Best quote of the day

[Bigman80]

"Audiophiles dont use their equipment to listen to our music. They use our music to listen to their equipment"



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[struth]

Very true in many cases Oliver

[Bigman80]

Very true in many cases Oliver
Ye. It made me think so it must be a good quote.

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[Haselsh1]

Excellent bit of thinking there

;)

[alphaGT]

"Audiophiles dont use their equipment to listen to our music. They use our music to listen to their equipment"



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It depends on what day you ask me.....


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[Yomanze]

"Audiophiles dont use their equipment to listen to our music. They use our music to listen to their equipment"



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Part 2: "When audiophiles realise that they are listening to their equipment, they either quit or spend a lot to get back to listening to the music again. Some are never cured though..."

[Bigman80]

Part 2: "When audiophiles realise that they are listening to their equipment, they either quit or spend a lot to get back to listening to the music again. Some are never cured though..."

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Hahaha quality. Yes there is no cure.

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[Pharos]

The real problem I have is that as the Hi-Fi gets better, more objective that is, I hear the music in the barest of forms warts and all.
I then wonder exactly what it was that I had previously found so entrancing.

[Yomanze]

The real problem I have is that as the Hi-Fi gets better, more objective that is, I hear the music in the barest of forms warts and all.
I then wonder exactly what it was that I had previously found so entrancing.
Yep, I think it's important to "back off" a bit from the forensic detail, so that the music is allowed to flow properly. You can have too much of a good thing to the point where things like poor mastering start to become a tiring issue.

[Bigman80]

This is spot on. At Times I really enjoyed listening to music. then I found myself analyzing everything. Its only very recently ive found myself just enjoying things. Its nice to be back at the stage where its enjoyment in the songs. They just sound so much better these days lol

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[walpurgis]

Have a listen to a pair of proper big Tannoys. That'll mess your day up! :D

You'll never be the same again.

[Marco]

Part 2: "When audiophiles realise that they are listening to their equipment, they either quit or spend a lot to get back to listening to the music again. Some are never cured though..."

Part 3: "Someone who's system is worth than their music collection, loves equipment more than music..."

Discuss! ;)

Marco.

[walpurgis]

Part 3: "Someone who's system is worth than their music collection, loves equipment more than music..."

Discuss! ;)

Marco.

Not something I've ever considered really. My records are certainly worth more now than when I bought them and possibly the same applies to the gear in my system, so I'd have a job working it out! :)

[struth]

Whatever turns you on i guess. Think most folk would like to have an expensive fancy system if they didnt have to worry about costs. Nowadays you dont need a music collection anyway if you just stream from, say Tidal which is lossless. In some ways it makes sense, as for 20 quid a month you get access to 40 million tracks. You never own anything but your system could be quite small, quite expensive and technically have no music there. Could be a bugger if your interweb went tits up of course.

[walpurgis]

for 20 quid a month you get access to 40 million tracks.

Not that I do, but I reckon I'd sooner spend £240 a year on records and CDs. Of course that means more room is needed though.

[WESTLOWER]

Whatever turns you on i guess. Think most folk would like to have an expensive fancy system if they didnt have to worry about costs. Nowadays you dont need a music collection anyway if you just stream from, say Tidal which is lossless. In some ways it makes sense, as for 20 quid a month you get access to 40 million tracks. You never own anything but your system could be quite small, quite expensive and technically have no music there. Could be a bugger if your interweb went tits up of course.

I only invested quite heavily in my Analogue equipment as i had spent most of my life collecting records and figured after years and years of listening on a 'poor' system that the record collection deserved something better
(although at the time I really enjoyed my music on what I had, I knew no different!). If I were starting out again i doubt i would go the Vinyl road with where digital presentation is today, and the cost effectiveness of a digital system.
Getting that balance right of equipment cost outlay to music collection worth is a very real equation for me. You can buy a lot of music for the price of a very good amplifier.

I still buy records pretty extensively and it's a conscious effort to replenish the collection to warrant the Hifi investment. If that makes sense. It's real pound juggling as far as I am concerned when funds are so stretched and Music & HiFi
isn't the only priority.

[Puffin]

I became semi-retired in 2012 and found that my long-term condition which the doc diagnosed as "upgradeitis" started to diminish, I also stopped listening to the system and just enjoyed the music. I don't feel the need to "check the system" every day ;)

[Pharos]

Now I can hear clearly what is going on, I am looking for art that is worthwhile and not lame.

[Marco]

I also stopped listening to the system and just enjoyed the music. I don't feel the need to "check the system" every day ;)

That's the happy place where everyone's 'head should be at'... It's certainly where mine is these days. Too many folks in this hobby appear to suffer from a (seemingly incurable) illness.

Marco.

[Marco]

Not something I've ever considered really. My records are certainly worth more now than when I bought them and possibly the same applies to the gear in my system, so I'd have a job working it out! :)

OK, let's see....

I've got approximately 3500 records, 1500 of which were brought brand new, at an average price of £25, so thats £37.5k, for starters.

The remaining 2000 were bought second-hand, at say, an average cost of £5, so that's another £10k... However, in reality it's probably rather more, as I have quite a few rare and collectable classic albums on vinyl, which cost considerably more than £5!

I've got around 2500 CDs, all of which were bought brand new, at an average cost, of say, £10, so that's another £25k... I've also got about another 1000 or so CDs, which are simply copies, but I'll just ignore that.

Total music spend: (approx) £72.5k

Last time I totalled up the cost of my system and ancillaries, it was just shy of £35k, so I'm pretty happy with my 'music owning-to-equipment' ratio :cool:

Marco.

[Stryder5]

Perhaps the upgraditis is fed somewhat by forums such as this?

I remember being stunned when I first heard stereo which was a record deck (portable) that had one speaker in base unit, and the lid was another speaker that you could move about 5 feet away. Can't (don't want to ) remember how long ago!

So things progress, and you start by reading magazine reviews, and you get the need to make things (that sounded great) better.

Then you make a magical discovery....AoS....bugger...everyone's talking of kit you've never heard of, and suddenly IC's, cartridges, head amps, amplifiers, speaker cable, speakers can all be talked about, reviewed and commented on.

So I guess the human psyche kicks in, man, if these things are so good I must try to make my system as good as possible, then comes the kicker, bottlenecks in your current system could be changed to enable music to be "better", lo and behold UPGRADITIS

Sorry if I drifted from OP.

[walpurgis]

My 'upgraditis' kicked in before most members here were born! :D

[Bigman80]

Perhaps the upgraditis is fed somewhat by forums such as this?

I remember being stunned when I first heard stereo which was a record deck (portable) that had one speaker in base unit, and the lid was another speaker that you could move about 5 feet away. Can't (don't want to ) remember how long ago!

So things progress, and you start by reading magazine reviews, and you get the need to make things (that sounded great) better.

Then you make a magical discovery....AoS....bugger...everyone's talking of kit you've never heard of, and suddenly IC's, cartridges, head amps, amplifiers, speaker cable, speakers can all be talked about, reviewed and commented on.

So I guess the human psyche kicks in, man, if these things are so good I must try to make my system as good as possible, then comes the kicker, bottlenecks in your current system could be changed to enable music to be "better", lo and behold UPGRADITIS

Sorry if I drifted from OP.
Haha yes, it doesn't help at time BUT without it id have never heard what im hearing now. That would have been a shame to have missed out on.

I am very aware that my dad, who's love of music really impacted me, never heard his vinyl (which I now own) sound as good as I do.

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[magiccarpetride]

"Audiophiles dont use their equipment to listen to our music. They use our music to listen to their equipment"



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This was true for me in the days when I was trying to get my digital chain to sound acceptable or even good. Because initially my digital chain sounded a bit harsh and brittle, I was always on a lookout for CDs and digital files that would make it sound less congested, less glassy, less electronic/synthetic. As I was slowly improving my chain, I was able to involve more and more of my digital music collection into my listening sessions, but I remember catching myself every now and then listening more to my sound system than to my music. Any time I'd catch myself doing that, I'd slap myself on the wrist. Bad boy!

However, since I've switched to LPs, I have realized that now I'm only listening to music. That's because right out of the gate turntable sounds, well, turntable-y. There is no need to strain and work on it to make it sound more like vinyl. So now I can finally relax and focus all my attention on the music that's playing on my tt.

[paulf-2007]

My music collection is worth far less than my kit but I don't see that as loving the kit more than the music. To listen to the music I love I needed kit good enough to play it with. Those with huge music collections rarely play much of it anyway as there's not enough time to do so, that in itself is similar to box swapping. I stream music mostly with the odd session of vinyl. I still have all my CDs so should the Internet go tits up I've got vinyl, cd and cassette to fall back on.

[Marco]

Those with huge music collections rarely play much of it anyway as there's not enough time to do so...

Speak for yourself, Paul... Being semi-retired and working from home, I listen to music (on average) for 6-7 hours a day, so trust me, considerable chunks of my 'huge music collection' is played [and hugely enjoyed] on a daily basis! :)

Marco.

[struth]

No doubt Ive got more music than I can listen too, and it can become an annoyance. I reckon I played more when I had less. LP's are coming down and need further culling. think I have 150+ to move on. CDs seem to multiply by themselves, and are mostly flac-ed bar my blues collection which I just mostly keep on cd only. Having Spotify I listen there a lot to classics and to new stuff, and at a tenner I think its value.

[Marco]

No doubt Ive got more music than I can listen too, and it can become an annoyance.

Interesting... Of course, you're right with the first bit, but in terms of the latter, I find the opposite. I see it as a bit of an 'adventure', especially when exploring the 10TB of music files, stored on my hard-drives (containing many thousands of albums), as every day you're discovering something new - and it takes you on a rather entertaining journey!

Incidentally, none of the cost of the music in my streaming system was factored into the equation in my previous post about 'music-to-equipment' ratios....

And, in terms of my physical music collection, it's similar in terms of the 'journey' aspect, as it's like having access to a small record shop, where you can dip into something new everyday. I've probably got at least a couple of hundred albums I've bought, brand new in the last six months, which I haven't even listened to yet, so I've still got that to look forward to :)

Obviously, storing a large physical music collection takes up a lot of space, but if you've got a dedicated room to house it all in, then it's not a problem. I certainly wouldn't sell any of my records or CDs, that's for sure, in fact I'll be continuing to buy more! :cool:

Marco.

[Bigman80]

I dont like enough music to have more than I can listen to lol. Im very picky.

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[Marco]

Lol... I've got very wide tastes in music, Oliver, so I love exploring different genres and previously unheard of artists, which is part of the fun with the NAS drives and downloading new music from various sites :)

Can't stand playing the same old stuff, again and again, or only listening to the same music I used to listen to 20 or 30 years ago!

Marco.

[Bigman80]

Lol... I've got very wide tastes in music, Oliver, so I love exploring different genres and previously unheard of artists, which is part of the fun with the NAS drives and downloading new music from various sites :)

Can't stand playing the same old stuff, again and again, or only listening to the same music I used to listen to 20 or 30 years ago!

Marco.
Im always on the lookout Marco, but there's very little that makes ot into my collection permanently. Digital is very good for not committing money to a shit album.

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[Marco]

No worries, mate. I'm finding interesting new stuff all the time, especially with indie, blues, electronica and classical genres :)

Marco.

[Pharos]

So what are the criteria for choice - I know mine.

Right back in the teens and into the twenties, whilst becoming an adult, and in what I argue was a period of great musical art and revolution, and before the corporations got their hands on it, I was absolutely 'shaken' by much that I heard.

It was for me because the songs spoke of the politics (small 'p') of the world; human interactions, and abuses, injustices, and the problems to be faced. I could list all the vital formative ones, and I'm sure many here would also empathise.

But it is essentially a learning process, and one develops; Three Blind Mice may well be enchanting and exciting for a three year old, but not for one of ten, and so it goes on into a more complex understanding both intellectually, and more importantly, emotionally; the way what we hear resonates with our personal experiences, and reinforces our values.

For me, I keep little music compared with most here, but it is seminal to my growth and development, and my vinyl is historically positioned on a shelf as a record of that. I have duplicated much in CD also, and I use it as references to my own earlier emotional reactions, in my attempts to aid my current artistically similar aspirations.

If you think 'pop' is not a powerful form, then look at just how often references are made to it on news media, usually in caption form. The period I refer to was groundbreaking and shapeshifting, and has really changed society. Whether or not we address the issues positively to produce a better future, is moot.

[Joe]

Im always on the lookout Marco, but there's very little that makes ot into my collection permanently. Digital is very good for not committing money to a shit album.


Ah, the shit album problem. Back when I were a lad, and had very little money, an album was a major purchase. I spent hours in record shops, flipping through the racks, trying to decide which album to buy; knowing that it would be months before my next purchase. I remember to this day my bitter disappointment when an LP I got as a birthday present turned out to be a stinker. I played it lots of times, hoping to 'get' it, then gave up on the thing. I also held on to several other rubbish LPs, but sold most of them when I ran out of money during a period of unemployment.

Now, even in terms of physical media, it's a non-issue. I got a £20 Fopp voucher as one of my birthday presents. At their prices, that means I can buy four albums, or two lots of the 'five albums by ...' series, making ten albums in total. Birthdays and Christmas aside, if I wanted to, I could spend £20 a week on albums, every week of the year. Even if half turned out to be rubbish, it'd be no big deal.

[walpurgis]

Like it or not. The artistic revolution of the sixties and seventies was fueled by LSD and Cannabis. I have no doubt most creative people were using those and and this was the influence that brought on such radical changes. What was previously 'pop music' became the message board for the more serious feelings of young people.

[struth]

Ah yes Fopp. I was once led there but they dont have an online store, or didnt. A strange turn of events when most record companies are doing the opposite. No idea to this day if they sell anything worthwhile and guess i never will..

[Joe]

Ah yes Fopp. I was once led there but they dont have an online store, or didnt. A strange turn of events when most record companies are doing the opposite. No idea to this day if they sell anything worthwhile and guess i never will..

They over-expanded, went bust and closed down completely a few years back, then re-opened a few stores. They have a great selection of DVDs and rock CDs, but are less good with jazz and classical (though I've picked up some excellent jazz titles at £3 each).

[Stryder5]

It's interesting how you get your memory jogged, reminded recently of saxophonist Candy Dolfur and a song Lilly Was Here with David A Stewart. Bought the Vinyl copy off eBay.

Absolutely stunning album, produced by David Stewart himself on the Anxious label.

[Bigman80]

Ah, the shit album problem. Back when I were a lad, and had very little money, an album was a major purchase. I spent hours in record shops, flipping through the racks, trying to decide which album to buy; knowing that it would be months before my next purchase. I remember to this day my bitter disappointment when an LP I got as a birthday present turned out to be a stinker. I played it lots of times, hoping to 'get' it, then gave up on the thing. I also held on to several other rubbish LPs, but sold most of them when I ran out of money during a period of unemployment.

Now, even in terms of physical media, it's a non-issue. I got a £20 Fopp voucher as one of my birthday presents. At their prices, that means I can buy four albums, or two lots of the 'five albums by ...' series, making ten albums in total. Birthdays and Christmas aside, if I wanted to, I could spend £20 a week on albums, every week of the year. Even if half turned out to be rubbish, it'd be no big deal.
Im not in a position to throw money at albums I dont like so I have to choose carefully. I find digital sources are great for sampling new artists

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[rigger67]

Ah yes Fopp. I was once led there but they dont have an online store, or didnt. A strange turn of events when most record companies are doing the opposite. No idea to this day if they sell anything worthwhile and guess i never will..

I worked for them and it's a sorry tale how the chain died.
We did have an online store for a while and it was actually based in my shop in Southampton - one of the largest branches - but it was only ever a half-hearted effort and we didn't do much business. It was essentially like visiting the shop itself via remote rather than accessing the vast warehouses of the major online retailers ..

The few branches still open - Bristol Park Street is a cracking little example - are mostly owned by HMV now but they kept the Fopp ethos of ultra-value prices and interesting back cat/artist selections, as well as an esoteric literature section :)

[Marco]

There's still a Fopp in Glasgow: http://www.fopp.com/

I visit it whenever I'm up there :)

Marco.

[Rothchild]

Lol, yup, just went to Fopp Cambridge at lunch time and am now the proud owner of 5 Parliament albums and 5 by The Meters (on CD), all for the princely sum of £20