New Lenco and Photobucket is being a bucket of poo

[Si74]

Dying to post new pics but Photobucket is becoming a pile of p-sh!
First use of a PTP and not remotely impressed. Sounds initially very good but rumble, rumble and more rumble.
My own Lencos, the motor stands up off the sub plinth and never had any trouble with rumble.
Bought a load of these years ago for peanuts on the basis they can sound sublime, better and simpler than
301s and 401s, if housed in a suitable plinth.
The prices of any of the idlers these days makes me wonder..... 300 quid for a feckin bog standard Lenco?
simply taking the p--h?
Rebuilding a 301 is like rebuilding a car in miniature, listening to one afterwards is like why bother?

[ianlenco]

A well fettled Lenco shouldn't rumble as you obviously know and a PTP, with its motor isolation should be even less likely to rumble. Presume the motor and bearing are serviced and everything is properly aligned? Have you run the motor off the deck to check if it's running smoothly? All sounds a bit odd.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Dying to post new pics but Photobucket is becoming a pile of p-sh!
First use of a PTP and not remotely impressed. Sounds initially very good but rumble, rumble and more rumble.
My own Lencos, the motor stands up off the sub plinth and never had any trouble with rumble.
Bought a load of these years ago for peanuts on the basis they can sound sublime, better and simpler than
301s and 401s, if housed in a suitable plinth.
The prices of any of the idlers these days makes me wonder..... 300 quid for a feckin bog standard Lenco?
simply taking the p--h?
Rebuilding a 301 is like rebuilding a car in miniature, listening to one afterwards is like why bother?

The lenco can still be purchased for <£100 with patience. The Lenco isn't usually viewed as sounding better than a 301 and a properly setup 301 will usually still complete with most designs today. I've totally rebuilt both the 301 and the Lenco and know which I prefer!

[Si74]

Might have solved the Photobucket issue but not the Lenco one. It's driving me nuts, stripped and serviced every motor, bearing and idler I have
and it's now probably worse than ever. Seriously has me beat as I've built six or seven of these, four were sold and a couple were gifted to people
I owed a favour, never any problems. Only built one that had a PTP but was a kind of mini one (WAF), but with a PU 7 and an Audionote cartridge, sounded
fabulous.
As to the 401s, couple of people who still own Lencos I built still have them and the 401s are long gone.
Looking at the prices of GL 75s on Ebay, I'm flabbergasted.. I used to buy them for 10 or 15 quid, as to Garrards, I knew an ex BBC
engineer who could have got me as many 301s as I wanted for 70 quid a piece, why oh why didn't I buy a dozen:-)

[ianlenco]

How frustrating for you. Maybe some photos might help some of us chip in with possible solutions although from what you say your no novice with these machines so it's going to be difficult doing any diagnosis from a distance. One suggestion - if you press on the platter does it rock on the bearing? Even properly serviced if the bushes are worn this can happen. I'll also repeat suggestion re running the motor off the deck - put it on a wood surface and see how quiet it is. Sometimes a tap on the nose quietens them down :)

Good luck.

[Ali Tait]

A mate has just built one for me, build thread here-

http://www.audio-talk.co.uk/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=6826

Pick it up this week.

[jollyfix]

Very nice Ali.

[Si74]

That's lovely and way better than any of mine and should sound rather special!

[Si74]

Had 3 different motors in bits, running them on the kitchen worktop. None of them are what you would call silent but vibration free and make no noise when suspended on the springs from Peters motor mount plate. This is really annoying me as I'd intended to built a nice looking one to replace my Oracle, that's how much I rate them but sadly it's just not happening. I've stripped the plinth and added dampening layers but seem to be getting nowhere. Given I've had no problems with any of the others, think I'll revert to standing the motor of a lower plinth. Will add photos later.

[Si74]

:doh: well hours (and hours) later, still no joy with this. Four platter, four bearings, three motors and three arms/idler wheels this is really doing my head in.
Stripped all the various parts and checked and lubed them. One motor is giving of a horrible hum under test, the other two are silent in operation, definite slight vibration which doesn't transmit when on the springs,or so I thought.
The motor, beairing and idler installed at the moment are virtually silent even with my ear as close to the deck as possible, sounds marvellous up to half volume then all hell breaks loose. Not sure I would call it rumble now, it's more like there is a frequency being picked up from the motor and amplified. It's not a hum as per a grounding loop but something much bassier??
I did wonder about the proximity of the unshielded tone arm leads from the WTA when in the rear position but moving it to the usual right hand side
position improves matters slightly but not by much.
Given the number of these I have built previously without problems, have to say this one has me stumped.
The PTP is a very early one and heavily magnetic which has me wondering. I've only used one other much newer PTP, three prior builds used the
standard toplate modded and the last two had the motor stood of the lower plinth, the toplates being cut from kitchen splashback.
None of these ever gave any problems even when plugged into very expensive systems.
Only thing I'm wondering about is that the Lenco is plugged into a power strip that also feeds my laptop and the wallwart for the phonostage being used, problem is there are no other sockets readily available as the system runs from a usa outlet feeding a Shunyata Hydra and moving stuff to run the deck from this thru the main systems pre and phono is a p.i.t.a. I can well do without.1971219713

[ianlenco]

Not sure I would call it rumble now, it's more like there is a frequency being picked up from the motor and amplified. It's not a hum as per a grounding loop but something much bassier??
I did wonder about the proximity of the unshielded tone arm leads from the WTA when in the rear position but moving it to the usual right hand side
position improves matters slightly but not by much.

Hi Simon, maybe you're on to something here. Is there any chance what you are hearing is the 50Hz mains? Arms placed behind the platter are obviously nearer the motor and can be more susceptible to picking up noise but that's usually rumble. Do you have an alternative tonearm to try? Given you have swapped/serviced all the Lenco parts maybe the problem isn't with the Lenco :scratch: What cartridge are you using - not a Grado by chance?

[Si74]

Hi Ian,

using the well tempered arm and an old Goldring Epic 11. This has been my standard go to for testing, using on all the past Lencos
and never caused any problems. Only time I ever experienced problems with a Grado was on an LP 12 when it got near the inside
of the record. Unfortunately my collection of arms has long since gone and much as I'd loved to have tried it if the latest deck was playing ball,
the thought of stripping the Kuzma/Koetsu of the Oracle to be met with the same problem holds no fascination at the moment.
It's weird as the current deck is as near silent to the naked ear as I've ever achieved, hence my frustration. Will try running the deck from
another outlet on it's own or maybe stick on iec plug and run it from the Hydra but given it's running from the same outlets
I normally use for the Lencos, I'm not overly hopefull:-(

[CornishPasty]

I've often wondered how a PTP isolates the motor from the rest of the deck when both plates are bolted to the same lump of wood. Get your stethoscope out Si and have a listen around. If the deck is mechanically quiet then you need to be looking for electrical noise. Is everything properly grounded and tied together including the tone arms?

[Si74]

Ever felt foolish? What could it possibly be, what changed... laptop psu was replaced.
Unplugged it and the deck is as quiet as a mouse and sounds great at any volume.
Now to dismantle and finish the plinth cosmetically..

[CornishPasty]

Sometimes you just can't see the wood for the trees.

[paulf-2007]

I've often wondered how a PTP isolates the motor from the rest of the deck when both plates are bolted to the same lump of wood. Get your stethoscope out Si and have a listen around. If the deck is mechanically quiet then you need to be looking for electrical noise. Is everything properly grounded and tied together including the tone arms?it doesn't

[Wakefield Turntables]

Simon,

Just caught up on this thread. Have you tried replacing the mounting springs for the motor? I had a similar problem to yourself where I just couldn't get the motor to stop humming and on close inspection I noticed that one of the motor mounting springs had been crushed and was no longer blocking vibration. Alternatively make sure the springs are sitting correctly in the mounting sockets on the motor. I appreciate that you've done a few of these but even the most experieced rebuilder can sometimes forgot a something simple.