Warm sounding cartridge or phono pre-amp

[Rob1969]

I recently got a Project Classic with the Ortofon Silver Cartridge and whilst I love the looks the sound is a little on the thin side.

Can anyone recommend a cartridge to replace the Ortofon that has a richer more substantial presentation (to go with a Rega phono pre) or a replacement for the Rega that would go well with the Ortofon and give me the sound I am looking for.

Thanks.

[walpurgis]

A vintage Shure cartridge could be the thing. They certainly don't sound weedy.

When asking for recommendations, stating your budget is a good idea.

[Rob1969]

A vintage Shure cartridge could be the thing. They certainly don't sound weedy.

When asking for recommendations, stating your budget is a good idea.

Budget would be around £400.

[walpurgis]

For a bit more, you'd buy a Rega Fono MC and a new Denon DL-103 low output moving coil cartridge. Locate a good second hand DL-103 (they are not hard to find) and you could be within budget. The DL-103 would never be accused of sounding 'thin'!

[Jazid]

For a bit more, you'd buy a Rega Fono MC and a new Denon DL-103 low output moving coil cartridge. Locate a good second hand DL-103 (they are not hard to find) and you could be within budget. The DL-103 would never be accused of sounding 'thin'!There's a Denon AU320 SUT in the classifieds which could be bought along with a new 103 under budget, and use the existing phono stage. Great combo (I use one and it is as far from 'thin' sounding as I can imagine) but I don't know your phono stage and how that might contribute.
Mind you, the Denon likes a massy arm, not sure the Project is ideal in that respect?
Sent from my GT-I9195 using Tapatalk

[hifi_dave]

Absolutely nothing wrong with the Rega phono stage and I would suggest you retain that and buy a better balanced cartridge than the 2M Silver. Something like a Rega Exact, Goldring or Hana should do the job nicely.

Get that Silver on the classifieds or E-Bay and the changeover won't be expensive.

[Spectral Morn]

Have you run it in ? If reaction is based on a not run in cart, then run it in and then decide. I suspect you are not hearing it run in. Also is the Rega set up right for it and the arm cart properly set up/aligned ?

[Rob1969]

Have you run it in ? If reaction is based on a not run in cart, then run it in and then decide. I suspect you are not hearing it run in. Also is the Rega set up right for it and the arm cart properly set up/aligned ?

The cartridge has probably 15 or so hours on it so maybe need to give it a bit more time before rushing into another purchase....

[Rob1969]

Have you run it in ? If reaction is based on a not run in cart, then run it in and then decide. I suspect you are not hearing it run in. Also is the Rega set up right for it and the arm cart properly set up/aligned ?

The cartridge has probably 15 or so hours on it so maybe need to give it a bit more time before rushing into another purchase....

[Spectral Morn]

The cartridge has probably 15 or so hours on it so maybe need to give it a bit more time before rushing into another purchase....

No where near enough time on it, 50 hours to 100

[Rob1969]

The cartridge is slowly settling in. Bass is much better than it was and the top end is starting to lose some of the edge it had.

Still not quite as "musical" as the Rega but the gap is closing.

[Primalsea]

Have you tried adjusting the tracking weight and rake angle. Some times a little tweak can help.

[moffer]

Is there a reason why you can't try whatever cartridge is fitted to your Planar 3 with the Pro-ject? You might prefer it to the Ortofon.

[vinylist]

Hi Rob - in case you decide to look at a new cartridge - I tried a few up to that sort of money and settled on a Hana EH. Very rounded and musical to my ears, nice bit of warmth to it. (Don’t think i’ve heard an Ortofon Silver but the Hana was much more to my tastes than the Bronze).

[alphaGT]

I’m not familiar with the Rega preamp, but it’s kind of a budget piece isn’t it? Don’t underestimate the importance of the preamp, you could probably find a £1000 preamp used in the £400 range. Something with great flexibility in setup, you will be able to adjust it to match nearly any cartridge in the future. MC carts are usually a step up from MM, something you can work toward in the future. Even if you buy a warmer cartridge now, be thinking about a better pre in the future.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[hifi_dave]

"Budget piece" it might be but I've heard far worse at £1K, so it's not shabby by any standard.

[alphaGT]

"Budget piece" it might be but I've heard far worse at £1K, so it's not shabby by any standard.

I certainly don’t mean to insinuate that it’s not a decent entry level component. And there is much to be said for simplicity. My point is just that the pre is just as important as any other piece in the chain, equal to the cartridge, and ‘table, etc. and is often overlooked.

In the past I always depended on the built in phono preamp built into the main preamp, when I invested in an outboard pre I was shocked and amazed at the improvement. ( and I’m aware that some high end preamps have some awesome built in phono boards). At present I’ve got a Musical Surroundings Phonomena, 2 chassis unit with battery power, it sold for $1000 new, and I got it used at $435, a major score as far as I’m concerned! I’ve got a ways to go in the cartridge department before I outgrow it.

So yes, the Rega may prove perfectly fine for the time being, but keeping an eye to the future, and keeping your cartridge options open, is not a bad thing.

Russell


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Rob1969]

Thanks for all the various replies. Tried a few basic tweaks and they seem to have helped.

The Rega is now sold and so I am "stuck" with the Project Classic - to be honest now it has a few more hours it is no bad thing. It really has closed the gap on the Rega in the areas that the Rega excels but to my ears adds a better soundstage and more detail to the proceedings.

Thanks again for all the suggestions. I am still tempted to change the Rega Pre for something with the flexibility to adjust load etc as I wouldn't mind trying a MC cartridge on the Classic.

Short list up to £500 would be the Project Tube Box DS or the Arcam rPhono.

Any thoughts on these or other suggestions? Smallish boxes please. Appreciate I could buy a separate preamp with a phono stage included but haven't the shelf space.

[seanm]

...

Short list up to £500 would be the Project Tube Box DS or the Arcam rPhono.

Any thoughts on these or other suggestions? Smallish boxes please. Appreciate I could buy a separate preamp with a phono stage included but haven't the shelf space.

Of those two, the Pro-ject has the more useful loading options for MM: looks like the lowest capacitance with the Arcam is 120pF, which is too high for Audio Technicas and (from what I've heard, no personal experience) possibly the 2M series as well.

[BenK]

Thanks for all the various replies. Tried a few basic tweaks and they seem to have helped.

The Rega is now sold and so I am "stuck" with the Project Classic - to be honest now it has a few more hours it is no bad thing. It really has closed the gap on the Rega in the areas that the Rega excels but to my ears adds a better soundstage and more detail to the proceedings.

Thanks again for all the suggestions. I am still tempted to change the Rega Pre for something with the flexibility to adjust load etc as I wouldn't mind trying a MC cartridge on the Classic.

Short list up to £500 would be the Project Tube Box DS or the Arcam rPhono.

Any thoughts on these or other suggestions? Smallish boxes please. Appreciate I could buy a separate preamp with a phono stage included but haven't the shelf space.

No experience with the Arcam, but my brother has a Tube Box DS and it's a very nice little thing; sounds really good and lots of options to optimise if for different carts, including MC if you subsequently decide to go that way.


Of those two, the Pro-ject has the more useful loading options for MM: looks like the lowest capacitance with the Arcam is 120pF, which is too high for Audio Technicas and (from what I've heard, no personal experience) possibly the 2M series as well.

Ortofon quotes 150-300pF for the 2M range.

[Rob1969]

Thanks for the replies.

The Tube DS looks tempting - the only issue is that it pushes into Croft Phono Preamp territory for, in the scheme of things, not much more.

Then there are offerings by Graham Slee which come highly recommended.........

What I thought was simple is turning into a minefield. A good one with all the choice mind.

[oldson]

Rob1969
curious to know what you decided on?

[magiccarpetride]

I recently got a Project Classic with the Ortofon Silver Cartridge and whilst I love the looks the sound is a little on the thin side.

Can anyone recommend a cartridge to replace the Ortofon that has a richer more substantial presentation (to go with a Rega phono pre) or a replacement for the Rega that would go well with the Ortofon and give me the sound I am looking for.

Thanks.

In my experience, everything largely depends on the LP you're listening to. I have LPs in my collection that sound wonderfully warm, cuddly, cozy, liquid and just delightful. But I also have LPs that sound thin, brittle, metallic, unpleasant to listen to. Some of the worst LPs can literally drive listeners out of the room!

I've never heard a cartridge/phono combo that was capable of sugar coating horrendously thin sounding LPs. So maybe it would help if you list the LPs that sound thin on your system? That way, maybe you'll learn that those LPs sound thin on much more higher end systems, and that might save you some money down the road ;)

[STD305M]

Rob1969
curious to know what you decided on?


I use a project turntable and have an Audio Technica at33ptg on it.
Sound great, definitely not thin
Huge soundstage and bags of details but more important it sounds very musical

Your welcome to come over and listen

[curry49]

In case you again lean toward a 'warmer' sounding cart, perhaps you may want to consider a Grado Platinum or Sonata.

[Jac Hawk]

In my experience, everything largely depends on the LP you're listening to. I have LPs in my collection that sound wonderfully warm, cuddly, cozy, liquid and just delightful. But I also have LPs that sound thin, brittle, metallic, unpleasant to listen to. Some of the worst LPs can literally drive listeners out of the room!

I've never heard a cartridge/phono combo that was capable of sugar coating horrendously thin sounding LPs. So maybe it would help if you list the LPs that sound thin on your system? That way, maybe you'll learn that those LPs sound thin on much more higher end systems, and that might save you some money down the road ;)

100% agree, i have many LP's in my collection that sound crap, most of the U2 and The Police albums sound very thin and tinny, a shame really