My visit to Castle Marco

[Barry]

Good Evening


This is a visit report of Count Marco’s system, an invitation made to me from the end of last year.

Having spent Christmas and the New Year in North Wales, I successfully made my way east through the Carpathian mountains into Transylvania, the home of Count Marco. Drawing close to the quaint village of Wrecsam, I enquired of the locals for directions. This proved to be of little help as the mere mention of the Count’s name had the locals recoiling with horror, withdrawing into the shadows making strange hand gestures. The only advice I was given was to go to the local shop and ask the proprietor, T. Esko, to sell me a string of garlic globes. My only solution was to phone the Count directly and explain my predicament. The Count agreed to send out his coachman to guide me to the Castle. This proved to be successful up to the second roundabout, whereupon I could no longer see the coach and instead could only see a solitary bat flying ahead of me. Eventually all was resolved and I arrived at Count Marco’s only an hour later than planned.

I was immediately welcomed by Del into their home and having been given a warming drink went upstairs to the famous listening room to hear The System. I was suitably attired: wearing a back Chanel cocktail dress and carrying an Hermés clutch handbag, into which I had put three garlic cloves and a make-up mirror as a precaution.

So there I was; in the presence of two massive Lockwood cabinets fitted with Tannoy Gold drive units. The Gold drive units replace the original Reds and the crossover circuit has also been upgraded with better components. At the risk of repeating things, the speakers are fed by a 30W AnthonyTD ‘Copper’ amp using KT88 output valves and connected to the Tannoys via not insubstantial Van den Hul cables. The source components are an up-market Sony CD player with separate Sony DAC and of course a Technics turntable using Dave Crawley’s Timestep power supply, fitted with a Jelco arm and Denon DL103SA cartridge. The preamp is a Croft design, which displayed a far better fit and finish than I was expecting. The cartridge output is boosted using an Aufschnaiter ‘Auditorium’ A23 transformer. All the electronics are supported on a bewildering stack of Mana platforms to a vertigo-inducing height.

The first thing that crossed my mind was how would such large speakers behave in a room of modest dimensions? Bearing in mind that the speakers are each mounted on a single isolation platform on a wooden floor, this might explain the need for so many isolation platforms to support the electronics. The first disc played was Nils Lofgren ‘Acoustic Live’ (Vision Music VMCD 1005), and I have to say that the speakers did perform well. There was a good impression of height; Nils is not a tall in stature and his voice (mouth) appeared at a creditable height. So to did his guitar, however since he uses an electric guitar this is more an indication of the skill of the mixing engineer, than that that of the speakers themselves. I wasn’t aware of too much depth and the width of the sound stage did not appear to extend beyond the physical separation of the speakers, but this did vary slightly with listening position. My preconceived fear that the speakers would be too big and interact badly with the room was unfounded. I assume the asymmetrical shape of the room helps here, as there was no bass boom or bloom. Only occasionally did I hear some upper bass notes that suggested a possible poor interaction with the room. As I posted earlier, we played a version of the Vivaldi ‘Four Seasons’ (Winter), where I heard an organ being played quietly that I had never heard before on my system!

These speakers are not called monitors for nothing. They are very detailed and are ruthlessly revealing: there wouldn’t be a flaw, fault, duff note, or tape drop-out that would not be shown up by these speakers – you can see why the likes of such are used by Decca amongst others in their recording studios! We played a variety of discs and records (or ‘choons’ as they say in Transylvanian): Dusty Springfield, Aretha Franklin, Jeff Beck etc. The Count likes to play his system far louder than I do, and I have to say louder than is realistic; but then it’s his ears not mine. I did however appreciate that the speakers are very good for dance music, a genre important to Marco; the speakers do have the requisite cojones for that.

In general most of the listening session was spent listening to and discussing music, rather than in analysis of the system; which is always a good thing in my book and an indication that the system is not a bad one at all. Clearly Marco has assembled a system that suits him and his wide repertoire of musical tastes well. It is not a system that I would have put together, or one that would suit me – but then we all hear differently and have different requirements from our systems.

One very pleasant fall-out from the listening session was that of being introduced to the works of Bettye LaVette (and the Drive By Truckers) ‘The Scene of the Crime’, (ANTI 6873-2) and of Cara Dillon (‘After the Morning’). Thanks Marco.

Finally I cannot finish this report without mentioning and praising Del’s legendary cooking skills. Upon enquiry as to what was for dinner, Del replied: “Oh just a cassoulet”! Just a cassoulet – there is nothing ‘just’ about a cassoulet and indeed it was delicious. I should also add that a pretty good cellar is kept at Castle Marco.

So thanks to both Del and Marco for a very interesting and pleasant stay and a chance to be introduced to some new ‘choons’.

(PS I have seen behind ‘that’ little white door and have had direct experience of its use.)

Regards

Jonathon Harker

aka

[Spectral Morn]

Fantastic Barry.....fantastic.

What a great write up.


Regards D S D L

[Marco]

Hi Barry,

Nice write-up, mate, so thanks for taking the time to compose it. Both Del and I very much enjoyed your company and you are most welcome again to pop by next time you're in the area :)

Thank you for bringing along an excellent selection of wine - much appreciated, and I'm glad that you enjoyed the cassoulet :cool:

We certainly did listen to a wide and varied selection of music well into the wee small hours (gone 3am, if I recall), so now you know how eclectic my tastes are. No, we didn't dwell too much on hi-fi chit-chat, but then that's never the case when the company is good and the system does its stuff as it should.


These speakers are not called monitors for nothing. They are very detailed and are ruthlessly revealing: there wouldn’t be a flaw, fault, duff note, or tape drop-out that would not be shown up by these speakers – you can see why the likes of such are used by Decca amongst others in their recording studios!


That's just how I like it, mon ami. (An almost forensic) insight, musically and in terms of detail retrieval, into recordings is my No1 system priority. If you can't hear exactly what's going on, how can one hope to appreciate a recording's musical merit? I wonder if Tim Farney's reading this. Old Tannoys and valve amps are so coloured sounding, says he... Arf!

And yes, I can well imagine how different the Lockwoods sound to your Quads, so I know exactly where you're coming from!! ;)

Anyway, next time you're up this way I'll keep a room free for you in the dungeon.... :eyebrows:

Marco.

[Alex_UK]

Very good Barry, excellent write up! :lol:

[Themis]

Nice write-up Barry. I can almost smell the cassoulet ! ;)

[Marco]

We can send a doggy bag...?

Marco.

[Covenant]

Barry, I think I know why you have called him Count Marco. You obviously stopped and asked a welshman for directions and he replied "You dont want to visit that count do you?" :lol:

[Macca]

We can send a doggy bag...?

Marco.

Yes! - I've got the munchies...

Barry - Enjoyed the write up - what did you mean by 'more than realistic levels'?

[Marco]

Barry, I think I know why you have called him Count Marco. You obviously stopped and asked a welshman for directions and he replied "You dont want to visit that count do you?"


I was more shocked at his description of Wrexham as a "quaint village". Poor chap must have been more lost than I thought! :lol:

Marco.

[The Vinyl Adventure]

I have one question... Did you spot any rabbit dropppings?

[Beechwoods]

I was more shocked at his description of Wrexham as a "quaint village". Poor chap must have been more lost than I thought! :lol:

Marco.

He must have come in via Gresford and the village duckpond therein!

Thanks for your report Barry. I'd been looking forward to seeing this for a while :eyebrows: What did you make of Marco's turntable, by the way?

[Barry]

Yes! - I've got the munchies...

Barry - Enjoyed the write up - what did you mean by 'more than realistic levels'?

Hello Macca,

This might appear contentious (and I believe there has already been a thread on 'correct listening levels') but I believe that there is a 'correct' listening level for most music. Deviate too far from this level and you loose realism in that you loose the sense of scale. To give an example, a folk singer playing say a guitar, if played too loudly sounds as if they have an enormous mouth and are playing a very loud guitar; they just have too much presence. Conversly, a orchestra replayed too softly sounds unrealistic and has the audible equivalent of being viewed the wrong way through a pair of binoculars.

Whilst it is often useful in order to test the resolution of ones system to see how quietly it can be played before losing information, it will never sound right. Conversely, music played too loudly to me never sounds right.

Usually there is a certain amount of leeway between a comfortable listening level (neighbours and all that) and a realistic level, and it does vary between recordings. (Which reminds me - why is there a much greater variation of recording levels between CDs than there ever was/is on vinyl?) Well that's how my ears 'work'.

Regards

[Jonboy]

Nice write up Barry, did you by chance take some of your cables for Marco to listen with and annalise

[Macca]

Hello Macca,

This might appear contentious (and I believe there has already been a thread on 'correct listening levels') but I believe that there is a 'correct' listening level for most music. Deviate too far from this level and you loose realism in that you loose the sense of scale. To give an example, a folk singer playing say a guitar, if played too loudly sounds as if they have an enormous mouth and are playing a very loud guitar; they just have too much presence. Conversly, a orchestra replayed too softly sounds unrealistic and has the audible equivalent of being viewed the wrong way through a pair of binoculars.

Whilst it is often useful in order to test the resolution of ones system to see how quietly it can be played before loosing information, it will never sound right. Conversely, music played too loudly to me never sounds right.

Usually there is a certain amount of leeway between a comfortable listening level (neighbours and all that) and a realistic level, and it does vary between recordings. (Which reminds me - why is there a much greater variation of recording levels between CDs than there ever was/is on vinyl?) Well that's how my ears 'work'.

Regards

Thanks Barry - and I agree there is a definite variation in level on CDs and Lps, no question.

[Marco]

This might appear contentious (and I believe there has already been a thread on 'correct listening levels') but I believe that there is a 'correct' listening level for most music. Deviate too far from this level and you loose realism in that you loose the sense of scale.


I agree wholeheartedly. Barry, you should've wrestled the volume control from me :eyebrows:

Marco.

P.S Watch out for the old 'loose', 'lose' thing.

[Barry]

I agree wholeheartedly. Barry, you should've wrestled the volume control from me :eyebrows:

Marco.

P.S Watch out for the old 'loose', 'lose' thing.

Oops! Spelling now corrected.

[Barry]

Nice write up Barry, did you by chance take some of your cables for Marco to listen with and annalise

Hello Jon,

Sorry, I should have mentioned that Marco uses Mark Grant interconects in his system. The intention had been to take along both my cables and some of JJ's MAD cables to try. These cables are with John (Music Room Mod) at the moment and owing to cancellation of the MAD dinner, mid December, I did not get the opportunity to obtain them in time for my visit to Marco's. No doubt we will be able to do so at the next venue.

Regards

[Marco]

Hi Barry,


Thanks for your report Barry. I'd been looking forward to seeing this for a while What did you make of Marco's turntable, by the way?


I'm curious about this too. We never really chatted about it much (too busy listening to music), although I know that you enjoyed the Stevie Ray Vaughan track before we went down for dinner :)

Marco.

[Jonboy]

Hello Barry,
i did make up a couple of pairs of your cables but only with the cheaper Neutrik plugs, they seem to sound alright though and cost very little to make.

[Alex_UK]

P.S Watch out for the old 'loose', 'lose' thing.

Finally, I realise where I have been going wrong with women all my life - always on the lookout for a loose one, but all I do is lose!

[chris@panteg]

Very nice and entertaining write up Barry ' or should it be Jonathan ?

[Barry]

Very nice and entertaining write up Barry ' or should it be Jonathan ?

Not quite sure myself. All I can say is that since the visit I have had seemingly uncontrollable urges to eat flies and spiders and a tendency to want to sleep during the day.

Regards

[Spectral Morn]

Not quite sure myself. All I can say is that since the visit I have had seemingly uncontrollable urges to eat flies and spiders and a tendency to want to sleep during the day.

Regards


That was Renfield ! Barry ;):lol::lol::lol::lol:and he was a familiar (servant) not a Vamp.


Regards D S D L

[Barry]

That was Renfield ! Barry ;):lol::lol::lol::lol:and he was a familiar (servant) not a Vamp.


Regards D S D L

It might have happened to Renfield, how do you know it's not happened to me?

Regards

[Spectral Morn]

It might have happened to Renfield, how do you know it's not happened to me?

Regards

I can't really picture you as Marco's servant...knowing him, it would not be as a butler but would require you to wear something black and white with lace and made of satin....I think a French Maid would be what he would want :eek:;):lol::lol::lol::lol:


Regards D S D L

[chris@panteg]

Henceforth you shall be known as ' Renfield '

[chris@panteg]

Do you remember this ' makes me chuckle

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQQbcjbZC7w

[Alex_UK]

Do you lot mind, I'm now going to bed with these images in my mind! <shudder>
:eek:
;)
:goodnight:

[Spectral Morn]

Do you lot mind, I'm now going to bed with these images in my mind! <shudder>
:eek:
;)
:goodnight:

:eyebrows::eek::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:


Regards D S D L

[Barry]

I can't really picture you as Marco's servant...knowing him, it would not be as a butler but would require you to wear something black and white with lace and made of satin....I think a French Maid would be what he would want :eek:;):lol::lol::lol::lol:


Regards D S D L

No No No! I just don't have the legs for it. But then you don't know what goes on behind that white door!

Regards

[bonneville]

You are safe enough until the Count starts to dust off his Dukus (Scorcerers Apprentice) LP :lol:

Vinnie

[Themis]

We can send a doggy bag...?

Marco.
That's ok, Marco, I'm not far from Castelnaudary or Toulouse (my family-in-law lives in Toulouse, actually).

But, perhaps... when I come to Britain... in north Wales... :)

[Mike Reed]

A very well-written and allegorical resume, BARRY (a.k.a. JONATHAN). Interesting choice of Romanian folklore, but I suppose there is that Latino connection........

[Barry]

Further to my visit report to ‘Castle Marco’, I have been asked to make a few comments on the Technics turntable Marco uses. The turntable is a standard direct drive Technics SL1200 that has been worked upon by Dave Crawley of Sound Hi Fi and fitted with the latter’s ‘Timestep’ power supply. The deck is fitted with a Jelco SA-750D 9” arm carrying a Denon DL103SA cartridge (headshell unknown).

I did not comment on the individual components that make up Marco’s system as I heard the system as a whole and do not have the listening acuity or acumen to be able to ascribe a sonic ‘signature’ to any individual part. Suffice it to say that judging by the movement (or rather lack) of the stroboscope, the rotational speed was spot-on and rock steady. When it comes to attributes such as PRAT, all I can say is that, where appropriate, my foot was tapping along with the music.

Only on one occasion did I notice a low frequency tone during the ‘silence’ between tracks. It unlikely to have been turntable rumble and was more likely low frequency vinyl ‘roar’. Marco’s Tannoy Lockwood speakers have sufficient subterranean response that they can reproduce virtually any low frequency, and it was hard to identify the source of noise on such a brief acquaintance.

Regards

[DSJR]

if it's in the deck, then gently tapping the plinth (or even the rotating playing disc) will reproduce it. Judging by the room size (assymetrical or not), it may just be a minor room mode...

When I had the big ATC's before I married, at the listening seat there was a massive 9db rise at 120Hz, hence my experimentation with an old graphic eq... Shifting my position to a non-central position alongside the CD player position removed this "bump" completely (the speakers were measured by ATC on two separate occasions with no problems at all in the bass performance...)

[Marco]

Hi Barry,


Only on one occasion did I notice a low frequency tone during the ‘silence’ between tracks.


I've no idea what it was, mate, as I wasn't aware of it. Do you remember which album it was we were playing when you noticed this "low frequency tone"? Maybe it was an after-effect of the cassoulet? ;)

The "unknown headshell", incidentally, was an NOS Audio Technica LT-12 magnesium one - perfect for the DL103SA :cool:

Marco.

[Primalsea]

Drawing close to the quaint village of Wrecsam, I enquired of the locals for directions. This proved to be of little help as the mere mention of the Count’s name had the locals recoiling with horror, withdrawing into the shadows making strange hand gestures.


I didn't realise that that there was so many Wigwamer's, HHD Forum'ers etc etc in Wrexam!

[Marco]

:lolsign:

Marco.

[Steve Toy]

We don't slag off other forums although HDD is a worthy exception ;)

[leo]

We don't slag off other forums although HDD is a worthy exception ;)

I just had a browse on there, hard to know what to say really:whistle: obvious a few trying to look like they know more than they actually do, doesn't take long to spot the BS'ers

[chris@panteg]

I have to say i noticed quite a bit of Linn bashing ' now let me just say i have on occasion
been guilty of this myself '

And just for the record i was pretty well pished ':cool: when i posted the comments ' but i regret making the silly remarks i made because they sound stupid ' ill informed and well just look silly .

[Marco]

What I find amusing about the HDD forum, and it's an honest observation with no malice intended, is that AoS sometimes gets accused of being a 'fanboy forum' for the likes of Technics T/T and Beresford DAC users. I disagree, as it goes much deeper than that.

However, I see an almost identical state of affairs on the HDD forum with Apple and AVI. Therefore, could someone tell me what makes AoS more of a 'fanboy forum' for Beresford and Technics than the HDD forum is for AVI and Apple??

Or is their brand of 'fanboyism' somehow different from ours? ;)

All I see, in reality, is two different sets of enthusiasts equally passionate about their respective ways of enjoying music.

Marco.

[Themis]

What I find amusing about the HDD forum, and it's an honest observation with no malice intended, is that AoS sometimes gets accused of being a 'fanboy forum' for the likes of Technics T/T and Beresford DAC users. I disagree, as it goes much deeper than that.

However, I see an almost identical state of affairs on the HDD forum with Apple and AVI. Therefore, could someone tell me what makes AoS more of a 'fanboy forum' for Beresford and Technics than the HDD forum is for AVI and Apple??

Or is their brand of 'fanboyism' somehow different from ours? ;)

All I see, in reality, is two different sets of enthusiasts equally passionate about their respective ways of enjoying music.

Marco.
That sums up my opinion, too. ;)

And I add that, I am as fedup as you seem to be, Marco, about these "subjectivists vs objectivists" situation. Having friends of both "camps", this situation has been poisoning my life since the late seventies...
But, as I said the other day, c'est la vie. ;)

[Steve Toy]

It's not the objectivists themselves I really have an issue with, it's the reductionists amongst them.

[Themis]

It's not the objectivists themselves I really have an issue with, it's the reductionists amongst them.
If I interpret properly, these ones have no friends at all. ;)

[Barry]

Hi Barry,



I've no idea what it was, mate, as I wasn't aware of it. Do you remember which album it was we were playing when you noticed this "low frequency tone"? Maybe it was an after-effect of the cassoulet? ;)

The "unknown headshell", incidentally, was an NOS Audio Technica LT-12 magnesium one - perfect for the DL103SA :cool:

Marco.

Can't remember which LP was playing; we played quite a few. It could have been the Thomas Dolby, 'Flat Earth' (?) or the John Fahey, 'Yellow Princess', or yet the Hendrix, 'Live at Woodstock'. It was not the Frank Sinatra, as that was the first record we played and I only noticed the low pitched noise some time later.

I couldn't have been the cassoulet - how could you possibly impugn Del's cooking with that remark? :lolsign:

Regards

[Marco]

Well, we had after all just consumed a rather large amount of Haricot beans, so thus one could presume that said "low frequency tone" was indeed our collective 'botty burps', had they occurred within the same audible frequency range... :eyebrows:

Marco

P.S it's John Fahey, matey, not Brian (or Brain), as you have erroneously typed.

[Beechwoods]

John Fahey? Which album Marco? A good choice, I'd say :)

[Marco]

It's not the objectivists themselves I really have an issue with, it's the reductionists amongst them.

Indeed, Steve. Let it be known by everyone that I have the deepest respect imaginable for real scientists; i.e. those who possess a genuinely open and enquiring mind and who recognise that science is constantly involving, therefore 'imperfect', and so does not always have a definitive answer to everything in life that we genuinely experience.

Real scientists know therefore that there is still very much for mankind to discover and learn, not just in audio, but in every area of life in general.

Indeed, if it wasn't for real scientists I literally wouldn't be alive today, as two years ago I was diagnosed as having a spinal tumour (fortunately benign), which if not removed, would've grown further and eventually killed me - and indeed even if removed could have left me paralysed from the waist down.

Fortunately, thanks to modern technology and the tremendous skills of the Neurosurgeons at Walton hospital in Liverpool, the spinal tumour was successfully removed and I made a full recovery with only minimal permanent lasting effect to my mobility. Therefore, you can be bloody damn sure that I have the deepest respect for science - *when correctly applied* in the field of medicine, for example.

However, I'm afraid that I see the relationship between science and audio as being overall rather more ambiguous - certainly in terms of relevance to the end-user or listener of any associated hi-fi equipment, and when attempting to categorically 'prove' or 'disprove' certain audible sonic effects. This is why the final arbter for me will always be my experienced and discerning ears, which in the final analysis I retain complete faith in. For designers and engineers of equipment of course, it's rather different, as they must juggle both the objective and subjective when creating new products.

However, I've never understood why we, the end-users, should be unduly concerned with how equipment measures, as surely all that matters is how music reproduced through it sounds (to our ears) in the final analysis? That is why I care not a jot about such things.

It's when science and measurements are almost religiously applied to audio (and viewed as an unfailing panacea) by blinkered self-appointed reductionists with rigidly inflexible mindsets, who display an almost unassailable arrogance and complete disrespect for the equally valid alternative beliefs and methodologies of others, that I have a problem with it. Fortunately though these misguided creatures are although, albeit vocal, firmly in the minority....

Marco.

[Marco]

John Fahey? Which album Marco? A good choice, I'd say :)

'The Yellow Princess', dude - and damn good it is, too! :cool:

Marco.

[Steve Toy]

To add to post #49 above by Marco these alternative methodologies that do work, although their effects may not be easy to measure do nevertheless conform to the laws of physics, notably - where isolation is concerned, to the laws of thermodynamics.

[Barry]

Well, we had after all just consumed a rather large amount of Haricot beans, so thus one could presume that said "low frequency tone" was indeed our collective 'botty burps', had they occurred within the same audible frequency range... :eyebrows:

Marco

P.S it's John Fahey, matey, not Brian (or Brain), as you have erroneously typed.

Hi Marco,

Yes, of course it is - Silly me! Put it down to another 'senior moment'. :doh:

Nick, if you like John Fahey, have a listen to 'The Transfiguration of Blind Joe Death', 1968, Transatlantic TRA 173. A superb performance by Fahey who plays guitars with unusual tuning plus some interesting banjo pickin'. Could be right up your street.

Regards

[Marco]

I must get that, Barry. I remember you recommended it when you were here :)

Marco.

[Beechwoods]

I'm familiar with 'Dance Of Death' off the Zabriskie soundtrack. Extremely haunting playing. I'll check out the album you mention!

[Primalsea]

The thing is at the end of the day its all about enjoying listening to music. sure there are elements of pride of ownership and the excitement of the new, but listening is what its about. I just cant see how anyone can tell me that I'm going to enjoy listening to something more because it technically measures better than anything else.

I do believe that there is a lot of stuff out there that is a rip off, but there is a lot of stuff that is expensive because it's been priced for a particular market level. This is fine as some people want to take pride in what they have. I bought a real oak floor just because I wanted to. I probably could have got a laminate floor that looked almost the same or just as good but that's not the point, I wanted a real wood floor and I could afford it. It doesn't offer me a better way of walking across it, I don't feel "OHHH thats nice when my feet touch it. In fact it feels the same to most other floors that I walk on.

The similar can be said for audio gear,as well as cars, watches, curtains, trainers ........

At some point you do have to go by what your ears tell you. Its up to you to make sure that you don't imagine a difference as well as any other pitfall that lines the way.

[Marco]

Spot on, Paul!

Why is it I find myself agreeing with most of what you write these days? :)


I just cant see how anyone can tell me that I'm going to enjoy listening to something more because it technically measures better than anything else.


Indeed - but that certainly doesn't stop some people from trying (and attempting to influence the gullible) ;)

My 'considered response' will always be to offer them a two-fingered salute, because there's no chance of that crap working on me unless my ears confirm it!!

Marco.

[Primalsea]

Spot on, Paul!

Why is it I find myself agreeing with most of what you write these days? :)



When I grow up I want to be a Marco too!

:lol: