Should You be Seeking Better Sound or Better Enjoyment?

[walpurgis]

A thought crossed my mind. What was the most satisfaction I'd had from my Hi-Fi?

I think back to my first 'proper' Hi-Fi system, bought around 1972 and I was over the moon with it at the time.

It was a record playing system only, all bought new and comprised of a Thorens TD150 turntable with a Decca International arm and cartridges were a choice of Decca London Blue or ADC 10E Mk.IV. Amplifier was a Rotel RA-611 (settled on after a couple of disappointing Ferrograph F307's) and this drove a pair of Tannoy IIILZ speakers.

I kept this setup for quite a few years and drew great pleasure from it and don't think anything that has followed has improved on the level of enjoyment it gave me.

Is the constant search for improvement in sound really a sign of dissatisfaction? We all know that nothing is perfect, so are we chasing up a blind alley by seeking better sound?

[andyrlb]

Not sure if this is a bit out there but my first memory of hifi really getting my attention for the first time was in a room full of smoke many many years ago (79) !! So perhaps it wasn't the music or system but I remember thinking WOW !!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[walpurgis]

Not sure if this is a bit out there but my first memory of hifi really getting my attention for the first time was in a room full of smoke many many years ago (79) !! So perhaps it wasn't the music or system but I remember thinking WOW !!!

I had a similar experience maybe 1970. A friend bought A Garrard AP76 with a Shure cartridge, a Sansui AU-101 and a pair of whopping Goodmans Magister speakers.

I thought it sounded incredible. I'd never heard any Hi-Fi at all until that time and what really got me, was realising that clear treble and deep bass actually existed. I was hooked from that day on!!

[HackneyRF]

Maybe the dissatisfaction comes from having too much 'Stuff' Geoff!

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MvgN5gCuLac

[struth]

indeed, I think its true. More you have the more choice and your more inclined to be dissatisfied. always enjoyed records more when i had less of them. cds too, so sure it can be extended to equipment

[walpurgis]

Maybe the dissatisfaction comes from having too much 'Stuff' Geoff!

I guess that can be true.

In my case I have a lot of 'stuff' (Hi-Fi), but tend to have one system that is settled and has been to an extent for years. And I'm happy and satisfied with it. The point I'm making, is that what I have now, which sounds damn good, brings no more pleasure than my first system did :).

[HackneyRF]

I guess that can be true.

In my case I have a lot of 'stuff' (Hi-Fi), but tend to have one system that is settled and has been to an extent for years. And I'm happy and satisfied with it. The point I'm making, is that what I have now, which sounds damn good, brings no more pleasure than my first system did :).

Ah, I see your point Geoff. My comment was really just a generalisation about our/societies desire, no doubt largely driven by market forces, to acquire the next best thing which can often lead to a sense of dissatisfaction and an accumulation of 'stuff'. But George Carlin says it much better than I possibly could. Maybe you are on to something if your are as happy with your system now as you were back then. :cool:

Cheers

Loz

[walpurgis]

I'm considering a 'back to basics' setup actually. I don't play records as much as I used to and may scale back the vinyl playing side of things to something basic, but good sounding. More compact and simpler amplification could be on the cards too. I'm planning to base the system around CD for now, as I have nearly all the music I want in that format and much is needlessly duplicated on vinyl. Single driver, full range speakers appeal as well. I may eventually get involved with streaming, but feel no real need.

[Truckletheuncivil]

I think it depends on why you have a hi-fi. If you use it to listen to music you'll be happy as long as it sounds good. If you are more interested in the hi-fi itself you may never be satisfied as there will always be something better coming along.

[Puffin]

I the last few years as I have entered semi-retirement my hifi is used to play music on and not as a vehicle to distract me from the arse-ache that was the day job. I had to have something to concentrate on and use as a diversion for my brain/mind (Oh.... and lots of alcohol as well!) If I spent my leisure time searching for better sound then I was engrossed in something that I really wanted to do. It is only now that I have started to do the stuff that I amassed at the time and never got around to building. However, my system has never sounded so good.

[Jimbo]

I guess that can be true.

In my case I have a lot of 'stuff' (Hi-Fi), but tend to have one system that is settled and has been to an extent for years. And I'm happy and satisfied with it. The point I'm making, is that what I have now, which sounds damn good, brings no more pleasure than my first system did :).

My first hifi system consisted of a Garrard 301, Decca blue, Croft Micro, Leak stereo 20, b&W speakers.

The sound of this system has been a benchmark I have tried to recreate 30 years on,however I have slightly exceeded what I had then only because I have more knowledge especially regarding system set up.

Essentially they sound the same and I am more than happy with my current set up and do not seek better sound. As it stands it gives me huge enjoyment and a thirst for more music which is really what it should all be about.

Not a thirst for more boxes.:)

[walpurgis]

Hi Rob. I remember hearing a modest little pair of Mission 780SE speakers at your place sounding amazingly good. One of my fav small speakers. There was something 'right' about those! Should have kept mine.

[Puffin]

Yes Geoff, I sold those too....Doh!

I have been using the refurbed Heybrook HB3's for some time and I really like what they do.

[cre009]

My view is that each of us have a tonal quality of sound we prefer that is unique to us individually. We will migrate via swapping of components to a system that provides us with that quality of sound.

However our hearing particularly with regard to high frequencies does tend to diminish with time so what may have sounded good years ago may not be so good for us now.

The components that most impact tonal quality are speakers and their positioning or for vinyl the cartridge and arm setup and phono stage settings. There is more flexibility to subtly change tonal quality with vinyl systems than with CD systems.

The upgrade route for other parts of the chain tends to provide components that will provide better definition rather than change of tonal quality though there are exceptions.

I have had periods where I have had a system that I really enjoy and I know that is the case when I use it a lot and don't have a desire to tweak anything. I have also had one lengthy period where I got totally fed up with the system and rarely bothered to listen to it.

[danilo]

Is the constant search for improvement in sound really a sign of dissatisfaction? We all know that nothing is perfect, so are we chasing up a blind alley by seeking better sound?

I think so.. there is a clear line between Good enjoy the muzak sounds and striving for a sound to rule all others :-)
Illusory and IMO self defeating in my experiences.
Half of MY recordings are rendered to Shite sound qualities with my 'Big Rig'.
Yet sound Just Fine / pleasing on my in study setup.
Guess which gets most use?
Maybe there is wisdom with age, or perhaps that what's been in our faces for so long finally gets noticed ??

NOTE though: in My observations a Lot (most?)of Audio weenie aspirations are just that.. Aspirations.. typically status driven.
Nawww.. that can't be true .. can it?

[r100]

Not sure if this is a bit out there but my first memory of hifi really getting my attention for the first time was in a room full of smoke many many years ago (79) !! So perhaps it wasn't the music or system but I remember thinking WOW !!!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Haha ! That rings a bell with me when I walked into this room many years ago and Devo were playing "I can't get no satisfaction" quite loudly on some very nice equipment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GbNiDk-WvY

[Idlewithnodrive]

My viewpoint is a little different.

When I started out it was all about the music and creating a system that played that music in a way I liked. Lack of experience led me to buy ever more expensive kit, believing that the more I paid the better the result would be.

As I climbed the hi-fi tree (in terms of value), I often found myself listening to / analysing the kit as opposed to enjoying the music and the associated expectation bias often left me feeling a bit disappointed with my new piece of kit.

Many years later and a wealth of experience (knowing the sound I like and how to create it) has meant that I can create a system to play music in a way I like, with the emphasis on the music and not the equipment. The value of the kit has dropped massively but the enjoyment of music has increased reciprocally, partly due to lack of expectation bias but mainly due to being happy with what I have and knowing that the grass isn't always greener.

Now, instead of blowing money on hi-fi, I invest it in music. I'm in a great place musically.

[Yomanze]

I spent a lot of time and money looking for better sound, and it took me a long time to get back to better enjoyment. It's easy to go too far so you're in the habit of analysing the HiFi rather than listening to music. Am pleased I've made no major system changes in years now.

[Haselsh1]

As the man said, I started by buying a Hi-Fi for better quality sound. That was back in 1979. I am currently in my best ever place sonically. This is where I intend to stay for some considerable time. My biggest dilemma these days is whether to buy vinyl and twenty odd quid a throw or buy CD's at a tenner...? No contest really I guess.

[Pete The Cat]

As I've moved up the hi-fi ladder I've found the constraints of recorded media to be a disappointment - the point about the better the system the more that it reveals flaws, particularly CDs issued since the mid 90s.

I'm still in it for the music more than anything else so for me it has to be seeking better enjoyment. I sometimes listen to "recordings of independent origin" and both my systems utterly destroy them, whereas in the kitchen on the Walkman via the SoundLink - yes, the work of the devil - they really cook (bad pun intended).

Since using a Rock in the main rig I'm probably at my most contented now for playing records since my first system nearly 40 years ago. I think I've got the better sound / better enjoyment balance right there.

Pete

[magiccarpetride]

A thought crossed my mind. What was the most satisfaction I'd had from my Hi-Fi?

I think back to my first 'proper' Hi-Fi system, bought around 1972 and I was over the moon with it at the time.

It was a record playing system only, all bought new and comprised of a Thorens TD150 turntable with a Decca International arm and cartridges were a choice of Decca London Blue or ADC 10E Mk.IV. Amplifier was a Rotel RA-611 (settled on after a couple of disappointing Ferrograph F307's) and this drove a pair of Tannoy IIILZ speakers.

I kept this setup for quite a few years and drew great pleasure from it and don't think anything that has followed has improved on the level of enjoyment it gave me.

Is the constant search for improvement in sound really a sign of dissatisfaction? We all know that nothing is perfect, so are we chasing up a blind alley by seeking better sound?

I find myself chasing after better sounding pressings of the LPs I already have. And I'm finding better enjoyment in that activity. But it has nothing to do with my sound system.

[Jingles]

For me it's all about the music and enjoying the music.

Sure good gear is nice, but whats the point of spending all your money on gear if you don't have any left to buy music to actually play and enjoy with all the gear?

I'd rather have a decent sound and enjoy my music rather than chase the perfect sound because there is no such thing. No matter how good your gear is it could probably always be better, there will probably be something that you don't like about it. Why not just appreciate what you have and enjoy it?

It's analogous to Gear Acquisition Syndrome (GAS) that some photographers suffer from. They search for the perfect camera, the perfect lens, the perfect tripod, lighting setup etc... thinking that it will make them a better photographer or make their photos better. But it doesn't and they just buy more and more gear chasing elusive perfection and end up as sad sacks instead of learning to use and appreciate what they have already got.

[walpurgis]

Sure good gear is nice, but whats the point of spending all your money on gear if you don't have any left to buy music to actually play and enjoy with all the gear?


Sensible philosophy, that I think most of us have.

Although, there are those who will spend every spare penny on the next 'upgrade'. Or those who accumulate and hoard gear, just for the sake of possession (I'm a little bit guilty there :)).

[RobbieGong]

It's the pleasure of music that makes this passion / hobby worth while - hifi and music interlink.

One thing that has become very apparent to me is that there can be a lot of pain for the pleasure.

It's taken me a number of years to get to where I want to be and I'm almost there BUT it's come at a cost as my system has spent more time down than up and running as a result.

It's been a personal project and an absolute labour of love.

The last phase has been particularity long and painful but I'm almost there now.

Once she's back up again I've promised my self it's music music music and the pleasure there of, no more down time - mission accomplished :)

[Infinitely Baffled]

Having and owning gear can be nice in itself, quite aside from its purpose of playing music. There can be a lot of pleasure had from the ownership of something beautifully designed, or terrifically well-made, a design classic maybe and something that speaks to you from a different time or place. It's the same with many interests - whether it is classic motor bikes, vintage fountain pens, furniture - anything. It's a separate and distinct pleasure from the music you play on it, but a perfectly legitimate source of enjoyment in itself. No need for shame!
IB

[Jingles]

Or those who accumulate and hoard gear, just for the sake of possession (I'm a little bit guilty there :)).

I'd be lying if I said I wasn't guilty of that too, except I do it with cameras. I have 6 of them, mostly different cameras for different jobs. I have my Nikon D600 and D610 backup body, a Nikon D3200 that I have had converted to IR, a Fujifilm X100F, a Minolta X-570, and a Voigtlander Bessa R4A. Plus an assortment of lenses. My photography hobby isn't going to let me hoard audio gear, except for maybe headphones I do have a bunch of different IEMs.

[RobbieGong]

Having and owning gear can be nice in itself, quite aside from its purpose of playing music. There can be a lot of pleasure had from the ownership of something beautifully designed, or terrifically well-made, a design classic maybe and something that speaks to you from a different time or place. It's the same with many interests - whether it is classic motor bikes, vintage fountain pens, furniture - anything. It's a separate and distinct pleasure from the music you play on it, but a perfectly legitimate source of enjoyment in itself. No need for shame!
IB

+1 Full pleasure indeed - sounds great, built and looks great. Doesnt get better than that .....:)

[User211]

A thought crossed my mind. What was the most satisfaction I'd had from my Hi-Fi?

I think back to my first 'proper' Hi-Fi system, bought around 1972 and I was over the moon with it at the time.

It was a record playing system only, all bought new and comprised of a Thorens TD150 turntable with a Decca International arm and cartridges were a choice of Decca London Blue or ADC 10E Mk.IV. Amplifier was a Rotel RA-611 (settled on after a couple of disappointing Ferrograph F307's) and this drove a pair of Tannoy IIILZ speakers.

I kept this setup for quite a few years and drew great pleasure from it and don't think anything that has followed has improved on the level of enjoyment it gave me.

Is the constant search for improvement in sound really a sign of dissatisfaction? We all know that nothing is perfect, so are we chasing up a blind alley by seeking better sound?
If you had it back I:m betting you'd hate it now.

[jandl100]

For me it's the journey that's fun - I don't worry about the destination, I don't think I even have one.

Do I get more enjoyment out of my current system than I did out of my first ever? Damn right I do, it's far more musically rewarding.
Part of the thing is that my musical knowledge and depth and breadth of taste has increased vastly since I was a spotty teenager. In a way, and thinking about it now, I guess my system evolution has been about keeping pace with, as well as to an extent driving, my musical explorations.

Like Justin just said, if I went back to my 1st ever system I feel sure that it would be very unsatisfying indeed.
I enjoyed it muchly at the time, though, and it initiated and fed my desire to get more out of audio systems.

[Dynamics]

I don't think the two questions are mutually exclusive as posed by your thread title Geoff. For me better sound is better enjoyment as it's more faithful to how the track really sounds.

[walpurgis]

My basic point was that the 'WOW factor' is at it's most with the first proper sound system one assembles. And that progressing up the upgrade ladder never brings quite the same again. Sure there are revelatory moments when a truly special bit of equipment makes its presence felt. But is the enjoyment of the system and music any greater than it was at the beginning of the journey? Somehow, I think not.

[jandl100]

I think I still retain a large part of my boyish enthusiasm. :yay:
And I am certainly getting more out of music - education and experience is a large part of that, but so are ongoing improvements to my audio system which allow me to hear more of the the music and its inner and outer complexities and also, of course, what the musicians are doing, how they are playing and interacting with each other and the space in which they are performing.
So yes, my enjoyment is greater. Sorry. ;)

[struth]

Inclined to feel you can overdo the listening experience to point where the music is secondary. Dont get me wrong, we all want it to sound the best it can but at same time there is a time to just say; stuff it, I got into this to listen to music. Thats where I am.

[Infinitely Baffled]

Inclined to feel you can overdo the listening experience to point where the music is secondary. Dont get me wrong, we all want it to sound the best it can but at same time there is a time to just say; stuff it, I got into this to listen to music. Thats where I am.

This is dead right!
IB

[alphaGT]

To me, it's more a case of, "Peanut Butter and Jelly are great until you taste Steak.". My first system I put together when I was only 13 years old, A Technics receiver for Christmas. Some used speakers. And a BIC turntable I bought with my own money. While I was a teenager I upgraded the speakers and turntable, and it was a very nice system! Big cassette deck, and record player and tuner, all the main sources of the day. And I kept that system until many years after I was married! And we partied and played a million records, and enjoyed it to no end. Everyone loved it! And friends came just to spin records at my house.

But I went to the salon and saw better systems! And I heard amazing things, grand pianos and saxophones right in the middle of the room! And I have been chasing that sound ever since. And even to this day I have never reached that level, I am closer than I have ever been, and my present system is most satisfying. Just last night a lady friend stopped by and we drank beer and spun records into the wee hours, and we enjoyed the music.

But perhaps if I had never heard anything better than my first system, I would still own it and still think it was as great as I did back then?

[jandl100]

I think it's called growing up.
As the years pass, as well as getting wrinkles you also get more sophisticated and knowledgeable about things.
What was Great then would now be What the hell was I thinking?