View Full Version : cartridge recommendation for a Linn Ittok
Hi and thanks for taking the time look
I am having an LVII (MK1) Ittok rewired and I was thinking ahead to a suitable cartridge.
Its going to be mounted on a Heybrook TT2 and will run into a modest system of Cambridge 640p / Marantz PM7200 / Wharfedale Diamond 9.1.
I have a PT1 with Mission 774SM / Denon DL160 which I love the sound of but I wanted to try a different MC cartridge with the Ittok / TT2.
My budget at the moment is about £250.00. My musical taste is Jazz, Soul, Funk, Blues, Rock, Folk, Dance, Electronica but not really into classical music.
Some of the carts I`ve looked at are:
1. Sumiko Blue Point Special Evo III
2. Ortofon X5, X3 and MC3 Turbo
3. Goldenote Babele
4. Dynavector 10X5
5. Benz Micro Silver / Gold
6. Audio Technica OC9 MKII
I`ve found these by doing a search online over the last couple of days but as I have never tried any of them I have no preference.
If you could briefly describe the sound quality behind your reason for your recommendation I`d be grateful.
Cheers
Bubba45
Who's doing the re-wiring?
The ittok has a lively sound and will be great on the TT2 as long as the latter has the cast sub-chassis. If it's an early one with tubular steel sub-chassis, then the bass will boing too much and smeer the mid IMO - a Basik Plus or cheap Jelco would be better.
A Troika or Karma bought as cheap as possible and sent to EsCo for a re-build would be an excellent match and, of the ones you mention, I'd personally avoid the Ortofons listed, as all of them sounded a bit crude and nothing like as good as a top notch mm to me... Just 'cos they're moving coil doesn't mean they're any good you know...
The BPS in all its forms has been a favourite of mine, just take care of it....;) The 10XV is a bit more refined than its predecessor which used to cost the same as the DL110 (it did, honestly!) and the ittok loves it, as well as the 20X and 17D if set up carefully.
I'm a fan of the OC9ML2 but some find it a bit OTT in the treble. Again, set up right it can sound fantastic, but the fine-line tip needs great skill in setting up.
The first thing is to check the TT2 for the better later sub-chassis. Heybrook thamselves used an Ittok on one with no difficulties. I'd probably look at modern mat technology too if you haven't already done so, as the wooly felt Heybrook used will have gone off by now and a Herbies/SoundHiFi style one (or an NAS Spacemat perhaps) should be a useful upgrade and ready for when you upgrade the whole thing to a techie/Jelco :lolsign:
The only 'reasonably priced' cartridges I would personaly consider would be re-tipped Karma, Troika (as Dave mentions above) - or a new Audio-Technica AT33PTG. There are other cartridges I would be happy to use - buy not cheaper than these.
+1 on the PTG over the OC9ML, but they have to be imported and I don't know about current costs, that's all...
Andrew's EsCo'd Troika sounded really good to me and I've a sneaky suspicion that on an Ittok, today and on a TT2, this one may well beat the lot...
+1 on the PTG over the OC9ML, but they have to be imported and I don't know about current costs, that's all...
Andrew's EsCo'd Troika sounded really good to me and I've a sneaky suspicion that on an Ittok, today and on a TT2, this one may well beat the lot...
Yes, he has an ESCo Troika on an Ittok - quite a high spec LP12 though (all the latest spec including RadiKal motor - but RubiKon instead of a Keel chassis).
As some may know - I also use an ESCo Troika (have done for many years)but in a (very lightly modified) Aro and not on a commercially available turntable.
To be honest, I'm a firm believer in the 'source first' principle (at least with regard to turntables - which is all that interests me) and would place the deck well ahead of the arm and both significantly ahead of the cartridge. Having said that, there is a distinct minimum that I am prepared to listen to when it comes to cartridges.
http://www.hovanfue.com/store/products/audio%252dtechnica-AT33PTG-MC-type-cartridge.html
For what it's worth, I loved my AT OC5 on my Ittok/LP12 combo - just hit the right spot for me, lively and dynamic with a deep & wide soundstage. I can only imagine the OC9 would be 'more of the same'.
Jason
chris@panteg
05-02-2010, 09:57
Jason i would say go for the 0C9 ' trust your ear's ' one of my friends has the LP12/ittok/OC5 ' He loves it .
Yep, Audio-Technica cartridges tend to work pretty well on the Ittok and Ekos, therefore an OC-9 or AT33PTG should be a good combo.
However, much like Mark, I think that an ESCo'd Troika would be the one. Remember that this was specifically designed to partner the Ittok, so here I feel lies the best synergy :)
Marco.
The Karma is a good second hand choice too (although prices on these have risen a lot recently). With regard to the OC5 and 9 - the 5 is OK but not in the same class as the others mentioned; the 9 is not to my taste at all - far too yin and not enough yang (as they used to say in the Absolute Sound) :), just too lean and emotionally detached (though better in this respect than some Dynavectors). Andrew had an OC9 before his Troika and thought it was great. The first time I heard his system I told him he needed a Troika to re-balance it - eventually he relented and as soon as he made the change he realised exactly what he had been missing (he owns two now and has never looked back).
It’s a popular belief that the Ittok isn’t good enough for some ‘top flight’ cartridges but in all honesty that just isn’t true. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think it is the best arm out there (I don’t use one) but it is genuinely good (significantly better than some other options) and quite capable of doing a posh cartridge justice. However, as I implied before, the cartridge is very much secondary to the arm and deck combination. It doesn’t matter how shiny and pretty the fine detail is if the bone structure is crap. In all honesty, although I know all about the build of the Heybrook, I can’t remember what it sounded like at all (though I suspect one could get it to sound surprisingly good – especially the cast chassis version).
Please noe fella's that we're NOT talking about an LP12, but a deck that was judged a rung or two down from it - fairly or not...
If the TT2 has the tubular sub-chassis then it will be rather coloured, if a little "boppy" with it. The OC9 may work ok, but I can say with some certainty that it may not be a balanced sound.
If the TT2 has the cast sub-chassis, the balance may be rather better and the Ittok will be given more of a chance to shine, especially in re-wired form (I hope all the fixing screws and bearings will be sympathetically attended to as well). Remember to fit and finally tighten the cartridge with the arm OFF the deck, as failing to do this flexes the arm-tube and can loosen the fixings...
A good and well fettled Ittok *should* out-perform ANY of the detachable headshell arms out there (maybe not an SME 309 in fairness), as long as effective mass is considered when cartridge matching. Important or not, the "SME style" headshell fixing has a definite resonance in the midrange which comes up on practically every arm of this type available and regardless of price charged. OK, a solid headshell will minimise the effect and once again, careful cartridge choice should all but ignore this. The Ittok has a fixed shell to IMPROVE performance, not degrade it.......
Hi all
And thanks for getting back to me. You`ve certainly got plenty to think about now.
Just to clarify though the Ittok has been refurbished by J7 of Audiorigami with full bearing strip down and check, internal rewire and arm tube foam filled. A Troika or similar Linn cart won`t be possible as the internal wires run straight through to the cartridge tags.
Sadly the TT2 is a mark 1 with the welded subchasis and I had not realised there so much difference between the 2 types of subchasis. I`m sure the guy who designed the TT2 said he did not think there was any real sonic difference between the 2 types.
Of the carts suggested here and on other forums 4 are in the running:
ATOC9; AT33PTG; Golden(Blue)note Babele; Benz Silver / Gold
The AT33PTG probabaly 1st choice at the moment.
Cheers for the replies
Jason
You could still use a Troika - Andrew's arm wires are the same as yours (as are the ones on my ARO) - you just need some little femal to female pins (easy to make). The Karma has standard pins like most cartridges.
Hmmm.... Funnily enough I was pondering whether that would be possible after I put my post up.
I have not done many searches about the Karma but I know that like the Troika it is as rare as hen`s teeth, costs about £200 - £250 to start with and then another £265 for a retip.
I guess because of the scarcity of both and the outlay pushes my budget too much at the moment I had thought of going for one of the other 4 in my post.
A Karma or a Troika may be a longer term goal.
flatpopely
10-02-2010, 14:35
Its £285 for a full rebuild. If the Karma is in good nick with an intact cantilever then its not as much just for a retip.
I *personally* thought the TT2 better with the cast sub-chassis, but that's just me...
A re-built AO Ittok will be rather better than a twenty five year old un-touched item, so treasure it, maybe add a better exit cable if this hasn't been attended to in the re-furb and for heaven's sake look out for a troika (how do you think the ARO copes - by supplying f-f links as Mark suggests. Johnie may be able to make some perhaps?.
I use a vintage OC9 (Stilton'd) and have no difficulty with it at all (the NAS Spacemat or one of Dave Cawley's mats should be perfect for it). The PTG has a little more power/weight in the bass, but would still be a touch "leaner" than a re-built Troika or Karma.
Look out for an OK Karma and get it re-built, even if you get the PTG now and use it while the Karma is being sorted. With an Ittok, I really don't think you'll be disappointed.
P.S. just a note about future deck upgrades. I don't think an Ittok would be entirely happy with a Techie, but I'd love to be proved wrong. Before the Systemdek III gets re-discovered, I'd look out for one of these cheap, as fettled and with a new belt (from Audio Note, since they make the II model as their own now???), it knocks the pants off a standard 1980's LP12, loved the Ittok and sounded more like the Roksan Xerxes, many of which now have sagging arm boards and faulty power supplies I think.
There was a time when the opinions of Dave and myself seemed to be poles apart. These days I want to validate every post he makes (perhaps I have mellowed like an overripe cheese....;)).
I use a Karma as my backup cartridge and (in my arm and on my deck) it performs remarkably well (it was the model bellow the Troika back in the day).
As Dave writes above, both the Karma and the Troika have a character more biased towards the bass than cartridges such as the OC9 (for example). If the arm and deck (not to mention the rest of the supporting system) are sympathetically matched the sound can have quite remarkable midrange communication with a very 'human' quality'. However, if poorly matched I could easily believe that this quality could be masked and replaced with a rather dull and overly warm presentation.
I don't know how your Heybrook sounds to be honest, but looking at the design I would be surprised if it sounds much like the deck I use.
Mark, I think and hope we both agree that EsCo'd Karma's and Troika's are rather better and more neutral beasts than the factory originals..
I remember the very first Karma's sounding crisp and lively. After a very few months, subsequent batches, from new, sounded like a run-in original and went dull from there. Linn claimed they had removed a resonanse in the mid treble region and if the things were measured, the response might have been more linear. My experience first hand of an Esco'd Troika (with original Vital tip) and Andrew's needle drops (downloaded or not) assures me that the re-built Troika (and mechanically similar) Karma have a sense of life and "verve" up top that I don't remember the originals having - more like a tamed Decca IMO :eek: although I do draw the line at using either brand in a PL71 arm..............
Then again, I love the AT OC9 and 33 series, but do admit that in some brightly lit systems it may be too much of a good thing ;)
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2026 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.