, 14:43
whats SOWTER and what do they make that you have to put in a little box?
The Grand Wazoo
28-02-2010, 15:10
They make transformers & you can buy some suitable for a step up then stick em in a box or on a box.
.....like so..........
http://www.bobsdevices.com/images/sowtera.jpg
HighFidelityGuy
28-02-2010, 16:01
Sorry if this has already been mentioned, I couldn't be bothered to read the whole thread. Anyway, you can pickup a NAD PP2 from HERE (http://www.audioaffair.co.uk/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=3617) for £39.95, providing you don't mind not getting the original box. Free delivery too. :)
Seen as they're supposed to be good value at £50-60, you can't go wrong at that price.
Well, you lot can have a HUGE laugh at my expense :steam:
That means you two Daves (SoundHiFi Cawley and Radlett Wren.....)
Saw reference to the PEQ3 going cheap on a different thread here, so bought one, thinking it could do duty transferring LP's to PC M-Audio 2496 as an experiment. With added P&P the total was around £44 (alarm bells ringing). It arrived this morning with a further £16.50 approx added for import VAT and Parcel-farce handling charges. So, £60 or so and the wall-wart is US voltage only, as is the claim on the link posted by Marco. The socket isn't standard either, so you can't go into Maplin and buy an 18V step-down transformer:(
I've bid on a cheap old laptop power supply which *should* be better than an overworked wall-wart and I can splice one lead onto another to make a suitable supply, but I'm pigged off with my stupidity, as I could have got something that works from Dave C at a small discount and something even better at TRADE (!!!!!) from DW with change to spare.... The baby Rega Fono-mini would have been fine!!!!!!!!!
I'm a prize plonker of the first order. Shan't do that again - he says, shambling off into the sunset......
Hi Dave,
Did you not ask the person you bought it from if it would work on UK mains as standard?
Anyway, I bet that when you get it working properly it'll sound fab! Keep us posted :)
Marco.
The Vinyl Adventure
26-03-2010, 19:25
It will be more likely me that's keeping you posted marco.... Can I still borrow your head amp please? :)
The Vinyl Adventure
26-03-2010, 20:00
This should do eh???
http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww282/hamish_gill/fc4c587f.jpg
http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww282/hamish_gill/7642aa96.jpg
The Vinyl Adventure
26-03-2010, 20:00
I got spare tips too
You may need 'em Hamish. I'll post it out Monday and give you the other details you need too........ I'm sure it'll sound great as the 5525 chip can still do ok if used right IMO.
To be honest, a good solderer may be easily able to fit a different socket on the AT motherboard.
Marco, I took a gamble that the wall-wart was a 100 - 240V model as so many are. Sadly, it isn't...
The Vinyl Adventure
19-03-2012, 17:42
This thread is old!
All about Cheapy mm's these days me!
7 pages eh, what you lot on
I have what you need, unless you have sorted it?
The Vinyl Adventure
19-03-2012, 18:43
The last time I posted in this thread was 26th march 2010
It's well out of date!!
wiicrackpot
20-03-2012, 12:14
How did you end up with a Philips GP412?, is it a MC?, never heard of it before so has it darkhorse properties?.
Many Q's i know.:rolleyes:
wii.
The Grand Wazoo
20-03-2012, 12:33
Andy, take a look at Hamish's post no. 67.
The Vinyl Adventure
20-03-2012, 19:39
Yeah, proper gem IMO
Hard to find though, I just won a spare stylus for £5, tried to buy a second but got out bid at £20 for the second ...there were 2 on eBay minutes apart...
The first I've seen on eBay, bar third party ones since I got my cart maybe a year ago ...
There is a mkiii on eBay at the mo, but that's going to be mine too... Out bid me and I'll hunt you down and do in ya knees ;)
Reid Malenfant
20-03-2012, 20:47
There is a mkiii on eBay at the mo, but that's going to be mine too... Out bid me and I'll hunt you down and do in ya knees ;)
With your flash gun I assume Hamish :rfl:
The Vinyl Adventure
20-03-2012, 20:49
Nah, bit plastic...
wiicrackpot
21-03-2012, 01:00
Andy, take a look at Hamish's post no. 67.
Soz about that Chris, should read more slowly and take it in.:doh:
Yeah, proper gem IMO
Hard to find though, I just won a spare stylus for £5, tried to buy a second but got out bid at £20 for the second ...there were 2 on eBay minutes apart...
The first I've seen on eBay, bar third party ones since I got my cart maybe a year ago ...
There is a mkiii on eBay at the mo, but that's going to be mine too... Out bid me and I'll hunt you down and do in ya knees ;)
O.K. Hamish, all yours pal, i'll look into it after you've built up your wee stash.:)
P.S. just had a wee look on the Bay, doesn't look a giant killer, spotted a 215 and it comes in a bubble/card packaging.
wii.
The Vinyl Adventure
21-03-2012, 07:31
Hehe, nah it's fair game if it's on eBay ... I'm just very intrigued by the mkiii because of how good the mkii is
This is it http://www.vinylengine.com/library/philips/super-m-mark-ii.shtml
If packaging is anything to go by, mine came in a faux velvet lined box with gold (yes gold!!) cardboard packaging ... And on te subject of gold the outer part of the body of the cart is also made of gold coloured plastic ;)
Here you go, the thread at the time I found it... It explains the text in my signature if nothing else
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=10476
In one of the early posts I mention it sounding muddled ... That is not the case any more! I have it on a rb301 which the maths says it shouldn't work on! It actually sounds truly wonderful!
At one stage I had a techie with £2000 worth of mods including a audio technica oc9 ... My current set up IMO is a much better sounding one! Certainly makes music sound more like music! And the oc9 had a gold metal (although not actual gold) body ;)
In my mind it is a giant killer... I certainly have no desire to upgrade anything ... I just keep my eye on eBay for 400 series bits ... But as I say since I picked up the cart at the end of march last year I have only seen 2 original replacement stylus and one cart ...The stylus ended yesterday, I won one and lost the other. The cart is still on eBay, I have had it confirmed that it has no stylus, but I'll be buying as a spare anyway!
I guess they were just not that popular in thier day?
wiicrackpot
21-03-2012, 19:19
Hamish, Thanks for the info and links, much appreciated as my days of shelling mega bucks for carts are over, :( hence on the trails of old but good vintage carts.
wii.
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