Fitting Jelco 750 to Nottingham TT

[Mikeandvan]

Hi all, just got my Nottingham Interspace back from NAS (what a job they did!) and I am slightly confused as to how I fit the tonearm.
Here's a few pics

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4524/38293805591_1218644dd6_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21kTLgr)IMG_20171109_211745819 (https://flic.kr/p/21kTLgr) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4558/38293588901_905e7253da_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21kSDRp)IMG_20171109_211813193 (https://flic.kr/p/21kSDRp) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4548/38238780296_0f360c9937_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21g2Kas)IMG_20171109_211805248 (https://flic.kr/p/21g2Kas) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr

Now I know you put cart in headshell (where, front, middle or back?) and then place needle on a record and get arm parallel with record. But what I'm unsure about is the placement of the tonearm once in its collect (holder), how do I know exactly when to tighten the grub screw to fix the tonearm in place? Or is it just guess work? That is the tonearm should obviously run square alongside the TT edge, but as its an S shaped arm this is not so easy. Hope I'm making myself clear, may'be not, please help! I normally get Audio T to do this, but I've already bought a few carts from them recently and don't need another! Gonna fit my well used - but still some life in it - Denon dl110 to it.

[paulf-2007]

Hi all, just got my Nottingham Interspace back from NAS (what a job they did!) and I am slightly confused as to how I fit the tonearm.
Here's a few pics

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4524/38293805591_1218644dd6_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21kTLgr)IMG_20171109_211745819 (https://flic.kr/p/21kTLgr) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4558/38293588901_905e7253da_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21kSDRp)IMG_20171109_211813193 (https://flic.kr/p/21kSDRp) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4548/38238780296_0f360c9937_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21g2Kas)IMG_20171109_211805248 (https://flic.kr/p/21g2Kas) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr

Now I know you put cart in headshell (where, front, middle or back?) and then place needle on a record and get arm parallel with record. But what I'm unsure about is the placement of the tonearm once in its collect (holder), how do I know exactly when to tighten the grub screw to fix the tonearm in place? Or is it just guess work? That is the tonearm should obviously run square alongside the TT edge, but as its an S shaped arm this is not so easy. Hope I'm making myself clear, may'be not, please help! I normally get Audio T to do this, but I've already bought a few carts from them recently and don't need another! Gonna fit my well used - but still some life in it - Denon dl110 to it.
Check the travel of the tone arm from the centre of the record to the outside of the record and make sure there is nothing impeding it's movement, when you are happy with its position tighten the grub screw. I don't see it needing to be exact.

[Mikeandvan]

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4566/38294290601_bf51144d22_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21kWfrF)IMG_20171109_215956365 (https://flic.kr/p/21kWfrF) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr

Does arm look level?

[Mikeandvan]

BTW NAS were amazing in helping me renovate this TT. I bought it off a member of AOS, and it was an early Interspace model, no serial number, with the thicker platter which NAS advised they stopped making as it was uneconomical. The tonearm base had been buggered about with but NAS made do, they actually skimmed the arm base on a lathe for me, as it had been badly scratched, it now looks new. They also advised the original motor was noisy and had a bent spindle, so they replaced that. They originally sent me one of their ready made Jelco 750 arm base, but it wouldn't fit as my TT isn't exactly a regular one. So they said I should send it back to them, and I'm so glad I did, as they wouldn't have discovered the buggered motor or had a chance to make the rest of it look lovely as they did. All this for only £80! Getting the TT back (in the strongest box I 've ever seen) was like getting an early xmas pressie! They cleaned the base too and put one of their NAS interspace plastic logos on it. So its now a lovely slab of black, the silver 750 looks good against it. Yet to play it, will tell thoughts when I do. Currently using a Sony PS-X6, which is pretty damn good as well, absolutely silent motor. Just a shame the tonearm isn't more substantial. NAS also threw in a cart alignment gauge which has been very helpful.

[Mikeandvan]

OK, more updates. The arm rest was getting in the way of the arm when I placed the needle on a record, so I had to rotate the tonearm around anti clockwise until the arm rest was clear of the tonearm when playing records. A few pics to explain, still don't know whether I've done this right.

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4531/38294963351_558094dd8c_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21kZGqP)IMG_20171109_223548140 (https://flic.kr/p/21kZGqP) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4522/38263310292_125972432f_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21ict5q)IMG_20171109_223607723 (https://flic.kr/p/21ict5q) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4556/38294948781_b285ac4b24_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21kZC6B)IMG_20171109_223632449 (https://flic.kr/p/21kZC6B) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr

[Mikeandvan]

Well, all set up using the NAS gauge, seems to be perfect. Tried it with the DL110, wasn't as good as the sony with the Goldring 2200. So I put the Goldring on the jelco - keeping it on the Sony headshell and adjusting the tonearm weight, and it sounded better, fuller bass than the Denon, and overall smoother sound, there must be quite a few hours on the Dl110 to be fair. The Goldring is a month old. Not sounding a million miles better than the Sony yet, but I've only played a few sides, first impressions are quieter, smoother, clearer, but its not night and day. Still it looks great As we all know it takes a few hours listening to different records to appreciate the difference. That's if I've set it up correctly of course.

[paulf-2007]

OK, more updates. The arm rest was getting in the way of the arm when I placed the needle on a record, so I had to rotate the tonearm around anti clockwise until the arm rest was clear of the tonearm when playing records. A few pics to explain, still don't know whether I've done this right.

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4531/38294963351_558094dd8c_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21kZGqP)IMG_20171109_223548140 (https://flic.kr/p/21kZGqP) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4522/38263310292_125972432f_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21ict5q)IMG_20171109_223607723 (https://flic.kr/p/21ict5q) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickr
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4556/38294948781_b285ac4b24_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21kZC6B)IMG_20171109_223632449 (https://flic.kr/p/21kZC6B) by Mike Van (https://www.flickr.com/photos/145505522@N02/), on Flickras long as the arm runs into the run off groove with no restrictions you must have it right. I had a similar problem when I fitted Stax arm, but as the Stax arm base has a key in a key way I was unable to rotate the arm base like you can. I had to drill three new holes as the collar is fixed with three screws. When the arm got to the run out groove it was lifting off the record because the antiskate mechanism was fouling on the arm.

[Haselsh1]

Got to be honest Mike, I used to use a Denon DL160 and really wasn't impressed with it. Whilst I had it Denon cranked up the price so when I sold it I got as much as I paid for it. I do though love the Nottingham Analogue Interspace which is why I use one. I also had the same problem with the rest on my Origin Live Onyx and had to rotate the arm base slightly so that it would clear the rest whilst playing an LP. I prefer the Interspace to the Space Deck as, as a solid support I find it less compromised than the Space Deck. I never used to like that third support under the Space Deck plinth that is wholly supported on a piece of quarter thread.

[Mikeandvan]

as long as the arm runs into the run off groove with no restrictions you must have it right. I had a similar problem when I fitted Stax arm, but as the Stax arm base has a key in a key way I was unable to rotate the arm base like you can. I had to drill three new holes as the collar is fixed with three screws. When the arm got to the run out groove it was lifting off the record because the antiskate mechanism was fouling on the arm.

I used the gauge that came with the TT (NAS threw it in free among other things!), and its all good now.

[Mikeandvan]

Got to be honest Mike, I used to use a Denon DL160 and really wasn't impressed with it. Whilst I had it Denon cranked up the price so when I sold it I got as much as I paid for it. I do though love the Nottingham Analogue Interspace which is why I use one. I also had the same problem with the rest on my Origin Live Onyx and had to rotate the arm base slightly so that it would clear the rest whilst playing an LP. I prefer the Interspace to the Space Deck as, as a solid support I find it less compromised than the Space Deck. I never used to like that third support under the Space Deck plinth that is wholly supported on a piece of quarter thread.

I don't know how much difference there is between the Interspace and spacedeck and hyperspace etc but I'm not really one for minor upgrades, I don't seem to hear what audiophiles hear. But like you I like the 1 piece base of this TT, and since getting it back from NAS it looks amazing, they are really nice people. I'm starting to appreciate its sound the more I play it, it turns out more solid sounds, for instance drums have real depth to them. But as in my other threads I have a bass boom problem with my set up/room and the Interspace slightly exacerbates that. Of course not entirely sure I have set it up to play at its best.

[Tea24]

Not trying to hijack the thread, but would it be possible to fit a Jelco750 to my Interspace Junior? Not that I am unhappy with the Notts arm, but I would like to be able to change carts at will. The Junior looks very much like the OP's early Interspace.

By the way Mike, can we have some listening feedback with this combo please?

Julian

[Mikeandvan]

Not trying to hijack the thread, but would it be possible to fit a Jelco750 to my Interspace Junior? Not that I am unhappy with the Notts arm, but I would like to be able to change carts at will. The Junior looks very much like the OP's early Interspace.

By the way Mike, can we have some listening feedback with this combo please?

Julian

I'm guessing you can change arms, just send an email to NAS, they are extremely helpful. My turntable is sounding good now, as I stated earlier it takes a few days listening to get an idea of changes. Was playing some jazz today and I'm pretty sure this is he best I've ever heard it sound. Solid, good timing, bass is a accentuated, which isn't good in my system, but the speakers or room need adjusting to fix that I guess. Before I had the Jelco on a 1210 and that was good, but I think the NAS beats it. And I absolutely love its looks and simplicity.

[Tea24]

Great! This gives me ideas.

By the way I couple my Notts table with a Pro-ject Speed Box SE, which has several advantages.

1. IMHO it definitely improves the sound.
2. Rock solid speed stability.
3. Speed adjustment.
4. No need to move belt when changing from 33 to 45.

Julian

[Mikeandvan]

Great! This gives me ideas.

By the way I couple my Notts table with a Pro-ject Speed Box SE, which has several advantages.

1. IMHO it definitely improves the sound.
2. Rock solid speed stability.
3. Speed adjustment.
4. No need to move belt when changing from 33 to 45.

Julian

How do you connect it to the Interspace? I'm baffled. And it what ways does it improve sound? I think the timing is already pretty good on my Interspace.

[Tea24]

You just plug it in and plug the speed controller into the mains. A strobe disc is then used to get the TT running at exactly the right speed.

The best explanation of what it does I took from Deco Audio's site:

"The circuit inside most turntables is in essence a very basic Resistor/Capacitor network. The capacitor is in place to make sure that the platter always spins in the right direction when you turn it on. This is a very cheap and simple way of making a turntable, and in a perfect world would be a perfectly satisfactory. However this not being the case the motor ends up directly seeing all the impurities and irregularities that are a feature of the mains supply.


For example whilst in the UK the mains is supposedly 50Hz it actually varies*, this can results both in absolute pitch change and stability problems. So the ability to generate a new mains waveform can be very beneficial, not only does it guarantee that the speed remains stable but it should also be possible to make it much cleaner with less noise and distortion than exists on the mains.


*in fact all the electricity board have to do is maintain an average of 50Hz with a 1% tolerance throughout the course of 24 hours, to ensure that AC powered clocks keep good time over the course of a day."

The sound, to me at any rate, certainly sounds more defined. In fact Tom FLetcher who designed the Notts tables offered one as an accessory & supplied them on some of his higher end tables - the Pro-ject one is just much cheaper.

[Intenso]

You just plug it in and plug the speed controller into the mains.

Plug what in? The Notts TT simply has a UK plug attached to it. I can't see anywhere on the speedbox that will accept a 3 pin plug?

Love what you have done to the NA BTW Mike!

[Tea24]

You plug the wall wart of the speed controller into the mains & the plug on the end of the TT mains lead into the back of the sped box - job done!

[Intenso]

You plug the wall wart of the speed controller into the mains & the plug on the end of the TT mains lead into the back of the sped box - job done!

Ah, I get it now.

Do they come with 3 pin versions as all I can see is two pin euro socket versions which is what confused me?

[Tea24]

Well I live in France so I have the 2 pin version but they make, or used to make, a 3 pin UK version. In fact my TT had originally a UK plug so I simply didn't bother with the earth wire when I put a 2 pin euro plug on the end - doesn't seem to make any difference & i needed the 2 pin wall wart for here, obviously.

[Intenso]

Well I live in France so I have the 2 pin version but they make, or used to make, a 3 pin UK version. In fact my TT had originally a UK plug so I simply didn't bother with the earth wire when I put a 2 pin euro plug on the end - doesn't seem to make any difference & i needed the 2 pin wall wart for here, obviously.

Took a bit of time but I can see you're right.

The model is the Pro-Ject Speed Box SE II which retailed at about £400 and not the current cheaper version which will only work with Project TTs.

Looks like the Pro-Ject Speed Box SE II is now discontinued though.

Might be worth looking out for secondhand...

[Tea24]

Well Deco audio will sell you the Bastin one for £500 which includes a strobe disc; when I bought my Pro-ject it was about £250 if I remember right but that was about 10 years ago.

[Mikeandvan]

Well Deco audio will sell you the Bastin one for £500 which includes a strobe disc; when I bought my Pro-ject it was about £250 if I remember right but that was about 10 years ago.

Too expensive! My whole TT and arm cost me less than £500!

[Mikeandvan]

Plug what in? The Notts TT simply has a UK plug attached to it. I can't see anywhere on the speedbox that will accept a 3 pin plug?

Love what you have done to the NA BTW Mike!

I was lucky I sent it back to NAS - at first I didn't, they sent me a new arm base for my Jelco but it didn't fit, so they said it was best if I sent them the TT. They advised motor was noisy and spindle bent, so good to get that changed, and also milled the arm board so it now looks good as new, all this - and more! and they only charged me £80. They're obviously passionate about what they do, as they were really doing me a favour, they certainly didn't make any money out of me!

[Mikeandvan]

Glad to report that this is now the best TT I've had. I've owned in order - RP3, Heybrook TT2 with RB300 then briefly OL Silver (I didn't like the silver - the counter weight is very hard to set and the bias is a fiddly piece of string). A 1210 with the Jelco which I liked, but it doesn't have the detail resolution of the Interspace, and I didn't fancy the upgrade path. So kept the Jelco, cos I love its detachable headshell. Then got the Interspace, which came with RB300, and left it for ages while I figured out how to mount the jelco, that story is above. The interspace with the RB300 wasn't anything special, it wasn't bad either. Its only after sending the Interspace to NAS and them fitting the tonearm base for the Jelco, that the deck now sounds like something better than all the previous decks I've owned, it has a new motor too which probably helps. I see no need to ever move on from this, bollocks to spending thousands on tiny improvements in sound!

[alphaGT]

A fine looking setup Mike! Most impressive for what you’ve got invested!

From looking at the photo, the tonearm looks slightly low in the rear. Does it have VTA adjustment? If not, a shim may be used to raise it up a bit. If it is in fact low in the rear, it could just be the camera angle? When I say shim, I mean just a plastic disk that is cut to match the base, of a given thickness. If you get it right, chances are you’ll never need to adjust it again anyway. But if you are able to get the bottom of the cartridge parallel to the record, it doesn’t hurt if the tonearm is slightly uphill, as long as it doesn’t drag the edge of the record as it gets closer to the spindle. Even a thin wedge between the cart and headshell can be used to square the base of the cartridge to the record.

Mounting the cartridge into the headshell, there is what they call “overhang”. You see the long slots in the headshell that allow moving the cart forward and back a bit. When you place the alignment gauge on the platter, and try to square the sides of the cartridge with the lines on the gauge, it will line up with one set, but not the other, until you get the overhang, or distance forward just right, then it will line up with both sets of square lines. It’s not that difficult really.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Haselsh1]

My Interspace came with an RB250 which was nothing very special so I replaced it with the Origin Live Onyx which was a huge step forward. I was going to fit the Jelco but was then put off having heard about the mounting collar issue. If I am buying a brand new tonearm I do not want to then have to pay out more money for an after market mounting collar. I do though love detachable headshells. A very forward thinking device.

[Mikeandvan]

A fine looking setup Mike! Most impressive for what you’ve got invested!

From looking at the photo, the tonearm looks slightly low in the rear. Does it have VTA adjustment? If not, a shim may be used to raise it up a bit. If it is in fact low in the rear, it could just be the camera angle? When I say shim, I mean just a plastic disk that is cut to match the base, of a given thickness. If you get it right, chances are you’ll never need to adjust it again anyway. But if you are able to get the bottom of the cartridge parallel to the record, it doesn’t hurt if the tonearm is slightly uphill, as long as it doesn’t drag the edge of the record as it gets closer to the spindle. Even a thin wedge between the cart and headshell can be used to square the base of the cartridge to the record.

Mounting the cartridge into the headshell, there is what they call “overhang”. You see the long slots in the headshell that allow moving the cart forward and back a bit. When you place the alignment gauge on the platter, and try to square the sides of the cartridge with the lines on the gauge, it will line up with one set, but not the other, until you get the overhang, or distance forward just right, then it will line up with both sets of square lines. It’s not that difficult really.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Thanks for the advice Alpha, I was thinking last night how the tonearm looked a bit down at the back, its easy to set VTA, you just loosen alen bolt in tonearm collar and it moves up and down. NAS also sent me a cartridge gauge which I'm getting the hang of now, don't know why I used to bother bringing my TTs to the local Audio T to get them to change cart, duh! I've tried a few carts on it now, I think the Goldring is best, but the other 2 may be a bit worn. I listen to vinyl about 4 hours a day. I understand this is more than some folk! I did pay a good price for this TT and arm, but as Ying & Yang would have it I bought an expensive (for me) cart a few months back at £400 and I broke it after only 2 days. That was my first and last expensive cart, now I won't go above £200.

[Mikeandvan]

My Interspace came with an RB250 which was nothing very special so I replaced it with the Origin Live Onyx which was a huge step forward. I was going to fit the Jelco but was then put off having heard about the mounting collar issue. If I am buying a brand new tonearm I do not want to then have to pay out more money for an after market mounting collar. I do though love detachable headshells. A very forward thinking device.

NAS provide an arm base especially for the Jelco, which makes the collar redundant. The guy that bought my OL Silver seemed happy with it, personally I rate ease of use, which is why I don't bother with record weights and such.

[alphaGT]

Thanks for the advice Alpha, I was thinking last night how the tonearm looked a bit down at the back, its easy to set VTA, you just loosen alen bolt in tonearm collar and it moves up and down. NAS also sent me a cartridge gauge which I'm getting the hang of now, don't know why I used to bother bringing my TTs to the local Audio T to get them to change cart, duh! I've tried a few carts on it now, I think the Goldring is best, but the other 2 may be a bit worn. I listen to vinyl about 4 hours a day. I understand this is more than some folk!

Yes it’s nothing to it once you’ve done it a few times. And at 4 hours a day, you’re getting your money’s worth!


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