View Full Version : How knowledgeable are hi fi sales staff overall?
magiccarpetride
21-08-2017, 17:08
I've been frequenting various hi fi shops recently, looking for ways to improve my audio chain. Been chatting with the sales staff, asking questions.
What strikes me is the discrepancy I've been hearing from various 'experts'. Often times, what one sales guy claims is being denied by another sales guy (in a different shop, of course).
That made me wonder -- how competent overall are those sales guys? Do they know (are the expected to know) a lot of facts, or are they just expected to bullshit their clientele?
rigger67
21-08-2017, 17:24
Maybe they believe it because they stock the products and listen to them every day.
If you worked in the Levi's Store you'd probably think their jeans are better than, say, the ones they sell down the road in Diesel or across the mall in Gap.
I think the most you can hope for is a store that presents products according to what the client tells them they're looking for, their budget, room size, musical tastes, etc and lets the customer decide for themselves.
Then there's the consideration that customers already find themselves attracted to certain brands and go to the dealers that stock them so they're halfway there anyway.
I think the only way to be totally honest is in a used hi-fi store which stocks any and all brands regardless.
walpurgis
21-08-2017, 17:26
Why would you suppose dealer sales staff might be 'experts'?
Many of them could have little or no training and may only have been in the job a short while and picked up little real knowledge.
Some dealers use good people, but lets face it, those are probably hard to come by.
I think you are more likely to get well informed opinion here.
You wouldn't believe the crap I've had told to me at dealers. When they realise they are confronted by somebody who actually knows their stuff, they tend to spot another customer who requires immediate assistance and move away :lol:.
magiccarpetride
21-08-2017, 17:31
Why would you suppose dealer sales staff might be 'experts'?
Many of them could have little or no training and may only have been in the job a short while and picked little real knowledge up.
Some dealers use good people, but lets face it, those are probably hard to come by.
I think you are more likely to get well informed opinion here.
No doubt. But what I cannot get here is the ability to sit down and listen to the recommended components. The only reason I go to the brick-and-mortar stores it to be able to evaluate different configurations side by side. However, if the staff are not knowledgeable, they won't be able to demonstrate the right configuration, so it'll end up being a waste of everyone's time.
Manicatel
21-08-2017, 17:31
Like any other sphere, some know more than others. Some good some bad.
Then again, you will get customers who just want to go to a shop to show off how much they know.
A bit like going to a restaurant & telling the chef how you cooked your meal last night!
I know people who work in Hifi stores who go to manufacturers for training & also have visits from reps to update new products.
Then again, all the tech knowledge in the world is no good whatsoever if they can't talk to customers & are rude, with no people skills. It would be easy to baffle a new customer with tech info about streaming, for instance without effective communication skills.
A good retailer will give sensible advice, even if he doesnt stock it or doesnt get the sale from it. The swings and roundabouts hopefully will kick in somewhere along the line and he will get his reward.
also a good retailer will stock what he thinks is best. Its unfortunately the case that some just stock and push the stuff they are going to make most cash on. A short term outlook
Last time I was in a Hi Fi shop was at least thirty years ago. It was a large and famous store in London, and I got the distinct impression the staff there were talking a load of bollocks, and seemed only interested in pushing the 'flavour of the month'. I should add that at the time most dealers were influenced by, and under, the hegemony of the Linn-Naim axis.
These days I do feel some sympathy with dealers - they have to invest a fair amount in the stock they hold, only to find that after taking time to demonstrate the kit to an interested customer, the customer says "Thank you" and goes and buys the kit on-line, thus undercutting the dealer and wasting his time.
walpurgis
21-08-2017, 17:34
Last time I went in a Richer Sounds shop, there was not one sales assistant who had a clue. That was a while back. Maybe things have improved?
southall-1998
21-08-2017, 17:54
Did you work in a Hi-Fi shop in your youth, Geoff?
S.
walpurgis
21-08-2017, 18:00
Did you work in a Hi-Fi shop in your youth, Geoff?
S.
Nope!
southall-1998
21-08-2017, 18:03
Nope!
Oh, OK. You do have some great sales pitch!
S.
Sherwood
21-08-2017, 19:09
I recall the total incompetence and disinterest of the staff in Laskys in Edgware Road London in the mid 70's.
Also a few smug gits too ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXDK3x5lAYI
Geoff
Last time I went in a Richer Sounds shop, there was not one sales assistant who had a clue. That was a while back. Maybe things have improved?
I was in there last month buying a telly. Bloke who served me said he did not own a telly, just a stereo. He did know how to change the speed on an Rega Planar 3. He also advised me that all optical cables sound the same. Not sure if Richer Sounds condones objectivism amongst its sales staff but there you go. His kung foo was reasonably good:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4OM3rBKhf8
Manicatel
21-08-2017, 19:27
I was in there last month buying a telly. Bloke who served me said he did not own a telly, just a stereo. He did know how to change the speed on an Rega Planar 3. He also advised me that all optical cables sound the same. Not sure if Richer Sounds condones objectivism amongst its sales staff but there you go.
]
I still hear quite embarrassing things about RS. Clueless staff etc.........however, didn't they recently get voted best Hifi shop ( or something like that) recently? Also, they seem to be going more & more into on-line selling, with their stores opening for quite short hours.
Difficult to see how that equates to excellent customer service.
I still hear quite embarrassing things about RS. Clueless staff etc.........however, didn't they recently get voted best Hifi shop ( or something like that) recently? Also, they seem to be going more & more into on-line selling, with their stores opening for quite short hours.
Difficult to see how that equates to excellent customer service.
I bought my tv on a Sunday and they were open all day. I don't know if that is typical.
The staff are always very young as you'd expect as they no doubt don't pay them much, so there is going to be a limit to how much they can know. But they are not selling any weird, high end kit so not catering to the enthusiast. I'm sure they know enough to sell the things they do.
Manicatel
21-08-2017, 19:54
They seem to be open about 6 hrs a day, opening lunchtime. As you say, they don't need in depth knowledge of vintage valve amps or high end Naim gear etc etc, as they aren't in that market sector. Hopefully, they can give advice on 4K tv's & every-day Hifi stuff without resorting to trying to sell extended warranties & the like.
magiccarpetride
21-08-2017, 19:58
I recall the total incompetence and disinterest of the staff in Laskys in Edgware Road London in the mid 70's.
Also a few smug gits too ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXDK3x5lAYI
Geoff
I remember once being talked out of buying anything at a hi fi shop. Went in to enquire about getting some accessories, such as stylus cleaning brushes, anti static treatments for the LPs, etc. The sales guy kind of brushed me off, almost gesticulating toward the doors, telling me "nah, you're good bro, no need for any of those gimmicks. Ta-ta!"
sq225917
21-08-2017, 22:13
It varies. Some shit, some ok on their stock. Some real enthusiasts. Depends on the shop. Guys in independent higher end shops tend to be better. Guys in second hand specialists tend to be great, IME.
Minstrel SE
22-08-2017, 05:52
I feel it depends on the type of shop and it depends on your knowledge, research and experience.
If you are looking for high end stuff then ideally you want a specialist dealer in the know. I cant imagine many of the experienced people on this forum would put up with a chain store. Im not going to mention names but Ive never felt they really know how to steer someone in the right direction beyond flavour of the month and whats left in the stockroom. Ok some try to be helpful but I find many pushy and brash while sounding vacuous. Theres nothing worse than a stilted conversation where I feel patronised by someone who knows less then me. Im nodding politely but thinking why I am I having this conversation because its embarrassing :)
I have always favoured a minimalist style approach. A dealer in jeans and a t shirt that knows all the designers :) makes his own amplifiers in the back room :) and has done clever research on a small selection of products. A sofa, brew and nothing which registers on the BS detector.
I want to feel the dealer knows his onions. Ok they cant know or stock everything but my bias will steer me towards what they do have on demonstration
I like the idea of a particular dealer who just displays and demos headphones in a farmhouse somewhere. I think its worth making the effort to go and get a proper selection and proper service.
I will deal with sales people if I feel they can really add anything or offer a proper demonstration. If they can't, I want as little interaction with them as possible :)
Acoustica in Chester have some seriously knowledgeable folk.
I bought my tv on a Sunday and they were open all day. I don't know if that is typical.
The staff are always very young as you'd expect as they no doubt don't pay them much, so there is going to be a limit to how much they can know. But they are not selling any weird, high end kit so not catering to the enthusiast. I'm sure they know enough to sell the things they do.
They are also, in my experience, always helpful and friendly. Some 'specialist' dealers I used to frequent in London were the reverse, and acted as if they were doing you a favour by deigning to speak to you.
Spectral Morn
22-08-2017, 09:54
They are also, in my experience, always helpful and friendly. Some 'specialist' dealers I used to frequent in London were the reverse, and acted as if they were doing you a favour by deigning to speak to you.
KJ West One.
KJ West One.
The very worst in my experience was Billy Vee in Lewisham. The staff there were downright rude, as opposed to just stand-offish.
Spectral Morn
22-08-2017, 10:11
The very worst in my experience was Billy Vee in Lewisham. The staff there were downright rude, as opposed to just stand-offish.
Never in there.
Walrus ignored me, KJ were very arrogant and thought I would just give them money for no effort. Best experience I had was Fortress Audio. Fabulous shop, great kit and very friendly. Sadly they didn't last.
jollyfix
22-08-2017, 10:34
Walrus, never knew what mood they were in, sometimes you were lucky if they got up from the desk at the back of shop to open the door, let alone show any more interest.
Oranges and Lemons another, how dare you enter the shop and disturb me from Facebook.
walpurgis
22-08-2017, 10:36
Walrus ignored me
Same here.
But KJ always seemed OK with me.
Last dealers I frequented were Audio T in High Wycombe and Harrow Audio in Harrow (obviously :)). Both have been patient and helpful. Not been for a few years though.
jollyfix
22-08-2017, 10:39
Mike Manning when he had a shop in Taunton. Great staff, very good, knew what they were talking about. The Yeovil shop good too, from my experience.
I was drove all the way up to doug Brady s in Warrington to pick up some dedicated speaker stands for my shan shimna s ( made from the same
concrete materials ). They were 50 quid but the guy actually gave me a tenner back towards my petrol money, how nice was that !. Made quite
a difference to s.q. as well. Mind you he probably thought I was a bit mad and needed helping perhaps ?
narabdela
22-08-2017, 11:05
Some 'specialist' dealers I used to frequent in London were the reverse, and acted as if they were doing you a favour by deigning to speak to you.
Had that experience at Cymbiosis Leicester about twenty years ago when I went in with a view to upgrading the LP12 I owned at the time. Admittedly I was wearing my 'gardening' clothes at the time, but that was no excuse. Needless to say, I didn't trouble them with my business.
magiccarpetride
22-08-2017, 16:30
I feel it depends on the type of shop and it depends on your knowledge, research and experience.
If you are looking for high end stuff then ideally you want a specialist dealer in the know. I cant imagine many of the experienced people on this forum would put up with a chain store. Im not going to mention names but Ive never felt they really know how to steer someone in the right direction beyond flavour of the month and whats left in the stockroom. Ok some try to be helpful but I find many pushy and brash while sounding vacuous. Theres nothing worse than a stilted conversation where I feel patronised by someone who knows less then me. Im nodding politely but thinking why I am I having this conversation because its embarrassing :)
I have always favoured a minimalist style approach. A dealer in jeans and a t shirt that knows all the designers :) makes his own amplifiers in the back room :) and has done clever research on a small selection of products. A sofa, brew and nothing which registers on the BS detector.
I want to feel the dealer knows his onions. Ok they cant know or stock everything but my bias will steer me towards what they do have on demonstration
I like the idea of a particular dealer who just displays and demos headphones in a farmhouse somewhere. I think its worth making the effort to go and get a proper selection and proper service.
I will deal with sales people if I feel they can really add anything or offer a proper demonstration. If they can't, I want as little interaction with them as possible :)
I stopped visiting hi fi shops where it is obvious that they have one person on the lookout for what kind of a car did you drive into their lot. Then based on the worth of your automobile, they'd adjust their pitch.
Another confusing thing for me is the fact that, after forging relationships with some local 'gurus' (i.e. older dudes who spent their entire lives selling audio equipment), I get differing, sometimes downright contradicting advice from those guys. For example, one 'guru' would claim that any cartridge with spherical stylus is garbage, and that only elliptical stylus makes sense, while another 'guru' would claim the opposite. And so on. In the end, looks like it's just another person's opinion, and there doesn't seem to be any real expertise on sale there.
southall-1998
22-08-2017, 16:34
Had that experience at Cymbiosis Leicester about twenty years ago when I went in with a view to upgrading the LP12 I owned at the time. Admittedly I was wearing my 'gardening' clothes at the time, but that was no excuse. Needless to say, I didn't trouble them with my business.
Judging a book by it's cover......Tut-Tut!
S.
hifi_dave
22-08-2017, 16:40
Never done that. Some of my best customers have been scruffier than me.
I treat all my customers spending £10 or £10K with the same respect and expect the same when I'm shopping.
Judging a book by it's cover......Tut-Tut!
S.
Yes, rookie sales mistake that. I used to sell used commercial vehicles and you would get blokes walk on the lot, expensive clothes, fancy watch, all the patter, would want to see everything, but never bought a thing. Whereas scruffy blokes with paint on their jeans would never leave empty-handed because they had turned up actually needing to buy a van instead of to pamper their ego.
Many years ago I had great service from Grahams in London, and somewhat resentful treatment by KJ when I asked to hera 10 pairs of loudspeakers costing £10k a pair.
RA told me that Peter Qvortrop of AN used to drive to potential customers' addresses at a time separate from engagement with them in order to gauge their wealth, this determining what he would later charge when deal was made.
Many years ago I had great service from Grahams in London, and somewhat resentful treatment by KJ when I asked to hera 10 pairs of loudspeakers costing £10k a pair.
RA told me that Peter Qvortrop of AN used to drive to potential customers' addresses at a time separate from engagement with them in order to gauge their wealth, this determining what he would later charge when deal was made.
More likely to se if it was worth the bother of pitching them the expensive stuff. Audio Note goes from affordable all the way to super-silly. Your not going to waste time demming the cheaper stuff to a millionaire. Plus there is always the risk he might be satisfied with that. So you sell a £20K system when you could have sold £200K.
Minstrel SE
31-08-2017, 19:51
There are service engineers and experienced owners on this forum that are more knowledgeable that most sales people I have ever met. I dont think the shop sales people like the hi fi forums :)
Ive had experiences where you feel intimidated to walk in and say anything. I know its not easy dealing with the British public and there is a question of how much time and encouragement to offer the tyre kickers. I just feel that if you get a spark of real enthusiam and quality time you will come back. Then again I am a sales persons nightmare as I like to sleep on it...show me a Systemdeck II and I will have think for a good while :D Im not naive and I know is about a balance of time vs reward for the dealer.
I dont like cocky sales people who rush you along. Everything just sounds so false and flavour of the month. They will seize on a tiny almost insignificant piece of information and suddenly you are in for a whirlwind of "this is what you want sir".
I know it cant be easy running a hi fi shop. Ive seen many close down. Yonks ago I found a good guy In Stockport but even he was demonstrating my first biased choices with the greatest profit margins. I remembered later that he did have Royd standmounts which he could have used for comparison but he didnt. I did alright but Im sure I could have got a better value source first system.
His profit aims do create a conflict of interests. I was hankering after some large real wood veneer speakers and I knew later I could have done better making savings there.
I liked his casual less pushy style though( in jeans and a t shirt) and thought I can do business again with this guy as I upgrade later. He had closed down 6 months to a year later so that was the end of that. Back to a sixty mile round trip or the happy box shop :)
I once arranged a demo of some speakers 2 weeks in advance with a shop in Sheffield. I live in Doncaster. The demo was on a Saturday morning so I rang them tea time on the Friday to confirm I was still coming only to be told , "sorry we have had to cancel you as we have arranged a big demo with another customer"
When were they going to tell me? When I turned up on the Saturday?
I had spent £1500 on a cd player with them a few months previous.
Called in a couple of weeks later to sort another demo and while talking to the sales guy another customer walked in and the sales guy shouted hello, turned his back on me and escorted the other customer into the demo room. I stood there for about 10 mins on my own and then left.
Never been back.
Bought the speakers from Sevenoaks in Leeds.
Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
In essence that is the same thing Martin.
I once arranged a demo of some speakers 2 weeks in advance with a shop in Sheffield. I live in Doncaster. The demo was on a Saturday morning so I rang them tea time on the Friday to confirm I was still coming only to be told , "sorry we have had to cancel you as we have arranged a big demo with another customer"
When were they going to tell me? When I turned up on the Saturday?
I had spent £1500 on a cd player with them a few months previous.
Called in a couple of weeks later to sort another demo and while talking to the sales guy another customer walked in and the sales guy shouted hello, turned his back on me and escorted the other customer into the demo room. I stood there for about 10 mins on my own and then left.
Never been back.
Bought the speakers from Sevenoaks in Leeds.
Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
That's terrible. I'm surprised you went back a second time.
southall-1998
31-08-2017, 22:58
I once arranged a demo of some speakers 2 weeks in advance with a shop in Sheffield. I live in Doncaster. The demo was on a Saturday morning so I rang them tea time on the Friday to confirm I was still coming only to be told , "sorry we have had to cancel you as we have arranged a big demo with another customer"
When were they going to tell me? When I turned up on the Saturday?
I had spent £1500 on a cd player with them a few months previous.
Called in a couple of weeks later to sort another demo and while talking to the sales guy another customer walked in and the sales guy shouted hello, turned his back on me and escorted the other customer into the demo room. I stood there for about 10 mins on my own and then left.
Never been back.
Bought the speakers from Sevenoaks in Leeds.
Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
You should have given them a bad review on Google.
S.
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